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CitizenErased
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Liner question
#18819004 - 09/09/13 01:58 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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First monotub. Has been colonizing for 9 days. Anyway, the liner on the right side of the tub is laying over and on top of the sub. Should I open the tub once it's fully colonized to pull it back up and maybe tape it to the side or cut it more? Its only about an inch but should I be concerned that too much moisture could get trapped under there during fruiting and cause a problem?
Edited by CitizenErased (09/09/13 01:59 PM)
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Trippy_Penguin



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It should be fine. I just make sure to tape mine up nicely before I fill the tub, but don't forget to remove the tape after colonization
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mason man
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I ran into the same issue this time... all the moisture in the tub during colonization caused the tape to fail.
1. I used shitty tape 2. I should have cut the bag more before i closed it up to colonize.
It's the little things that are only really learnt by first hand experience
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Trippy_Penguin



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I don't even cut my liner before. I just tape it up and load it up. Once it's fully colonized I cut it. That's just my preference though.
Edited by Trippy_Penguin (09/09/13 02:35 PM)
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CitizenErased
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How long does it generally take you guys to fully colonize? I've read a lot of very different numbers. I'm using a 64 quart tub with 8 jars of rye spawn and 9 quarts of coir/verm/ gypsum. Its been 9 days and it looks pretty well colonized to me. It's not a solid blanket of white but close. I've seen the 14 day figure floating around. What are your experiences?
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PussyFart
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10 days or less usually for me....
If it looks fully colonized, not necessarily pure white, but colonized....you can fruit it.
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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CitizenErased
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Thanks. Also, in my last grow, (buckets) which failed, I had the polyfill tightly on the bottom holes and loosely in the top for fruiting. I was just wondering, what would be the difference between tight poly in the bottom holes and just leaving the tape on them?
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PussyFart
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You would screw up the air flow in the tub.
Air comes into the tub thru the top holes, which pushes air out thru the bottom holes.
If the bottom holes are taped, there will be a massive effect on airflow.
Just because the bottom holes are stuffed as tight as possible, does not mean there is no airflow, it is just reduced compared to the top holes.
It would be extremely difficult to stuff a hole with polyfill so tight that it completely stopped airflow....so no worries about stuffing the hole too tight, just make it as tight as possible.
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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mason man
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Quote:
CitizenErased said: How long does it generally take you guys to fully colonize? I've read a lot of very different numbers. I'm using a 64 quart tub with 8 jars of rye spawn and 9 quarts of coir/verm/ gypsum. Its been 9 days and it looks pretty well colonized to me. It's not a solid blanket of white but close. I've seen the 14 day figure floating around. What are your experiences?
What sized jars?
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PussyFart
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Jars of what?
He is asking how long the tub will take, not the jars....
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
Edited by PussyFart (09/09/13 06:23 PM)
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CitizenErased
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Gotchya. (And the jars were quarts). Here are a few pics. Best I could do without lifting the lid or using the flash.



Time to fruit?
Also, is it normal for this much condensation to be on the lid during colonization?
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CitizenErased
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There's definitely more brown in there than you can see in those pics though, so those probably don't really help at all I guess. Ha.
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PussyFart
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Lift the lid and get a good shot of the surface....with flash...
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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CitizenErased
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Isn't that a risk if it's not fully colonized?
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PussyFart
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You must be forgetting that you spawned the tub in open air, and that there are already millions of contams mixed into the substrate.
If the tub was going to contam, it would not be from you lifting the lid for a second or 2....
Pasteurized substrate material is contam resistant, just like fully colonized spawn.
This is how we can get away with spawning in open air.
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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mason man
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Quote:
Notahacker420 said: Jars of what?
He is asking how long the tub will take, not the jars....
Size of jars matter because of the spawn to sub ratio.. using more spawn will lower colonization time, that's why I asked. 8 1/2 pint jars is far far different than 8 quart jars.
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CitizenErased
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Yeah, it definitely wasn't pasteurized properly though. Temps went way over. Tried, but just couldn't keep them down. Decided to try it anyway. Either way, I'm guessing I probably would have run into problems by now if it were too bad. I've just read a bunch of times that you shouldn't touch it at all while colonizing. Don't mean to be paranoid. Just don't want to fuck it up.
I took the picture, but when I lifted the lid, all of the water hanging out on the top of the tub went straight down into the back side of it. Is this something I should worry about?
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Stromrider
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Quote:
CitizenErased said: Isn't that a risk if it's not fully colonized?
Where in the world is this coming from? I keep hearing people say this.
I also keep hearing people saying that the polyfill on a monotub is used to filter the air.
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PussyFart
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Do not worry about the water.
I would give that tub another day or two then fruit it.
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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CitizenErased
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Good enough for me. Thanks for all of the information and advice, guys. Appreciated as always.
Edited by CitizenErased (09/09/13 08:09 PM)
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SpitballJedi
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Quote:
psillyshroomer said:
Quote:
CitizenErased said: Isn't that a risk if it's not fully colonized?
Where in the world is this coming from? I keep hearing people say this.
I also keep hearing people saying that the polyfill on a monotub is used to filter the air.
That's because people like to repeat what they hear without actually understanding. It happens so much that people reading think "so many people say it, so it must be true"
If only there were some way to identify the cultivators you could trust. And then if those cultivators could somehow make and post a record of how they do stuff.
-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
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Stromrider
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Well aren't you a smarty pants tonight
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SpitballJedi
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-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
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cynical bastad
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dumb question of the day:
I've been keeping an eye out for how to sterilize the liner...nobody has said anything about it, that i've found. Is it because sub being pasteurized and spawn being fully colonized it's less resistant? Or are the smurfs wiping w/ alcohol while sleeping?
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PussyFart
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Quote:
cynical bastad said: dumb question of the day:
I've been keeping an eye out for how to sterilize the liner...nobody has said anything about it, that i've found. Is it because sub being pasteurized and spawn being fully colonized it's less resistant? Or are the smurfs wiping w/ alcohol while sleeping? 
Spawning/fruiting is not a sterile process, and if using trash bags they should be sterile off the roll anyways...
Yes, pasteurized bulk substrate material is contam resistant, just like fully colonized spawn....
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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mason man
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Quote:
cynical bastad said: dumb question of the day:
I've been keeping an eye out for how to sterilize the liner...nobody has said anything about it, that i've found. Is it because sub being pasteurized and spawn being fully colonized it's less resistant? Or are the smurfs wiping w/ alcohol while sleeping? 
Never hurts to sanitize. I had bags sitting under the sink for a long time... ripped off two bags and used the third haha. The two I ripped off will be used for actual trash.
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Stromrider
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Good thinking
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CitizenErased
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Welp, I went to put the tub into fruiting today and it's contaminated. Bunch of grey along the edge where the liner was folded over and big spot of trich right in the middle. Needless to say, this is quite discouraging. Not sure what I'm doing wrong. Seeing as how this hasn't even begun fruiting yet, is there any chance anything will come out of it? I can't put it outside like I've heard to do, but I do have a garage.
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Skinty
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Quote:
CitizenErased said: Welp, I went to put the tub into fruiting today and it's contaminated. Bunch of grey along the edge where the liner was folded over and big spot of trich right in the middle. Needless to say, this is quite discouraging. Not sure what I'm doing wrong. Seeing as how this hasn't even begun fruiting yet, is there any chance anything will come out of it? I can't put it outside like I've heard to do, but I do have a garage.
I'd refer you back to what you said about not pasteurising properly - maybe you sterilised yr bulk...
If you have some friends you could invite them over and have a little party in your garage
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Nice Ol Bud
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Re: Liner question [Re: Skinty]
#18827334 - 09/11/13 11:25 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Since were already on the subject. Could I possible line the tub from the outside with a black bag if properly secure? I'd just figure it's less stuff in the Mono.. This less worries of contaminants. I already know about coir and it's resistance.. but I prefer to do it on the outside of the mono. Any suggestions? Thanks everyone!
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SpitballJedi
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No. You missed the point of the liner. The liner goes inside to prevent side pins. If you put it on the outside, it would do nothing.
Use the search feature (UTSF) and search "side pins" or "side pinning" to discover what we are talking about doing with the liner.
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abltsandwich
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Quote:
Notahacker420 said: 10 days or less usually for me....
If it looks fully colonized, not necessarily pure white, but colonized....you can fruit it.
So you don't advocate any consolidation period?
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mason man
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Re: Liner question [Re: Skinty]
#18828076 - 09/11/13 02:37 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Skinty said:
If you have some friends you could invite them over and have a little party in your garage 
Do internet friends count?
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Skinty
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Quote:
mason man said:
Quote:
Skinty said:
If you have some friends you could invite them over and have a little party in your garage 
Do internet friends count?
Only if I'm invited  
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Nice Ol Bud
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Quote:
SpitballJedi said: No. You missed the point of the liner. The liner goes inside to prevent side pins. If you put it on the outside, it would do nothing.
Use the search feature (UTSF) and search "side pins" or "side pinning" to discover what we are talking about doing with the liner.
I'm more then fully aware of side pins. Thanks though.. found my answer from someone more informatable & helpful LOL.
Hope this helps others! <3
Quote:
Bstsneverr said: During colonization i have them in a giant trash bag, and then i check on it on day ten if it needs more time i take it out on day 15 and i drop the bag to substrate level then tape it. Ive never had any real issues with side pinning, the only time i get them is by second flush but the substrate already substantially shrunk from the sides of the bins so i like them popping up there, they grow just fine IMO.
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Doc_D
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Quote:
Nice Ol Bud said:
Quote:
SpitballJedi said: No. You missed the point of the liner. The liner goes inside to prevent side pins. If you put it on the outside, it would do nothing.
Use the search feature (UTSF) and search "side pins" or "side pinning" to discover what we are talking about doing with the liner.
I'm more then fully aware of side pins. Thanks though.. found my answer from someone more informatable & helpful LOL.
Hope this helps others! <3
Quote:
Bstsneverr said: During colonization i have them in a giant trash bag, and then i check on it on day ten if it needs more time i take it out on day 15 and i drop the bag to substrate level then tape it. Ive never had any real issues with side pinning, the only time i get them is by second flush but the substrate already substantially shrunk from the sides of the bins so i like them popping up there, they grow just fine IMO.
When the liner is on the inside and the substrate shrinks it takes the liner with it and as the liner is still attached to the substrate it eliminates side pins completely (I don’t use one but for different reasons).
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Nice Ol Bud
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Re: Liner question [Re: Doc_D]
#18828401 - 09/11/13 03:41 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Doc_D said:
Quote:
Nice Ol Bud said:
Quote:
SpitballJedi said: No. You missed the point of the liner. The liner goes inside to prevent side pins. If you put it on the outside, it would do nothing.
Use the search feature (UTSF) and search "side pins" or "side pinning" to discover what we are talking about doing with the liner.
I'm more then fully aware of side pins. Thanks though.. found my answer from someone more informatable & helpful LOL.
Hope this helps others! <3
Quote:
Bstsneverr said: During colonization i have them in a giant trash bag, and then i check on it on day ten if it needs more time i take it out on day 15 and i drop the bag to substrate level then tape it. Ive never had any real issues with side pinning, the only time i get them is by second flush but the substrate already substantially shrunk from the sides of the bins so i like them popping up there, they grow just fine IMO.
When the liner is on the inside and the substrate shrinks it takes the liner with it and as the liner is still attached to the substrate it eliminates side pins completely (I don’t use one but for different reasons).
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PussyFart
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Quote:
abltsandwich said:
Quote:
Notahacker420 said: 10 days or less usually for me....
If it looks fully colonized, not necessarily pure white, but colonized....you can fruit it.
So you don't advocate any consolidation period?
Nope.....not for bulk.....
--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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Nice Ol Bud
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Quote:
Notahacker420 said:
Quote:
abltsandwich said:
Quote:
Notahacker420 said: 10 days or less usually for me....
If it looks fully colonized, not necessarily pure white, but colonized....you can fruit it.
So you don't advocate any consolidation period?
Nope.....not for bulk.....
Why not? Wouldn't it fruit faster if, for-say, a mono if it consolidated for extra 2 days then fruited? I wouldn't imagine pinning would be more heavy and that you'd get a more even pin set.
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PussyFart
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Consolidation is only for highly nutritious substrate material, like BRF....
They fruit right at 100% for me....
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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abltsandwich
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Don't you usually post RR quotes all the time? As I recall he advocates consolidation for a week or more.
Can you elaborate?
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HypnotoadCroaked
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Quote:
abltsandwich said: Don't you usually post RR quotes all the time? As I recall he advocates consolidation for a week or more.
Can you elaborate?
Bulk monotubs do not need a "consolidation" period. Period. Fruit at 100% colonization. BRF cakes benefit from consolidation. Hope If you need more elaboration, there are plenty of respected cultivators, Nothahacker420 included who advise and advocate exactly as I described. This has been brought up a number of times. Coir/verm/hpoo etc are not a solid mass of nutrition like brown rice flower.
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PussyFart
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Quote:
abltsandwich said: Don't you usually post RR quotes all the time? As I recall he advocates consolidation for a week or more.
Can you elaborate?
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/18194095#18194095
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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abltsandwich
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That quote says it's always a good idea to consolidate and to let it consolidate a few days and fruit for bulk. That's different than what you said, which is to fruit immediately at 100%. I'm just wondering why. It's been several years since I've even attempted a grow and when I was cultivating consolidation was always recommended for bulk. Searches turn up many different things. I see TCs mentioning to consolidate, and others saying not. Maybe my search syntax is wrong.
Edited by abltsandwich (09/12/13 03:11 PM)
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PussyFart
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There are a lot of TCs that fruit right at 100% without issue, and think it helps the first flush in yield...there are also a good number who believe that consolidating for a few days is the only way, and helps the first flush just the same....either way it all works, but you can fruit at 100% without issue, I can attest to this personally.
I agree, that was probably not the best quote i could have found, lol.....
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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Stromrider
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Like is said before you're slipping hacker
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abltsandwich
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I really just want to further my knowledge of the how and why of things on this. The explanation of mycelia needing to "digest" what they've colonized, and it taking many days of consolidation for this to happen, makes sense to me. So if that's not the case, what's going on? Sorry to derail the thread but I've been searching MushCult for the last 30 minutes and I can't find any info that's up-to-date.
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PussyFart
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The higher the amount of nutrients in a substrate, the more consolidation time is needed.
BRF cakes are almost on the border of being too nutritious....so a week of consolidation is recommended at the minimum.
Bulk substrates are way less nutritious, so they require very little if any consolidation time. The grains are way more nutritious than the substrate, hence why the mycelium rips through it so fast.....mycellium will colonize a less nutritious substrate faster than one with a lot of nutrients....it stretches out in search of more food.
Hope that helps a little.
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
Edited by PussyFart (09/12/13 04:04 PM)
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 8,598
Loc: Nibiru
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Quote:
Notahacker420 said: I agree, that was probably not the best quote i could have found, lol..... 
Really tho, it probably is the best one because it really does show how "unstrict a science" this is
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CitizenErased
Stranger
Registered: 05/10/13
Posts: 246
Last seen: 6 years, 11 months
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I know that I asked this briefly before, but wasn't really clear on the response. Should I expect a tub that has contaminated so early to bear any fruits at all?
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