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Offlinejimiandtheshroom27
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18767173 - 08/28/13 04:11 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Yes you do, why would you else post the following smiley after your sentence: :rolleyes:?

To indicate that maybe you are depressed. I apologise it was poor choice of smiley for the intended meaning.

they use cognitive patterns to create melody and rhythm IMO.
What are instincts if not cognitive patterns? Isn't all activity cognitive patterns? I can't help but feel you are just disagreeing for the sake of it right now. I'm a blues musician. What i mean is times when you aren't aware for sure of what note you are about to hit.


What defines raw emotion? Not thinking things through and acting on instinct? How is that an emotion?


No. I'm getting seriously tired of you twisting everyone's words into things they're not even saying. I am saying that as a musician, acting on instinct and not thinking things through (no doubt you'll claim i am) allows you to access raw emotion. Jesus. I never claimed instinct and not thinking were emotion.

Quote:

Silliness is by all means stupidity turned acceptable.




Stupidity transcends many species of animals across the animal kingdom. Are stupid animals not acceptable?

I think the main fault in your argument is that you are certain you are right about things which can not even be proven. The ego arguably does not even exist, it is simply used to represent certain aspects of our psyche. There is no actual place in the human brain where the ego specifically rests.

Here's the sound part of your argument- Humour is laughing at other organisms. Perhaps that may sound bad to you, but i dont think so. Could be bad, could not be. All that means is simply laughing at the life around us. Everything else you have said about humour is conjecture. The idea that it is destructive, feeds the ego, that a baby laughing at the sky does so because it's ego says "i am alive, i am great", that Illusions are destructive.

Ultimately, whenever someone gives you a good point that challenges the idea that humour is destructive, you start referring to unconscious forces that can not be proved nor disproved such as the ego being fed and that a baby feels heroism when it looks at the sky and laughs. You've also completely ignored the positive effects of humour.


--------------------
Are you a lucky little lady in the City of Light
Or just another lost angel?
City of Night, City of Night,
City of Night, City of Night, woo, c'mon


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18767244 - 08/28/13 05:31 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
Ultimately, it's all about laughing at organisms.

Finding confidence in imbecile. Glorification of idiotic.

I suppose laughing with the genius is sane but even then, you're laughing at other organisms as subjective metric. Unless you take everything with you into eden.




In my opinion laughter is the vocal manifestation of an emotion, if you take away our language and revert back to apish grunts laughter still has its part. That part doesn't necessarily communicate what you're suggesting in OP, as often as not laughter is completely innocent.

When a friend of mine walks in the room I laugh because I'm happy to see them


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: jimiandtheshroom27]
    #18767578 - 08/28/13 08:31 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

To indicate that maybe you are depressed.

Merely to boost your own ego or confidence. That you're somehow right since I am weaker than yourself.

What are instincts if not cognitive patterns? Isn't all activity cognitive patterns? I can't help but feel you are just disagreeing for the sake of it right now. I'm a blues musician. What i mean is times when you aren't aware for sure of what note you are about to hit.

Cognitive patterns are based on thoughts; musicians, improvisational ones too use well thought out cognitive patterns when creating music.

No. I'm getting seriously tired of you twisting everyone's words into things they're not even saying. I am saying that as a musician, acting on instinct and not thinking things through (no doubt you'll claim i am) allows you to access raw emotion. Jesus. I never claimed instinct and not thinking were emotion.

What does "access raw emotion" then mean?

Also, theoretically speaking it's not possible to not think and so therefore purely act on instincts is impossible. But humour is a leading contributor to more instinctive behavior or less thinking which is obviously destructive in today's world.

Stupidity transcends many species of animals across the animal kingdom. Are stupid animals not acceptable?

Some are accepted, some are not. Humans control and boss over less intelligent organisms so they are accepted based on silliness and not stupidity. On the other hand, many humans rage on and abuse less intelligent organisms due to the organisms stupidity.

However, stupidity amongst humans is not acceptable but it's when turned into silliness. Behaving like you're stupid, when you're only being silly but in reality stupid or less intelligent.

Smartness is humans primary weapon.

I think the main fault in your argument is that you are certain you are right about things which can not even be proven. The ego arguably does not even exist, it is simply used to represent certain aspects of our psyche. There is no actual place in the human brain where the ego specifically rests.

Laugh till you die.



What does it matter if the ego exist or not?

Fact is, people laugh at each other because they feel better than the victim.

Here's the sound part of your argument- Humour is laughing at other organisms. Perhaps that may sound bad to you, but i dont think so. Could be bad, could not be.

Finding confidence in imbecile. Glorification of idiotic.

Ultimately, whenever someone gives you a good point that challenges the idea that humour is destructive, you start referring to unconscious forces that can not be proved nor disproved such as the ego being fed and that a baby feels heroism when it looks at the sky and laughs. You've also completely ignored the positive effects of humour.

Show me an example where humour is not destructive.

It's obvious the baby feels heroic when laughing as laughing is a defense mechanism against the fragility of existence, surely you can't disagree with this?

The positive effects of humour is based on negative effects of another.


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18767595 - 08/28/13 08:37 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

In my opinion laughter is the vocal manifestation of an emotion, if you take away our language and revert back to apish grunts laughter still has its part. That part doesn't necessarily communicate what you're suggesting in OP, as often as not laughter is completely innocent.

Why must we always compare ourselves to the past?

Learn from it and avoid it, its repetitive pattern is clearly not working. Laughter is by all means making fun of organisms unless you have factual examples of the opposite. Nor is there any novelty in laughing. People in masses laugh at the exact same situations over and over again.

When a friend of mine walks in the room I laugh because I'm happy to see them

Because you find them silly IMO. Or you have had many such moments with them, making fun of organisms together.

Now you will feed your defense mechanism or shield through or with/at your friends on the behalf of idiocity.


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: liquidlounge] * 3
    #18767702 - 08/28/13 09:21 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

In my opinion you're assuming a lot without much ground to stand on. The word novelty doesn't mean much to me, but poetry does. Life isn't black and white, there can be a million emotions behind a laugh.

How many variations can one make with 7 notes?

On first glance there isn't much to the chromatic scale, especially when its reduced to 7, 5, or 3 notes being examined at a time. A melodic sequence might read: C E G C D E E G
Very plain but that could be any song, if you look at the math and forget that there is poetry which gives the numbers life and meaning then there is no understanding.


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18767895 - 08/28/13 10:21 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

In my opinion you're assuming a lot without much ground to stand on. The word novelty doesn't mean much to me, but poetry does. Life isn't black and white, there can be a million emotions behind a laugh.

I have shown proof and logic approach to back up my statements, now it's your turn to prove me wrong.

What do you laugh at when you see your friends come into the room?

How many variations can one make with 7 notes?

On first glance there isn't much to the chromatic scale, especially when its reduced to 7, 5, or 3 notes being examined at a time. A melodic sequence might read: C E G C D E E G
Very plain but that could be any song, if you look at the math and forget that there is poetry which gives the numbers life and meaning then there is no understanding.


This was too complicated for me, please elaborate more simple.


--------------------
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Offlineashfiken
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: liquidlounge] * 1
    #18767992 - 08/28/13 11:03 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I, by and large, agree with op.
I think in all cases it would be an intelligent evolution to direct swap out silliness/humor/glorification of stupidity for compassion.
I would be interested to obtain data in humans detailing their affinity towards one or the other and how they are mutually exclusive or not.
Seems to me that it may be a logical thought pattern to assume those using the mechanism of humor(which is ultimately at another organisms expense) may be devoid of compassion.
Wih rational thought humor can be diminished nd compassion traded in flux.
I see how SILLY it has been for most to assume how serious and boring we would be without laughter. Nonsense. Take away laughter and you still have a caring and comforting smile, tears of joy, and prob many Other ways we can healthily show our positive feelings.
Great thought provoking thread LL.
Cheers


--------------------
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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: ashfiken]
    #18768012 - 08/28/13 11:11 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

:thumbup:


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Offlinejimiandtheshroom27
Lost in endless spirals.
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18768049 - 08/28/13 11:29 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Merely to boost your own ego or confidence. That you're somehow right since I am weaker than yourself.

Not at all. I suffer from depression. I just think its important to see how it can affect your mind.

What does "access raw emotion" then mean?

To tap into the subconscious, where some of our strongest, unrestrained feelings are held.

Quote:

stupidity amongst humans is not acceptable




Yes it is, to an extent. so long as isn't harmful. It's certainly not desirable, but it's accepted.

What does it matter if the ego exist or not?

Fact is, people laugh at each other because they feel better than the victim.


You were the one who brought ego into it. Several of your explanations for humour being destructive have been based around the ego. Seems pretty important for your argument.

Finding confidence in imbecile. Glorification of idiotic.
Okay. you've said that many times. :rolleyes:
Yes okay. That's one way of looking at humour. That's one way of saying this is what its all about.

Show me an example where humour is not destructive.

I can, but at the same time i can't. The reason i can't is because any example i give you will claim is destructive, for reasons that cannot be proven nor disproved. You are taking one way of looking at humour and claiming it as its raison d etre.

It's obvious the baby feels heroic when laughing as laughing is a defense mechanism against the fragility of existence, surely you can't disagree with this?


Hahaha of course i can! Can you read a babies mind? It is just your opinion laughing is a defence mechanism against the fragility of life! Even if it is a defence mechanism, it is again just your opinion that defence mechanisms are harmful.

I don't think i've ever met a person who has been so sure of their views that they don't have the politeness to at least occasionally say "i think that" as opposed to just stating their own views like facts. Its just nice to acknowledge that matters of the mind are subjective.


--------------------
Are you a lucky little lady in the City of Light
Or just another lost angel?
City of Night, City of Night,
City of Night, City of Night, woo, c'mon


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18770265 - 08/28/13 08:07 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
In my opinion you're assuming a lot without much ground to stand on. The word novelty doesn't mean much to me, but poetry does. Life isn't black and white, there can be a million emotions behind a laugh.

I have shown proof and logic approach to back up my statements, now it's your turn to prove me wrong.

What do you laugh at when you see your friends come into the room?

How many variations can one make with 7 notes?

On first glance there isn't much to the chromatic scale, especially when its reduced to 7, 5, or 3 notes being examined at a time. A melodic sequence might read: C E G C D E E G
Very plain but that could be any song, if you look at the math and forget that there is poetry which gives the numbers life and meaning then there is no understanding.


This was too complicated for me, please elaborate more simple.




Most of the time there isn't an object to laugh at, the act of laughing being only an expression like a smile. Most of the time I don't smile at anything either, it is only an expression of a mood.

The musical analogy. If you take the melody of a song and write it out, even if we're talking about classical music which is very detailed, the math tells us little about the music. Its the poetry in music which gives it life and meaning, not the math.
With laughter its the same, its a means for expressing emotion not an emotion in itself, anymore than the notes which one expresses themselves through is an emotion.

On another point laughter is physiologically good for you and its not a behavior limited to humans


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Offlineomegafaust
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18770408 - 08/28/13 08:35 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Op says he takes humour for what it is, yet he seems completely blind of its true purposes. 

obviously op has been ridiculed his whole life and so takes offense to other peoples enjoyment.

you will have a very sour soul op if you don't give in to the joys of life.

i would argue humour is an instinct.  laughing relieves stress which when unchecked puts stress on your genes, whivh results in abnormalities, sickness, cancer.

so we use humour in a way to regulate stress as previously stated.  much like yawning, which alerts others to your mental clarity, humour is important.


--------------------
The Universe has an interesting sense of irony, in that you are the universe experiencing itself.  All you are is a thought.


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InvisibleLunarEclipse
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: omegafaust]
    #18770647 - 08/28/13 09:22 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

omegafaust said:
Op says he takes humour for what it is, yet he seems completely blind of its true purposes. 

obviously op has been ridiculed his whole life and so takes offense to other peoples enjoyment.

you will have a very sour soul op if you don't give in to the joys of life.

i would argue humour is an instinct.  laughing relieves stress which when unchecked puts stress on your genes, whivh results in abnormalities, sickness, cancer.

so we use humour in a way to regulate stress as previously stated.  much like yawning, which alerts others to your mental clarity, humour is important.




Can we at least spell it humor?

Honestly that's a wall of text.  I couldn't begin to pretend to decipher this thread.  What's funny to me is probably super offensive to the next person.  Of course that's probably been hashed and rehashed. 

OP gives people what he thinks are friendly looks, and they flip him the bird.  Nuff said.


--------------------
Anxiety is what you make it.


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Offlineomegafaust
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: LunarEclipse]
    #18772230 - 08/29/13 09:30 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Humour is preffered in every non american english areas.  we lazy americans just like being lazy speaking so get over it.

and if you mean that my comment is a wall of text, i assure there are worse "walls of text" in this thread.

It's like No one can read anymore, or they're too lazy to.

And op has only denied the fact that he may be wrong and
that someone can actually enjoy in humor, (happy?), without
Belittling an organism -_-

so of course
everyone
will flip
him off
if not
for
their own
humour

Is that easy enough for you to read?


--------------------
The Universe has an interesting sense of irony, in that you are the universe experiencing itself.  All you are is a thought.


Edited by omegafaust (08/29/13 09:36 AM)


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: jimiandtheshroom27]
    #18782136 - 08/31/13 05:24 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

jimiandtheshroom27 said:
Merely to boost your own ego or confidence. That you're somehow right since I am weaker than yourself.

Not at all. I suffer from depression. I just think its important to see how it can affect your mind.

What does "access raw emotion" then mean?

To tap into the subconscious, where some of our strongest, unrestrained feelings are held.

Quote:

stupidity amongst humans is not acceptable




Yes it is, to an extent. so long as isn't harmful. It's certainly not desirable, but it's accepted.

What does it matter if the ego exist or not?

Fact is, people laugh at each other because they feel better than the victim.


You were the one who brought ego into it. Several of your explanations for humour being destructive have been based around the ego. Seems pretty important for your argument.

Finding confidence in imbecile. Glorification of idiotic.
Okay. you've said that many times. :rolleyes:
Yes okay. That's one way of looking at humour. That's one way of saying this is what its all about.

Show me an example where humour is not destructive.

I can, but at the same time i can't. The reason i can't is because any example i give you will claim is destructive, for reasons that cannot be proven nor disproved. You are taking one way of looking at humour and claiming it as its raison d etre.

It's obvious the baby feels heroic when laughing as laughing is a defense mechanism against the fragility of existence, surely you can't disagree with this?


Hahaha of course i can! Can you read a babies mind? It is just your opinion laughing is a defence mechanism against the fragility of life! Even if it is a defence mechanism, it is again just your opinion that defence mechanisms are harmful.

I don't think i've ever met a person who has been so sure of their views that they don't have the politeness to at least occasionally say "i think that" as opposed to just stating their own views like facts. Its just nice to acknowledge that matters of the mind are subjective.




We're walking around in circles IMO.

I have yet to see anything substantial from your side.


--------------------
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Edited by liquidlounge (09/01/13 02:36 PM)


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Invisibleliquidlounge

Registered: 12/22/10
Posts: 9,256
Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18782157 - 08/31/13 05:30 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Repertoire89 said:
Most of the time there isn't an object to laugh at, the act of laughing being only an expression like a smile. Most of the time I don't smile at anything either, it is only an expression of a mood.



Not sure if you're sincere now. I have never experienced laughing at 'nothingness', nor have I ever felt 'nothingness'. There are always mental pictures in your head, these are based on your surroundings.

I always express moods in accordance with my thoughts which are based on my surroundings.


--------------------
As far as I assume to know...


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Invisibleteknix
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18782559 - 08/31/13 07:18 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

liquidlounge said:
Ultimately, it's all about laughing at organisms.

Finding confidence in imbecile. Glorification of idiotic.

I suppose laughing with the genius is sane but even then, you're laughing at other organisms as subjective metric. Unless you take everything with you into eden.




I don't know if it is so much laughing at organisms as it is laughing at our innate stupidity.


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OfflineGoldenEye
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18783908 - 09/01/13 02:00 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Anyone who has ever done a laughter meditation will know that even with the eyes closed, laying on the back, there is always a source of joy inside all of us that can be tapped into. Causing very free laughter.

(This is coming from the former biggest skeptic of those meditations; until I joined in one obviously)


Edited by GoldenEye (09/01/13 02:03 AM)


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Offlinejimiandtheshroom27
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: liquidlounge]
    #18785542 - 09/01/13 02:25 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I don't think we could come to any conclusion anyway, even if showed you my "side", i think we just have too different feelings towards humour, i think any positive effect i could list you would rebut. I guess my simple argument would be that, yes although some humour is nasty, humour can often cause more happiness through laughter than than the small amount of damage it could potentially do to a human's ego. Say someone makes a joke about how big my head is. its true i may not find it as funny as others do, but i can laugh at myself and the small damage done to the ego is just not proportionate to the happiness caused by the joke. providing the joke is funny of course. people can go too far, and its important to question why we laugh. Good comedy shows often make you do just that, by adding a scene where you ask yourself whether you should laugh or not


--------------------
Are you a lucky little lady in the City of Light
Or just another lost angel?
City of Night, City of Night,
City of Night, City of Night, woo, c'mon


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Invisibleteknix
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: GoldenEye]
    #18785555 - 09/01/13 02:27 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

GoldenEye said:
Anyone who has ever done a laughter meditation will know that even with the eyes closed, laying on the back, there is always a source of joy inside all of us that can be tapped into. Causing very free laughter.

(This is coming from the former biggest skeptic of those meditations; until I joined in one obviously)




Yeah, that's right!

There are other phenomena that you can "tap" into as well, and these phenomena are often called chakra's, energy centers, Dan Tiens, among other things.


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OfflineGoldenEye
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Re: "Humour is destructive!"? [Re: teknix]
    #18785601 - 09/01/13 02:37 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

teknix said:
Quote:

GoldenEye said:
Anyone who has ever done a laughter meditation will know that even with the eyes closed, laying on the back, there is always a source of joy inside all of us that can be tapped into. Causing very free laughter.

(This is coming from the former biggest skeptic of those meditations; until I joined in one obviously)




Yeah, that's right!

There are other phenomena that you can "tap" into as well, and these phenomena are often called chakra's, energy centers, Dan Tiens, among other things.




I realised upon re-reading that this has nothing to do with humor...

For me, humor can be quite healing as well. Especially when used to mock yourself.

By not taking myself seriously I have felt great relief and more freedom to act impulsively and instinctively. It has made me happier.

In summary, I like to put the joke on myself. It makes other people laugh with you and is appearently also a sign of confidence towards the other gender.

Try it :smile:


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