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GreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche


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Christianity On Psychedelics
#18779689 - 08/30/13 11:16 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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So I have a few questions for Christians...keep in mind that this is a question specifically for Christians that actually believe and have faith in god and Jesus, not for guys who have read the bibles or went to church or anything like the but for people who truly have faith.
1. How do you feel about psychedelics? 2. Have you ever used psychedelics in an attempt to commune with god? 3. Do you believe that your use of psychedelics is righteous and justified in the eyes of god?
I'm agnostic by the way.
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
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sailing
China Cat Sunflower



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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: GreySatyr]
#18779712 - 08/30/13 11:20 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I am god
-------------------- Love is the deep spiritual connection between the self and all things. We are all a part of the same universe. Crazy cat peekin through a lace bandanna,like a one eyed cheshire, like a diamond eyed jack.
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The Phleg
Big Dick Chakra



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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: GreySatyr]
#18779714 - 08/30/13 11:21 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Religion is bad
-------------------- You wanna get high? Drink tap water. --------------------
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GreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche


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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: sailing]
#18779719 - 08/30/13 11:23 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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The beeble says you are created in his likeness.
Anywho, I'm hoping for serious answers. Something has sparked my interest in this phenomenon.
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
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sailing
China Cat Sunflower



Registered: 09/21/11
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: The Phleg]
#18779730 - 08/30/13 11:25 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Just say no to organized religion
-------------------- Love is the deep spiritual connection between the self and all things. We are all a part of the same universe. Crazy cat peekin through a lace bandanna,like a one eyed cheshire, like a diamond eyed jack.
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GreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche


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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: sailing]
#18779737 - 08/30/13 11:27 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Inquiry should not be frowned upon. That is how ignorance began in the first place, bro ham.
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
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sailing
China Cat Sunflower



Registered: 09/21/11
Posts: 3,534
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: GreySatyr]
#18779754 - 08/30/13 11:31 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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my bad, ill stop trollin ive been internetting too long for one night
http://9gag.com/gag/6964959
-------------------- Love is the deep spiritual connection between the self and all things. We are all a part of the same universe. Crazy cat peekin through a lace bandanna,like a one eyed cheshire, like a diamond eyed jack.
Edited by sailing (08/30/13 11:35 PM)
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Futuresight
Mind Mage



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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: sailing] 1
#18779764 - 08/30/13 11:36 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I honestly do not believe in organized religion, but am very interested in hearing the answers to these questions.
A peek into the mind of those I don't understand.
--------------------
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GreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche


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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: Futuresight]
#18779810 - 08/30/13 11:52 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
sailing said: my bad, ill stop trollin ive been internetting too long for one night
http://9gag.com/gag/6964959
I understand, it's late and were all tired.
Quote:
Futuresight said: I honestly do not believe in organized religion, but am very interested in hearing the answers to these questions.
A peek into the mind of those I don't understand.
Me too. I've been an rebel/outcast for a long time. Well one day I just woke up and decided to blend into society and become a chameleon and walk among the people who are more in tune with society and modern cultural. I cut my hair, I mean I went through a HUGE physical change just to learn everything that I could about anything that I could. I started going to church and reading the bible. I've networked an made friends in high places. I've learned about carpentry, metal fabrication, tons and tons of skills, I've done numerous things for my community. Point is, the stories and some philosophies from the bible have intrigued me and actually having applied them to my life ive done much better in my life than i have in years which is what brought out my curiosity in this topic.
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
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Futuresight
Mind Mage



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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: GreySatyr]
#18779823 - 08/30/13 11:57 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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But do you have FAITH? This is the problem I have with organized religions, and good ol Terence put it best: "I think belief is ridiculous, because the second you truly believe something, you close your mind to the other possibilities." (Paraphrased at the end)
So, if you are a devout christian, is it hard to keep an open mind? Can you still accept concepts and ideas that psychedelics and even other cultures have brought about? Most christians claim that the state of mind God gives us is what we're meant to have, how do you feel about this? Pure pleasure and euphoria is often linked with satanic practices in Christianity (IME), how do you justify yourself against this?
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galindoi
Morning, Noon and Nitrous



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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: GreySatyr]
#18779838 - 08/31/13 12:02 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I know this isn't exactly what you were looking for, but it may be somewhat relevant, or at the very least, interesting to your topic. I was someone who was raised just on this side of being a full out fundamentalist Christian. Home schooled to avoid the influences of those 'secular' people and their evil ways. No music, limited tv and movie influence. Think snake handlers, but one step below that. My family even moved all the way across country so my father could become a preacher (it didn't work out and we moved back after a year).
A lot of people were questioning their passed down faiths in their early childhood/teenage years. It wasn't until I was an adult and was actually able to emerge into real society that I saw there was a whole world of different religions and philosophies. I became, and am still, fascinated by the different religions/philosophies/cults/what have you of the world, and the more I studied them, the more ridiculous the one that I was brought up in started to seem, until I finally unshackled myself from that. I feel almost embarrassed that I was "late" to the game on that front, but I'm glad that I didn't end up like some of my acquaintances who continue to leave the blinders on and only see life in the one and only way it could possibly be based on their childhood rearing.
I think there's a lot to be taken from religious scripts and I highly recommend reading as many as you can get your hands on, as there is a lot of wisdom to be taken from them. As far as where I stand spiritually, right after I shook the shackles of my religion that I was saddled with from birth I may have tossed around the word atheist from time to time, but fairly quickly I came to the conclusion that it seems just as silly to claim without a doubt, 100% that there is a god just the same that there absolutely is none. I would call myself agnostic, but am trying to pursue some kind of spiritual regimen, because for all the new age bullshit, hocus-pocus that goes on around that particular subject, I feel there's something to it. The whole universe seems to recycle itself, it may not be in the religious afterlife way that some cults would have you believe, but everything has a use, during and after it's time in this plane of reality.
Heavier doses of psychedelics and ego softening/loss/death scenarios can really bring one to question just exactly what it is there may be out there.
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Deemstar
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: galindoi]
#18779862 - 08/31/13 12:12 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I asked a baptist pastor what he thought about shrooms and weed, he said there evil because the ground is cursed, and if you communicated with any so called god it's certainly satan.
-------------------- Gnome-miii-odd JAH!!! Pasta-far-eye! R.I.P. Georgie poor G A.K.A. Jorgon Lucy
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Futuresight
Mind Mage



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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: galindoi]
#18779864 - 08/31/13 12:13 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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That was a wonderful answer. I was raised in a christian home, not as bad as that, but I was forced to go to church every sunday and was smacked if I said the lords name in vain. Then my brother gave me a copy of Fear and Loathing. I was hooked on the idea of altered conciousness and the strange and surreal from the time i was twelve.
FORTUNATELY, I never had the chance to do drugs until I was 17. I had only tried weed once before trying Psilocybin, so I had no idea what I was getting myself into.
I encountered ego death that day, and have never been the same since. I don't value the same things "normal" people do, I don't favor technology, I dabble in all kinds of religions/sects/concepts, and all intrigue me.
But to this day, I believe that what happens after life MAY be very similar to a heavy psychedelic trip. Maybe more cognitive, or less cognitive. I like to think that it is a solitary journey, not simply a place where you are surrounded by friends if you were good or in eternal pain if you werent. I think that the afterlife would be a mixture of all emotions, at the same tims, OR mayybe it's not even an event, but merely an existence outside of any human understanding.
Either way, I love the world we live in, and I wish it the best.
--------------------
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GreySatyr
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: Futuresight]
#18779892 - 08/31/13 12:34 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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My thing is this...
If you're Christian and you can't enter an altered state because you fear the devil is going to try to tempt you or that he will try to communicate with you then I believe that your faith just isn't strong at all. It's a question of someone's strength of faith. I think that if you're a true Christian believer then you should be able to enter altered states to strengthen your communication with god and as long as its done in a righteous way then it is justifiable.
Some verse in the bible says something along the lines of "don't get drunk on the wine, get drunk on the Holy Spirit." It never says "do not drink or do not indulge." You can indulge in alcohol or in this case psychedelics in the righteousness of the Holy Spirit? Am I right, Christians? If your cause is just and righteous. In the bible it says a lot about not getting angry yet Jesus got angry in the bible but his anger was in righteousness. I don't know, guys. Just my thoughts on the subject. Really wanna hear some thoughts from Christians.
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
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DeeBee
The Cake is a Lie

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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: Futuresight]
#18779899 - 08/31/13 12:36 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I'm fairly Christian but starting to become more and more purely "spiritual" as time goes on. Meaning I pray to God but also am tapering off a bit and just becoming open to the world and ideas through tripping. I went to a christian school though so I can answer these questions as a christian would: 1. Anything that puts you in an altered state of mind is a no-no. God made you to be sober, yo. (I fucking love psychedelics and trip anyway) 2. I've used psychedelics and meditation to open my soul and mind to any revalations and ideas that can apply to me. Whether or not this is "communing with God" is perspective. 3. Do you believe that your use of psychedelics is righteous and justified in the eyes of god? This is tough. It could go either way. Fun vs. Spiritual Healing. Fun, no. Spiritual healing, maybe.
--------------------
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LuSiD enthusiast
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: Deemstar]
#18779904 - 08/31/13 12:39 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Deemstar said: I asked a baptist pastor what he thought about shrooms and weed, he said there evil because the ground is cursed, and if you communicated with any so called god it's certainly satan.
Lol at the concept that god put us on a cursed earth and he wants to try and show people why we should love him.
I have always considered myself a christian whether the other christians would agree or not it's not my place to worry. I have seen the light (so to speak there will always be another mind shattering moment where i'll say "NOW I'VE SEEN GOD" in the future) and i see the christian god for what he really is.
That is love, plain and simple, psychedelics have shown me how this love is what connects all of our conscious and. I don't cast other people's beliefs out, i am just delusional to the experience of life that i have found myself in. There's an alternate reality for everything that can, has, and will happen, and i can never see the world through your eyes, so how in the world am i supposed to tell you what is right or wrong?
Personally when i see people live out other beliefs, they never seem to be as happy as i tend to be, not that i am the world's happiest person (except when tripping, then i beat you all by miles). So my belief is that we are all living throughout these different dimensions constantly seeing every possibility there is. Psychedelics help to slow down and view this process.
I also have a hunch that we will never experience our own deaths. I have relatives who have died, but i believe they are all just experiencing an alternate reality where they survived, and my experience at the moment is just one of millions without them. But eventually one day, that will change. I will wake up in the morning, be ten years younger and all the pain and sorrow i have accrued in between eill just be lost in a haze and my existance will be in another realm with those i lost.
Will i seem dead to everyone around me? Maybe but if i'm here and i see you that's all that matters, and i'll keep living out my life while the rest of the world might see me as dead.
-------------------- I'm addicted to coke, weed, booze, ludes and speed. Not LSD, you can't get addicted to LSD, it was built by scientists. I ain't got no demons that gonna get woke. In erowid we trust. Just take your damn pills and don't ask any questions, you'll be fine.
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GreySatyr
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: DeeBee]
#18779909 - 08/31/13 12:40 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Thanks for your insight. Is there any particular verse that says any altered states is a no no or is that just a more modern concept being preached these days?
Another reason for this thread is because I read a report of a guy who said he had visions of Jesus on the cross and that he became a Christian once again after giving it up for several years. He said mushrooms brought him back to god.
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
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galindoi
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: Futuresight]
#18779939 - 08/31/13 12:54 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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It's funny in the way Fear and Loathing piqued your interest is similar to me. That's how I was with Alice in Wonderland whenever it was I watched that for the first time, probably 5 or so, or whenever it was they let me watch those movies. I was captivated by the surreal and -even though I didn't know how to put my finger on it at the time- the psychedelic aspect of the art and the story. I can honestly say that shaped my world view for years, searching out anything I could find that was surrealistic. I didn't even care if it made sense, if it was bizarre just for the sake of being bizarre it was right up my alley. Go figure a Disney cartoon could have that much influence on someone.
Like the good little Christian I was, I never tampered with any kind of "illicit narcotic" while I was growing up, even though I was aware of them and that they would bring about the surreal aspect of my life that I sought after. I didn't even smoke weed until I was 23. I guess I'm kind of thankful in a way for that as that cleared my schedule for other things that needed doing. But now that I'm my own being, the past few years have been very interesting. I haven't quite stepped over the boundary to a full out ego death for hours on a mushroom trip alone, but an 1/8th and some nitrous will take you to places that are impossible to describe and my closest experience to ego death that I can fathom. It's quite jarring the first time, especially when you weren't expecting it.
The fun theory that I like to float around in my head when thinking about the eternal is that, even though corporeal beings are a blip on the radar of the universe, the consciousness isn't quite as concrete as the rest of the world. It gives me pause and makes me wonder what that could possibly lead to.
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sonamdrukpa
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: GreySatyr]
#18779949 - 08/31/13 12:56 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I feel weird about psychedelics. The Bible is pretty explicitly against witchcraft - Exodus 22:18, "Thou shall not suffer a witch to live", plus a weird episode with Saul and the Witch of Endor, and some events in Acts. And the more I've learned about herbs, deliriants like datura and hensbane, as well as various psychedelic religions all over the world, the more and more I find it hard to argue with the idea that the use of psychotropic substances is witchcraft.
On the other hand, I also find it very hard to listen to the Bible as a source of literal revelation. Whatever that means.
There is also a part of me that sees psychedelic headspaces as the fulfilling of all the hoopla about heaven in Revelations. I think about a verse from John a lot when thinking about psychedelica and religion. "My Father’s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?" Jesus said.
I met God while on acid and ayahuasca once, in the form of a fractal.
It is complicated, is what I am saying.
--------------------
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Asante
Mage


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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics (moved) [Re: GreySatyr]
#18780262 - 08/31/13 03:23 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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This thread was moved from The Psychedelic Experience.
Reason: Best suited here, please give it serious respectful replies
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Agentchewy
Pantheism.


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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics (moved) [Re: Asante]
#18780367 - 08/31/13 06:13 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Jesus Christ said he was Jesus Christ and everybody put him down for it
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If I knew the way, I would take you home.
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mt cleverest
clevendafodil

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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: GreySatyr]
#18780917 - 08/31/13 11:00 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I first tried mushrooms in bible college. half way through the trip I realized I was God. This was very unsettling at first and so I tried to play worship hillsong music to get my head in the right space again. But western christianity does not vibe at all with the psychedelic experience and so started my complete disillusionment with it. psychedelics are all about unity and oneness; the religion of christianity is built on the notion of separation/division, it would not exist otherwise.
1)psychedelics are truth 2)communing with god (my true self) is why I use psychedelics 3)if Im doing psychedelics, of course they are righteous and justified in the eyes of god. the eyes of god are my eyes and your eyes.
true christianity = death of self, resurrection of SELF (the christ story)
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Yogi1
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics (moved) [Re: Asante]
#18780961 - 08/31/13 11:14 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
Wiccan_Seeker said: <img src='http://www.shroomery.org/forums/images/moved.gif'> This thread was moved from The Psychedelic Experience.
Reason: Best suited here, please give it serious respectful replies
Are there Christians on the Shroomery?
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MarkostheGnostic
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: GreySatyr] 1
#18780985 - 08/31/13 11:23 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Quote:
GreyMorph said: So I have a few questions for Christians...keep in mind that this is a question specifically for Christians that actually believe and have faith in god and Jesus, not for guys who have read the bibles or went to church or anything like the but for people who truly have faith.
1. How do you feel about psychedelics? 2. Have you ever used psychedelics in an attempt to commune with god? 3. Do you believe that your use of psychedelics is righteous and justified in the eyes of god?
I'm agnostic by the way.
News Flash!: History is on-going. Here is evidence that early Christians used Amanita muscaria mushrooms: http://distelrath.tripod.com/fabbro.htm I am living evidence that 20th-21st century Christian Gnostics also used psychedelic mushrooms. Here is a pic of my votive table, replete with symbols, including a mushroom. Mushrooms serve a sacramental function for me. At the end of the day, the depictions of Y'shua ben Miriam (Iesous Son of Mary) from the Bible, the Christian Apocrypha, and the Nag Hammadi library, all taken together, form a profile of a kind of human being (mystic, psychic, prophet, healer, teacher, visionary) that mushrooms help me get a better understanding of for my own development. I do not strive to believe in the God-Realization of a 1st century Jewish peasant, I strive to have the same Realization, to Realize "the mind of Christ, and in so doing to "Know Thyself," as the Delphic/Socratic statement dictates.
My God is a Panentheistic version, not a Theistic version, nor a Pantheistic version. Panentheism simply suggests that the Eternal co-exists with space-time, but not in a dualistic way, or else there could be no communication between separate modes of being. Creation and Creator are co-extensive, gradations of Reality, symbolized by the spheres on the Kabbalistic Tree. Like the Buddhist formula that Nirvana is Samsara, form is not separate from the formless. Creation is not, as orthodoxy asserts, separate from God. It is a paradox, perhaps akin to light behaving as waves and particles in a scientific idiom.
There are therefore no "eyes of God" in ANY anthropomorphic sense, so your question cannot be answered because it is constructed on false premises. God is not an Old Bearded Guy in the Sky. God is Spirit, and Spirit (Latin: Spiritus, Greek: Pneuma, Hebrew: Ruach) is an archaic word for Consciousness or Awareness. Consciousness is therefore the Ultimate reality, formless and eternal, intelligent and compassionate. If "God is Love," it is agapé love, which is equivalent to the Buddhist karuna in meaning, compassion. The Qur'an also states "God the Merciful, the Compassionate at the beginning of every sura. This is love as a state of being, not interpersonal love. It is universal in nature. Inasmuch as "God is love," Universal Mind is the metaphysical infrastructure of Reality, to use philosophical terms to explain religious language. Universal Mind is called the Logos, usually translated as "word" in the New Testament. To have one's human mind suffused by the Logos, the Universal Mind, is to "be in Christ," biblically speaking. It is evidenced by increased compassion, and a tendency to constellate synchronicities around oneself - a modern word for miracles. But this is just my 2¢.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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GreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche


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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics (moved) [Re: Yogi1]
#18781056 - 08/31/13 11:46 AM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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I've seen Christians post on the shroomery. That's the reason I posted the thread here. I know of at least two. I can't remember their names though.
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
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mt cleverest
clevendafodil

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 2,348
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Quote:
MarkostheGnostic said:
News Flash!: History is on-going. Here is evidence that early Christians used Amanita muscaria mushrooms: http://distelrath.tripod.com/fabbro.htm I am living evidence that 20th-21st century Christian Gnostics also used psychedelic mushrooms. Here is a pic of my votive table, replete with symbols, including a mushroom. Mushrooms serve a sacramental function for me. At the end of the day, the depictions of Y'shua ben Miriam (Iesous Son of Mary) from the Bible, the Christian Apocrypha, and the Nag Hammadi library, all taken together, form a profile of a kind of human being (mystic, psychic, prophet, healer, teacher, visionary) that mushrooms help me get a better understanding of for my own development. I do not strive to believe in the God-Realization of a 1st century Jewish peasant, I strive to have the same Realization, to Realize "the mind of Christ, and in so doing to "Know Thyself," as the Delphic/Socratic statement dictates.
My God is a Panentheistic version, not a Theistic version, nor a Pantheistic version. Panentheism simply suggests that the Eternal co-exists with space-time, but not in a dualistic way, or else there could be no communication between separate modes of being. Creation and Creator are co-extensive, gradations of Reality, symbolized by the spheres on the Kabbalistic Tree. Like the Buddhist formula that Nirvana is Samsara, form is not separate from the formless. Creation is not, as orthodoxy asserts, separate from God. It is a paradox, perhaps akin to light behaving as waves and particles in a scientific idiom.
There are therefore no "eyes of God" in ANY anthropomorphic sense, so your question cannot be answered because it is constructed on false premises. God is not an Old Bearded Guy in the Sky. God is Spirit, and Spirit (Latin: Spiritus, Greek: Pneuma, Hebrew: Ruach) is an archaic word for Consciousness or Awareness. Consciousness is therefore the Ultimate reality, formless and eternal, intelligent and compassionate. If "God is Love," it is agapé love, which is equivalent to the Buddhist karuna in meaning, compassion. The Qur'an also states "God the Merciful, the Compassionate at the beginning of every sura. This is love as a state of being, not interpersonal love. It is universal in nature. Inasmuch as "God is love," Universal Mind is the metaphysical infrastructure of Reality, to use philosophical terms to explain religious language. Universal Mind is called the Logos, usually translated as "word" in the New Testament. To have one's human mind suffused by the Logos, the Universal Mind, is to "be in Christ," biblically speaking. It is evidenced by increased compassion, and a tendency to constellate synchronicities around oneself - a modern word for miracles. But this is just my 2¢.

Yes! the universal mind is the mind of Christ. have you heard of Tim Freke? he's pretty cool.
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Yogi1
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics (moved) [Re: Agentchewy]
#18781518 - 08/31/13 02:24 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Blasphemy! This man is god vvv
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder



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Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
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Re: Christianity On Psychedelics [Re: mt cleverest]
#18781591 - 08/31/13 02:47 PM (10 years, 4 months ago) |
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Yes! the universal mind is the mind of Christ. have you heard of Tim Freke? he's pretty cool.
Yes, we're friends on FB. I own all the books he wrote with Peter Gandy on Gnosticism.
-------------------- γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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GreySatyr
Pagan-Psyche


Registered: 06/20/13
Posts: 3,376
Loc: North Carolina
Last seen: 9 years, 8 months
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Oh boy. Opened a can of worms.
-------------------- ...also, go to hell, huh?
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mt cleverest
clevendafodil

Registered: 08/19/12
Posts: 2,348
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Quote:
MarkostheGnostic said: Yes, we're friends on FB. I own all the books he wrote with Peter Gandy on Gnosticism.
Cool! ya, I just finished reading "the gospel and the second coming." After getting into psychedelics pretty heavily a few yrs ago, I went from popular christianity straight into nonduality, and have been trying to reconcile the two ever since. That book was the missing piece. it really confirmed many things Ive been feeling about Christ(not to be confused with jesus lol).
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