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Offlinemellowparty
legitimate researcher


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 18,467
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: Snotfish] * 1
    #18802648 - 09/05/13 09:55 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Dankfish said:
The fatality of the diseases is not comparable at all. Cancer, if left untreated, will definitely result in passing away. On the other hand, many people leave depression untreated but still have enough will to live healthy lifestyles and while sad will remain living.

Cancer is more of a black and white thing.

Depression is completely in the gray.



I think the true nature of serious depression is generally underestimated. There are worse things than death for example having the desire to die but not the energy to actually do something about it.


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InvisibleJoieDeVivre
Hippie Babysitter
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Registered: 10/13/11
Posts: 5,751
Loc: Gamehenge
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: Snotfish]
    #18802652 - 09/05/13 09:56 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Dankfish said:
The fatality of the diseases is not comparable at all. Cancer, if left untreated, will definitely result in passing away. On the other hand, many people leave depression untreated but still have enough will to live healthy lifestyles and while sad will remain living.

Cancer is more of a black and white thing.

Depression is completely in the gray.



Most people with severe depressed don't end up living healthy lifestyles. It's very often fatal, and it impacts family members including children who can't understand why their parents feel a certain way and aren't healthy which can lead to depression or developmental issues later in life. It's not just being "sad" it's being completely devoid of normal feelings of life. You're incapable of the happiness or even simple contentment that others feel because of your brain chemistry. You feel numb, things don't feel real.

It's not grey, we just can't crack open the brain and measure chemicals yet. Depression is still a valid diagnosis, it's still pretty black and white you just have to know what to look for. There's just about as much trial and error in depression treatment as there is with cancer (especially once it's progressed to a certain stage).


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Sapere aude

"We cannot live for ourselves alone. Our lives are connected by a thousand invisible threads, and along these sympathetic fibers, our actions run as causes and return to us as results."


UBUNTU- I am because we are.




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Invisiblebadchad
Mad Scientist

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 13,373
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: Tangich]
    #18802747 - 09/05/13 10:29 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Tangich said:
What I'm often wondering, can depression actually be cured? I don't mean treated, but cured, like gone forever? Or does it always linger somewhere just waiting for an opportunity to spring back up?




I think the short answer is "yes" some cases of depression remit indefinitely.

It brings into question though the very definition of "depression" and how its diagnosed.  If you look at DSM-V, most symptoms are relatively vague:  What is a "depressed mood", which you have to have "most of the day, nearly every day" to account as a symptom.  How "recurrent" do you need to have "thoughts of death" to fulfill that criteria?  10x/day, once a week?, what constitutes a "diminished ability to think"?

ICD-10 classifications are nearly as subjective/complex.  And in clinical trials, "depression" is usually assessed via the HAM-D questionnaire, which also exists in various "modified" and/or truncated forms along with other odd questionnaires.

From a clinical sense, it makes diagnosis difficult.  Compound the difficulty in diagnosis with all of the vast scientific literature linking everything and its mother to depression or viewed as a "marker" of depression, and it makes the question of whether depression can be "cured" almost impossible to answer.


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...the whole experience is (and is as) a profound piece of knowledge.  It is an indellible experience; it is forever known.  I have known myself in a way I doubt I would have ever occurred except as it did.

Smith, P.  Bull. Menninger Clinic (1959) 23:20-27; p. 27.

...most subjects find the experience valuable, some find it frightening, and many say that is it uniquely lovely.

Osmond, H.  Annals, NY Acad Science (1957) 66:418-434; p.436


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OfflineGloomShroom
Stranger
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Registered: 09/04/13
Posts: 90
Last seen: 10 years, 1 month
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: smack] * 1
    #18802780 - 09/05/13 10:41 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

smack said:
If Walter White had depression, nothing would've happened.




HAHAHA ow my sides...


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Invisiblelessismore
Registered: 02/10/13
Posts: 6,268
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: GloomShroom]
    #18802824 - 09/05/13 10:56 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Maybe cancer and depression are both a result of forgetting oneself

Because if you are yourself you love your body, and it doesn't get sick as much
Then you probably wouldn't smoke everyday i.e.

Stress makes us forget ourselves too without knowing it, stress makes us careless about ourselves

That's why meditation is important, or living in a stress free environment

I think most illnesses are self created(a result of soul loss)
the soul is perfect, our bodies are a mirror of our souls state


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OfflinePatlal
You ask too many questions
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Registered: 10/09/10
Posts: 44,812
Loc: Ottawa Flag
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Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: lessismore]
    #18802850 - 09/05/13 11:03 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I'll be honest with you guys, I would trade my depression for a cancer if it meant that my depression would completely disappear. I'd rather do chemo for a while than live with depression all my life.

Luckily for me, I found the right meds, so technically my depression is cured.


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Invisiblelessismore
Registered: 02/10/13
Posts: 6,268
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: Patlal] * 1
    #18802925 - 09/05/13 11:20 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
I'll be honest with you guys, I would trade my depression for a cancer if it meant that my depression would completely disappear. I'd rather do chemo for a while than live with depression all my life.

Luckily for me, I found the right meds, so technically my depression is cured.




I was depressed everyday for 5 years, very stressed everyday for 10 years(no regular sleep in that period, and overeating etc.), but I had forgotten myself for >10 years , first partially then fully

Now I can never be depressed again, unless stress gets to control me again

My cure was psychedelics (LSD,mushrooms,salvia) , haven't taken them in approx 4 months, and 5-6 months before that, it lasts well.

But try to avoid stress with nature,meditation,minimum hours,doing what I love :-)
and by searching for a quiet place to live

The depression was so severe I almost destroyed myself, ate fastfood everyday for past 10 years, stopped drinking water(only drank coke everyday), got kidney stones/high bp/gaut/bad liver etc... went to the hospital numerous times (was only 25), had gained like 70 pounds...
was usually always a low healthy weight, lower than average weight, before I was depressed

Depression is from forgetting oneself often

The funny thing is I was sure I knew who I was....
But I was never happy.. not one single day, I just appeared so

Had forgotten most social activities, and anything fun in life, it was replaced with working& studies as my only enjoyment in life

Turned out I hadn't known myself in >10 years

When you are yourself, everything you see makes you happy, everything around you you appreciate, you love the world that you see like first time you saw it
happiness everyday from inside, and you know what makes you happy so you can appreciate it
you love every part of yourself as well, appreciate your body


Edited by lessismore (09/05/13 11:29 AM)


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OfflineXUL
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Registered: 03/16/05
Posts: 28,261
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Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: volcomstoner]
    #18802992 - 09/05/13 11:41 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

volcomstoner said:
:lolwut:
How the fuck are you going to compare depression to cancer?




I agree. His comparative conclusion could be made with many different illnesses. He doesn't prove anything.


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TRUMP 2020


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Invisiblekoraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,691
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: mellowparty] * 2
    #18803035 - 09/05/13 11:49 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mellowparty said:
They are both physical malfunctions of the body. They are both deadly, potentially treatable and can happen to anyone.



And a bicycle is like a car. Both have wheels and are used for transportation and they tend to break down at some point.

If you take enough distance, everything starts to blend into everything else. The question is: does that still give any useful insight? Usually it doesn't.


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Offlinemellowparty
legitimate researcher


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 18,467
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: XUL]
    #18803144 - 09/05/13 12:17 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mio said:
Maybe cancer and depression are both a result of forgetting oneself

Because if you are yourself you love your body, and it doesn't get sick as much
Then you probably wouldn't smoke everyday i.e.

Stress makes us forget ourselves too without knowing it, stress makes us careless about ourselves

That's why meditation is important, or living in a stress free environment

I think most illnesses are self created(a result of soul loss)
the soul is perfect, our bodies are a mirror of our souls state



Quote:

XUL said:
Quote:

volcomstoner said:
:lolwut:
How the fuck are you going to compare depression to cancer?




I agree. His comparative conclusion could be made with many different illnesses.



So what you are saying is that one feature of a disease resembling similar feature or outcome in an unrelated disease is itself an unrelated feature because it originates from two different health-related conditions?


Quote:

He doesn't prove anything



:facepalm: I see that the point of this comparison has evaded your senses oh wise one. It was never my goal to prove that depression is somehow resembling cancer outside the simple frameworks of my comparison.


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Offlinemellowparty
legitimate researcher


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 18,467
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: koraks]
    #18803155 - 09/05/13 12:20 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

koraks said:
The question is: does that still give any useful insight? Usually it doesn't.



Yes, because it raises awareness about some general misconceptions about depression. You can't shake it off at the pub with a couple of pints and friends, but hey you can't do that with cancer either which is not technically incorrect but points to the persistence of the original problem.


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OfflineSnotfish
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Registered: 02/27/10
Posts: 2,082
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Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: mellowparty]
    #18803203 - 09/05/13 12:37 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

You need to seriously stop drawing comparisons between the two. They are completely different. One creates deadly and spreadable tumors. One is chemical neuron balance. They are not the same, quit trying to lump them together because one, whether it is hard to cope with, is much more fatal than the other and much more difficult to treat.


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Invisiblesmack
Observer
Male

Registered: 08/05/09
Posts: 5,600
Loc: Land of the Ice and Snow Flag
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: Snotfish]
    #18803214 - 09/05/13 12:40 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

This thread stinks of pretentious college kid.


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14:31


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Offlinemellowparty
legitimate researcher


Registered: 05/17/09
Posts: 18,467
Last seen: 10 years, 3 months
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: Snotfish]
    #18803217 - 09/05/13 12:41 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Dankfish said:
They are not the same



:imout:


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Invisiblekoraks
Registered: 06/02/03
Posts: 26,691
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: mellowparty] * 1
    #18803302 - 09/05/13 01:05 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mellowparty said:
Quote:

koraks said:
The question is: does that still give any useful insight? Usually it doesn't.



Yes, because it raises awareness about some general misconceptions about depression. You can't shake it off at the pub with a couple of pints and friends, but hey you can't do that with cancer either which is not technically incorrect but points to the persistence of the original problem.



If that's the purpose, then the tactic will backfire. It'll anger cancer patients for having their deadly disease compared to something that is decidedly less lethal (generalizing across all types of cancer and all types of depression). It may also anger patients suffering from depression, for basically the same reason. And to skeptics, you are only the more vulnerable in your argument because once you get past the superficialities in the OP, it becomes really difficult to uphold a credible argument that the two are comparable.


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InvisibleAsante
Mage
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Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 87,006
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: mellowparty] * 2
    #18803311 - 09/05/13 01:08 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mellowparty said:
They are both physical malfunctions of the body. They are both deadly, potentially treatable and can happen to anyone.





:mad:

Rectal prolapse is like depression too, they're both physical malfunctions resulting in you being unable to handle your shit.

Seriously though an OP should have more content than that.  Theres a whole encylopedia of ailments that fit that description, making the two that were picked entirely arbitrary in absence of a conrete topic.


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Omnicyclion.org
higher knowledge starts here


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OfflineShortknight
Male


Registered: 02/25/13
Posts: 2,164
Last seen: 6 years, 6 months
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: nicechrisman]
    #18803387 - 09/05/13 01:35 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

nicechrisman said:
But do you think depression can lead to cancer?



It totally can. Although you can get cancer unluckily anyhow, the happier life you live the less chance you have to get it, stress just cripples you sometimes, and makes your body do all sorts of funky stuff:peace:

Shorty:yinyang:


--------------------
Did I say it too loud? Big heart? Or a little misleading!:musicnote:


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OfflineXUL
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Registered: 03/16/05
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Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: Shortknight]
    #18803455 - 09/05/13 02:00 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

It was never my goal to prove that depression is somehow resembling cancer outside the simple frameworks of my comparison.




On this forum you should expect that some of us will respond in an intelligent manner as we may inquire to more than a hypothesis and request some data or a theory. You have a hypothesis, so what now?

How would you prove this to us through experiment?


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TRUMP 2020


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OfflineKonyap

Registered: 06/30/07
Posts: 33,945
Loc: Planet Piss
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: XUL] * 1
    #18803506 - 09/05/13 02:13 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Thinking about cancer, gives you cancer.  Not thinking about cancer, gives you more cancer.


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OfflineMush4Brains
LOOL HACKED!!!

Registered: 07/31/13
Posts: 4,419
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: Depression resembles cancer [Re: Konyap] * 1
    #18803585 - 09/05/13 02:36 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I think this thread has given me both depression and cancer.


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