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Invisibleabltsandwich
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Why do fantasy movies always use British accents?
    #18768639 - 08/28/13 02:20 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Lord of the Rings, Game of Thrones, etc.
Like wouldn't the general depicted timeframe consist of people speaking Old English?


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InvisibleMe_Roy
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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768642 - 08/28/13 02:21 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

...and drinking Olde English 800?


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Me_Roy]
    #18768653 - 08/28/13 02:24 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Well you know what I wish Gandalf had a Russian accent.:kingcrankey:


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich] * 1
    #18768654 - 08/28/13 02:24 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Apparently fantasy as a form of entertainment requires a certain level of "sophistication", that can only be achieved through British accent(Received Pronunciation)..

I'd love to see Harry Potter in Castle 'pon Tyne or Cockney accent :lol:


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768659 - 08/28/13 02:26 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I don't think they would seem as fantastical if the characters sounded like they were from Kentucky or New Jersey.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Murph]
    #18768664 - 08/28/13 02:28 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

So by that logic then fantasy movies are less fantastical to British folks?


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768669 - 08/28/13 02:28 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

It is a dramatic convention.

It helps to establish distinctions in class between characters and their place of origin.

LOTR was written by an Englishman and GoT's plot is based in England's dark history.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768674 - 08/28/13 02:30 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

:lol:

They live the fantasy, so obviously it has to be less appealing :lol:


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768679 - 08/28/13 02:32 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

abltsandwich said:
So by that logic then fantasy movies are less fantastical to British folks?




I suppose they are but seeing as I'm not british I cant really say.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768683 - 08/28/13 02:34 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Because of time and place. Everyone knows America is young as fuck, so it would detract from the aesthetic if they had American accents.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Rose]
    #18768687 - 08/28/13 02:35 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

They'd be speaking Old English in that time period which doesn't sound like modern British English.
And those were just two examples.
Lets add more:

Gladiator, 300, Chronicles of Narnia...

Quote:

jewunit said:
Because of time and place. Everyone knows America is young as fuck, so it would detract from the aesthetic if they had American accents.




Why not use a different language with subtitles of appropriate aesthetic is the goal?


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768690 - 08/28/13 02:37 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

abltsandwich said:
They'd be speaking Old English in that time period which doesn't sound like modern British English.
And those were just two examples.
Lets add more:

Gladiator, 300, Chronicles of Narnia...



maybe I'm just remembering it wrong but I'm preeetty sure they don't sound British in 300, maybe a little bit in Gladiator though.

and the characters in Narnia are from England sooo...


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: mushroom_sandwich]
    #18768694 - 08/28/13 02:39 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)



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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768695 - 08/28/13 02:39 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Well I think if you use the actual language of the time you would need subtitles and they usually scare people off. I like a good subtitled movie because I cant tell if the acting is bad or not and it really seems interesting if you have to read every detail to keep up with the story.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768701 - 08/28/13 02:41 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

eh I wouldn't say that sounds all that british :shrug:


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: mushroom_sandwich]
    #18768705 - 08/28/13 02:42 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Dude watch the movie or YouTube some clips.  It's all British.

Same with Troy and Clash of the Titans.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768711 - 08/28/13 02:45 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Clash of the Titans ALSO happens to be one of the worst acted, written, and filmed movies of all time. OF ALL TIME.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich] * 1
    #18768713 - 08/28/13 02:45 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

If they were in old English, you wouldn't understand any of it.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768715 - 08/28/13 02:46 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

maybe becuz mainstream associates that voice with medieval times and swords and things of that nature plus its exotic


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: mushroom_sandwich]
    #18768717 - 08/28/13 02:46 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mushroom_sandwich said:
Clash of the Titans ALSO happens to be one of the worst acted, written, and filmed movies of all time. OF ALL TIME.



You're complete wrong about that.  I loved that movie when I was a kid.  Bubo was awesome and Burgess Meredith rocked


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Enlil]
    #18768720 - 08/28/13 02:47 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
If they were in old English, you wouldn't understand any of it.



I remember reading Canterbury Tales in Old English in high school :lol:
That would be terrible for movies.
Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

mushroom_sandwich said:
Clash of the Titans ALSO happens to be one of the worst acted, written, and filmed movies of all time. OF ALL TIME.



You're complete wrong about that.  I loved that movie when I was a kid.  Bubo was awesome and Burgess Meredith rocked



I was referring to the remake.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Does]
    #18768725 - 08/28/13 02:49 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
If they were in old English, you wouldn't understand any of it.




It can be subtitled.  Or if we're making the leap to put it in English, why always to British?

Quote:

Does said:
maybe becuz mainstream associates that voice with medieval times and swords and things of that nature plus its exotic




It's only exotic to non-British people.  And if mainstream society associates medieval times with modern British accents then that's stupid.  And very likely perpetuated by the fact that medieval times are always depicted with British accents by the media in the first place.

And whether a movie is good or bad doesn't have any relevance to this thread.
I still can't wrap my head around Ancient Roman characters speaking with modern British accents.  That is fucking retarded.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: mushroom_sandwich]
    #18768733 - 08/28/13 02:51 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mushroom_sandwich said:
I remember reading Canterbury Tales in Old English in high school


Canterbury Tales isn't Old English....it's Middle English.  Old English is much worse.  Try reading Beowulf.
Quote:


I was referring to the remake.



Why remake a perfect movie?  More importantly, why watch a remake of a perfect movie when you can watch the original?


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Enlil]
    #18768740 - 08/28/13 02:53 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
Quote:

mushroom_sandwich said:
I remember reading Canterbury Tales in Old English in high school


Canterbury Tales isn't Old English....it's Middle English.  Old English is much worse.  Try reading Beowulf.
Quote:


I was referring to the remake.



Why remake a perfect movie?  More importantly, why watch a remake of a perfect movie when you can watch the original?



You're right, it's Beowulf that's in Old English. Which I also read.

and I love the original, I saw the remake because I'm a.. bad person? At least I hated it.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Enlil]
    #18768741 - 08/28/13 02:53 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Enlil said:
If they were in old English, you wouldn't understand any of it.




Yep, it might as well be in German. It would be just as incomprehensible to modern English speakers. I think a lot of people are mixed up about what Old English actually is.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: mushroom_sandwich] * 2
    #18768746 - 08/28/13 02:54 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mushroom_sandwich said:
I'm a.. bad person?



CORRECT!  At least we're getting somewhere.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: mushroom_sandwich]
    #18768752 - 08/28/13 02:56 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

mushroom_sandwich said:
You're right, it's Beowulf that's in Old English. Which I also read.




You probably read a translation. The original text looks like this:

Quote:

    Hwæt! We Gardena        in geardagum,
    þeodcyninga,        þrym gefrunon,
    hu ða æþelingas        ellen fremedon.
    Oft Scyld Scefing        sceaþena þreatum,

    monegum mægþum,        meodosetla ofteah,
    egsode eorlas.        Syððan ærest wearð
    feasceaft funden,        he þæs frofre gebad,
    weox under wolcnum,        weorðmyndum þah,
    oðþæt him æghwylc        þara ymbsittendra

    ofer hronrade        hyran scolde,
    gomban gyldan.        þæt wæs god cyning!
    Ðæm eafera wæs        æfter cenned,
    geong in geardum,        þone god sende
    folce to frofre;        fyrenðearfe ongeat




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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Enlil]
    #18768753 - 08/28/13 02:56 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Fantasy movies are always in British because England has many castles which is needed for fantasy. Also, most fantasy books seem to be in medieval times and America hadn't been discovered yet. The the target audience is America, therefore requiring the film to be in English. the UK fits all the criteria necessary


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Patlal]
    #18768759 - 08/28/13 02:58 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

boom?


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Patlal]
    #18768782 - 08/28/13 03:07 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Patlal said:
Fantasy movies are always in British because England has many castles which is needed for fantasy. Also, most fantasy books seem to be in medieval times and America hadn't been discovered yet. The the target audience is America, therefore requiring the film to be in English. the UK fits all the criteria necessary




I don't remember seeing any castles in Gladiator and 300.
And castles aren't needed for fantasy unless you only stay within Tolkien-esque fantasy.
Not to mention the type of English spoken in the time periods depicted is dramatically different and doesn't sound like British or American English.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768789 - 08/28/13 03:09 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Well, those movies ARE fictional...so, why do you expect them to have a realistic accent?


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Enlil]
    #18768794 - 08/28/13 03:10 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I don't.  I'm just wondering why British accent of all accents?  Neither is historically accurate so if we're making the logical jump that they should be speaking modern English, then why British?


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768799 - 08/28/13 03:13 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Because American chicks find British accents to be sexy.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768803 - 08/28/13 03:13 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I could just imagine a redneck avatar.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Inconspicuous]
    #18768811 - 08/28/13 03:16 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

We really need a James Bond that sounds like Woody Allen.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Enlil]
    #18768813 - 08/28/13 03:16 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Or perhaps Kai the (allegedly) murdering hitchhiker should play Gandalf.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich]
    #18768827 - 08/28/13 03:19 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

abltsandwich said:
Why not use a different language with subtitles of appropriate aesthetic is the goal?



Subtitles have much less mass appeal, I think that is pretty obvious. It achieves the desired flavor without requiring subtitles. Not to mention a lot of the stuff you brought up was written by English authors.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: jewunit]
    #18768934 - 08/28/13 03:47 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

because british actors need the work, and it fits better.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: abltsandwich] * 1
    #18769064 - 08/28/13 04:06 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I already gave you your answer.

Let me try again.

Brits speak differently than Americans. Their dialects do not just determine the region they are from but also their social class. Certain dialects are taught to children in expensive schools. Other dialects like Cockney, serve as a way for lower class people to annoy the hell out of the upper class by speaking improperly. There are even middle class dialects. And different sounds for North, South, city, country and town to town. Then there are the Irish, Scotish and Welsh.

When we are talking about epic stories, there are usually a ton of characters. The dialects help an audience keep track of who is who. A king should not sound the same as a commoner.

America is too new. Yes we have regional dialects, but they are not as organic as English dialects, which developed over hundreds/thousands of years, before the dawn of modern transportation, radio and television. The most extreme differences in American dialects are along the East coast, as they are the oldest States and had the most time to evolve their own dialects. By the time we started expanding westward, technology was speeding things along. When you can drive from state to state, you will sound more like your neighbors.

So American dialects are not as effective in classical cases. Also, there was no America in classical times, so people may just think the dialect sounds too new. If Ned spoke in a Jersey dialect, it would be extra weird.

Compare the country Scottish dialect of Ygritte, "You know nothing John Snow."
With the heightened Lannisters, "A Lannister always pays his debts."

Dialect really helps inform the audience about character.

Welsh, a soft and frankly timid sounding dialect is a great choice for informing the audience about the nature of Hobbits and it contrasts beautifully with the regal high elves.

This is why we focus on British dialects in epic and historic tales. Yes, it is a dramatic convention... and so is speaking English in the first place in many of these tales. I mean they probably should have spoken Latin in Gladiator.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Rose]
    #18769083 - 08/28/13 04:11 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

you pretty much put it perfectly Cervantes.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: mushroom_sandwich]
    #18769429 - 08/28/13 05:23 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I am an actor. Spent plenty of time learning dialects.

There is one American dialect, called American Standard, which most American actors learn in school. It serves a couple purposes, first it helps an actor remove their regionalisms from their speech (if you can only speak like you are from Kentucky, where you were born, your castability will be limited). Second, American standard is a heightened form of American English, so if you are playing a king in a Shakespeare play, American Standard is an option. Much like Standard British (Recieved Pronunciation or RP), American Standard is a phony dialect. It was invented to teach in schools. It did not organically evolve. It is known as a Mid-Atlantic dialect, as if some imaginary English speaking island nation existed in the middle of the ocean between Great Britan and the USA.

Like Standard British, Standard American drops the letter "R" from most words... so to an untrained ear, Standard American may sound British when it actually is not. You may hear, "This is Spahta!" Instead of "This is SpaRta" and think British. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't.

A good example of a Standard American dialect, although he pronounced his "R's", is Kelsey Grammer's character Frasier Crane. By using this dialect, he informed the audience that his character loved the sound of his own voice and that he had been trained to use it. He was a radio psychologist after all. And it made him sound full of himself, even at his most vulnerable. These are great and vital character traits that were conveyed simply by using a dialect people only learn in school.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Rose]
    #18769740 - 08/28/13 06:20 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Cervantes said:
It is known as a Mid-Atlantic dialect, as if some imaginary English speaking island nation existed in the middle of the ocean between Great Britan and the USA.





You sure that it's not known as "Mid-Atlantic" because it imagines a point half-way down the East Coast of the U.S. where both New England and Southern regional dialects would be absent?

I wonder if the dropped 'R's are related to the 'R's trilled with the tip of the tongue in German opera, etc. (See, for ex., the singer from Rammstein who I've heard was trained as an opera singer and adopts this affectation in his performance.) The more common uvular trill (in the back of the throat) simply won't carry if one's trying to project one's voice. Might Standard American simply give up on enunciating 'R's to avoid attempts at exaggeration?


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Me_Roy]
    #18769883 - 08/28/13 06:51 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

As for your first question. Standard American is considered Mid-Atlantic as in the middle of the ocean. It is mostly American with a little British thrown in. It has no hint of American Southern. It was also created by a Brit, Edith Skinner, if I am not mistaken. Her intent may have been to create an East coast dialect without regionalisms, but she added quite a bit of Brittish along the way.

As for the "R" sound, you are almost entirely correct. Vowell sounds carry better than consonant sounds. So when speaking on stage, which is often unamplified, the "R" sound does not carry well unless it is exaggerated to the point of sounding quite harsh and/or ugly. So in standard American and British, "R's" get dropped, unless followed by a word starting with a vowell... and other odd rules. English speakers have the ability to hear an "R" even when it is not spoken. It is a sound that only happens in certain places within words. We are able to effortlessly fill the gap just by listening and thinking. Dropping the "R" is efficient, so an actor's voice can speak longer without wearing out, while projecting loud enough to fill a large space. But it doesn't sound American. Bostonians drop their "R's" as do some Southerners. The rest of the nation really embraces their "R" sound. It is one of those things that make Americans sound American. It just sounds ugly, especially on stage. But, "R" is often used in ugly words, like rage, crap, burp, turd... the last two examples I used, burp and turd, would have their "R's" dropped in Standard... I can't help but think the impact of those words lose something in the process.

Thanks for your questions. It makes my week to talk about this stuff.


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Invisiblejewunit
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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: Rose]
    #18769893 - 08/28/13 06:53 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I had always heard that it was more mid-west than mid-atlantic.


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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: jewunit]
    #18769902 - 08/28/13 06:56 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

We have culturally agreed upon it being our Standard dialect. So... you are kind of correct.

Anchor people and radio DJ's often speak with it, so it becomes the dialect people hear and learn. Just like Standard British. But it is a made up dialect... and people just hear it enough to pick most of it up. The Midwesterners and Westerners were most effected by it. This is primarily due to the fact that radio and telivision came around before they had firmly established their own dialects.


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InvisibleCidneyIndole
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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: psi]
    #18770024 - 08/28/13 07:22 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

psi said:
Quote:

    Hwæt! We Gardena        in geardagum,
    þeodcyninga,        þrym gefrunon,
    hu ða æþelingas        ellen fremedon.
    Oft Scyld Scefing        sceaþena þreatum,

    monegum mægþum,        meodosetla ofteah,
    egsode eorlas.        Syððan ærest wearð
    feasceaft funden,        he þæs frofre gebad,
    weox under wolcnum,        weorðmyndum þah,
    oðþæt him æghwylc        þara ymbsittendra

    ofer hronrade        hyran scolde,
    gomban gyldan.        þæt wæs god cyning!
    Ðæm eafera wæs        æfter cenned,
    geong in geardum,        þone god sende
    folce to frofre;        fyrenðearfe ongeat









Ah yes. So true, though. So true.

In fact, I think I was just saying "Syððan ærest wearð he þæs frofre gebad" to my gf earlier.

She was all like "Hwæt!"



:gome:


:firstladyofapproval:





Back on topic-- it's even better when they do it in "sci-fi" Space Opera type movies (Like Star Wars). I've seen that happen a few times.


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OfflineRoseM
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Re: Why do fantasy movies always use British accents? [Re: CidneyIndole]
    #18770089 - 08/28/13 07:31 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Star Wars was filmed in England to save money, at the time. So most of their side characters were cast in England. Carrie Fischer had just finished British acting school even though she was and is American, so she still sounded British, particularly in the first (4th) film.


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