|
Shroomslip
Architekt



Registered: 11/25/12
Posts: 23,656
Last seen: 34 minutes, 50 seconds
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: Lynnch]
#18822935 - 09/10/13 11:03 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Lynnch said:
Quote:
Enlil said: ...it's more analogous to RIDING IN A CAR.
No. It's more like saying
Quote:
"Hey, we should let everyone carry around hand grenades, it's already illegal to use them, so where's the harm in carrying them?" 
Nobody carries a loaded gun just for looks. There is the intention there that they will use it if necessary. And as noted before, it is simply impossible for a blind person to operate a weapon safely.
I can understand a blind person owning a car, I can understand a blind person owning a gun. I do not accept the reasoning of 'Freedom1!11!!' to let them drive that car or carry that weapon loaded where it might kill someone.
It's like riding in a car but making them responsible for telling the driver what color the traffic lights are.
Thank you. You put it better than I could (and I tried) after luvdemshroom's comment about missing his (Enlil's) point. I didn't miss his point. I disagree with them being able to carry loaded weapons for exactly this reasoning.
If they want to carry around an unloaded weapon for transport, that's entirely different matter. Here when we talk of being permitted to carry a weapon in public, it's a loaded weapon meant to be used in defense. Not a fashion statement.
--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
|
luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: Lynnch]
#18822939 - 09/10/13 11:04 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Lynnch said: Nobody carries a loaded gun just for looks. There is the intention there that they will use it if necessary. And as noted before, it is simply impossible for a blind person to operate a weapon safely.
Those are absolutes, which absolutely are not absolute.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,967
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: Lynnch]
#18822942 - 09/10/13 11:05 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Your hand grenade comment is a non sequitur. I see no reason to discriminate against blind people when it comes to CARRYING a weapon, and you've certainly not demonstrated one with your posts.
No one is arguing that a blind man can use a gun as safely as a sighted person. I'm simply saying that a blind man can CARRY a gun as safely as a sighted person, so why shouldn't he be allowed to if he wants? You keep getting into the USE of the gun, but that's another non sequitur. Someone who's willing to shoot a person with a gun isn't concerned whether or not it was legal for them to carry it in the first place....and it doesn't matter if they're blind or not.
And yes...many people carry guns just for looks. In fact, many people carry guns unloaded.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
shivas.wisdom
בּ



Registered: 02/19/09
Posts: 13,462
Loc: Turtle Island
Last seen: 30 minutes, 53 seconds
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#18822944 - 09/10/13 11:06 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
my googlefu was not strong enough
--------------------
|
luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#18822949 - 09/10/13 11:08 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
|
luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: shivas.wisdom]
#18822951 - 09/10/13 11:08 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
shivas.wisdom said: my googlefu was not strong enough 
We all have those days.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
|
Patlal
You ask too many questions



Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,812
Loc: Ottawa
Last seen: 13 hours, 41 minutes
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#18822954 - 09/10/13 11:09 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:
Patlal said:
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said: I'm amazed how many of you are missing Enlil's point.
To not have your constitutional rights breached due to a disability?
Does a blind person lose their right to freedom of speech? The right to not incriminate themselves? The right to be free from illegal search?
A right is a right.
Quote:
I'm sorry, but the disability is disabling you enough to justify not giving a blind man a gun do to COMMON SENSE
Common sense should tell you a blind man is entitled to the same rights as the rest of us.
That's the problem with that stupid 2nd amendment. Instead of saying you have the right to bare arms it should say "you may be given privilege to bare arms".
But since its not written that way, we now have blind people with guns. Wouptidoo
--------------------
|
psi
TOAST N' JAM


Registered: 09/05/99
Posts: 31,467
Loc: 613
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#18822955 - 09/10/13 11:09 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:
Patlal said:
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said: I'm amazed how many of you are missing Enlil's point.
To not have your constitutional rights breached due to a disability?
Does a blind person lose their right to freedom of speech? The right to not incriminate themselves? The right to be free from illegal search?
A right is a right.
What are your views on restricting gun rights for the mentally ill?
|
Shroomslip
Architekt



Registered: 11/25/12
Posts: 23,656
Last seen: 34 minutes, 50 seconds
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#18822958 - 09/10/13 11:11 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said:
Huge difference in target shooting and pulling a gun in self defense. Spin them around and slap them in the face a few times and put 1 target meant to be shot and then 5-6 that cannot be hit or it's a fail and see what happens. Even that wouldn't be a fair test unless you can somehow convince them their life is actually in danger. If it's still in a 'safe' setting the pressure isn't really on like it would be otherwise.
--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way. I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today. Nothing appeals to me no one feels like me, I’m too busy being calm to disappear. I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear. You can't wake up, this is not a dream. You're part of a machine, you are not a human being With your face all made up, living on a screen. Low on self esteem, so you run on gasoline
Edited by Shroomslip (09/10/13 11:11 AM)
|
luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: Patlal]
#18822969 - 09/10/13 11:13 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Patlal said: That's the problem with that stupid 2nd amendment. Instead of saying you have the right to bare arms it should say "you may be given privilege to bare arms".
But since its not written that way, we now have blind people with guns. Wouptidoo
That's exactly what's right about "rights", otherwise they'd be called privileges.
You may be given the privilege to have free speech and you may be given the privilege to not be searched illegally. You may be given the privilege to have an attorney.
Doesn't sound quite right.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,967
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: Shroomslip]
#18822971 - 09/10/13 11:14 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
That, of course, is not the issue...No one is issuing permits to people allowing them to use a gun in self-defense. We already have that right, so no permit is necessary...
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
Patlal
You ask too many questions



Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,812
Loc: Ottawa
Last seen: 13 hours, 41 minutes
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#18822975 - 09/10/13 11:14 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:
Patlal said: That's the problem with that stupid 2nd amendment. Instead of saying you have the right to bare arms it should say "you may be given privilege to bare arms".
But since its not written that way, we now have blind people with guns. Wouptidoo
That's exactly what's right about "rights", otherwise they'd be called privileges.
You may be given the privilege to have free speech and you may be given the privilege to not be searched illegally. You may be given the privilege to have an attorney.
Doesn't sound quite right.
All the other amendments are great. The 2nd one is just dangerous.
--------------------
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,967
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: Patlal]
#18822980 - 09/10/13 11:16 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Really? You're a fan of the 18th amendment?
I personally hate the 16th.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: psi]
#18822986 - 09/10/13 11:17 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
psi said:
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:
Patlal said:
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said: I'm amazed how many of you are missing Enlil's point.
To not have your constitutional rights breached due to a disability?
Does a blind person lose their right to freedom of speech? The right to not incriminate themselves? The right to be free from illegal search?
A right is a right.
What are your views on restricting gun rights for the mentally ill?
There are many forms of mental illness. Unless the mentally ill have been judged to be a danger to others...
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
|
Magicman69
All About the Benjamins



Registered: 05/29/13
Posts: 6,876
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#18822990 - 09/10/13 11:18 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
I'm fine with it
|
luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: Patlal]
#18822991 - 09/10/13 11:19 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Patlal said: All the other amendments are great. The 2nd one is just dangerous.
Funny thing. Many disagree.
We have quite a few here on this site. One need only look at the Martin/Zimmerman threads to see just how many don't care for peoples rights.
The Second helps preserve the rest.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
|
GreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche


Registered: 06/20/13
Posts: 3,376
Loc: North Carolina
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: psi]
#18823000 - 09/10/13 11:21 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
A privilege is something given to another by the selfish overindulgent idea of self righteousness. A right is a personal right and everybody should be given that equally. This is the type of argument most liberals would stand for except that it involves weapons and your modern liberal is ignorant in the LIBERTY of weapons.
Add On: I can't stand the ignorance of the people who do not respect the second amendment, it's there for ONE SIMPLE AND PERFECT reason. To defend YOUR PERSONAL FREEDOM, duh.
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
|
Patlal
You ask too many questions



Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,812
Loc: Ottawa
Last seen: 13 hours, 41 minutes
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: luvdemshrooms]
#18823005 - 09/10/13 11:22 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:
Patlal said: All the other amendments are great. The 2nd one is just dangerous.
Funny thing. Many disagree.
We have quite a few here on this site. One need only look at the Martin/Zimmerman threads to see just how many don't care for peoples rights.
The Second helps preserve the rest.
I dunno, it just seems to me that the 2nd amendment was created to prevent government from abusing power. Now that the government is doing it, nobody does shit about it.
--------------------
|
Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 65,967
Loc: Uncanny Valley
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: GreySatyr] 2
#18823011 - 09/10/13 11:23 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
|
luvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?


Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,247
Loc: Lost In Space
|
Re: Iowa Issues Permits for the Blind to Carry Guns in Public [Re: Patlal]
#18823035 - 09/10/13 11:28 AM (10 years, 5 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Patlal said: I dunno, it just seems to me that the 2nd amendment was created to prevent government from abusing power.
Correct.
Quote:
Now that the government is doing it, nobody does shit about it.
What's your hurry?
I personally, as a gun owner and a huge fan of the Second, would rather exhaust all other means of change before considering taking up arms against my government.
-------------------- You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers
|
|