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OfflineAnahata


Registered: 02/25/12
Posts: 2,399
Last seen: 2 days, 22 hours
Obama is full of it.
    #18781136 - 08/31/13 12:09 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Why wont he listen to the people? hes hell bent on going to war no matter what people are saying or what the facts are. It's so frustrating listening to him speak, hes so stupid, and hes making every wrong choice you can and his ideas for doing it are just plain ridiculous.

Mind your own business and quit trying to be the world police, this is a civil war and in no way a threat to us, yes its terrible but it's not our responsibility.

Hes not going to listen to the UN report hes not going to listen to the people, hes not going to listen to state representatives, hes hell bent on proving a point that he is an idiot. 

I just cant believe hes doing this and there nothing we the people can do about it. Here comes WWIII.


.


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Offlineqman
Stranger

Registered: 12/06/06
Posts: 34,927
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Anahata]
    #18781181 - 08/31/13 12:22 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

He's a puppet, he does what he is told, he prefers to play golf and shoot basketball.


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InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
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Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Anahata]
    #18781189 - 08/31/13 12:24 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Anahata said:
Why wont he listen to the people? hes hell bent on going to war no matter what people are saying or what the facts are. It's so frustrating listening to him speak, hes so stupid, and hes making every wrong choice you can and his ideas for doing it are just plain ridiculous.

Mind your own business and quit trying to be the world police, this is a civil war and in no way a threat to us, yes its terrible but it's not our responsibility.

Hes not going to listen to the UN report hes not going to listen to the people, hes not going to listen to state representatives, hes hell bent on proving a point that he is an idiot. 

I just cant believe hes doing this and there nothing we the people can do about it. Here comes WWIII.


.





He hasn't done anything yet. :lol:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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OfflineBrakepad
Fuck society
Male

Registered: 11/29/12
Posts: 163
Last seen: 9 years, 7 months
Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Anahata]
    #18781200 - 08/31/13 12:29 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

We gon free the shit out them damn towel heads! MERICA!!!!!!!!!


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:sanpedro:Cactus.
:lsdabc: :kong: :chemistry: :scaryshroom: :fasted:


Edited by Brakepad (08/31/13 12:30 PM)


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
Last seen: 7 years, 7 months
Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Anahata]
    #18781210 - 08/31/13 12:34 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Anahata said:
Why wont he listen to the people? hes hell bent on going to war no matter what people are saying or what the facts are. It's so frustrating listening to him speak, hes so stupid, and hes making every wrong choice you can and his ideas for doing it are just plain ridiculous.

Mind your own business and quit trying to be the world police, this is a civil war and in no way a threat to us, yes its terrible but it's not our responsibility.

Hes not going to listen to the UN report hes not going to listen to the people, hes not going to listen to state representatives, hes hell bent on proving a point that he is an idiot. 

I just cant believe hes doing this and there nothing we the people can do about it. Here comes WWIII.


.



There is no WW3 imminent and Obama has proven himself to be an idiot from the get go.  His only skill is suckering schmucks into hiring him.  Listen to the American People?  He doesn't even listen to himself.
http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/obama-and-biden-have-said-military-action-without-congressio

“The president does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation,” Obama said in 2008.

The only reason this is happening is because of his ego over backing his stupid ass into a corner last year with his red line pronouncement.  Fucking idiot.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
Loc: Fractallife's gym
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Brakepad]
    #18781213 - 08/31/13 12:34 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Brakepad said:
We gon free the shit out them damn towel heads! MERICA!!!!!!!!!




That's not what this is about, genius.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 81,741
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Icelander]
    #18781216 - 08/31/13 12:35 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Icelander said:
Quote:

Anahata said:
Why wont he listen to the people? hes hell bent on going to war no matter what people are saying or what the facts are. It's so frustrating listening to him speak, hes so stupid, and hes making every wrong choice you can and his ideas for doing it are just plain ridiculous.

Mind your own business and quit trying to be the world police, this is a civil war and in no way a threat to us, yes its terrible but it's not our responsibility.

Hes not going to listen to the UN report hes not going to listen to the people, hes not going to listen to state representatives, hes hell bent on proving a point that he is an idiot. 

I just cant believe hes doing this and there nothing we the people can do about it. Here comes WWIII.


.





He hasn't done anything yet. :lol:




Yeah, too bad it won't stay that way.


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OfflineBrakepad
Fuck society
Male

Registered: 11/29/12
Posts: 163
Last seen: 9 years, 7 months
Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18781281 - 08/31/13 12:56 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

no threat of ww3? so Russia is just gonna sit back and watch us attack Syria? Why do you think you know everything zappa


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:sanpedro:Cactus.
:lsdabc: :kong: :chemistry: :scaryshroom: :fasted:


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InvisibleLe_Canard
The Duk Abides


Registered: 05/16/03
Posts: 94,392
Loc: Earthfarm 1 Flag
Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Anahata]
    #18781364 - 08/31/13 01:23 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

He's going to get Congress' approval before wading in. If he doesn't, I'm not sure what he will do. Personally, I think he should make massive airdrops of food and medicines for the people, screw the assholes of either side.


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OfflineManianFHS
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Registered: 07/06/04
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: qman]
    #18781371 - 08/31/13 01:26 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

qman said:
He's a puppet, he does what he is told, he prefers to play golf and shoot basketball.




I would be very surprised if he was calling shots of his own will.


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InvisibleTherian
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Le_Canard]
    #18781391 - 08/31/13 01:36 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

“The president does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation,” Obama said in 2008.




Now we have this:

Quote:

Obama said he had decided the United States should take military action and that he believes he has "the authority to carry out this military action without specific congressional authorization."




Thank god this asshole has Kerry on his team, now one can say they were for it before they were against it, the other they were against it before they were for it.

What a bunch of depraved, narcissistic, lying, douchebag lawyers. And people wonder why congressional approval is at an all time low. Is Obama a lying piece of shit that intentionally defies the will of the people, and has absolutely no reservations about making himself look like a hypocritical, habitual lying dick? I guess that depends on what the meaning of the word is, is.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Therian]
    #18781458 - 08/31/13 01:58 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

He doesnt need approval for anything anyway. He will do whatever he wants. If he wants to arm Al Qaeda he will do it.

Watching and waiting is not my philosophy on life. But really, with this guy, watch and wait, youll see it all, no matter how much you dont want to, he will do it


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:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

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OfflineFuckspice
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Registered: 12/30/12
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: imachavel]
    #18781486 - 08/31/13 02:10 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Obama is going to congress because for him it is a win win.  If they deny he wont look like a pushover to syria and if they accept then it won't just be obama who's supporting the war.  I like obama and am a liberal but he does look like he took too much xanax before every speach.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Brakepad] * 2
    #18782188 - 08/31/13 05:42 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Brakepad said:
no threat of ww3? so Russia is just gonna sit back and watch us attack Syria?




They are going to sit back and laugh about the backlash.
Quote:



Why do you think you know everything zappa




Because I pay attention


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Fuckspice] * 1
    #18782202 - 08/31/13 05:44 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Fuckspice said:
Obama is going to congress because for him it is a win win.  If they deny he wont look like a pushover to syria and if they accept then it won't just be obama who's supporting the war.  I like obama and am a liberal but he does look like he took too much xanax before every speach.




How do you figure it is a win win if he goes for Congressional approval?  He won't get it and the American People are already dead set against this.


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Offlineimachavel
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18785344 - 09/01/13 01:33 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)





:lolwut:


--------------------
:kingcrankey: I did not say to edit my signature soulidarity! Now forever I will never remember what I said about understanding the secrets of the universe by paying attention to subtleties!

:facepalm: I'm never giving you the password again. Jerk


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OfflineFuckspice
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18801524 - 09/04/13 11:06 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Quote:

Fuckspice said:
Obama is going to congress because for him it is a win win.  If they deny he wont look like a pushover to syria and if they accept then it won't just be obama who's supporting the war.  I like obama and am a liberal but he does look like he took too much xanax before every speach.




How do you figure it is a win win if he goes for Congressional approval?  He won't get it and the American People are already dead set against this.



i said it was a win win for obama.  I personally dont agree with the war since there is very little chance it will help and be too costly on us


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InvisibleMushroomNSwiss
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Registered: 02/19/12
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Fuckspice]
    #18801711 - 09/05/13 12:47 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Saudia Arabia is paying for it now. So it's all good. It won't cost us anything, except lives.


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The early bird may get the worm... but the second mouse gets the cheese.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: MushroomNSwiss]
    #18803793 - 09/05/13 03:37 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Not likely.


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Offlinestarfire_xes
I Am 'They'
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18814086 - 09/08/13 05:56 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

The title of this thread is :lolsy:

It brings back fond memories of a few years ago, when I used to get scorned by people on here because I would make posts in which I said Obama was nothing by a cock-sucking, lying scum-bag shyster who shucked-and-jived his way into the Whitehouse--

But he does have important business in syria.  After all, he needs to find out what the fuck happened to the 400 surface to air missiles that where taken from the CIA/Embassy compound in Libya--you know, the Benghazi thing last year where his administration covered up everything that happened and the synchophantic media fell to their knees and sucked his dick and helped it not become news?  :smirk:


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: starfire_xes]
    #18814306 - 09/08/13 08:30 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah, good times, good times


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Offlinex Ju x
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18816984 - 09/08/13 09:59 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)



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InvisibleIcelander
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: x Ju x]
    #18817386 - 09/08/13 11:52 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Well I guess I agree. :thumbup: Wonder where she stood on Bush's wars?


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Icelander]
    #18817866 - 09/09/13 05:35 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Do you not see a difference?


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Offlinepsilynut
aka Patchraper

Registered: 10/22/09
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18818441 - 09/09/13 10:38 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Do you not see a difference?



I do , the bush wars cost us wayyyyy more. Both in lives and dollars. But luckily for all of us Bush was smart enough to enact a war tax like every president before him since 1812 to pay for it, otherwise wed be up to our eyeballs in debt right now.

"He has not developed any significant capability in respect to weapons of mass destruction, he is unable to project CONVENTIONAL power against his neighbors" -Colon Powell in 2001.

So in one war we fought against a guy on false wmd pretenses,who couldnt fight back, whos military we had already decimated when they tried to run away out of Kuwait, and once we got there we just drove around in humvees for 10 years gettin blown up , or doing gods work , according to some geniuses.

  In the war were about to have now, The guy can strike back, has a military , has chemicals weapons , but were not invading  were just gunna drop bombs and shoot missiles, as long as no one shoots back.

Neither Assad or Saddam ever attacked the US, ( allegedly saddam plotted to kill bush)and they were both our allies at one time. Syria was our ally against Iraq in 91.

n 1988,  Saddam gasses Kurdish resistance forces, but the relationship with Iraq at the time was deemed too important to throw away over it The United States did not even impose sanctions.
  Two decades later Rumsfeld and other members of the Bush administration repeatedly cited Hussein’s use of chemical weapons against his  own people as a justification for invading Iraq
There are some ironic similarities too.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: psilynut]
    #18818508 - 09/09/13 11:02 AM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Saddam attacked our ally, was an international menace and violated the terms of surrender he agreed to.  Assad has done none of those things.  Further the UN, the Arab League and Congress all signed off.  In addition, about 50 other nations joined us. 

Do you still not see a difference?  Because if you don't you are utterly lost.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18818711 - 09/09/13 12:18 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
There is no WW3 imminent and Obama has proven himself to be an idiot from the get go.  His only skill is suckering schmucks into hiring him.  Listen to the American People?  He doesn't even listen to himself.
http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczynski/obama-and-biden-have-said-military-action-without-congressio

“The president does not have power under the Constitution to unilaterally authorize a military attack in a situation that does not involve stopping an actual or imminent threat to the nation,” Obama said in 2008.

The only reason this is happening is because of his ego over backing his stupid ass into a corner last year with his red line pronouncement.  Fucking idiot.



He wasn't president in 2008...Now that he is, he's going to grab as much power as he can.  Every president had done that.  I can't imagine why you'd be surprised by this.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


Registered: 02/11/04
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18818744 - 09/09/13 12:28 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I don't think any except for FDR's court packing scheme have had quite the chutzpah this cunt has.  He is also one of the most egregiously lying pieces of shit to ever inhabit the Earth, not just the White House.  He gets away with it because of Donovan McNabb.



McNabb was never any good.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18818774 - 09/09/13 12:35 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

You only feel that way because he's on the other team.  Both Bushes made huge power grabs. 

I love how you rationalize us spending billions of dollars on wars based on the UN approving it.  If the UN approves spending our money on buying Kim Jong Un a jet, would you be okay with that?

Saddam, the Taliban, and Assad have never been a threat to us.


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Offlinezappaisgod
horrid asshole


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18818820 - 09/09/13 12:52 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
You only feel that way because he's on the other team.  Both Bushes made huge power grabs.




Name 'em
Quote:

 

I love how you rationalize us spending billions of dollars on wars based on the UN approving it.  If the UN approves spending our money on buying Kim Jong Un a jet, would you be okay with that?




LOL, that is not the only reason.  You know better than that course of argument, shyster.
Quote:




Saddam, the Taliban, and Assad have never been a threat to us.




Saddam invaded our ally and the Taliban gave a base of operations and sanctuary to the assholes who pulled off 9/11.  What has Assad done that comes even close to that?


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18818856 - 09/09/13 01:07 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Name 'em


 
Here are a few:
http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2006/08/71614?currentPage=all
Quote:

LOL, that is not the only reason.  You know better than that course of argument, shyster.



You're the one that mentioned the UN.
Quote:


Saddam invaded our ally


over 20 years ago, sure.  He posed no threat in 2003.  Your argument that he violated his agreement is just ridiculous.  Spending $1.9 trillion to punish someone for breaking an agreement is beyond foolish, and I don't believe that YOU even support such a waste of money for that purpose.
Quote:

and the Taliban gave a base of operations and sanctuary to the assholes who pulled off 9/11. 


Those assholes were mostly from Saudi Arabia, and they trained in the U.S. among other places.  I've seen no evidence that the Taliban funded their training or supported it in any way.


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Offlinezappaisgod
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18818934 - 09/09/13 01:36 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

zappaisgod said:
Name 'em


 
Here are a few:
http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news/2006/08/71614?currentPage=all




LOL

I don't see that as Presidential power grabs since Congress passed the Patriot Act and I don't consider waterboarding torture any more than I consider the bar exam as torture.  Obama has far surpassed Bush on surveillance and kept the prisoners in Guantanamo.  What they list is nothing close to what Obama has done in Libya and is trying to do in Syria and his other activity in granting waivers from legislation for favored actors affected by his Obamacare bullshit.  Fuck one, fuck all, I say.
Quote:


Quote:

LOL, that is not the only reason.  You know better than that course of argument, shyster.



You're the one that mentioned the UN.




Along with several other distinctions I drew.  See below.
Quote:

Quote:


Saddam invaded our ally



over 20 years ago, sure.  He posed no threat in 2003.  Your argument that he violated his agreement is just ridiculous.  Spending $1.9 trillion to punish someone for breaking an agreement is beyond foolish, and I don't believe that YOU even support such a waste of money for that purpose.




There was a Congressional Authorization to Use Military Force.  Pay attention to the word "Congressional".  It is very important in this context.

I do not believe that you are correct about the dollar amount but it wasn't 20 years old in 2003, was it?.  Even the feckless cunt Clinton bombed them.  Saddam was under an obligation to open up and didn't do it.  There was a surrender agreement and either you enforce contracts or you don't have contracts.  Do I think it was a mistake not to have taken him out in 1990?  You fucking bet I do.
Quote:

Quote:

and the Taliban gave a base of operations and sanctuary to the assholes who pulled off 9/11. 


Those assholes were mostly from Saudi Arabia, and they trained in the U.S. among other places.  I've seen no evidence that the Taliban funded their training or supported it in any way.




I didn't say they did.  I said they gave them a base of operations and sanctuary.  Pay attention to the words, shyster.  It is your stock in trade.

Oh yeah, there was also Congressional authorization far that as well.


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InvisibleEnlilMDiscord
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod] * 1
    #18818969 - 09/09/13 01:46 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

You have a pretty consistent history of endorsing actions by members of your chosen team and damning those same actions by members of the opposite team.  Your tribalism blinds you.  If you could step back from it for just a few seconds, you'd see that both teams are pretty much identical.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18818985 - 09/09/13 01:53 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

If by "identical" you mean both teams suck, you're correct.

If by "identical" you mean both teams suck the same way or want the same things, you're incorrect.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #18819000 - 09/09/13 01:57 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

They want the same things, generally.  They both want a more powerful federal government and a reduction in civil rights.  The only real difference is in what specific powers they want and what rights they want curtailed.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18819126 - 09/09/13 02:36 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
You have a pretty consistent history of endorsing actions by members of your chosen team and damning those same actions by members of the opposite team. Your tribalism blinds you.  If you could step back from it for just a few seconds, you'd see that both teams are pretty much identical.





Bullshit.  There are posts after post of me supporting the surveillance under Obama.  The fact that I can see a clear distinction between Syria and Iraq/Afghanistan and you can't speaks more to your blinkers than mine.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18819150 - 09/09/13 02:41 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

1.9 trillion dollars spent in Iraq because saddam broke an agreement...Do you really think that's worth spending nearly $6,000 for every man, woman, and child in the U.S.?


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18819172 - 09/09/13 02:51 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Like I said I think your cost is fucked
http://nationalpriorities.org/cost-of/

We have a $16T debt and in 2011 alone we gave away a trillion dollars in government largesse to losers and bums.  Since the Iraq War resumed in 2003 we have spent less that a $T on it. 

We spent that money since 2003 in Iraq because we didn't do what should have done in 1990.  And it is fucking peanuts compared to what else the federal government is spending.  Peanuts.

In just five years Obama has managed to eradicate any credibility we might have to influence the world to not be assholes.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18819198 - 09/09/13 02:55 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

The CBO came up with the $1.9 trillion figure, not me.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2007/10/24/us-iraq-usa-funding-idUSN2450753720071024

Also, another half a trillion for the war in Afghanistan.  Sounds like a great use of that money considering our whole reason for going was to get a guy that turned out to be living in Pakistan.

That's 15% of the national debt, right there.  What did we get for that 15%?  Are we safer?  Did our standard of living improve? 


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18819288 - 09/09/13 03:18 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

The CBO also said that Obamacare would be cost neutral. They have less credibility than a defense attorney.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18819327 - 09/09/13 03:29 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

The Wall Street Journal published a figure of $1.7 trillion in March, if you find that to be any more credible.

On the other hand, your little website that you linked doesn't cite any sources at all.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18819362 - 09/09/13 03:41 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)



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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18819369 - 09/09/13 03:45 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Good, so there you have it.  The site only includes allocations, but it doesn't include the cost of the interest on the money borrowed to pay those allocations.  That's why their figure is decidedly lower than everyone else who has calculated the cost of the Iraq war.  I've seen figures as high as 3, 6, and 8.8 trillion, but I chose the figure that seemed to be better supported.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #18819481 - 09/09/13 04:14 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Cost of interest?  Why should there be any cost of interest included?  I bought my house for around 900K.  I shudder to think what the total cost with interest will be if we don't pay it off ahead of time.  But I don't tell anybody it cost me 3 million (or whatever).  We could have paid for all of Iraq and Afghanistan with less than the money we gave bums in one year.  Keep shucking and jiving, shyster.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18819498 - 09/09/13 04:18 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Just because you don't tell anyone doesn't mean you don't pay it...Maybe you prefer the ostrich technique whereby you ignore inconvenient hidden costs such as interest, but whether you ignore it or not, it still is part of the cost.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #18819607 - 09/09/13 04:44 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

There is no reason why the largest financial entity in the history of the planet should ever have to borrow money and it is utterly moronic to ascribe the cost of a war to interest when we are borrowing ten times as much annually to give shit to bums.  Every cent of interest payments is due to giving shit to bums.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18819654 - 09/09/13 04:54 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Every dime we spend on anything becomes income for someone and generates commerce and revenue for the federal government.  You seem to think that spending 2.4 trillion dollars on wars against nations that posed no threat to us to be a better use of money than spending it to keep citizens of this nation healthier and fed.  That's your opinion, and it's a perfectly valid one.

I have a different opinion, however.  I see ZERO benefit to the wars we've been funding, and I believe that we are less secure as a nation because of them.  I see only a marginal benefit to the public assistance programs, but a marginal benefit is still better than a zero benefit/negative return from war.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #18819786 - 09/09/13 05:26 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Every dime we spend on anything becomes income for someone and generates commerce and revenue for the federal government.




The only revenue the federal government has comes from confiscation. 
Quote:

You seem to think that spending 2.4 trillion dollars on wars against nations that posed no threat to us to be a better use of money than spending it to keep citizens of this nation healthier and fed.




Nobody in this country is not fed and there is no evidence that government health insurance makes people healthier.
Quote:

  That's your opinion, and it's a perfectly valid one.




Oh thank you so much.[

The money keeps going up with you.  From everything I've seen there is less than 1T in direct costs for both of them.
Quote:



I have a different opinion, however.  I see ZERO benefit to the wars we've been funding, and I believe that we are less secure as a nation because of them.


We are less secure because we have an inconsistent feckless President
Quote:

I see only a marginal benefit to the public assistance programs, but a marginal benefit is still better than a zero benefit/negative return from war.



Do you think there is no public gain in prosecuting murders even though it is expensive to pursue and expensive to house the criminals?  I don't think that you have thought this through.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18819805 - 09/09/13 05:32 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

I've certainly thought this through.  Prosecuting murders is a necessary part of an ordered society.  Flying thousands of troops halfway around the world to oust the impotent ruler of an irrelevant country is not.

As far as the 1.9 trillion figure, that's what it is for Iraq.  It's 2.4 for both Iraq and Afghanistan.  You may not like that we pay interest on money we spend, but we do.  Get used to the idea.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18819874 - 09/09/13 05:49 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
I've certainly thought this through.  Prosecuting murders is a necessary part of an ordered society.  Flying thousands of troops halfway around the world to oust the impotent ruler of an irrelevant country is not.




Iraq?
Quote:


As far as the 1.9 trillion figure, that's what it is for Iraq.  It's 2.4 for both Iraq and Afghanistan.  You may not like that we pay interest on money we spend, but we do.  Get used to the idea.




We aren't paying interest on that money we are paying interest on the bum money.  In 2011 alone we gave away more than ten years of war costs in means tested gifts that does not include soc sec or medicare.  So are we to perform the same calculus on those gifts?  That would make them 2.5T a year by your figures.  That means that the Obamaphone pig's phone actually costs about 3 times what it seems to cost.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18819908 - 09/09/13 06:00 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

We should include the interest on all of it, of course.  Your argument is because we spend a shitload of money on stuff we shouldn't, it's okay if we spend a shitload of money on other stuff we shouldn't

I'm not arguing that we should redirect that money to social programs.  I'm arguing that we shouldn't be spending 2.4 trillion on pointless wars.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18819970 - 09/09/13 06:16 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

The amount has no limit by your calculus.  I'm going to repeat myself.  There is no reason why the single largest fiscal entity on earth should have any interest costs at all.  They should have interest income.  War expenses are utterly irrelevant in the greater theater of gross mismanagement


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18819981 - 09/09/13 06:20 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

We shouldn't, but we do.  As long as we do, we should include those interest costs when determining the true cost of any undertaking.

Interestingly, throughout all of this, you've yet to answer even one of my questions.  Do you really believe that the money we've spent on these two wars (whether 2.4 trillion or another figure) has been money well spent?


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18819998 - 09/09/13 06:24 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
We shouldn't, but we do.  As long as we do, we should include those interest costs when determining the true cost of any undertaking.

Interestingly, throughout all of this, you've yet to answer even one of my questions.  Do you really believe that the money we've spent on these two wars (whether 2.4 trillion or another figure) has been money well spent?




It's under a trillion for both over the entirety and yes, I think they were mandatory expenses.  As I have expressed numerous times.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18820010 - 09/09/13 06:26 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

And what, exactly, do you contend that we've gotten for our money?

P.S. Even your site places the number at almost 1.5 trillion for both combined.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18820061 - 09/09/13 06:36 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

These figures include both military and non-military spending, such as reconstruction.




What did we get for our money?  Until President Stupid took over, FEAR.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18820081 - 09/09/13 06:40 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Fear doesn't make us any more secure....at least not from attacks by people willing to die to harm us.  Suicide hijackers fear no reprisals.

P.S. The cost of a war includes military and non-military spending (along with the interest to fund)


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil] * 1
    #18820251 - 09/09/13 07:13 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Fear doesn't make us any more secure....at least not from attacks by people willing to die to harm us.  Suicide hijackers fear no reprisals.


  Not everybody is a suicide attacking nutlog
Quote:



P.S. The cost of a war includes military and non-military spending (along with the interest to fund)




I don't agree with including interest as a cost.  If you pay cash interest is not relevant.  Interest is a result of borrowing and not assignable to any particular expense.  Money is fungible.  You might as well say that the interest on the federal debt is  assignable to Pell Grants, which is not a federal responsibility as is foreign relations.

I cxannot stress this enough.  The Empty Pants Cunt has completely eliminated any sense in the world that we have balls.  His diplomacy is exactly the same as his baseball throwing


What a fucking homo.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18820310 - 09/09/13 07:26 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

No nation on the planet can hope to defeat us in a straight up military confrontation.  That hasn't been in question for decades.  The only real threats we face now are from obsessed zealots who care nothing for their own lives.  We can't beat them by putting fear in them, and invading their lands only creates a next generation of people who have the same passionate hatred for us.

When we kill 100 people, their children grow up to hate us. A small percentage of those children grow up hating us enough to give his life to harm us.  It only took 19 such whack jobs to take down the towers and damage the pentagon. 

Waging wars in foreign lands when they don't pose a threat to us can only harm us in the long run.  It doesn't make us any safer.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18820340 - 09/09/13 07:33 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
No nation on the planet can hope to defeat us in a straight up military confrontation.  That hasn't been in question for decades.  The only real threats we face now are from obsessed zealots who care nothing for their own lives.  We can't beat them by putting fear in them, and invading their lands only creates a next generation of people who have the same passionate hatred for us.




We need to eliminate their safe havens.  It is not so easy to organize that kind of crap and the Taliban enabled it and then wouldn't turn the fucks over even though they could have.  Fuck 'em, they are scum anyway.
Quote:



When we kill 100 people, their children grow up to hate us. A small percentage of those children grow up hating us enough to give his life to harm us.  It only took 19 such whack jobs to take down the towers and damage the pentagon. 

Waging wars in foreign lands when they don't pose a threat to us can only harm us in the long run.  It doesn't make us any safer.




By your calculus nobody poses a threat to us.  But they do pose threats to our allies.  See Kuwait and Saudi Arabia.  Don't give me any bullshit that the attackers were Saudi so Saudi Arabia bears responsibility.  Osama had been a fugitive from Saudi Arabia for many years.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: zappaisgod]
    #18820587 - 09/09/13 08:18 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Saudi Arabia and Kuwait can both afford to pay for any military help they need from us.  I see no reason that we should.


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Re: Obama is full of it. [Re: Enlil]
    #18820907 - 09/09/13 09:18 PM (10 years, 4 months ago)

Don't forget Israel, hezbolla is tied up in syria and who knows, the golan heights might wind up in their hands


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