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uncle_rico
my own worst enemy


Registered: 03/28/06
Posts: 2,664
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Re: Lime soaking straw [Re: FoxFire]
#18830359 - 09/11/13 10:21 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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"I'm interested in why the hot water pasteurization wasn't working for you.. Do you think it was a procedural thing? Genetics? I'm really curious because I've never had a straw log/bucket not colonize..
I also just realized that those buckets are bagasse which I have never used before.. Did you spawn through or layer those buckets?" FF
I don't think it was a procedural or genetics thing. I'm thinking it was a ph thing.
The spawn was layered.
CAP_TURTLE ... I haven't done holes larger than 3/8". These are the first buckets I drilled ... and 3/8" was the biggest bit I could 'chuck up' in my little drill.
Some of the pins didn't develop past the initial pinset ... I figure there were too many for the substrate to support. .. I think fewer, larger holes may work out better.
FoxFire has various sized holes in the buckets in his gallery. do you recommend fewer, larger holes?
 1st two lime buckets continuing to develop.
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FoxFire
Energized Matter



Registered: 07/17/05
Posts: 1,281
Loc: PNW
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I'd say those are good to go Rico!  What if, when we are pasteurizing it's been the lime doing the job all along, and the heat is only secondary... 
Quote:
FoxFire has various sized holes in the buckets in his gallery. do you recommend fewer, larger holes?
No. I recommend the same 4-5 inch spacing with smaller holes. Especially in the 5 gallon buckets, it's still a lot of holes which = a lot of surface area. I'm thinking 3/8" to 1/2" holes are best.
My newest run has mostly 3/8 inch holes that are pinning as of a few days ago, looks like Saturdays Farmers Market is a go! 
The bucket with the red warning label is from the old run, and the one bucket that is past its prime is for a spore photo op fyi
    (Sorry, I never miss a chance to show off )
Another thing I noticed when using the smaller holes is that when you pack the straw into it, it doesn't poke out the sides as much,. and the grain spawn doesn't fall out the holes as much either.
The 1" holes can give you some HUGE clusters, but at the sacrifice of most of the other clusters that grow poorly or just abort. 
Buckets are great, but I can't wait to have the facilities to hang up a bunch of columns! And if these oysters eat up the lime soaked straw en masse, that could prove to be very profitable...

-FF
-------------------- Unless someone like you cares a whole awful lot, Nothing is going to get better. It's not.
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CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Re: Lime soaking straw [Re: FoxFire]
#18831957 - 09/12/13 10:40 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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It looks like you have a lot of buckets in your room with 1" plus holes? Are those older buckets? Also do you use food safe buckets? They are more expensive but I have been buying them in case that becomes an issue in the future with any of the markets I wish to attend. I am planning a setup more or less exactly like yours though! Also forgive me if I've already asked you lol it's hard to remember all the great people around here but what are you doing for humidity and what about exhaust?
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FoxFire
Energized Matter



Registered: 07/17/05
Posts: 1,281
Loc: PNW
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I dont want to thread jack this most excellent of threads, so I made this thread about my green house and buckets and whatnot.
To answer your question, most of the new batch is in buckets with 3/8" holes, but there are some of the bigger ones in there.
All my buckets are food grade, either pickle buckets or the ones I got off ebay from an ice cream place (they all smell like raspberry jam ).
My GH has no exhaust, it's outside so it's always full of fresh air, that seems to have come new-made from snowy mountains high beneath a dome of stars, or from shores of silver far away washed by seas of foam.
Yeah, it's that fresh.

-FF
-------------------- Unless someone like you cares a whole awful lot, Nothing is going to get better. It's not.
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CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Re: Lime soaking straw [Re: FoxFire]
#18836516 - 09/13/13 11:18 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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When examining my lime soaked straw today I realized there are sprouts in it! I seen there was light wheat grains in it but figured so long as no contams ate it they'd be fine. Well no contams got to them but they sprouted lol I'm not sure if this will cause me any issues in the future. Will it just continue to grow if i let it and i can dispose of it when I dispose of the bags/buckets or will it die while being taken over by the mycelium then be prone to contams later. The ones I pasteurized for 30-45 mins at 145 before it dropped along with teh lime didn't get any sprouts but was a hassle so I'd like to continue with the lime and have 4 ful bales of this straw left.
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worowa
Professor

Registered: 06/29/07
Posts: 299
Last seen: 8 months, 25 days
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Quote:
CAP_TURTLE said: When examining my lime soaked straw today I realized there are sprouts in it! I seen there was light wheat grains in it but figured so long as no contams ate it they'd be fine. Well no contams got to them but they sprouted lol I'm not sure if this will cause me any issues in the future. Will it just continue to grow if i let it and i can dispose of it when I dispose of the bags/buckets or will it die while being taken over by the mycelium then be prone to contams later. The ones I pasteurized for 30-45 mins at 145 before it dropped along with teh lime didn't get any sprouts but was a hassle so I'd like to continue with the lime and have 4 ful bales of this straw left.
Yeh, I've had the same thing when using oat chaff and lime. The blocks fruited mushies, but the oats only got a few leaves, grew about 15cm, then shrivelled up. What I found interesting was some of the bags I didn't spawn-the ones left open sprouted oats, the ones I folded up never did,so CO2 (my guess)seems important for seed sprouting. I've had success with enoki, king oysters,a shimeji (not sure if it's Llyophylum) and shiitake using lime soaked eucalypt sawdust.
-------------------- We are all in this together. Visit my site, forestfungi.com.au, let me know what you think.
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CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Re: Lime soaking straw [Re: worowa]
#18839234 - 09/13/13 10:52 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Just curious foxfire, what area are you in and what do you sell oysters for?
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FoxFire
Energized Matter



Registered: 07/17/05
Posts: 1,281
Loc: PNW
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I'm up in the San Juan Islands, Washington.
I sell my oysters for $10/pound to the restaurants, and $4/quarter pound ($16/lb) at the farmers market.
I am the only person, as far as I know, who is doing this in the whole county, at least on this scale, which isn't all that big in the grand scheme of things.. 
-FF
-------------------- Unless someone like you cares a whole awful lot, Nothing is going to get better. It's not.
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liamtheloser
Advanced Idiot

Registered: 06/07/06
Posts: 1,453
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Re: Lime soaking straw [Re: FoxFire]
#18839738 - 09/14/13 01:15 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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You on orcas?
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uncle_rico
my own worst enemy


Registered: 03/28/06
Posts: 2,664
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well .... guys ... I have had some left-over lime water sitting in a closed bin for 3 days (it is Friday night and I spawned buckets Tuesday night). I opened the lid ... PU!
stinky ... like fish .. fishy bacteria.
I am not so keen on reusing this lime water, in fact, I won't. keeping the water use to a minimum and then neutralizing/discarding it seems like the direction I will go.
I'm loving the lime water pasteurization. (just started another batch soaking tonight)
  1st two buckets ... harvested .. and dunked. two other buckets made up Tuesday .... next batch of bulk is pasteurizing now.
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deadmandave
Slime


Registered: 02/16/10
Posts: 3,355
Loc:
Last seen: 11 hours, 29 minutes
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those are some good looking oysers! I used a stinky batch of lime and after 48 hours the log smelled normal so that was nice.
i've found that throwing a few kgs of wood chips into the lime water and letting it soak for a while brings the ph down to ~8. These are mostly cottonwood and a bit of aspen chips.
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OICU812
NC Tree Farm owner


Registered: 11/06/11
Posts: 1,064
Loc: Foothills of NC
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
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Generally, the fishy smell from the leftover lime water will be due to anaerobic bacteria, that is, bacteria formed in the absence of oxygen. Try using a small aquarium air pump with some tubing and an air stone. Bubbling some air in the water continuously will inject oxygen and thus prevent this bacterium.
-------------------- -------------- "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!" --Benjamin Franklin "Those who give up liberty for security won't have, or deserve, either.". . . Benjamin Franklin ----> Read: The Fight of our Lives - Defeating the Ideological War Against the West - by Victor Davis Hanson
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CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Re: Lime soaking straw [Re: OICU812]
#18840702 - 09/14/13 10:59 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thats an awesome idea OICU812! I knew I saved that fish pump for something lol I found ause for the aquarium it was to to pump mist into my greenhouse the other day. It had a lid with 2 removeable holes so fan goe into one and exhaust for mist out the other. I will try this immediately and let all know how it works. As far as the smell though I havent noticed this yet.
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CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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I accidentally soaked my straw around 40 or so hours instead of 24. Anyone think I will have a problem using this? I used fresh water for this batch.
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Ripjohnnyc
ninja


Registered: 11/18/11
Posts: 115
Last seen: 4 years, 1 month
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I accidentally left my soak for 2 days, and I tried it out. The straw was so dark and looked over saturated, but I inoculated some 3 ft logs anyways. The mycelium started growing, but after a couple days the whole thing was disgusting so I tossed them outside. I just threw them in the forrest at the back of my property, and they are recovering. I hope to have some "wild" oysters next year if these logs end up fruiting out there. I think if I had a way to dry the straw out more it would of work, I just find it hard getting the straw to field capacity because the cold wet straw just doesn't dry nicely like hot pasteurized straw. I am going to give those onion bags a try others have mentioned. Good luck!
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drake89
Mushroom Magnate



Registered: 06/26/11
Posts: 4,168
Loc: TN
Last seen: 4 years, 10 months
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Quote:
Ripjohnnyc said: I accidentally left my soak for 2 days, and I tried it out. The straw was so dark and looked over saturated, but I inoculated some 3 ft logs anyways. The mycelium started growing, but after a couple days the whole thing was disgusting so I tossed them outside. I just threw them in the forrest at the back of my property, and they are recovering. I hope to have some "wild" oysters next year if these logs end up fruiting out there. I think if I had a way to dry the straw out more it would of work, I just find it hard getting the straw to field capacity because the cold wet straw just doesn't dry nicely like hot pasteurized straw. I am going to give those onion bags a try others have mentioned. Good luck!
Quote:
Ripjohnnyc said: I accidentally left my soak for 2 days, and I tried it out. The straw was so dark and looked over saturated, but I inoculated some 3 ft logs anyways. The mycelium started growing, but after a couple days the whole thing was disgusting so I tossed them outside. I just threw them in the forrest at the back of my property, and they are recovering. I hope to have some "wild" oysters next year if these logs end up fruiting out there. I think if I had a way to dry the straw out more it would of work, I just find it hard getting the straw to field capacity because the cold wet straw just doesn't dry nicely like hot pasteurized straw. I am going to give those onion bags a try others have mentioned. Good luck!
Quote:
Ripjohnnyc said: I accidentally left my soak for 2 days, and I tried it out. The straw was so dark and looked over saturated, but I inoculated some 3 ft logs anyways. The mycelium started growing, but after a couple days the whole thing was disgusting so I tossed them outside. I just threw them in the forrest at the back of my property, and they are recovering. I hope to have some "wild" oysters next year if these logs end up fruiting out there. I think if I had a way to dry the straw out more it would of work, I just find it hard getting the straw to field capacity because the cold wet straw just doesn't dry nicely like hot pasteurized straw. I am going to give those onion bags a try others have mentioned. Good luck!
I gave laundry bags a try yesterday cause I can strap them straight to my woodchipper, I don't know why I didn't think of this before. Now I spend a half hour rather than a full hour every afternoon with the straw shredding. Liberating!
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cyt333
Stranger



Registered: 02/07/11
Posts: 11
Loc: Oregon
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Re: Lime soaking straw [Re: drake89]
#18851270 - 09/16/13 09:03 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I have used the mesh laundry bags bungeed to my chipper for a few years now. They would go from the chipper right into my barrel pasturizer. Cheap from Wallyworld and would usually last a few months. Don't know how long the bags will last with a lime soak. The lime tek looks very promising.
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NSF
Eager to learn


Registered: 01/27/11
Posts: 548
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
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Re: Lime soaking straw [Re: OICU812] 1
#18855411 - 09/17/13 08:43 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
OICU812 said: Generally, the fishy smell from the leftover lime water will be due to anaerobic bacteria, that is, bacteria formed in the absence of oxygen. Try using a small aquarium air pump with some tubing and an air stone. Bubbling some air in the water continuously will inject oxygen and thus prevent this bacterium.

I wonder whether or not oxygenating the water is a good idea, here's a video where stamets talks about anaerobic pasteurisation in salt water, then using oxygen to kill the bacteria Stamets at the Uplift festival Australia
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CAP_TURTLE
Adventurer



Registered: 03/11/05
Posts: 1,135
Last seen: 5 years, 8 months
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Re: Lime soaking straw [Re: NSF]
#18857283 - 09/18/13 10:03 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Slightly off topic but how are you guys cutting your straw? right now i'm using the mower but I need a way to do it indoors. Either leaf blower setup or trash can and weed eater is the other option. Any bad experiences with either?
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Forrester
aspiring sociopath


Registered: 02/05/13
Posts: 9,351
Loc: Northeast USA
Last seen: 25 days, 5 hours
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^^ I haven't used either method myself, but a friend of mine is a big fan of the weed-eater in a trash can method. He just modified the lid with a hole only big enough to stick the handle of the weed-eater through. He used it indoors in his basement, said it worked well and kept pieces from flying all over the place.
-------------------- Repugnant is a creature who would squander the ability to lift an eye to heaven, conscious of his fleeting time here. ------------------- Have some medicinal mushrooms and want to get the most out of them? Try this double extraction method.
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