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Offlinexbloodwhipx

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Is severe psychosis like ego death?
    #18804865 - 09/05/13 07:53 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

If you completely lose touch with reality, wouldnt that be like ego death? Is it possible to lose touch with reality to the point of ego death? Like can you mentally go "that far" without using drugs?


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Offlinexbloodwhipx

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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18804868 - 09/05/13 07:54 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

xbloodwhipx said:
Like can you mentally go "that far" without using drugs?



And i mean from mental illness, not from sensory deprivation or mediation or anything like that


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OfflineTaybs
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18804876 - 09/05/13 07:56 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

i think thats what schizophrenia is like


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OfflineLizard Eyes
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx] * 1
    #18804879 - 09/05/13 07:56 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I would say no.... my flirtation with Psychosis has always been ripe with lots of good old fashioned paranoia. If you experience ego death theres not really much to be paranoid about is there? Idk thats just the way I see it.


To me paranoia is the opposite of ego death, its worrying about stuff that will happen to you. :shrug:


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Offlinexbloodwhipx

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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Taybs]
    #18804881 - 09/05/13 07:57 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Taybs said:
i think thats what schizophrenia is like



I dont think you completely lose your ego from schizophrenia but i could be wrong.


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Offlinetwighead
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Taybs] * 2
    #18804883 - 09/05/13 07:57 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Taybs said:
i think thats what schizophrenia is like



Schizophrenics I've met have had massive ego inflation - they think they're the son of god, the antichrist etc. etc.


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OfflineShroomslip
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx] * 1
    #18804885 - 09/05/13 07:58 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I could be wrong but I don't think ego death and "losing touch with reality" are interchangeable.. I've yet to experience it so I could be wrong, but I think both concepts are their own thing.


--------------------
With my face against the floor I can’t see who knocked me out of the way.
I don’t want to get back up but I have to so it might as well be today.
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I’m in no shape to be alone contrary to the shit that you might hear.


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Invisiblesmack
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #18804891 - 09/05/13 07:59 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Ego death is the complete obliteration of your concept of your self. The realization that you are no better than anyone else, and that value is yet to determined upon recovery.


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14:31


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Offlinexbloodwhipx

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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #18804897 - 09/05/13 08:01 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomslip said:
I could be wrong but I don't think ego death and "losing touch with reality" are interchangeable.. I've yet to experience it so I could be wrong, but I think both concepts are their own thing.



You are completely not mentally in reality when you have ego death, you dont know what earth/people are or what you are, I would say they are interchangeable.


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Offlineberdinwall
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18804933 - 09/05/13 08:13 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I was under the impression ego death was kind of like a gradual thing...not like it just happens and you're there...

ego death to me was on an eighth of mushrooms and every thought "I" had was completely obliterated by the truth that "I" was a lie and almost every thought I had was proven wrong...it was wrong..."I" realized "I" was a made up thing by "me" which was pretty fucking devastating...you know how you get your heart broken when your partner of a long time leaves you or your best friend betrays you or you find out you were adopted or something...ego death is a lot like that I think except it applies to everything you've ever known....I realized I live a complete lie that night and I know to this day I still do....it's pretty fuckin redick and no one wants to admit it but it's always happening


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Invisiblevolcomstoner
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: berdinwall] * 2
    #18804945 - 09/05/13 08:17 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

So is this ego death like, a real thing or something made up by hippies?


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InvisibleMagicman69
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: volcomstoner]
    #18804979 - 09/05/13 08:29 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Ego death to me was being completely shut off from emotions about anything. Everything just is the way its supposed to be. There was no more me to react to things anymore, so I viewed them for what they really are.


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Offlinexbloodwhipx

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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: berdinwall]
    #18805005 - 09/05/13 08:34 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

berdinwall said:
I was under the impression ego death was kind of like a gradual thing...not like it just happens and you're there...

ego death to me was on an eighth of mushrooms and every thought "I" had was completely obliterated by the truth that "I" was a lie and almost every thought I had was proven wrong...it was wrong..."I" realized "I" was a made up thing by "me" which was pretty fucking devastating...you know how you get your heart broken when your partner of a long time leaves you or your best friend betrays you or you find out you were adopted or something...ego death is a lot like that I think except it applies to everything you've ever known....I realized I live a complete lie that night and I know to this day I still do....it's pretty fuckin redick and no one wants to admit it but it's always happening




Yeah well IME the end product is nothingness and everything at once. Trying to put it in words is near impossible. But there was certainly no "reality" involved.

At first it was like i was becoming less and less aware of my surronding and more inside of my own mind. Then my surrondings began to fade into a melting mess and i shut my eyes. Thats when i started losing my sense of who i am and where i was. Then i forgot i was on drugs, i still knew i was a person and on earth, but at some point that faded also. Then it was like i was just... Gone. I cant put it into words. At some point i started to become aware again and comedown.


Also, there where no earthly "things" existent. As far as im concerned i was in a different realm of awareness and existence, but A very peaceful yet very chaotic one. Also i dont know if I remember the peak. I felt like i was in the presence of something greater. Not a being or spirit or god. Just something that was there, i felt like i was part of it. Its hurting my brain to try to explain it.


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Offlinedruqs
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18805030 - 09/05/13 08:42 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

i've had psycosis pretty bad, still getting over it really to some degree even though its been 2 and a bit years.

i never experience ego death per se (as it is quite a hard thing to describe) but i am a changed person.


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18805058 - 09/05/13 08:47 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah in a way. I mean when I had ego death from gnarly shrooms I felt pretty fucking schizophrenic but something that is probably closer and I recently just experienced is GABAergic withdrawal. Heard voices, felt shit crawling on me, extreme primal paranoia, pretty much everything, racing thoughts, dreams were like reality to the point when I woke up I thought the dreams actually happened, fuck everything that can go wrong involves GABA receptors going ape shit. All from taking Phenibut once and then going on a 3 day drinking spree. I think I had some acute (minor) Delirium tremens even though I only drink once-twice a week if that. Probably why they say don't mix phenibut with alcohol EVER!!

Quote:

The main symptoms of delirium tremens are nightmares, agitation, global confusion, disorientation, visual and [7] auditory hallucinations, fever, hypertension, diaphoresis, and other signs of autonomic hyperactivity (tachycardia and hypertension). These symptoms may appear suddenly but can develop 2–3 days after cessation of drinking heavily with its highest intensity on the fourth or fifth day.[8] Also, these "symptoms are characteristically worse at night".[9] In general DT is considered as the most severe manifestation of alcohol withdrawal, which occurs 3–10 days following the last drink.[7] Other common symptoms include intense perceptual disturbance such as visions of insects, snakes, or rats. These may be hallucinations, or illusions related to the environment, e.g., patterns on the wallpaper or in the peripheral vision that the patient falsely perceives as a resemblance to the morphology of an insect, and are also associated with tactile hallucinations such as sensations of something crawling on the subject — a phenomenon known as formication. Delirium tremens usually includes extremely intense feelings of "impending doom". Severe anxiety and feelings of imminent death are symptomatic of DT.

DT can sometimes be associated with severe, uncontrollable tremors of the extremities and secondary symptoms such as anxiety, panic attacks and paranoia. Confusion is often noticeable to onlookers as patients will have trouble constructing simple sentences or making basic logical calculations. In many cases, people who rarely speak out of turn will have an increased tendency for gaffes even though they are sober.




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Offlinexbloodwhipx

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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Gorlax]
    #18805087 - 09/05/13 08:51 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah but like what im asking is, is it possible to go so crazy that you are unaware of ANTHTHING? Like your body is there but your mind may as well be dead?


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Invisibleluvdemboomers
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx] * 1
    #18805099 - 09/05/13 08:53 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I'd say they are polar opposites.

Psychosis is all about you.
Ego death there is no you.


Edited by luvdemboomers (09/05/13 08:55 PM)


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Offlinetwighead
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18805104 - 09/05/13 08:54 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I'm sure every point in the spectrum has more or less been covered by someone :lol:


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Offlinexbloodwhipx

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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: twighead]
    #18805130 - 09/05/13 08:59 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah, just the definition of severe psychosis has always confused me. Wouldnt complete loss of contact with reality mean you where like... Mentally turned off?

Then some defintions make it sound like delirium.

I guess i could compare it to drugs. Is severe psychosis more like being on DMT (blasted out of reality, unresponsive and mentally unaware of yourself) or datura?


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Offlinedanlennon3
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18805295 - 09/05/13 09:33 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

ego death and psychosis are worlds apart. I have experienced my fair share of both and they have very little in common. ego loss is like a way to experience the universe, which is essentially nothing-ness. Psychosis on the other hand causes you to see things in a very linear way, which in turn shuts you down from your self and reality. IME After one experiences ego death, it usually causes a positive lifestyle change. Psychosis causes a negative lifestyle changes(amongst other things) AS it's occurring.

So although the textbook definition of both things sounds similar, they honestly couldnt be further apart.


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OfflineNastyDHL
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18805604 - 09/05/13 10:40 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

xbloodwhipx said:
If you completely lose touch with reality, wouldnt that be like ego death? Is it possible to lose touch with reality to the point of ego death? Like can you mentally go "that far" without using drugs?




No.

The idea is that we all come from the same source (light) and we are unaware of this because of our identification with our imagination of our self. When one experiences ego death they tune into the light and they are not really related. People who experience ego death do not lose touch with reality, they realize a greater reality that doesn't hinge on the external world of matter. Can you go how far without using drugs? Ego death? Yes

...anyway, my guess is that people with psychosis probably have very present egos.


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: NastyDHL] * 1
    #18806774 - 09/06/13 09:56 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Give someone a massive of dose of LSD and put them in a glass box, put another person with sever psychosis in a similar box and have a double blind study to view which are suffering from symptoms of psychosis my hypothesis is you wouldn't be able to tell them apart. :goat:

it's all related to symptoms not some semantics about egos and existence.


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Offlinesanchothestoner
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Gorlax]
    #18806955 - 09/06/13 10:55 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

It could be.  It depends if you've had an ego death experience before.  People who are too scared to fully let go will think that THEY are god and all that stuff.  When you do let go you realize that WE are all divine beings making up this "god."  At least that's what I've learned, and if that's the case then people with psychosis could definitely undergo a sort of ego death experience.  I've been diagnosed with psychosis, yet everyone I come in contact with tells me that I am ego-less... I guess it's possible :shrug:

I think it really comes down to past experiences, drug induced or not.


--------------------
I fucking hate you... God damn, I love you...
But we both know if we stick together, we'll just tear ourselves apart
You are my sunshine, my only sunshine, you make me happy, when skies are grey
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: sanchothestoner] * 1
    #18807371 - 09/06/13 12:49 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Ego death isnt well defined and there are plenty of people whose mental illnesses have manifestations like peoples personal description of ego feath.

I dont think there is a faster way to make me tune someone out than if they mention ego death.


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Invisiblepsi
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: teamkiller]
    #18807595 - 09/06/13 02:04 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

People often seem to talk about it in a braggy way, so generally I figure that their egos are alive and well.


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: psi]
    #18807598 - 09/06/13 02:05 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

they can become experiences you're quite proud of, the most intense things one can live through. as if you had a choice in the matter :lol:

sometimes the ego just floats away peacefully like a cloud and sometimes it pops like a pimple. there's no one 'right' way for it to happen.


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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: g00ru]
    #18807759 - 09/06/13 03:00 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Ego is just some terminology left over from a very smart but old fashioned man from over 100 years ago named Freud.

Ego is in always control, Id is the subconscious and Super Ego is the guy who constantly fixes, but can't get everything right.

Ego death is those things with out ego. Ta-da!


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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Konyap]
    #18807777 - 09/06/13 03:04 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I think psychosis is when someone try's to achieve impossible things and loses a grip on themselves.

Not really delirium or brain dead.


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OfflineGorlax
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Konyap]
    #18807991 - 09/06/13 04:10 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Freud and his antics. I hate psychology... one of the few elective classes I have withdrew from..and at the time I was taking ochem 1 :facepalm:


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OfflineNastyDHL
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Gorlax]
    #18808003 - 09/06/13 04:13 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Gorlax said:
Give someone a massive of dose of LSD and put them in a glass box, put another person with sever psychosis in a similar box and have a double blind study to view which are suffering from symptoms of psychosis my hypothesis is you wouldn't be able to tell them apart. :goat:

it's all related to symptoms not some semantics about egos and existence.




it depends who the someone on LSD is

how is ego death related to symptoms?


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OfflineJacksonMetaller
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: volcomstoner]
    #18808123 - 09/06/13 04:38 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

volcomstoner said:
So is this ego death like, a real thing or something made up by hippies?




It's a real experience. As far as real "thing" i won't comment... But it's not hippy mumbo jumbo. That shits pretty literal when you're in the midst of it.


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Offlineteamkiller
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: psi]
    #18808208 - 09/06/13 04:51 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

psi said:
People often seem to talk about it in a braggy way, so generally I figure that their egos are alive and well.




I think its sad, when it comes to portraying the inner workings of subjective experience, english seems to fail most people.


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OfflineNastyDHL
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: teamkiller]
    #18808219 - 09/06/13 04:53 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

teamkiller said:
Quote:

psi said:
People often seem to talk about it in a braggy way, so generally I figure that their egos are alive and well.




I think its sad, when it comes to portraying the inner workings of subjective experience, language seems to fail most people.




ftfy


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InvisibleJoieDeVivre
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: sanchothestoner]
    #18808289 - 09/06/13 05:08 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

sanchothestoner said:
It could be.  It depends if you've had an ego death experience before.  People who are too scared to fully let go will think that THEY are god and all that stuff.  When you do let go you realize that WE are all divine beings making up this "god."  At least that's what I've learned, and if that's the case then people with psychosis could definitely undergo a sort of ego death experience.  I've been diagnosed with psychosis, yet everyone I come in contact with tells me that I am ego-less... I guess it's possible :shrug:

I think it really comes down to past experiences, drug induced or not.



Thinking we as humans are god still sounds pretty egotistical to me, and like a misinterpretation of the experience. I don't see how you think that calling oneself god is egotistical but saying "oh, well everyone else is god too" makes it less egotistical.


--------------------
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UBUNTU- I am because we are.




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Invisiblelessismore
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18808309 - 09/06/13 05:13 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

xbloodwhipx said:
If you completely lose touch with reality, wouldnt that be like ego death? Is it possible to lose touch with reality to the point of ego death? Like can you mentally go "that far" without using drugs?



Yes
Delerium... then you don't know who you are or what you do...

Can happen from illness, chock (psychically) etc.


But egodeath is not losing touch with reality
it is reconnecting with yourself, seeing reality from new

After egodeath I was closer to myself than in many years previously the next day..
Better overview of thoughts than in years
Better memory than in years
More happy than in years, from reconnecting with myself & nature

I would say I had lost touch with reality before egodeath
and more in reality after it
no trouble meeting new people etc, but there is the trouble of talking with people you know right after it, as they know you by your old identity(they will instantly know you changed) :-)

But there is no need to view change as bad, almost any change from my prior self is positive

and how do I know I'm in reality?

Happiness everyday, appreciation of the small things, accepting & appreciating everything I  see like first time I saw it, infinite happiness from the small things - and it has lasted >1 year now

Because egodeath made me find my true values in life that I appreciate everyday (i.e. nature,houseplants,pets,hobbies,being social/going out etc. , the small things that bring happiness)

Also it made me quit weed, I don't need anything to be happy, that's a good sign


Edited by lessismore (09/06/13 05:22 PM)


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Offlineg00ru
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: JoieDeVivre]
    #18808351 - 09/06/13 05:22 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

JoieDeVivre said:
I don't see how you think that calling oneself god is egotistical but saying "oh, well everyone else is god too" makes
it less egotistical.




it levels the playing field :cookiemonster:

but really, a lot of people say things like that which is obviously coming from a place of intellectual belief, not too dissimilar from a political opinion.


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Invisiblelessismore
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: g00ru]
    #18808369 - 09/06/13 05:26 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I don't need to call myself anything

but I know that we all have a connection to god inside of us, then you just gotta figure out what that connection is :-)

and I know that most of us forget ourselves at one point in life, because of living against ourselves

we must reverse that to be reunited with god


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OfflineJacksonMetaller
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: JoieDeVivre]
    #18808382 - 09/06/13 05:29 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

JoieDeVivre said:
Quote:

sanchothestoner said:
It could be.  It depends if you've had an ego death experience before.  People who are too scared to fully let go will think that THEY are god and all that stuff.  When you do let go you realize that WE are all divine beings making up this "god."  At least that's what I've learned, and if that's the case then people with psychosis could definitely undergo a sort of ego death experience.  I've been diagnosed with psychosis, yet everyone I come in contact with tells me that I am ego-less... I guess it's possible :shrug:

I think it really comes down to past experiences, drug induced or not.



Thinking we as humans are god still sounds pretty egotistical to me, and like a misinterpretation of the experience. I don't see how you think that calling oneself god is egotistical but saying "oh, well everyone else is god too" makes it less egotistical.




How is that egotistical? That's the basis of pantheism. All things are like cells of a larger body, all equally important. That sounds completely unegotistical


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: danlennon3]
    #18808396 - 09/06/13 05:34 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

danlennon3 said:
ego death and psychosis are worlds apart. I have experienced my fair share of both and they have very little in common. ego loss is like a way to experience the universe, which is essentially nothing-ness. Psychosis on the other hand causes you to see things in a very linear way, which in turn shuts you down from your self and reality. IME After one experiences ego death, it usually causes a positive lifestyle change. Psychosis causes a negative lifestyle changes(amongst other things) AS it's occurring.

So although the textbook definition of both things sounds similar, they honestly couldn't be further apart.




Very well said, and this

Quote:

psi said:
People often seem to talk about it in a braggy way, so generally I figure that their egos are alive and well.




:yesnod: . . . :peace:


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: vinsue]
    #18808740 - 09/06/13 06:45 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

How can you say you improved after ego death if you never had a test prior then after. I have had ego death once or twice and it fucking BLEW! the only thing that made it anyway beneficial is because I thought I was fucking dead and I was alive...just like when someone almost dies and they survive, they vow to live a better life after!


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Gorlax]
    #18808962 - 09/06/13 07:30 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Gorlax said:
How can you say you improved after ego death if you never had a test prior then after. I have had ego death once or twice and it fucking BLEW! the only thing that made it anyway beneficial is because I thought I was fucking dead and I was alive...just like when someone almost dies and they survive, they vow to live a better life after!




You have to learn to let go. Seriously. If you do it's absolutely blissful. I've had a shitty ego death on ayahuasca before and I know how much that sucks. Where literally the only thing you gain is a sense of relief to have your body and sanity back. But when it's good it's GODLY. And generally comes full of positive messages.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: JacksonMetaller]
    #18808992 - 09/06/13 07:34 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

^ I can have those experiences without ego death! Mescaline has never given me ego death! that is why I prefer it over anything. Every experience has been fucking amazing and life changing..straight  :nyan:


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Gorlax]
    #18809005 - 09/06/13 07:37 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

the simple and correct answer is NO because ego death implies your TRUE self shining through, not the complete destruction of everything you are

ego death is about destryoing the mask not the person


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Gorlax]
    #18809030 - 09/06/13 07:43 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Gorlax said:
^ I can have those experiences without ego death! Mescaline has never given me ego death! that is why I prefer it over anything. Every experience has been fucking amazing and life changing..straight  :nyan:




You can't have ego death experiences without ego death :wink: Trust me. If you can let go it's something to be sought after. I have had some of the most ridiculous bonding experiences with ego death. On my first date with my current gf we took 5 hits of decent L each and spent half the night melded into a single consciousness along with the rest of the universe. Realizing that each of us was just another mode of "god" witnessing itself through its evolutionary branches.

It was a little weird because I barely knew the girl :lol: But those kinds of things have stuck pretty damn deep. Beyond the most beautiful and cosmic experiences I've had.

I find the best way to make sure it's enjoyable is stack some nitrous crackers back to back while you're tripping on LSD. By the third time or so you're stuck in a loop that draws you closer to the "truth" until you finally realize it melt away. But it keeps it fun and euphoric.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: JacksonMetaller]
    #18809394 - 09/06/13 09:04 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

^ I still don't understand. I have experienced ego death and it was not fun or life changing, it flat out sucked. Even if I tried I could not snap out of it. If you are able to control yourself or whatever in ego death then it isn't ego death....

I had delusional thoughts, saw shit that wasn't there, and thought I was dead.. I had no fucking ego whatsoever because I thought I was dead.

but tis his own if you like ego death so be it.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Gorlax]
    #18809427 - 09/06/13 09:14 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Gorlax said:
^ I still don't understand. I have experienced ego death and it was not fun or life changing, it flat out sucked. Even if I tried I could not snap out of it. If you are able to control yourself or whatever in ego death then it isn't ego death....

I had delusional thoughts, saw shit that wasn't there, and thought I was dead.. I had no fucking ego whatsoever because I thought I was dead.

but tis his own if you like ego death so be it.




not "controlling yourself, letting go. letting go of your attempt to control yourself. letting go of the fear. letting it take you and just participating as an observer. believe me, it's like being on two different drugs. one is confusing, feels like your brain is warped in pretzels, you're permafucked and/or dying. the other is like you arrive to a moment of complete clarity, unified with all beings and have understood the true nature of your existence. letting go is something you normally have to do going in to the experience. once your on the wrong path it's pretty hard to snap out of. I had this experience during an ayahuasca ceremony and was actually begging the shaman to kill me and bawling my eyes out because I was so convinced that it was over for me (well, when i was starting to come down that is. during the peak i had no connection to the real world). The good ones are nothing but euphoric and are more coherent than real life itself.

i'm curious though, what did you take and how much?


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: JacksonMetaller]
    #18809450 - 09/06/13 09:19 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I took an eighth of insane shrooms and smoked salvia lol... it was the worst thing ever and even after the savlia went away I was rocketed into out ego death space!

I understand how you say you have had moments of confusion then clarity, that is just a common thing with most hallucinogens isn't it :shrug:. every time I do shrooms I get that going on..


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Gorlax]
    #18809462 - 09/06/13 09:22 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

mushrooms + salvia is the best way to do salvia.

salvia is so incredibly complex, much more-so than any other psychedelic and the mushrooms really let you see whats its doing.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: teamkiller]
    #18809468 - 09/06/13 09:24 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

^ dude how lol that shit was fucking crazy.. I saw shapes walking and my head spun off into space all out of body as fuck and then when it wore off I was knee deep in a bad shroom trip!


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: teamkiller]
    #18809481 - 09/06/13 09:26 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

teamkiller said:
mushrooms + salvia is the best way to do salvia.

salvia is so incredibly complex, much more-so than any other psychedelic and the mushrooms really let you see whats its doing.




I need to try the psychedelic+salvia combo. I was also thinking of the dissociative+salvia combo, have you tried that?


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Dawks]
    #18809639 - 09/06/13 10:06 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

i personally don't like dissociatives and salvia, but some people do.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: teamkiller]
    #18809709 - 09/06/13 10:28 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah I thought it might be cool because salvia makes me feel uncomfortable whereas dissociatives make me feel comfortable so I figured it may make the salvia experience more tolerable :shrug:


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Dawks]
    #18810343 - 09/07/13 02:55 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Ketamine and DMT was how I experienced ego death.

I was speechless for 18 hours afterwards.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: teamkiller]
    #18810372 - 09/07/13 03:13 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

teamkiller said:
i personally don't like dissociatives and salvia, but some people do.



Salvia is a dissociative


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #18810451 - 09/07/13 04:08 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I kinda wish the idea of "ego death" as the cornerstone of the psychedelic experience would just go away. I subscribed to it for a long time but it is in fact an absurdly useless concept. Many experiences that entail "ego death" to the same extent as psychedelics do not involve being transported to alternate dimensions or witnessing the creation of new ones. I do not think that "loss of the ego" is any more crucial to the psychedelic experience than it is to getting knocked over the head and passing out. Or to blacking out from alcohol, or any of the myriad other ways that exist to temporarily forget who you are.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: danlennon3]
    #18810470 - 09/07/13 04:24 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

danlennon3 said:
ego death and psychosis are worlds apart. I have experienced my fair share of both and they have very little in common.




The sense of timelessness felt in the beginning stages of ego loss is also sometimes a symptom of schizophrenia.  Not sure how far it goes though.


Edited by Hobozen (09/07/13 04:25 AM)


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Sophistic Radiance]
    #18810593 - 09/07/13 05:50 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

BlindSophist said:
I kinda wish the idea of "ego death" as the cornerstone of the psychedelic experience would just go away. I subscribed to it for a long time but it is in fact an absurdly useless concept. Many experiences that entail "ego death" to the same extent as psychedelics do not involve being transported to alternate dimensions or witnessing the creation of new ones. I do not think that "loss of the ego" is any more crucial to the psychedelic experience than it is to getting knocked over the head and passing out. Or to blacking out from alcohol, or any of the myriad other ways that exist to temporarily forget who you are.




The realizations happens IRL after the experiences

egodeath is just a good way of mindfuck like no other mindfuck ;-P

once you start to see the soul is the same in all living, those realizations come slowly else too  (without egodeath), even without drugs, in everyday life from nature i.e.

it is intense mindfuck, not sure I would have done it if I could chose so... it  always comes by surprise
I think the experiences could have lead to it as well in the end... so there would be no need for egodeath

you learn to love yourself and the earth/nature/others

and from that the realization that most of humanities suffering is from lack of love/being controlled by thoughts
and most likely the reasons for own suffering too :-)


but I think all of that happens gradually during any other psychedelic experience, not unique to egodeath
egodeath is just a quick hardreset... not that pleasant, and hard to put together again...
could I chose I would have chosen the experiences without the egodeath, it still confuses me a long time after

as in, life would have been a little easier sometimes without the death, so don't do it too often :wink:
best suited for when you got a stable life situation etc.  - but then there should be no problem with repeated deaths then in theory I think (I've experienced maybe 4 on lsd/shrooms, unconscious/wake up next day - new person) - it often makes living  easier  (once you've had one egodeath getting more gets easier... you can get there from just smoking weed, without drugs i.e. from seeing you're the same as everyone else i.e.)

it's not for the faint of heart.... it's very hard to sort out

but I believe the spiritual experiences are real, love is real :-)
love the planet

also you learn acceptance from it... and appreciation of what you have

after egodeath I'm high 24/7 on nature,best drug there is (houseplants,pets,walk in nature,sit in nature,meditate in nature, gardening etc) , it brings peace, all of them
and trying to help others brings peace too


Edited by lessismore (09/07/13 06:24 AM)


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Gorlax]
    #18810738 - 09/07/13 08:01 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Gorlax said:
I took an eighth of insane shrooms and smoked salvia lol... it was the worst thing ever and even after the savlia went away I was rocketed into out ego death space!

I understand how you say you have had moments of confusion then clarity, that is just a common thing with most hallucinogens isn't it :shrug:. every time I do shrooms I get that going on..




Well there you go. Salvia is atypical and not pleasant to most. Stick to the happy hippy drugs and you'll have a better chance of enjoying it :wink: ie, acid, weed, whippets. Things CAN go wrong but are generally more pleasant


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: volcomstoner]
    #18811600 - 09/07/13 01:25 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

volcomstoner said:
Quote:

teamkiller said:
i personally don't like dissociatives and salvia, but some people do.



Salvia is a dissociative



i still don't like mixing salvia and dissociatives.

even if you want to call salvia a dissociative its action is clearly way different than everything else that gets called a dissociative on here, so i have no clue why you would bother to tell me that.
I didn't think NMDA was the primary target.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #19351346 - 12/31/13 02:26 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

I have never used any hallucinogenic or dissociative drugs, yet I have experienced severe psychosis induced by the MAOI phenelzine. I ended up hospitalized for 3 months but for now I will just talk about my experience before I was forcibly incapacitated, medicated and imprisoned.

During the prodromal stage I became extremely egotistical to the point where I had decided to use my intellect against humanity and to manipulate it to my will, which was a complete change from my usual empathetic self. This ego inflation continued until I was absolutely certain within my own mind that I was a god, and not just a god but the God of gods, and that I had created the Universe as a joke upon the other gods but was overpowered and imprisoned within it as retribution.

Something changed, however. I cannot recall the mental steps I took for the revelation to come about, but I found myself staring into my bathroom mirror crying to myself at the sudden realization that I was not an all powerful God or Self but I was instead One and everything was me and I was everything etc. etc. the usual spiritual revelation that people describe, yet it was such a change from my earlier ego-maniacalism that it certainly felt like an ego-death to me.

During my hospitalization I switched between having an insanely huge ego and having none at all a few times again, however, and eventually came back to "baseline", though I certainly have a different outlook on reality and the human psyche since.

edit: Also, I now know and accept that there is a shadow inside me as evil as I am righteous, which is certainly a sobering revelation.

edit2: a lot of psych people say that psychosis itself is a form of ego-death


Edited by tradjik (12/31/13 02:52 PM)


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #19351531 - 12/31/13 03:20 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

xbloodwhipx said:
If you completely lose touch with reality, wouldnt that be like ego death? Is it possible to lose touch with reality to the point of ego death? Like can you mentally go "that far" without using drugs?



No severe psychosis is the total opposite of ego death. It is a deluded state in which ego is out of control, unbounded even by the illusory world you think you are now immersed in.

For the record I am a fully enlightened krishna conciousness buddha now so I have a lot of experience with ego death, and how it becomes permanent. There is no longer any "I" in what you're looking at, in fact it is almost difficult to wear the human suit and interact with other creatures in the hologram you call reality.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Ellis Dee] * 1
    #19351566 - 12/31/13 03:28 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

Ellis Dee said:
Quote:

xbloodwhipx said:
If you completely lose touch with reality, wouldnt that be like ego death? Is it possible to lose touch with reality to the point of ego death? Like can you mentally go "that far" without using drugs?



No severe psychosis is the total opposite of ego death. It is a deluded state in which ego is out of control, unbounded even by the illusory world you think you are now immersed in.

For the record I am a fully enlightened krishna conciousness buddha now so I have a lot of experience with ego death, and how it becomes permanent. There is no longer any "I" in what you're looking at, in fact it is almost difficult to wear the human suit and interact with other creatures in the hologram you call reality.




Interesting post, that last line resonates in my mind quite strongly. I experienced ego death for the first time after consuming 5g of mushrooms. Returning to reality and simply interacting with people as a challenge for a while, made living a "normal" life difficult. I eventually learned to accept the experience though


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Ellis Dee]
    #19351676 - 12/31/13 03:57 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

Ellis Dee said:
Quote:

xbloodwhipx said:
If you completely lose touch with reality, wouldnt that be like ego death? Is it possible to lose touch with reality to the point of ego death? Like can you mentally go "that far" without using drugs?



No severe psychosis is the total opposite of ego death. It is a deluded state in which ego is out of control, unbounded even by the illusory world you think you are now immersed in.

For the record I am a fully enlightened krishna conciousness buddha now so I have a lot of experience with ego death, and how it becomes permanent. There is no longer any "I" in what you're looking at, in fact it is almost difficult to wear the human suit and interact with other creatures in the hologram you call reality.




How do you explain my loss of ego while in a psychotic state, then?

BTW, no fully enlightened person would have the gall to call themselves "fully" enlightened.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: tradjik]
    #19351689 - 12/31/13 04:00 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

My psychosis involved seeing messages directed towards me everywhere I went. Hearing voices that would tell me things were going to happen, and then they did in a way that doesn't make sense.

At times it felt like an Alien was sucking out my thoughts and replacing them with images. Believing people were talking with me telepathically and everyone was out to get me.

All this shit started with an "ego death" experience though. Everything stemmed from that moment where I thought I was being re-born as a new person and that is what I contributed a lot of my delusions on.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Rhizohunter]
    #19351706 - 12/31/13 04:05 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

Rhizohunter said:
My psychosis involved seeing messages directed towards me everywhere I went. Hearing voices that would tell me things were going to happen, and then they did in a way that doesn't make sense.

At times it felt like an Alien was sucking out my thoughts and replacing them with images. Believing people were talking with me telepathically and everyone was out to get me.

All this shit started with an "ego death" experience though. Everything stemmed from that moment where I thought I was being re-born as a new person and that is what I contributed a lot of my delusions on.




My psychosis was mostly like being completely overwhelmed in synchronicity to the point where I couldn't discern what was external and what was internal. I also had periods of grandiose delusions mixed with a constant stream of paranoid delusions. It started with an ego that inflated so big that it popped and I was left picking up the pieces. Ego death is a pervasive pattern in many stories of psychosis.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: tradjik]
    #19351719 - 12/31/13 04:08 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

tradjik said:
Quote:

Rhizohunter said:
My psychosis involved seeing messages directed towards me everywhere I went. Hearing voices that would tell me things were going to happen, and then they did in a way that doesn't make sense.

At times it felt like an Alien was sucking out my thoughts and replacing them with images. Believing people were talking with me telepathically and everyone was out to get me.

All this shit started with an "ego death" experience though. Everything stemmed from that moment where I thought I was being re-born as a new person and that is what I contributed a lot of my delusions on.




My psychosis was mostly like being completely overwhelmed in synchronicity to the point where I couldn't discern what was external and what was internal. I also had periods of grandiose delusions mixed with a constant stream of paranoid delusions. It started with an ego that inflated so big that it popped and I was left picking up the pieces. Ego death is a pervasive pattern in many stories of psychosis.




I had that too:lol:

The synchronicity became overwhelming. Everything would be so related to each other that it was impossible for there to be any other explanation, so I would start becoming delusional. I believed so many crazy things that I am past embarrassment when I try to explain it to people.

Everything was just so damn connected...


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Rhizohunter]
    #19351739 - 12/31/13 04:14 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

Rhizohunter said:
Quote:

tradjik said:
Quote:

Rhizohunter said:
My psychosis involved seeing messages directed towards me everywhere I went. Hearing voices that would tell me things were going to happen, and then they did in a way that doesn't make sense.

At times it felt like an Alien was sucking out my thoughts and replacing them with images. Believing people were talking with me telepathically and everyone was out to get me.

All this shit started with an "ego death" experience though. Everything stemmed from that moment where I thought I was being re-born as a new person and that is what I contributed a lot of my delusions on.




My psychosis was mostly like being completely overwhelmed in synchronicity to the point where I couldn't discern what was external and what was internal. I also had periods of grandiose delusions mixed with a constant stream of paranoid delusions. It started with an ego that inflated so big that it popped and I was left picking up the pieces. Ego death is a pervasive pattern in many stories of psychosis.




I had that too:lol:

The synchronicity became overwhelming. Everything would be so related to each other that it was impossible for there to be any other explanation, so I would start becoming delusional. I believed so many crazy things that I am past embarrassment when I try to explain it to people.

Everything was just so damn connected...




Exactly, man. It's like when someone who is completely grounded in reality sees that all the evidence points to something, so they assume that it must be true. Except that someone who is in a psychotic state finds evidence EVERYWHERE, because everything is a pattern and has meaning relating to what they are currently thinking about...


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: tradjik]
    #19351768 - 12/31/13 04:23 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

It's kind of like a cop who is looking for a serial killer and is finding messages that are pointing them to a new location or idea of who the next victim is. Except there is no end to this manhunt and you are just crawling deeper and deeper into a hole of your own delusions.

I can't even explain the delusions, but it felt like I was in a time warp. I needed to keep following this train of thought to get out of it, but that only led me farther and farther into my delusions. I would watch people and see others do odd things that would tie into my thoughts. My thoughts and this reality were so fuckin connected that I could not get out.

I would think things and then other things would appear. They had to be connected somehow though, and I would always find a way to tie them into my delusion.

Feels good to be out of that train of thought, but just today I started getting messages again. Doctors say I am schizoaffective, and it's sad, but I kind of find peace in this psychotic mindframe.

Reality might become blurred again for me, but at least I know that this shit isn't real now. There was no way I would have believed this to be mental illness when I was in it that deep last summer.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: tradjik]
    #19351769 - 12/31/13 04:23 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

I've felt like mushrooms cause the most distorted thinking I've ever experienced. Even the hour or two after I'm no longer tripping, I have a hard time not allowing my thoughts to get out of control. I'm pretty convinced this experience is close to what psychosis is like.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: koods] * 3
    #19351796 - 12/31/13 04:30 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

i've been monitoring ellis's brainwaves for some time now and i assure you he is fully enlightened.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: teamkiller]
    #19353171 - 12/31/13 11:14 PM (10 years, 30 days ago)

NO!! Psychosis is NOTHING like an ego death. Yah you're out of touch with reality but you still have a FULL sense of yourself.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #19353303 - 01/01/14 12:08 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)

I didn't read the whole thread, so if this has been said, forgive me.
I think that permanently being unaware of existence (ego-death) without drugs is just being a vegetable; brain dead. Not crazy.
But, I could be wrong. I think if it were from craziness, it'd be more from the drugs you're being fed constantly at the but house than the psychosis itself.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: TopPmz]
    #19353875 - 01/01/14 07:22 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)

people who spend their whole life meditating can reach egodeath any time they chose
and also people who have been not meditating for that long

egodeath is just no definitions/no thoughts
it is a pretty pleasant state, union with all

most buddhists wouldnt mind going there

psychosis is something completely different, usually the opposite, lots of thoughts
mind going crazy from thought overload


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #19353885 - 01/01/14 07:27 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)



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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: lessismore]
    #19353907 - 01/01/14 07:43 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

mio said:
egodeath is just no definitions/no thoughts
it is a pretty pleasant state, union with all




there is a polar opposite when it comes to ego loss. 

full - empty
connection - dissociated/spaced
light - black (like space)
full of feeling - void of feeling

I've experienced both sides of ego loss; one is absolute bliss/timelessness, identification with the "great white light".  on the other side of the spectrum, no such bliss exists.  it is not pleasant before completely breaking through.  the complete silencing of the thought process is maddening, especially when you can't turn it back on.  you question if you lost your mind forever (at least if this is your first time with this sort of experience).  those who have taken a very large dose of MAOI + M. Hostilis can probably identify with this.

There are stories of Sadgurus in India who lose their shit too, also with some who attend Vipassana meditation retreats.  When you meditate for long enough you can enter a state where you feel like you're completely losing your mind while feeling stuck/expanded out of body.  I think that anyone who goes through this will find it to be too extremely intense and shocking for it to be labelled as generally pleasant.  To lose control of the wheel is madness.  The old mystics called it "The Divine Madness".


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Hobozen]
    #19353935 - 01/01/14 08:04 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)

yup :-)

the ego doesnt like letting go

grounding helped me(nature), else it can get unpleasant at times, disassociated like you say
weed isnt a good grounding IMO :-)

had to stop using that permanently, it just messed up my thoughts


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: lessismore]
    #19354117 - 01/01/14 09:47 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)

yeah man i know what you mean, weed in combination with lsd is what would send me off into the deep end.. scary stuff indeed but a good lesson in confronting and coming face to face with certain aspects of the self and existence which might be overlooked in those other more blissful trips.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #19354184 - 01/01/14 10:15 AM (10 years, 30 days ago)

Quote:

xbloodwhipx said:
If you completely lose touch with reality, wouldnt that be like ego death? Is it possible to lose touch with reality to the point of ego death? Like can you mentally go "that far" without using drugs?



No man, psychosis is nothing like ego death.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #20480093 - 08/26/14 04:28 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

I stumbled in this old topic right here, sorry, and I found this question very interesting one, so I couldn't refrain from giving my POV.

I don't think psychosis is the same as ego death, why?

For being able to elicit a life changing experience, as in ego death, a given understanding must be first... understood!

The enlightenment you feel with the ego death is a post-effect of some moment of truth or perfection of yourself.

Psychosis (as in schizophrenia), on the other hand, permanently disable your clear understanding of things and so you will never have a valid way to compare what you're feeling now with what you felt a given time ago.

This way you cannot, really, "learn" with psychosis in the way you learn with a genuine, clear cut experience of ego death and, so, these things in my understanding are not synonym.

If you could "revert" schizophrenia, then, with proper amount of time and hard work on self-knowledge (and it wouldn't be easy), it also could be called an "ego death experience".


--------------------
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"Consider a man that can think clearly and act only by himself, fully aware, unbiased, and seeking something he knows exactly what is, this man will never have a drug problem. This man can count with drugs, if he wish, to solve problems or to transcend to higher levels if no problem is left pending, but he will never surrender himself to vices and dissolution because he is the master of his own ship".

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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: AKellerman]
    #20480132 - 08/26/14 04:37 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

schizophrenia has been curable since the day it was discovered

you just need to submerge yourself in water and it's completely gone!


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Konyap]
    #20480156 - 08/26/14 04:43 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Severe psychosis isnt egodeath. It is a loss of the self, but the fleeting ego remaining :wink:


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Shroomslip]
    #20480323 - 08/26/14 05:21 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Shroomslip said:
I could be wrong but I don't think ego death and "losing touch with reality" are interchangeable.. I've yet to experience it so I could be wrong, but I think both concepts are their own thing.




Yeah you're correct. Ego-death is like finding "reality". Ultimately at least. There are of course hallucinatory aspects to experience itself, but the underlying themes are always very consistent to the natural order of things ime. Best way i can explain it is like being reduced to a continuous chemical/physical exchange that is the entire cosmos and watching it from a single point without actually being anything other than an objective witness. Ie you can no longer identify with things like humans and self and all those other mental constructs because they are all reduced to their very raw essence.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #20480392 - 08/26/14 05:33 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Obviously not. Ego Loss, Ego Death, Shiva Darshana, Nerodha-Samapatti or whatever else you wish to call it means there is no ego to be psychotic and no mind to display such symptoms.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Kaktos]
    #20480491 - 08/26/14 05:46 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

I've been through psychosis many times from meth.

My most memorable time was on the sixth day of a meth binge. In this particular binge I had been punched in the face twice, stabbed in my legs, had a knife to my throat, had smoked and shot up over twenty five points. At this point I would constantly hear overlapping voices and every single car looked like a police car. I drove home and cleared my meth pipe and all the clutter from the truck I was driving. When I came home and looked at the floor, many black pencil width worms would flow around on the floor. I thought this was very amusing. I went into the shower and closed my eyes and math formulas would pop into my head and resolve themselves in the form of a visual. I looked out the window and these innocent worms were the size of snakes.

I was in my computer room, called my buddy to go out to the bar and hang and thought he was down. I must have not actually called him but anticipated his arrival. Cars would pull into my drive way and I would come to greet the people then the car would not be there. People would come in and out of my computer room and I would talk to them. Sometimes they would put a shot of heroin or meth on the table and when I would grab it it would vanish. None of this bothered me because I thought it was completely real.

Then at some point I went out into my flower garden in front of my house at night and thought there was a party. A bunch of shadow people that looked real as a real person would pour their hearts out and said they were on MDMA. I would argue with them and say meth is better then MDMA. Then a bunch of people from my school showed up and I had about ten people in my garden and we would talk and they would hit the meth pipe and I would ask for it and they would get very angry. I got my shadow friend to call my dealer and I saw a car and saw the dealer in it and tried to open it but no one was there. Then they all looked very concerned for me about my use and the tone changed. Then they would tease me and put meth in the vine of the plant and the meth would flow down the vine and I would try and collect it in cups and I woke up the next day with a bunch of little cups in my flower garden. I asked all my friends if their was a party last night and if they had fun and apparently there was no party.

Maybe that was ego death I don't know.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx]
    #20480509 - 08/26/14 05:50 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

^Damn, that sound horrible.

Quote:

xbloodwhipx said:
If you completely lose touch with reality, wouldnt that be like ego death?




If by 'completely lose touch with reality' you mean someone thinks reality is X when all 'sane'/every day normal joes say reality is Y, then no.

If by 'completely lose touch with reality' you mean, lose sense of he/she who has been experiencing reality, then yes.

But people with psychosis still have a sense of "I am doing.../I am seeing...". And even if what the person says they are doing/seeing is actually false and they're just delusional....they still have the sense that THEY are doing/seeing something. Ego-death is all about....Being conscious of the here and now and realizing that that is all that is. Realizing that you don't need to do anything at all, for in this moment you're actually doing it all....but not by 'you'...by letting go of the sense of 'I'....that's what allows everything to be done without doing anything.

Crazies still have a sense of self, however delusional it may be.


Edited by TheMule73 (08/26/14 05:51 PM)


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: TheMule73]
    #20480526 - 08/26/14 05:54 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

It wasn't horrible, I actually think it was the most intense experience I have ever had on drugs.

You get to the point on meth where you are so afraid, paranoid, but once you break through to the other side and are enveloped in the psychotic world, you accept it as your own reality.

That's why I consider it ego death.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: xbloodwhipx] * 1
    #20480555 - 08/26/14 05:59 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

No, psychedelics are needed for this reason, that's why apes were eating mushrooms daily, because it gave them sharper eyes, better edge detail, and the packs that were eating mushrooms were thriving while the rest fell behind, this is why medicine is so important, it naturaurally re hardwires our brains into a fashion where we are superior, we are vastly superior, but the things of society, still linger, why going as far as i have is not for the feignt of hard, heroic doses of mushrooms and cactus and LSD made me schizophrenic, but i thank god every day for the light he has shared with me, to expose the lies and get back to the truth.


--------------------
I find, ego death isn't the loss of ego yet a barrier where you have the ability to live in front of your ego rather than behind it, through psychedelics this paht is oppenned, and hence why ego death is not really that.

Medicine: Mescaline, Mushrooms, LSD, DMT, Weed.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Bitter Cactus]
    #20480561 - 08/26/14 06:00 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Bitter Cactus said:
It wasn't horrible, I actually think it was the most intense experience I have ever had on drugs.

You get to the point on meth where you are so afraid, paranoid, but once you break through to the other side and are enveloped in the psychotic world, you accept it as your own reality.

That's why I consider it ego death.




But what you described really doesn't sound anything like a classic ego death. Nor does your description of "your own reality" make sense in the context of ego death. In ego death there is no "you".

It does sound really intense though. No doubt. I'm not sure i'd want to go through that myself


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: lonjing10]
    #20482751 - 08/27/14 04:35 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

lonjing10 said:
No, psychedelics are needed for this reason, that's why apes were eating mushrooms daily, because it gave them sharper eyes, better edge detail, and the packs that were eating mushrooms were thriving while the rest fell behind, this is why medicine is so important, it naturaurally re hardwires our brains into a fashion where we are superior, we are vastly superior, but the things of society, still linger, why going as far as i have is not for the feignt of hard, heroic doses of mushrooms and cactus and LSD made me schizophrenic, but i thank god every day for the light he has shared with me, to expose the lies and get back to the truth.




No, mate :wink: you just lack grounding. Other than that, youre just another tripped out entity.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Bitter Cactus]
    #20482827 - 08/27/14 05:30 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Bitter Cactus said:
I've been through psychosis many times from meth.

My most memorable time was on the sixth day of a meth binge. In this particular binge I had been punched in the face twice, stabbed in my legs, had a knife to my throat, had smoked and shot up over twenty five points. At this point I would constantly hear overlapping voices and every single car looked like a police car. I drove home and cleared my meth pipe and all the clutter from the truck I was driving. When I came home and looked at the floor, many black pencil width worms would flow around on the floor. I thought this was very amusing. I went into the shower and closed my eyes and math formulas would pop into my head and resolve themselves in the form of a visual. I looked out the window and these innocent worms were the size of snakes.

I was in my computer room, called my buddy to go out to the bar and hang and thought he was down. I must have not actually called him but anticipated his arrival. Cars would pull into my drive way and I would come to greet the people then the car would not be there. People would come in and out of my computer room and I would talk to them. Sometimes they would put a shot of heroin or meth on the table and when I would grab it it would vanish. None of this bothered me because I thought it was completely real.

Then at some point I went out into my flower garden in front of my house at night and thought there was a party. A bunch of shadow people that looked real as a real person would pour their hearts out and said they were on MDMA. I would argue with them and say meth is better then MDMA. Then a bunch of people from my school showed up and I had about ten people in my garden and we would talk and they would hit the meth pipe and I would ask for it and they would get very angry. I got my shadow friend to call my dealer and I saw a car and saw the dealer in it and tried to open it but no one was there. Then they all looked very concerned for me about my use and the tone changed. Then they would tease me and put meth in the vine of the plant and the meth would flow down the vine and I would try and collect it in cups and I woke up the next day with a bunch of little cups in my flower garden. I asked all my friends if their was a party last night and if they had fun and apparently there was no party.

Maybe that was ego death I don't know.





yeah fuck man that is pretty damn intense and well beyond anything i've ever gotten into. 25 points i mean shit. thats alot. over what time period was that?


my worst was 5 days straight, i probably smoked about a gram or so in that time. i wasn't really " hitting it hard " during that binge, mostly just being functional and staying awake.


but yeah i mean did that wear off? like once you got a good sleep, were you more back to normal? my meth psychosis has always worn off almost entirely after a solid period of sleep, usually assisted by xannax.


but hearing your story of psychosis to that level, makes me think that took a much longer period to subside.


how retarded is the shit we put ourselves through, all for 'that feel'? fuckin meth. retarded ass drug. and the worst part is ocne your into meth, nothing else really compares to it or rings your bell in the same way.


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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Soulidarity]
    #20485634 - 08/27/14 07:19 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Dosile said:
Quote:

Bitter Cactus said:
I've been through psychosis many times from meth.

My most memorable time was on the sixth day of a meth binge. In this particular binge I had been punched in the face twice, stabbed in my legs, had a knife to my throat, had smoked and shot up over twenty five points. At this point I would constantly hear overlapping voices and every single car looked like a police car. I drove home and cleared my meth pipe and all the clutter from the truck I was driving. When I came home and looked at the floor, many black pencil width worms would flow around on the floor. I thought this was very amusing. I went into the shower and closed my eyes and math formulas would pop into my head and resolve themselves in the form of a visual. I looked out the window and these innocent worms were the size of snakes.

I was in my computer room, called my buddy to go out to the bar and hang and thought he was down. I must have not actually called him but anticipated his arrival. Cars would pull into my drive way and I would come to greet the people then the car would not be there. People would come in and out of my computer room and I would talk to them. Sometimes they would put a shot of heroin or meth on the table and when I would grab it it would vanish. None of this bothered me because I thought it was completely real.

Then at some point I went out into my flower garden in front of my house at night and thought there was a party. A bunch of shadow people that looked real as a real person would pour their hearts out and said they were on MDMA. I would argue with them and say meth is better then MDMA. Then a bunch of people from my school showed up and I had about ten people in my garden and we would talk and they would hit the meth pipe and I would ask for it and they would get very angry. I got my shadow friend to call my dealer and I saw a car and saw the dealer in it and tried to open it but no one was there. Then they all looked very concerned for me about my use and the tone changed. Then they would tease me and put meth in the vine of the plant and the meth would flow down the vine and I would try and collect it in cups and I woke up the next day with a bunch of little cups in my flower garden. I asked all my friends if their was a party last night and if they had fun and apparently there was no party.

Maybe that was ego death I don't know.





yeah fuck man that is pretty damn intense and well beyond anything i've ever gotten into. 25 points i mean shit. thats alot. over what time period was that?


my worst was 5 days straight, i probably smoked about a gram or so in that time. i wasn't really " hitting it hard " during that binge, mostly just being functional and staying awake.


but yeah i mean did that wear off? like once you got a good sleep, were you more back to normal? my meth psychosis has always worn off almost entirely after a solid period of sleep, usually assisted by xannax.


but hearing your story of psychosis to that level, makes me think that took a much longer period to subside.


how retarded is the shit we put ourselves through, all for 'that feel'? fuckin meth. retarded ass drug. and the worst part is ocne your into meth, nothing else really compares to it or rings your bell in the same way.




That was one of my first binges. I only paid for five points and the rest was free. I'd been smoking crack too and to tell the entire story would take about half an hour person to person.

The comedown wasn't bad because it was early in my use. I pretty much woke up the next day fine.

Nothing does ring the bell like meth does. Listening to music I just associate every song with the feeling of meth and the flail and that kind of stuff. You might know what I'm talking about. Even with sex and masturbation I think of being high on meth and how good the sex and masturbation felt and it turns me on. I associate it with lots of things.


--------------------
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Soulidarity]
    #20485656 - 08/27/14 07:25 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Dosile said:
Quote:

Bitter Cactus said:
I've been through psychosis many times from meth.

My most memorable time was on the sixth day of a meth binge. In this particular binge I had been punched in the face twice, stabbed in my legs, had a knife to my throat, had smoked and shot up over twenty five points. At this point I would constantly hear overlapping voices and every single car looked like a police car. I drove home and cleared my meth pipe and all the clutter from the truck I was driving. When I came home and looked at the floor, many black pencil width worms would flow around on the floor. I thought this was very amusing. I went into the shower and closed my eyes and math formulas would pop into my head and resolve themselves in the form of a visual. I looked out the window and these innocent worms were the size of snakes.

I was in my computer room, called my buddy to go out to the bar and hang and thought he was down. I must have not actually called him but anticipated his arrival. Cars would pull into my drive way and I would come to greet the people then the car would not be there. People would come in and out of my computer room and I would talk to them. Sometimes they would put a shot of heroin or meth on the table and when I would grab it it would vanish. None of this bothered me because I thought it was completely real.

Then at some point I went out into my flower garden in front of my house at night and thought there was a party. A bunch of shadow people that looked real as a real person would pour their hearts out and said they were on MDMA. I would argue with them and say meth is better then MDMA. Then a bunch of people from my school showed up and I had about ten people in my garden and we would talk and they would hit the meth pipe and I would ask for it and they would get very angry. I got my shadow friend to call my dealer and I saw a car and saw the dealer in it and tried to open it but no one was there. Then they all looked very concerned for me about my use and the tone changed. Then they would tease me and put meth in the vine of the plant and the meth would flow down the vine and I would try and collect it in cups and I woke up the next day with a bunch of little cups in my flower garden. I asked all my friends if their was a party last night and if they had fun and apparently there was no party.

Maybe that was ego death I don't know.





yeah fuck man that is pretty damn intense and well beyond anything i've ever gotten into. 25 points i mean shit. thats alot. over what time period was that?


my worst was 5 days straight, i probably smoked about a gram or so in that time. i wasn't really " hitting it hard " during that binge, mostly just being functional and staying awake.


but yeah i mean did that wear off? like once you got a good sleep, were you more back to normal? my meth psychosis has always worn off almost entirely after a solid period of sleep, usually assisted by xannax.


but hearing your story of psychosis to that level, makes me think that took a much longer period to subside.


how retarded is the shit we put ourselves through, all for 'that feel'? fuckin meth. retarded ass drug. and the worst part is ocne your into meth, nothing else really compares to it or rings your bell in the same way.




first time with meth psychosis was homeless in a new city, camping in the outer forests.  dosed too high and was up for 3 days.  couldn't stay at the campsite because of aliens and demon panda bears so had to hide out in the city behind churches and shit.  i'm surprised i handled it as well i did looking back, sounds pretty unmanageable.


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OfflineSoulidarity
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Bitter Cactus]
    #20487739 - 08/28/14 07:09 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

how long was the 25 points consumed over?


but yeah pretty damn impressive that a good nights rest brought you back, even from being that far out.


i mean i've gotten to glimmers of what you've described, but that was well and truely above and beyond anything i've experienced with meth psychosis, and as i said, i was up for 5 days on only 10 points! and still didn't get anywhere near as bad as yours was!


it must have been pretty scary?? like did you realise it was all bs or were you too far gone by that point??


its weird how everything has that strange sense when your really fucked up. i can see how it would be believable if one just got way too out of it,


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OfflineBitter Cactus
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Soulidarity]
    #20488463 - 08/28/14 10:36 AM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Consumed over six days. Most smoked, some snorted, a good amount shot up.

High quality Canadian shards too.

I was so out there and not even paranoid or worried. I really thought it was all happening and so into this new world and had no doubts about it being real. When you are having a conversation with a group of people that look as real as actual people how are you supposed to tell?


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OfflineSoulidarity
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: Bitter Cactus]
    #20488892 - 08/28/14 12:46 PM (9 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah it's scary shit because thinking back on it, they've always looked ' real ' , but it has this oddness to it that always makes me realise its fake. Difficult to explain.

Kind of interesting that you decided to keep using the drug as well, with your first experience being a 6 day bender! Most people would just say ooookay fuck this drug! Lol


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OfflineEUR
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Re: Is severe psychosis like ego death? [Re: tradjik]
    #28361756 - 06/16/23 06:30 AM (7 months, 10 days ago)

Quote:

tradjik said:
Quote:

Ellis Dee said:
Quote:

xbloodwhipx said:
If you completely lose touch with reality, wouldnt that be like ego death? Is it possible to lose touch with reality to the point of ego death? Like can you mentally go "that far" without using drugs?



No severe psychosis is the total opposite of ego death. It is a deluded state in which ego is out of control, unbounded even by the illusory world you think you are now immersed in.

For the record I am a fully enlightened krishna conciousness buddha now so I have a lot of experience with ego death, and how it becomes permanent. There is no longer any "I" in what you're looking at, in fact it is almost difficult to wear the human suit and interact with other creatures in the hologram you call reality.




How do you explain my loss of ego while in a psychotic state, then?

BTW, no fully enlightened person would have the gall to call themselves "fully" enlightened.




Simply. By overcoming it at that moment. Your psychosis came to an end! The engine of it broke down.

Delusions of grandeur, anxiety, agitation and paranoia are not possibilities with ego death, to recall.

In this state, you cannot reference anything to yourself, because there's no concept of yourself. You are simply awareness/observing void that may or may not have retained its memories depending on the dose.

Psychosis and ego death are polar opposites.


Edited by EUR (06/16/23 06:39 AM)


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