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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Quote:
Grapefruit said: I'd be fucking crazy to take this shit again. Hell NO. Life is absurd and there is little to no choice in anything, you begin dumb and likely grow deluded, you can't even tell when you're deluded. Perhaps out of chance and mistake you can gain some wisdom, to grow wise enough to find peace in life likely requires nearly impossible luck.
Most humans are OK in my book, we have a tough job.
Spoken like a true mensch.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Grapefruit
Freak in the forest


Registered: 05/09/08
Posts: 5,744
Last seen: 3 years, 1 month
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: circastes]
#18807544 - 09/06/13 01:52 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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So the shittiness is transient? Yeah that's a good thing but it doesn't make it any better (except knowing we don't have to suffer it forever, or at least I hope).
-------------------- Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. "Chat your fraff Chat your fraff Just chat your fraff Chat your fraff"
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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There's no way to know. We may only be on an upper level of hell.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Grapefruit
Freak in the forest


Registered: 05/09/08
Posts: 5,744
Last seen: 3 years, 1 month
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Icelander]
#18807805 - 09/06/13 03:18 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Let's hope not. It always astonishes me when I realise how little I really understand.
-------------------- Little left in the way of energy; or the way of love, yet happy to entertain myself playing mental games with the rest of you freaks until the rivers run backwards. "Chat your fraff Chat your fraff Just chat your fraff Chat your fraff"
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Repertoire89
Cat



Registered: 11/15/12
Posts: 21,773
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Icelander]
#18808313 - 09/06/13 05:14 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: There's no way to know. We may only be on an upper level of hell. 
I've always thought that religions talking about "hell" were referring to this world.
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Memories



Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 10,484
Loc: Suwannee River
Last seen: 3 years, 10 months
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I wouldn't take it. I struggle enough with the pain of mundane thought.
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Romi
Indigo Child



Registered: 08/14/08
Posts: 425
Loc: Sunshine
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Icelander]
#18810649 - 09/07/13 06:59 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: There's no way to know. We may only be on an upper level of hell. 
but see we need to believe in a god in order to believe in a "hell"
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Romi]
#18810678 - 09/07/13 07:24 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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It's just a way of talking. I have no evidence for either. But actually Buddhists talk about hell realms and no belief in a god.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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treesniper119
No one of Consequence



Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 1,893
Loc: rainbow land
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Icelander]
#18810703 - 09/07/13 07:41 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Wait... We grow in our suffering!? Stop the press
-------------------- Icelander said: I'd like to fund unlimited abortions. Finally some good coming from my tax dollars. Repetoire89 said: I love abortion and fully condone it - some should make it into a sport. Treesniper119 said: Any one who is willing to start life & also willing to deny life to their form/seed/child/offspring is cursed. For you have severed your own cord to lifes worth. Anyone who condones these actions is cursed as well...
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Not always. A child tortured or suffering starvation? Where's the growth? A dog beaten starved and tortured. Where's the growth?
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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treesniper119
No one of Consequence



Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 1,893
Loc: rainbow land
Last seen: 6 years, 8 months
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Icelander]
#18810740 - 09/07/13 08:02 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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I said it half sarcastic & half believing it true when viewed through different lenses of observation.
-------------------- Icelander said: I'd like to fund unlimited abortions. Finally some good coming from my tax dollars. Repetoire89 said: I love abortion and fully condone it - some should make it into a sport. Treesniper119 said: Any one who is willing to start life & also willing to deny life to their form/seed/child/offspring is cursed. For you have severed your own cord to lifes worth. Anyone who condones these actions is cursed as well...
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viktor
psychotechnician



Registered: 11/03/10
Posts: 4,293
Loc: New Zealand
Last seen: 1 year, 10 months
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Icelander]
#18810747 - 09/07/13 08:06 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said: Not always. A child tortured or suffering starvation? Where's the growth? A dog beaten starved and tortured. Where's the growth?
Some karmic debt is repaid
-------------------- "They consider me insane but I know that I am a hero living under the eyes of the gods."
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Repertoire89
Cat



Registered: 11/15/12
Posts: 21,773
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: viktor]
#18810749 - 09/07/13 08:08 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
viktor said:
Quote:
Icelander said: Not always. A child tortured or suffering starvation? Where's the growth? A dog beaten starved and tortured. Where's the growth?
Some karmic debt is repaid 
karma is a convenient assumption, I don't buy it
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Well I'll take a more, imo, realistic approach to suffering and decide what makes for growth and what leads to only loss. Then I'll act on that. And hopefully the demons of childhood implanted guilt trips won't interfere with making that informed choice and then acting on it.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,761
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Icelander]
#18810777 - 09/07/13 08:27 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Icelander said:
Quote:
Raven Gnosis said: If you were offered the gift and curse of life before your birth, knowing that everything you would come to love would figuratively and literally die, that your own death was inevitable, would you truly take it?
Why or why not?
No, life is unsatisfactory imo. Ask the Buddha. If this is the best creation can do then it's pretty lame imo.
sure I would take it, and probably did at least in one reconstructed scenario of my dreams.
but about the buddha, I do not think he said life is unsatisfactory, he said that one thing that pervades our experience of life is a sense of unsatisfactoriness: this is significantly different and to a huge extent cognitively different.
it is not to declaim life and support arguments for the right to be a depressed complainer.
instead it is excellent observation as an object of meditation; the "aspect or quality of unsatisfactoriness" (which seems to pervade everything) is very valuable to regard where and when you notice it.
in fact, it becomes a salient and underlying attitude repeatedly emerging in consciousness, and this is a great clue, a great connection (to the mystery of mind), and even to the very core of being, connecting, and 'looking for meaning or relevance': it exposes - the commonality of sangha, the root cause for of compassion, and the patience to endure more of ongoing creation.
as for things "being unsatisfactory" as opposed to that quality (unsatisfactoriness) pervading or being projected upon all things within our scrutiny as a side effect of attitude(s) - it is here that some value in the buddha's comment may be found.
the seed of this, sharpens discernment and awareness, like the yang within the yin and vice versa.
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ClockCode
A Lonely Hypha


Registered: 11/12/12
Posts: 546
Loc: The Highest Desert
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The earth is overpopulated.
-------------------- Psilovibing
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery



Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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You're right, life just us. But subjectively it's unsatisfactory so that doesn't really change anything at all as far as my statement and choice goes.
-------------------- "Don't believe everything you think". -Anom. " All that lives was born to die"-Anom. With much wisdom comes much sorrow, The more knowledge, the more grief. Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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Romi
Indigo Child



Registered: 08/14/08
Posts: 425
Loc: Sunshine
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Icelander]
#18811008 - 09/07/13 09:53 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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Can I just be the cheese here and point out the obvious, loving this thread. Ok back to the discussion.
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Tropism
ChasingTail


Registered: 09/12/09
Posts: 2,039
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Romi]
#18823944 - 09/10/13 03:35 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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I don't know where people are getting the idea life was intended as an idyllic affair. 
Something is not clicking in my brain that one would give up all they have ever known from beginning to end in trade for for the complete lack of experience (presumably). I just don't get it. Too much negative stimuli? Not enough positive? Who said it wouldn't be that way? Where are we getting these crazy delusions of happiness from?
This is life and this is life. She ain't going to change so lets not try and change her. I'm not trying to defend her or say she isn't a horrible sadistic bitch, by no means am I --she is FUCKED, but to act as if there isn't some reward from life alone is perplexing to me. Living is a success in and of itself compared to how many things don't make that cut, how many billions of animal lives haven't ever been born thanks to their ancestors trotting off the cliff. What you think they're the ones who got lucky? Has life truly become such an empty meaningless husk to transport your mind from beginning to end?
Dudes, we get to see this shit. All of it, for better and worse. yeah, it's fucking mangled to all hell and we can devise a million ways it could be better but none the less this is what is happening. Fuck the human race, fuck self-righteousness and fuck our egos. This isn't about our ideas and expectations, this is between us and the universe, mono e mono.
Call it whatever you want, I call it perspective and ultimately that's all we've got.
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redgreenvines
irregular verb


Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 37,761
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Re: Would you take it? [Re: Tropism]
#18825124 - 09/10/13 08:20 PM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
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yah!
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