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Skinty
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Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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My probably doomed outdoor humus project!
#18810598 - 09/07/13 05:56 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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SO I had a mini mono that produced one half decent flush and then just stalled - suspected contam. Also some lackluster sterile technique (laziness) lead to 8 contam'd BRF cakes
Well I thought other people have good times with outdoor work so why not me? Only problem - small and conspicuous garden and north west Europe don't make for an ideal cube growing environment...
Anyway - I'm a keen gardener and composter and I figured that humus (no, not hummus)i.e. well decomposed organic matter could make an excellent bulk substrate.
I've taken a tub (prob 66 litres / quarts+) chucked in all the BRF / mono shit and mixed it with a shed load of humus. It's sat in a corner out of view of neighbours with spent coffee grounds getting dumped on it daily...
Anyone have any thoughts on this? Is humus in anyway useable as a bulk substrate? How moist should I keep this thing??? Is this strategy a complete waste of time? and would be good to keep crumbling on spent cakes and other crap? 
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Skinty
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Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18814632 - 09/08/13 10:35 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I have come to the conclusion that a response of zero probably means that what I have created is a load of nonce sense
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,326
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18814642 - 09/08/13 10:39 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I just dump my spent monotubs out in the woods and water daily. Well I say spent but I dump them after the second flush. I get a killer third flush this way. My last one I did this with I got 4.8 oz off of it! That was almost as much as the first 2 flushes. I live in the southeastern us so I have a good cube growing climate so that helps.
I can't answer your humus question. Sorry but I have no experience with it
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Trippy_Penguin



Registered: 03/18/12
Posts: 624
Last seen: 3 years, 5 months
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18814686 - 09/08/13 10:57 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Skinty said: I have come to the conclusion that a response of zero probably means that what I have created is a load of nonce sense 
If you're having contam problems already, don't make things harder on yourself. Coir and vermiculite until you get stuff figured out better.
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Skinty
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Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Stromrider]
#18814707 - 09/08/13 11:02 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
psillyshroomer said: I just dump my spent monotubs out in the woods and water daily. Well I say spent but I dump them after the second flush. I get a killer third flush this way. My last one I did this with I got 4.8 oz off of it! That was almost as much as the first 2 flushes. I live in the southeastern us so I have a good cube growing climate so that helps.
I can't answer your humus question. Sorry but I have no experience with it
It was impressive results like yours that got me interested in outside grows...
I'd be interested in having more feedback about the suitability of humus as a grow medium outside - in my mind it makes sense that it could work well...
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Skinty
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Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Trippy_Penguin]
#18814711 - 09/08/13 11:04 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
petersodm said:
Quote:
Skinty said: I have come to the conclusion that a response of zero probably means that what I have created is a load of nonce sense 
If you're having contam problems already, don't make things harder on yourself. Coir and vermiculite until you get stuff figured out better.

I'm talking about an outside grow. Like I said my contam problems are due to laziness as opposed to lack of knowledge and are not a problem as such. Getting contams was the kick up the ass I needed to not be complacent. Thanks though
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,326
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 1 hour, 8 minutes
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18814715 - 09/08/13 11:05 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yeah I don't know why it wouldn't but like I said I have zero experience with it. Hopefully someone that does will chime in. Did you try the search function to see if it would return anything useful on the subject?
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Skinty
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Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Stromrider]
#18814720 - 09/08/13 11:08 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
psillyshroomer said: Yeah I don't know why it wouldn't but like I said I have zero experience with it. Hopefully someone that does will chime in. Did you try the search function to see if it would return anything useful on the subject?
Zero threads with anything about humus. I don't know whether it's called something else in the US?? H-poo / any kind of poo from a herbivore is essentially uber broken down organic plant material so for me it follow that this could work. I will let you know the results
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omegafaust
mycofarmer



Registered: 05/29/12
Posts: 1,227
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18814783 - 09/08/13 11:25 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Humus is humus, in the us and europe. humus can be any organic matter that is sufficientlydecomposed. if its from cow or horse manure it may work, but I would probably add something to lghten it up, like verm, coir.
You say you're a keen gardner
that compost pile might be usable.
search for threads on compost, especially ones posted by agar.
If I recall correctly he says compost is the best substrate for the fungus, however that information may be outdated.
Compost goes through two phases and then is suitable for cultivation. you're looking for a partially decomposed product, not completely decomposed.
which is why I wonder what your humus originated from and how dense it is.
hope this wall of text has helped, anyone feel free to reprimand me if i have spread any false information.
-------------------- The Universe has an interesting sense of irony, in that you are the universe experiencing itself. All you are is a thought.
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Skinty
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Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: omegafaust]
#18814846 - 09/08/13 11:40 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
omegafaust said: Humus is humus, in the us and europe. humus can be any organic matter that is sufficientlydecomposed. if its from cow or horse manure it may work, but I would probably add something to lghten it up, like verm, coir.
You say you're a keen gardner
that compost pile might be usable.
search for threads on compost, especially ones posted by agar.
If I recall correctly he says compost is the best substrate for the fungus, however that information may be outdated.
Compost goes through two phases and then is suitable for cultivation. you're looking for a partially decomposed product, not completely decomposed.
which is why I wonder what your humus originated from and how dense it is.
hope this wall of text has helped, anyone feel free to reprimand me if i have spread any false information.
Interesting - thankyou. What are these "two phases"? The way I see it (from a gardener perspective) you have partly broken down decomposing material which at least in part resembles the original material (i.e. you could still tell it was an orange peel or a leaf) - I would not use this as "compost" as it is still decomposing. Then you have "humus" which is broken down material that resembles soil or compost you would buy. The latter of these is what I am using which is a blend of decomposed fruits / vegetables / garden plant.
I think the addition of verm would be useful - I stupidly hadn't thought of that. I have added gypsum however and as I said spent coffee grounds.
I'm not sure at this point whether mixing verm in would be helpful or whether it would be better to leave the material to be colonised in peace? 
Thanks for the feedback 
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omegafaust
mycofarmer



Registered: 05/29/12
Posts: 1,227
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18815413 - 09/08/13 02:17 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I would just let it sit for now, not to disrupt the mycelium. I'm no expert though.
in regards to the phases of composting, the first is what you do outside, partially decompose the material. The second phase pays more attention to detail, controlling... wait a second...
Quote:
agar said: The preparation of mushroom compost is usually done in two stages. The breakdown of raw ingredients begins in Phase I. Phase I is characterized by building the raw ingredients into long rectangular piles approximately 2 m high called "ricks" or "windrows". These stacks are then periodically turned, watered, and formed. This phase is essentially a microbiological process resulting in release of energy and heat.
To favor the development of relatively high temperatures, aerobic conditions are maintained by aerating the compost during repeated mixing or turning. Temperature fluctuations during this phase are paralleled by similar changes in the numbers of thermophilic (heat loving) bacteria. These organisms start to grow rapidly and release energy in the form of heat. Thermogenesis by microorganisms initiates the heating of Phase I and also produces heat in Phase II.
The internal temperature of a compost pile can reach up to 80oC. Traditional Phase I composting lasts from 7 to 14 days depending on the condition of the material at the start and its characteristics at each turn. It is considered complete when the raw ingredients have become pliable and are capable of holding water. The odor of ammonia should be sharp, and the color of the compost is dark-brown in color, indicating caramelization and browning reactions have occurred.
It is primarily the control of the environment that distinguishes Phase II from Phase I. Typically, compost is loaded into wooden trays, which are stacked, and then placed in specially designed rooms where the environmental conditions can be manipulated. Phase II is commonly referred to as peak-heating and may be initiated by steam. Pasteurization is accomplished early in the Phase II operation and is necessary to kill many insects, nematodes, and other pests or pathogens that may be present in the compost.
Pasteurization requires air and compost temperatures of 66oC for a minimum of 2 hours. Once pasteurization is accomplished, cool air is introduced into the Phase II room to assure adequate oxygen, and to help dissipate ammonia. An important function of Phase II microbes that survive the pasteurization process is the conversion of residual ammonia into protein. Because ammonia is lethal to the mushroom mycelium, it must be removed by the end of Phase II.
A stage is reached when the available food supplies for organisms inhabiting the compost become quite limiting, hence their activity decreases. The substrate is now set for spawning, and the substrate is said to be 'selective' for the growth of mushrooms. Once the odor of ammonia is no longer present, Phase II is over and the compost temperature can be dropped to 24oC for the addition of any type grain spawn. Completed compost should have a C/N ratio of around 17 to 1, with N in the area of 2.6.
Initially raw compost will have an alkaline pH. When mature and ready for inoculation the pH should be between 7.0 and 8.0. As the mushroom and mycelium grows there will be a drop of pH from the excreted metabolites until the pH reaches 5.0-5.5 at which time mushroom production will generally cease.
Optimal cubensis compost has this finished makeup: carbon / nitrogen ratio <17:1, nitrogen 2.6%, phosphorus 0.2-05%, potassium 1.5-2.5%, calcium 1.5-2.5%, available boron <2 ppm, available ammonium <10 ppm, soluble salts 3.0-5 OdS/m.
I. Guidelines for calculating pre/compost nitrogen (N) content: Calculate the starting N content of pile to be 1.5 to 1.7% before composting. The starting N for a synthetic compost formulas may be slightly higher than the wheat straw horse manure formulas. The percent N will increase throughout Phase I composting and Phase II and at spawning time the N content of the compost should be 2.1-2.6 %.
Knowing the N and % moisture of the bulk ingredients and supplements will increase the accuracy of the calculated and finished nitrogen content. If supplements are added by volume, occasionally weigh volume added to confirm calculated formula.
At the end of Phase I and again at the end of Phase II, compost may be analyzed for N, ammonia, ash and moisture. It is important to take a representative samples, several small handfuls thoroughly mixed. When taking a sample do not shake the compost.
II. Examples of Mushroom Compost Formulas
Horse manure pile Ingredients Wet Wt. Dry Wt. %N Tons N Horse manure 80 T 50 T 1.2% 0.6 T Poultry manure 7.5 T 6.0 T 4 % 0.24 T Brewers Grains 2.5 T 2.5 T 4 % 0.1 T Gypsum 1.25 T 1.25 T 0 0 59.75 T 0.94 ? 59.75 = 1.57%
Synthetic pile Ingredients Wet Wt. Dry Wt. %N Tons N Hay 15 T 12.8 T 2.0 % 0.26 T Cobs 15 T 12.8 T 0.3 % 0.04 T Poultry manure 3.8 T 2.4 T 4 % 0.09 T NH4NO3 0.3 T 0.3 T 32% 0.10 T Potash 0.3 T 0.3 T 0.0 0.00 Gypsum 0.6 T 0.6 T 0.0 0.00 29.2 T 0.49 ? 29.2 = 1.68%
Horse manure-synthetic blend Ingredients Wet Wt. Dry Wt. %N Tons N Horse manure 15 T 10.5 T 1.2% 0.13 Hay 7.5 T 6.3 T 1.1% 0.07 Corn Cobs 7.5 T 6.4 T 0.3% 0.02 Brewer's grains 3.0 T 3.0 T 4.0% 0.12 Poultry manure 2.0 T 2.0 T 4.5% 0.09 Urea 0.1 T 0.1 T 44.0% 0.06 Potash 0.2 T 0.2 T 0.0% 0.00 Gypsum 1.0 T 1.0 T 0.0% 0.00 29.5 0.49 ? 29.5 = 1.66%
III. Suggested watering procedures during composting:
Add as much water as possible without run off during pre-wet conditioning or during the first two turns. Avoid adding too much water early during Phase I, always be able to control moisture. Add only enough during next turn or turns to wet dry spots. Bring up compost moisture to desired water content by adequate watering just before filling.
During pre-wet it is advisable to flip or turn the compost every day. After the rick or pile is built, the compost should be turn every other day unless pile temperatures have not peaked.
IV. Changes in organic matter, carbohydrates and nitrogen during mushroom composting.
Soluble carbohydrates are simply adsorbed by the micro-organisms and it is converted into new living matter or provides energy for the cells. As these micro-organism grow energy in the form of heat is released.
As the pile heats to temperature above 150o F the activities occurring within the pile change from biological to chemical reactions. It is at these higher temperatures that carmelization takes place. Carmelization is the process where water is eliminated from the carbohydrates and carbon is concentrated. This process can be compared to boiling sap down to make maple sugar.
V. Phase I is considered complete when as soon as the raw ingredients become pliable and are capable of holding water, the odor of ammonia is sharp and the dark brown color indicates carmelization and browning reactions have occurred.
Moisture content at filling should be 70-73%. Water should drip from compost squeezed in the hand. But a good rule of thumb to follow is: the longer, greener or more coarse the compost then more moisture it can take. The shorter, more mature or dense the compost the less water it should have.
The shorter or wetter the compost, the more loosely it should be filled into the beds or trays. The longer or greener the compost, the more it can be firmed into the beds. Attempt to fill uniformly in both depth and compaction. Edges or sideboards should be packed slightly tighter, whereas the center should remain looser.
VI. Phase II composting has two objectives:
Pasteurization - elimination of undesirable insect pest, microbes and pathogens.
Conditioning - Creation of specific food for the mushroom and creating a selective and suppressive compost to favor the growth of the mushroom. VII. Insure adequate ventilation during Phase II. When in doubt, ventilate. A flame should be burn at all times.
The higher the nitrogen content of compost, the greener the compost or the more dry weight at filling time, the greater the ventilation required. When outside temperature is high as in summer or early fall, more ventilation is required than when Phase II occurs during the cold winter weather. This is especially important when the grower does not have a forced air ventilation system.
VIII. During Phase II keep compost in the temperature range where microorganisms grow best (115-140o F).
Microbes convert ammonia and ammonia containing salts into protein and other nitrogen compounds the mushroom uses for food. The growth of these microbes depends on having the available food, adequate moisture, sufficient oxygen and suitable temperature. A shortage of one of these requirements will limit growth and often results in incomplete conditioning.
IX. Heat up (pasteurization) for insect kill early in Phase II (perhaps 1-4 days after filling) so as to avoid a second heating cycle of the compost.
A good indication that the compost is ready to pasteurized, is the subsiding of microbial activity, which is indicated by a decrease in compost temperature at the same air temperature.
X. After pasteurization slowly lower compost through the temperature ranges of the microorganisms. A general rule is to lower compost temperature no more than 4-5o F. per day.
Provided that enough food, water and oxygen the microbes will continue to grow. Different microbes use different compounds and grow at different temperatures. Therefore it is important to make sure all areas of the beds and room gradually drop through all temperatures ranges.
Thermophillic fungi grow at lower temperatures and are important because they are able to grow into denser areas of compost.
XI. Composting is considered compete when no trace of ammonia odor can be detected and the compost has a uniform flecking of white colonies of actinomycetes, called fire-fang. The N content on a dry wt. basis should be in the range of 2.0 to 2.6.
As the mushroom and mycelium grows there will be a drop of pH from the excreted metabolites until the pH reaches 5.0-5.5 at which time mushroom production will generally cease.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5419358#5419358. that's the thread.
-------------------- The Universe has an interesting sense of irony, in that you are the universe experiencing itself. All you are is a thought.
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Skinty
TOP SECRET


Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: omegafaust]
#18815453 - 09/08/13 02:28 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
omegafaust said: I would just let it sit for now, not to disrupt the mycelium. I'm no expert though.
in regards to the phases of composting, the first is what you do outside, partially decompose the material. The second phase pays more attention to detail, controlling... wait a second...
Quote:
agar said: The preparation of mushroom compost is usually done in two stages. The breakdown of raw ingredients begins in Phase I. Phase I is characterized by building the raw ingredients into long rectangular piles approximately 2 m high called "ricks" or "windrows". These stacks are then periodically turned, watered, and formed. This phase is essentially a microbiological process resulting in release of energy and heat.
To favor the development of relatively high temperatures, aerobic conditions are maintained by aerating the compost during repeated mixing or turning. Temperature fluctuations during this phase are paralleled by similar changes in the numbers of thermophilic (heat loving) bacteria. These organisms start to grow rapidly and release energy in the form of heat. Thermogenesis by microorganisms initiates the heating of Phase I and also produces heat in Phase II.
The internal temperature of a compost pile can reach up to 80oC. Traditional Phase I composting lasts from 7 to 14 days depending on the condition of the material at the start and its characteristics at each turn. It is considered complete when the raw ingredients have become pliable and are capable of holding water. The odor of ammonia should be sharp, and the color of the compost is dark-brown in color, indicating caramelization and browning reactions have occurred.
It is primarily the control of the environment that distinguishes Phase II from Phase I. Typically, compost is loaded into wooden trays, which are stacked, and then placed in specially designed rooms where the environmental conditions can be manipulated. Phase II is commonly referred to as peak-heating and may be initiated by steam. Pasteurization is accomplished early in the Phase II operation and is necessary to kill many insects, nematodes, and other pests or pathogens that may be present in the compost.
Pasteurization requires air and compost temperatures of 66oC for a minimum of 2 hours. Once pasteurization is accomplished, cool air is introduced into the Phase II room to assure adequate oxygen, and to help dissipate ammonia. An important function of Phase II microbes that survive the pasteurization process is the conversion of residual ammonia into protein. Because ammonia is lethal to the mushroom mycelium, it must be removed by the end of Phase II.
A stage is reached when the available food supplies for organisms inhabiting the compost become quite limiting, hence their activity decreases. The substrate is now set for spawning, and the substrate is said to be 'selective' for the growth of mushrooms. Once the odor of ammonia is no longer present, Phase II is over and the compost temperature can be dropped to 24oC for the addition of any type grain spawn. Completed compost should have a C/N ratio of around 17 to 1, with N in the area of 2.6.
Initially raw compost will have an alkaline pH. When mature and ready for inoculation the pH should be between 7.0 and 8.0. As the mushroom and mycelium grows there will be a drop of pH from the excreted metabolites until the pH reaches 5.0-5.5 at which time mushroom production will generally cease.
Optimal cubensis compost has this finished makeup: carbon / nitrogen ratio <17:1, nitrogen 2.6%, phosphorus 0.2-05%, potassium 1.5-2.5%, calcium 1.5-2.5%, available boron <2 ppm, available ammonium <10 ppm, soluble salts 3.0-5 OdS/m.
I. Guidelines for calculating pre/compost nitrogen (N) content: Calculate the starting N content of pile to be 1.5 to 1.7% before composting. The starting N for a synthetic compost formulas may be slightly higher than the wheat straw horse manure formulas. The percent N will increase throughout Phase I composting and Phase II and at spawning time the N content of the compost should be 2.1-2.6 %.
Knowing the N and % moisture of the bulk ingredients and supplements will increase the accuracy of the calculated and finished nitrogen content. If supplements are added by volume, occasionally weigh volume added to confirm calculated formula.
At the end of Phase I and again at the end of Phase II, compost may be analyzed for N, ammonia, ash and moisture. It is important to take a representative samples, several small handfuls thoroughly mixed. When taking a sample do not shake the compost.
II. Examples of Mushroom Compost Formulas
Horse manure pile Ingredients Wet Wt. Dry Wt. %N Tons N Horse manure 80 T 50 T 1.2% 0.6 T Poultry manure 7.5 T 6.0 T 4 % 0.24 T Brewers Grains 2.5 T 2.5 T 4 % 0.1 T Gypsum 1.25 T 1.25 T 0 0 59.75 T 0.94 ? 59.75 = 1.57%
Synthetic pile Ingredients Wet Wt. Dry Wt. %N Tons N Hay 15 T 12.8 T 2.0 % 0.26 T Cobs 15 T 12.8 T 0.3 % 0.04 T Poultry manure 3.8 T 2.4 T 4 % 0.09 T NH4NO3 0.3 T 0.3 T 32% 0.10 T Potash 0.3 T 0.3 T 0.0 0.00 Gypsum 0.6 T 0.6 T 0.0 0.00 29.2 T 0.49 ? 29.2 = 1.68%
Horse manure-synthetic blend Ingredients Wet Wt. Dry Wt. %N Tons N Horse manure 15 T 10.5 T 1.2% 0.13 Hay 7.5 T 6.3 T 1.1% 0.07 Corn Cobs 7.5 T 6.4 T 0.3% 0.02 Brewer's grains 3.0 T 3.0 T 4.0% 0.12 Poultry manure 2.0 T 2.0 T 4.5% 0.09 Urea 0.1 T 0.1 T 44.0% 0.06 Potash 0.2 T 0.2 T 0.0% 0.00 Gypsum 1.0 T 1.0 T 0.0% 0.00 29.5 0.49 ? 29.5 = 1.66%
III. Suggested watering procedures during composting:
Add as much water as possible without run off during pre-wet conditioning or during the first two turns. Avoid adding too much water early during Phase I, always be able to control moisture. Add only enough during next turn or turns to wet dry spots. Bring up compost moisture to desired water content by adequate watering just before filling.
During pre-wet it is advisable to flip or turn the compost every day. After the rick or pile is built, the compost should be turn every other day unless pile temperatures have not peaked.
IV. Changes in organic matter, carbohydrates and nitrogen during mushroom composting.
Soluble carbohydrates are simply adsorbed by the micro-organisms and it is converted into new living matter or provides energy for the cells. As these micro-organism grow energy in the form of heat is released.
As the pile heats to temperature above 150o F the activities occurring within the pile change from biological to chemical reactions. It is at these higher temperatures that carmelization takes place. Carmelization is the process where water is eliminated from the carbohydrates and carbon is concentrated. This process can be compared to boiling sap down to make maple sugar.
V. Phase I is considered complete when as soon as the raw ingredients become pliable and are capable of holding water, the odor of ammonia is sharp and the dark brown color indicates carmelization and browning reactions have occurred.
Moisture content at filling should be 70-73%. Water should drip from compost squeezed in the hand. But a good rule of thumb to follow is: the longer, greener or more coarse the compost then more moisture it can take. The shorter, more mature or dense the compost the less water it should have.
The shorter or wetter the compost, the more loosely it should be filled into the beds or trays. The longer or greener the compost, the more it can be firmed into the beds. Attempt to fill uniformly in both depth and compaction. Edges or sideboards should be packed slightly tighter, whereas the center should remain looser.
VI. Phase II composting has two objectives:
Pasteurization - elimination of undesirable insect pest, microbes and pathogens.
Conditioning - Creation of specific food for the mushroom and creating a selective and suppressive compost to favor the growth of the mushroom. VII. Insure adequate ventilation during Phase II. When in doubt, ventilate. A flame should be burn at all times.
The higher the nitrogen content of compost, the greener the compost or the more dry weight at filling time, the greater the ventilation required. When outside temperature is high as in summer or early fall, more ventilation is required than when Phase II occurs during the cold winter weather. This is especially important when the grower does not have a forced air ventilation system.
VIII. During Phase II keep compost in the temperature range where microorganisms grow best (115-140o F).
Microbes convert ammonia and ammonia containing salts into protein and other nitrogen compounds the mushroom uses for food. The growth of these microbes depends on having the available food, adequate moisture, sufficient oxygen and suitable temperature. A shortage of one of these requirements will limit growth and often results in incomplete conditioning.
IX. Heat up (pasteurization) for insect kill early in Phase II (perhaps 1-4 days after filling) so as to avoid a second heating cycle of the compost.
A good indication that the compost is ready to pasteurized, is the subsiding of microbial activity, which is indicated by a decrease in compost temperature at the same air temperature.
X. After pasteurization slowly lower compost through the temperature ranges of the microorganisms. A general rule is to lower compost temperature no more than 4-5o F. per day.
Provided that enough food, water and oxygen the microbes will continue to grow. Different microbes use different compounds and grow at different temperatures. Therefore it is important to make sure all areas of the beds and room gradually drop through all temperatures ranges.
Thermophillic fungi grow at lower temperatures and are important because they are able to grow into denser areas of compost.
XI. Composting is considered compete when no trace of ammonia odor can be detected and the compost has a uniform flecking of white colonies of actinomycetes, called fire-fang. The N content on a dry wt. basis should be in the range of 2.0 to 2.6.
As the mushroom and mycelium grows there will be a drop of pH from the excreted metabolites until the pH reaches 5.0-5.5 at which time mushroom production will generally cease.
http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/5419358#5419358. that's the thread.
Whilst that doesn't look that complicated I'm too wasted right now to take it in - therefore I will simply say thanks for the info right now and I'll revisit this tomorrow
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Stromrider
This must be the place



Registered: 06/02/13
Posts: 7,326
Loc: Dept of know what I'm say...
Last seen: 1 hour, 8 minutes
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18815461 - 09/08/13 02:32 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Skinty
TOP SECRET


Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Stromrider]
#18817697 - 09/09/13 02:42 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yes an interesting read Omega - thanks.
Made me think that humus COULD work but next time I will pasteurize it as per normal bulk procedure before spawning to it. I think this would be sensible despite it being outdoors... 
Would love to hear others experience of using humus if anyone has tried this.
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Skinty
TOP SECRET


Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18818426 - 09/09/13 10:31 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Well looks like I got a couple of pins...will update with pics soon if anyone is interested
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omegafaust
mycofarmer



Registered: 05/29/12
Posts: 1,227
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18818483 - 09/09/13 10:51 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I would love to see. That's the beauty of outdoor spawning, nature does pretty well for you.
-------------------- The Universe has an interesting sense of irony, in that you are the universe experiencing itself. All you are is a thought.
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Skinty
TOP SECRET


Registered: 07/04/13
Posts: 1,150
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: omegafaust]
#18818486 - 09/09/13 10:53 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
omegafaust said: I would love to see. That's the beauty of outdoor spawning, nature does pretty well for you.
Do you think there would be an advantage in pasteurising before spawning in this kind of scenario?
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omegafaust
mycofarmer



Registered: 05/29/12
Posts: 1,227
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Re: My probably doomed outdoor humus project! [Re: Skinty]
#18818696 - 09/09/13 12:15 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I believe there would be definite benefits. pasteurizing leaves beneficial microbes and allows the mycelium to grab ahold before contams. and nature seems to balance itself, so i would think pasteurizing is a great idea.
sterilization of course, is out of the question.
I could be wrong though
-------------------- The Universe has an interesting sense of irony, in that you are the universe experiencing itself. All you are is a thought.
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