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Offlinenepter627
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should colonizing jars have
    #18799954 - 09/04/13 04:33 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

their lids screwed on tightly or loosened?


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OfflineAce1928
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: nepter627]
    #18799976 - 09/04/13 04:38 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Loosely. You want to allow the CO2 produced inside the jar to escape a little. But do not have it so loose that there are actual gaps to the air. Just enough so that pressure doesn't build up to an extreme.

Best option would be to have a 1 or more breather holes in the jar that are filled with a synthetic filter material like polyfill etc.


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Only by embracing that which mother nature has supplied to us can we hope to ever peacefully exist on this planet


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InvisibleSpitballJedi
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: Ace1928]
    #18799993 - 09/04/13 04:42 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Snug the lids down, but you don't need to wrench them. There is a reason you make GE holes and use a filter.


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Edited by SpitballJedi (09/04/13 04:45 PM)


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InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: Ace1928]
    #18799999 - 09/04/13 04:44 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Ace1928 said:
Loosely.



This is wrong to say no matter what sentence follows.  ALL lids should have a gas exchange port of some form or another.  Put your lid on tight (hand tight) to keep out contamination.


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OfflineAce1928
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: HypnotoadCroaked]
    #18800006 - 09/04/13 04:45 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Whippy said:
Quote:

Ace1928 said:
Loosely.



This is wrong to say no matter what sentence follows.  ALL lids should have a gas exchange port of some form or another.  Put your lid on tight (hand tight) to keep out contamination.




If the jars already have stuff in them then loosely is your only option.
You cannot go drilling holes in after you have inoculated.


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Offlinenepter627
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: HypnotoadCroaked]
    #18800010 - 09/04/13 04:46 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

so if i have one hole about the size of a skrewdriver thats fine?

im using tyvek as a filter till i can buy a sfd


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InvisibleSpitballJedi
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: nepter627]
    #18800017 - 09/04/13 04:46 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

yes. that's fine


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Offlinenepter627
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #18800020 - 09/04/13 04:47 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

thanks.


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InvisibleSpitballJedi
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: Ace1928]
    #18800038 - 09/04/13 04:50 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Ace1928 said:
If the jars already have stuff in them then loosely is your only option.
You cannot go drilling holes in after you have inoculated.




When would you have stuff in them but no GE hole drilled?

and

When would you inoculate before GE hole is drilled?


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InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: Ace1928]
    #18800041 - 09/04/13 04:50 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Ace1928 said:

If the jars already have stuff in them then loosely is your only option.
You cannot go drilling holes in after you have inoculated.




GE PORTS should be in the lid before you even jar anything up.  Without a gas exchange port, you are setting yourself up for failure.  If you have created a grain tek that involves no holes in the lid and a loosely fitting lid, please feel free to present it.  There is no way that a "loosely" fit lid will offer proper gas exchange AND keep out contamination.


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OfflineAce1928
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #18800057 - 09/04/13 04:53 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Some people new to the hobby do that. As i did myself at the time I started

And in saying that no jars with loose lids ever got a contam but it definitely wasn't ideal.
Effectively if you have a small gap the pressure of the gas build up inside the jar is higher than external pressure so air wont get sucked in. Providing the thread of the jar doesn't get wet that means there is no where for contams to come in.

GE hole > loose lide any day of the week though


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OfflineAce1928
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: HypnotoadCroaked]
    #18800066 - 09/04/13 04:55 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Whippy said:
Quote:

Ace1928 said:

If the jars already have stuff in them then loosely is your only option.
You cannot go drilling holes in after you have inoculated.




GE PORTS should be in the lid before you even jar anything up.  Without a gas exchange port, you are setting yourself up for failure.  If you have created a grain tek that involves no holes in the lid and a loosely fitting lid, please feel free to present it.  There is no way that a "loosely" fit lid will offer proper gas exchange AND keep out contamination.




Challenge Accepted :P

I have some sterilized jars with no holes in the lids waiting to go at the moment. Just waiting for my agar plate to finish colonizing which should only be a few days off.
Then ill take photos of colonization progress

I can assure you it won't be ideal growth speed but it has worked before.


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InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: Ace1928]
    #18800119 - 09/04/13 05:06 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Ace1928 said:
Some people new to the hobby do that. As i did myself at the time I started

And in saying that no jars with loose lids ever got a contam but it definitely wasn't ideal.
Effectively if you have a small gap the pressure of the gas build up inside the jar is higher than external pressure so air wont get sucked in. Providing the thread of the jar doesn't get wet that means there is no where for contams to come in.

GE hole > loose lide any day of the week though



You are making less and less sense to me.

There are plenty of "people new to the hobby" that have been using gas exchange ports for years and years.  I eagerly anticipate a photo of your excellent jar tek for people not new to the hobby, and a scientific explanation of how a loose jar will exhale pressure, but never brings pressure in.  Also, what about IF the jar is "exhaling", what is to stop humidity from accumulating near the edges of the lid.  Surely water drops near the lid create a vector of contamination.  There is a very good reason why we use "GAS EXCHANGE PORTS".  There is an exchange, and not the "exhale only" it seems you are stating jars do.

I am really just hoping that I misunderstood you, because it still feels like you are advocating a no-hole grain jar lid screwed on loose for gas exchange.


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Offlinejonnymushroom
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: nepter627]
    #18800120 - 09/04/13 05:06 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

As long as the co2 can get out and you can open the jars easy you will be ok just snug is fine.


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InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: Ace1928]
    #18800146 - 09/04/13 05:11 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Ace1928 said:

I can assure you it won't be ideal growth speed but it has worked before.



Ill bite.

Assuming that it colonizes, you are stating that it "won't be ideal growth speed" as a comparison to what?


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OfflineAce1928
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: jonnymushroom]
    #18800152 - 09/04/13 05:13 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I'm not advocating a no hole grain jar lid. IT works in a situation where you forgot to put gas exchange or something.

But it is not ideal in comparison to if you have gas exchange ports. A loose lid is most definitely not optimal but in a last ditch effort to not completely screw your jar it will work.

The scientific explanation as to why it exhales pressure but does not bring it in is due to the metabolism of carbohydrates that is occurring by the mycelium. It's the same as when you brew alcohol.

Quote:

jonnymushroom said:
As long as the co2 can get out and you can open the jars easy you will be ok just snug is fine.





What that guy said ^^


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Only by embracing that which mother nature has supplied to us can we hope to ever peacefully exist on this planet


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InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
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Registered: 01/05/13
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: Ace1928]
    #18800186 - 09/04/13 05:26 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Ace1928 said:
I'm not advocating a no hole grain jar lid. IT works in a situation where you forgot to put gas exchange or something.




You are saying it will work, but terribly and advising others of such like this is a new-best-idea.  Less than 10 minutes to drill a case of wide mouth jar lids out and pack with polyfill WILL yield MUCH MUCH faster colonization, but you are stating that, not me.

"But it is not ideal in comparison to if you have gas exchange ports."

OP:  Take it for what its worth.  This is either a troll, or someone who obviously does not care about knowingly giving advice that is bad in this thread.


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InvisibleSpitballJedi
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: Ace1928]
    #18800187 - 09/04/13 05:26 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

In all the threads I've read, I don't recall ever reading that someone did not make a GE hole of some sort in their lid.:shrug:

I'm not saying it can't be done, I'm just saying it's so basic to this hobby, that not making one would be like forgetting to sterilize.

I think it's so basic, that I don't understand why you would even mention leaving the lid loose.


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A little civility goes a long way

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InvisibleHypnotoadCroaked
Retired, but will check MSGs

Registered: 01/05/13
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #18800208 - 09/04/13 05:30 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

SpitballJedi said:
In all the threads I've read, I don't recall ever reading that someone did not make a GE hole of some sort in their lid.:shrug:





I dunno either.  Im done here.  I scoped out some of Aces' threads.  Pretty much found that I wasted time here defending correct and simple procedures that involve thinking ahead.


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Offlinenepter627
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Re: should colonizing jars have [Re: SpitballJedi]
    #18800211 - 09/04/13 05:31 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

in franks wbs prep he states
"Sometimes when I take them out of the PC hot, the lids will be a little loose. I tighten each lid before I shake it, then I loosen it a quarter turn afterwards. Put each in an area with minimal air movement to cool overnight (I use a large plastic tote.)"


thats why i ask


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