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Offlinewindowlikcer
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Registered: 11/14/11
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Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober,
    #18770446 - 08/28/13 08:40 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Everything looks like a pointalist painting, and I get the "breathing walls" effect as well. All the time, whether I'm on psychedelics or not.

Its yet another factor making me realize that reality is utterly no different from a dream. Just an image whipped up by the consciousness which I am and yet am not. There is no point in clinging to the world or to the roller coaster of life and death. It is all emptiness, and when the dream of your current life fades and the next one takes its place you won't even remember all these random feelings and emotional attachments you have had to simple images in your mind.

Anyone else have these persistent, saturating effects? I don't feel any fear that I am going insane, I am more stable in real world matters and mental health than ever. I just feel no connection to the world anymore, it is just a wavy, colorfully sparkling image with no substance, no lasting presence of any kind.


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InvisibleTheMule73
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Registered: 08/26/11
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: windowlikcer]
    #18770486 - 08/28/13 08:50 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

How long have you been sober?


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InvisibletheRAPeutic
Hueman
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Registered: 07/22/13
Posts: 8,702
Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: TheMule73]
    #18770501 - 08/28/13 08:54 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

HPPD


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OfflineAgentchewy
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: TheMule73]
    #18770504 - 08/28/13 08:55 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Those feelings will fade,
You're abusing the power of the mind negatively obviously.

You need to realize that this world that you feel no attachment to is you. You are made of it and in effect you are the universe experiencing itself. You are the very fabric of existence itself. A spiritual being.


--------------------


If I knew the way, I would take you home.


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InvisibleBlazer420
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Registered: 06/13/09
Posts: 4,825
Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: Agentchewy]
    #18770528 - 08/28/13 09:00 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

These thoughts/feelings will subside in a couple weeks+


--------------------
~ I used to get high on life, until I realized life was cut with morons ~
* You need 2 wake up and smell the music! *
-We are all computer data in a materialistic world-
|Sometimes you have to lose yourself, to find anything|


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OfflineLuSiD enthusiast
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: Agentchewy] * 1
    #18770530 - 08/28/13 09:00 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I bet if you tripped again the walls breathing would be entirely different then they are now and you wouldn't even consider the sober walls breathing.


--------------------
I'm addicted to coke, weed, booze, ludes and speed.
Not LSD, you can't get addicted to LSD, it was built by scientists.

I ain't got no demons that gonna get woke.


In erowid we trust.

Just take your damn pills and don't ask any questions, you'll be fine.


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Offlinewindowlikcer
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: Agentchewy]
    #18770535 - 08/28/13 09:01 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Agentchewy said:
Those feelings will fade,
You're abusing the power of the mind negatively obviously.

You need to realize that this world that you feel no attachment to is you. You are made of it and in effect you are the universe experiencing itself. You are the very fabric of existence itself. A spiritual being.




I do realize that. In fact that is exactly what I'm saying. There is no world outside of mind. I feel no attachment to the world because I feel that it is myself. If it is negative abuse of my mind, why do I feel so much peace?


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OfflineAgentchewy
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: windowlikcer]
    #18770552 - 08/28/13 09:03 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Well the wording threw me off, just be safe,the line between genius and insanity, enlightenment and psychosis is quite fine, and sometimes breaks are lifesavers


Edit,,

Everyone wants to say their yoga, works better or faster but true enlightenment is being at peace with the level you are at


--------------------


If I knew the way, I would take you home.


Edited by Agentchewy (08/28/13 09:05 PM)


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Offlinewindowlikcer
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: LuSiD enthusiast]
    #18770557 - 08/28/13 09:04 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

LuSiD enthusiast said:
I bet if you tripped again the walls breathing would be entirely different then they are now and you wouldn't even consider the sober walls breathing.




I definitely agree. Same goes for the matrix of jewels laid over everything I see. However, they still happen when I'm sober, even if I cannot lose myself in them the way one might under the influence...


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Offlinewindowlikcer
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: Agentchewy]
    #18770571 - 08/28/13 09:07 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Agentchewy said:
Well the wording threw me off, just be safe,the line between genius and insanity, enlightenment and psychosis is quite fine, and sometimes breaks are lifesavers




Thank you for the support.

It is somewhat frustrating that there are experiences like this being had by so many people yet there is no real place for it in our society. No vocabulary, no knowledge, no answers. Yet at the same time, on a much deeper level, I am not concerned with answers because answers would be as empty as every other mental event.


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OfflineLabs4858


Registered: 04/20/13
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: windowlikcer]
    #18770608 - 08/28/13 09:14 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Ive been sober for a couple weeks now. Effects were pretty apparent and now they are starting to get noticeably better.


--------------------


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Offlinewindowlikcer
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: Labs4858]
    #18770637 - 08/28/13 09:21 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

These effects aren't something that started happening after a particular trip. The visual effects have been happening at least subtly as long as I can remember. However, it seems that psychedelics have brought them out to the forefront of my attention much more than they were during the first 20 years of my life which I spent stone cold sober.

Reality is a strange place...


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OfflineLuSiD enthusiast
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: windowlikcer]
    #18770767 - 08/28/13 09:40 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I've noticed tons more of everyday optical illusions thanks to tripping. Troxler effect is one. Stare at yourself in the mirror and let your eyes unfocus and you'll start to look like a ghost (scientific evidence supports this and it's where the childhood game bloody mary originated) positive and negative afterimages is andother one. Stare and squint at the screen long enough and the letters will kind of expand up or down like light spectrums (easiest way to explain something, and if you read erowid reports long enough while tired this is probably.the most notable place i've seen it due to the color scheme.)
Light spectrums is another one i noticed pretripping, but i never really noticed color changes in any light spectrum ever, whereas post first acid trip i can kind of see colors fading in a light spectrum if i squint lookimg at a foggy plate of glass with a street light or some light source on the other side. Look up into a plain blue sky,it's not really static but it'll be so bright that your eyes don't just see a plain blue sky, rather some sort of static disruption to protect your eyes from colorblinding yourself from taking to much of one color in at once (my theory, that or it's a variation of the troxler effect)

I don't doubt the existence of hppd, but i also feel that a large number of people who claim to have it are just noticing minor optical illusions your brain played on you for years and and you just become so used to it you had never noticed some of these minor effects, kind of like you might not notice your vision going bad until you look through a pair of glasses for the first time in years.


--------------------
I'm addicted to coke, weed, booze, ludes and speed.
Not LSD, you can't get addicted to LSD, it was built by scientists.

I ain't got no demons that gonna get woke.


In erowid we trust.

Just take your damn pills and don't ask any questions, you'll be fine.


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Offlinewindowlikcer
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Registered: 11/14/11
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: LuSiD enthusiast]
    #18770824 - 08/28/13 09:50 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

LuSiD enthusiast said:
I've noticed tons more of everyday optical illusions thanks to tripping. Troxler effect is one. Stare at yourself in the mirror and let your eyes unfocus and you'll start to look like a ghost (scientific evidence supports this and it's where the childhood game bloody mary originated) positive and negative afterimages is andother one. Stare and squint at the screen long enough and the letters will kind of expand up or down like light spectrums (easiest way to explain something, and if you read erowid reports long enough while tired this is probably.the most notable place i've seen it due to the color scheme.)
Light spectrums is another one i noticed pretripping, but i never really noticed color changes in any light spectrum ever, whereas post first acid trip i can kind of see colors fading in a light spectrum if i squint lookimg at a foggy plate of glass with a street light or some light source on the other side. Look up into a plain blue sky,it's not really static but it'll be so bright that your eyes don't just see a plain blue sky, rather some sort of static disruption to protect your eyes from colorblinding yourself from taking to much of one color in at once (my theory, that or it's a variation of the troxler effect)

I don't doubt the existence of hppd, but i also feel that a large number of people who claim to have it are just noticing minor optical illusions your brain played on you for years and and you just become so used to it you had never noticed some of these minor effects, kind of like you might not notice your vision going bad until you look through a pair of glasses for the first time in years.




Haha I have experienced the same phenomenon while reading Erowid reports!


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Invisiblesailing
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: windowlikcer] * 1
    #18771300 - 08/28/13 11:50 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Ive been sober for about 5 months now and i still get it. the breathing is only sometimes, but the visual static is constant and pretty strong.

it will fade, but it will take a long time. do yourself a favor, and let your brain recover, trust me, the depersonalization is not worth it.


--------------------
Love is the deep spiritual connection between the self and all things. We are all a part of the same universe.

Crazy cat peekin through a lace bandanna,like a one eyed cheshire, like a diamond eyed jack.

:awecid2:


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: sailing]
    #18771839 - 08/29/13 04:37 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Basically what you have been told is correct.

HPPD and depersonalization happen commonly for trippers, especially frequent trippers.

The effects do tend to fade/vanish but not in all cases.

The best thing to do is not care about it. It is no big deal. Hell, the visuals are kind of fun. Live life don't dwell on the past. You have simply seen the world in a new light. That effect can linger. Remember, nobody but you can see through your eyes. Nobody can tell.

Depersonalization simply requires repersonalization. Make the effort to engage in friendships and family. It is simply feeling like nobody but you understands what you have learned so why bother? Well, bother. We are social beings, and we need practice. Socialize and your depersonalization will fade before you know it. Do fun things with people. You will soon see that fun is important even while not tripping, and you can have fun with people who may never trip. Your friends and family, even though they may not understand the psychonaut in you, still care deeply for you. Not only will it cure your depersonalization, it will make it less likely to happen in the future.

At my age and experience level, depersonalization is no longer an issue with tripping. I trip when I trip and I sober when I am sober. HPPD can still get me from time to time though. Especially after a BIG trip.

I suspect depersonalization is most common amongst young trippers, who have fears of their parents or society coming down on them for what they have learned during their trips. I find tripping with friends aids in reducing the risk of depersonalization as well, since you are all in it together.

Main thing, the less you dwell on the side effects, the quicker they tend to go away.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: Rose]
    #18771860 - 08/29/13 04:51 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

HPPD and depersonalization happen commonly for trippers, especially frequent trippers.




That is not true, for example, have a look at the people in the Native American Church and you will not find a single case. That's also why I agree with you in the sense that diving into the experience as a well-trusted community is safer than playing the lone psychonaut.

I also don't dare to tell you, OP, what to do. If it is not a problematic situation for you, there is no need for my advice.


--------------------
Stand up. You're not alone.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: Lord_McLovin]
    #18771872 - 08/29/13 05:03 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

You had to quote the one line I was going to edit.

I should have said, "Depersonalization happens most often to young trippers who don't feel like society would appreciate the fact that they have tripped in the first place."

Something like that. It is getting late here. I may review my thoughts tomorrow and try to make my point clearer.


--------------------
Fiddlesticks.



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Offlinecrkhd
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: Rose]
    #18771915 - 08/29/13 05:46 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

It's not HPPD. It's THE Trip.


Reality is The Trip. It's fluid. Psychedelics bring it out.

The walls are always breathing. You breathe out, the air molecules hit off the walls. They breathe.


If you are a programmer, send data codes to the visual matrix and it WILL respond. This is the essence of Self-inquiry meditation and I understand now how Ram Dass & Co could drop acid and be on his merry way.


--------------------


"Everything there is, and all that there is, is a Pattern of unspeakable proportion. The Pattern contains everything that is, completely fixed in succession, all the minimal particles interconnected in every way that is. Every way that is is not every conceivable way, because not everything that can be conceived is manifest in the pattern."

"THE Human, you, is a miniscule but essential part of that pattern. In it lies complete fulfillment. It will never become something it is not, but it will never need to be anything else." - Wiccan_Seeker

"If boring drudgery was the way of the universe, everything would have killed itself long ago." - Spacerific


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OfflineLord_McLovin
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Re: Now, 24/7, even when I'm sober, [Re: Rose]
    #18771937 - 08/29/13 06:00 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Still, I would not agree completely.

From my experience, the dangers of psychedelics, which are almost purely psychological, are mainly from improper use of these substances. In terms of what we should define as proper use to avoid those risks, I would suggest to take a look at history. They have either been used as a part of a communal ritual most often in a spiritual and I would also say hedonistic context or by shamans to heal and to discover the realm of the unconscious (= the spirit world). In my mind, putting those uses into a modern frame should be our aim as a psychedelic community - and of course this includes the need to create the proper legal framework.
Users of psychedelics tend to be white guys in their twenties or thirties at most, so I only see correlation, not causality.

As far as OP goes, it does not sound pathological. We should be careful with judging his state of mind as bad just because it is not normal in our terms.


--------------------
Stand up. You're not alone.


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