Home | Community | Message Board

NorthSpore.com BOOMR Bag!
This site includes paid links. Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Shroomery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: PhytoExtractum Kratom Powder for Sale   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Bridgetown Botanicals CBD Concentrates

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1
OfflineAtrium
Cunt Tickler

Registered: 08/18/13
Posts: 1,284
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
Psychotherapy and Psychedelics
    #18754740 - 08/25/13 10:43 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I'm in my second year of psychology and my whole life, found it a joke until finding chemical engineering not for me. I can go into detail of why when I write my life story but to put it simple, I want to heal people.

Changing to psychology was the best thing that ever happened to me. I know, one year in, also have never touched a psychedelic besides LSD or MDMA ( which was probably nbome, and something else for MDMA).

Anyways, I believe heavily in the idea of this type of treatment and plan to get my Psy.D before reaching 30(18 currently).

My questions are, who really is someone (author, scientist, psychologist) I should follow to understanding the possibilities better? And, which entheogens and tryptamines and such lead to a therapeutic session (besides what is known of LSD, shrooms, MDMA, ibogaine, aya). Anything I missed in that list?


--------------------
The only thing about Chemistry I like is all the psychedelics that come from it.

The only reason I study Psychology is to have a legitimate excuse to enjoy Chemistry. :tongue2:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleIcelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Male


Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
Re: Psychotherapy and Psychedelics [Re: Atrium] * 1
    #18754838 - 08/25/13 11:22 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I think people who want to "heal" others are usually dangerous to humanity sooner or later. :satansmoking:


--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.

" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.

With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
Re: Psychotherapy and Psychedelics [Re: Atrium]
    #18754853 - 08/25/13 11:28 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

(1) All of Stanislav Grof's books should be considered. Be careful, the original, Realms of the Human Unconscious, has been renamed LSD: Doorway to the Numinous, so buy only one. I have the former older book, and I recommend that to start because it introduces you to his concept of the Four Basic Perinatal Matrices.  http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=stan+grof%2C&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Astan+grof%5Cc

(2) You will have to familiarize yourself with the essentials of Freudian and Jungian schools of depth psychology. Freud's work describes the phenomenology of the first two chakras of Yoga psychology, Jung, perhaps the 4th chakra. Regardless, you won't understand Grof, who is the #1 name in Psychedelic Psychotherapy (and he has a book by that name, but so does W.V. Caldwell, whose work is more Freudian).

(3) Aside from Freud and Jung, Alfred Adler's work enjoins the phenomenology of the 3rd or Manipura chakra in Yoga psychology, and his "social interest" as well as other aspects is a wedge into the Existential, Humanistic, and Transpersonal psychological schools: Rogers, Victor Frankl, Abraham Maslow, Ken Wilber, Michael Washburn, Jack Engler, Mark Epstein. You're gonna need to know about Freud, Adler and Jung anyway for your doctoral studies (I earned a PhD 30 years ago, and they still apply).

(4) Your generation may well see the advent of Psychedelic Psychotherapists. Of course, it is unlikely that even a psychologist with a Masters in psychopharmacology who can administer some drugs today, will be granted the license to administer psychedelics. Although you never know. I recommend that you 'wet your whistle' with The Secret Chiefs Revealed: Conversations With Leo Zeff, Pioneer in the Underground Psychedelic Therapy Movement by Myron J. Stolaroff. http://www.amazon.com/Secret-Chief-Revealed-Myron-Stolaroff/dp/0966001966/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1377451692&sr=8-1&keywords=secret+chiefs+revealed


--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Edited by MarkostheGnostic (08/26/13 01:19 PM)


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineAtrium
Cunt Tickler

Registered: 08/18/13
Posts: 1,284
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
Re: Psychotherapy and Psychedelics [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #18755175 - 08/25/13 01:29 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks for all that info. I'll definitely check into it when I get some free time.

And I also agree that healing is a fine line top cross but my intentions are not to impose but to help the ones who seek help from someone like me. I do not believe in prescriptions. They are a bandaid to cover the problems until the"treatment" is no longer given. This is why psychedelic psychotherapy intrigues me so much.


--------------------
The only thing about Chemistry I like is all the psychedelics that come from it.

The only reason I study Psychology is to have a legitimate excuse to enjoy Chemistry. :tongue2:


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineKGB Is Go
Сталкер
Male


Registered: 09/09/10
Posts: 322
Loc: VIC Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 9 months
Re: Psychotherapy and Psychedelics [Re: Atrium]
    #18756010 - 08/25/13 05:05 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Rick.
Doblin!

/thread (I'm exaggerating a bit)

This guy is phenomenal. Such a fuckin' cool guy. Brilliant attitude and commitment to his goals. (I really idolise the guy at the moment, so I'm a bit obsessed.) He's the founder and president of MAPS (Multi-disciplinary Association for Psychedelic Study) and has been working for some 26 years or so to get psychedelics legalised as a medicine. He's really more of an organiser/strategist/fundraiser, rather than (official, scientific) researcher or therapist these days, but he a very good grasp of the whole situation. His mentor is Stanislav Grof, who's a very notable figure as Mark also mentioned. I won't go on too much because you can find out all of this information yourself. I highly, highly recommend checking out some of his interviews/presentations on YouTube (the London Real interview is good), and while you're at it check out some presentations from the Psychedelic Science 2013 conference. Lots of interesting presentations there.

Beyond Rick, I would definitely second Stanislav Grof. I find Grof to be so refined, precise and thorough in his work. If I'm not mistaken, Grof has done thousands of sessions of LSD-assisted therapy (perhaps unofficially) and is extremely well-read in the literature - I'd say he is the authority on LSD-assisted therapy. I believe he was one of the first recipients of LSD when Sandoz was sending out samples to various psychiatrists around the world and was a very close friend of Albert Hoffman ('founder' of LSD). These days I'd say Grof, with his wife, Christina, is more focused on their Holotropic Breathwork method, rather than psychedelic therapy, but I'd say it's quite similar in it's approach/methodology (and worth a look). A couple of books of his which I think are worth a read are: LSD Psychotherapy and Psychology of the Future.

Further to this, I'd mention David E. Nichols and Dennis McKenna (Terence's brother) and the rest of the Heffter Institute (including Charles Grob). I don't know much of Grob, but I know he's a significant figure on the psychedelic front. McKenna and Nichols have amazing grasps of the chemistry involved in psychedelics. A presentation from Nichols will likely bamboozle you with receptor sites and various dimethyl-ethyls and tryptos etc. but it’s interesting nonetheless, especially if you’re into the detail of it all. I reckon interviews with Dennis are always entertaining too.

A couple of others definitely worth a mention are David Nutt and IONS (Institute Of Noetic Sciences). There are plenty of others which you can explore and find for yourself.

I think you covered all of the psychedelics suitable for therapy on your list. I'd say MDMA is the closest to being legalised (currently in Phase 2 research, I believe, for the treatment of PTSD), Doblin optimistically says around 10-15 years, I believe.

Funnily enough, I studied Chemical Engineering (and have been working in it for last 3 years since grad). I was disillusioned with it all around my second year (of four) but continued on, thinking I might do something cool like hemp processing, or otherwise some kind of health food or something beneficial and interesting. I've continued to lose interest and am now also keen to pursue some career which is related to solving the social/health crisis with regard to psychedelics. Not sure how to approach it just yet.


--------------------
"The guy went axe-happy on a trout farm, he killed 60 fish."


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offlinecircastes
Big Questions Small Head
Male User Gallery

Registered: 01/14/10
Posts: 8,781
Loc: straya Flag
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
Re: Psychotherapy and Psychedelics [Re: KGB Is Go]
    #18756488 - 08/25/13 06:51 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Grof is one of a kind. He's also right.


--------------------
My solitude...
My shield...
My armour...

TESTED
WITH
FULL
FORCE


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleEllisDSox
King Hella!

Registered: 01/22/07
Posts: 25,730
Re: Psychotherapy and Psychedelics [Re: MarkostheGnostic]
    #18758545 - 08/26/13 05:05 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

MarkostheGnostic said:
(1) All of Stanislav Grof's books should be considered. Be careful, the original, Realms of the Human Unconscious, has been renamed LSD: Doorway to the Numinous, so buy only one. I have the former older book, and I recommend that to start because it introduces you to his concept of the Four Basic Perinatal Matrices.  http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=stan+grof%2C&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Astan+grof%5Cc

(2) You will have to familiarize yourself with the essentials of Freudian and Jungian schools of depth psychology. Freud's work describes the phenomenology of the first two chakras of Yoga psychology, Jung, perhaps the 4th chakra. Regardless, you won't understand Grof, who is the #1 name in Psychedelic Psychotherapy (and he has a book by that name, but so does W.V. Caldwell, whose work is more Freudian).

(3) Aside from Freud and Jung, Alfred Adler's work enjoins the phenomenology of the 3rd or Manipura chakra in Yoga psychology, and his "social interest" as well as other aspects is a wedge into the Existential, Humanistic, and Transpersonal psychological schools: Rogers, Victor Frankl, Abraham Maslow, Ken Wilber, Michael Washburn, Jack Engler, Mark Epstein. You're gonna need to know about Freud, Adler and Jung anyway for your doctoral studies (I earned a PhD 30 years ago, and they still apply).

(4) Your generation may well see the advent of Psychedelic Psychotherapists. Of course, it is unlikely that even a psychologist with a Masters in psychopharmacology who can administer some drugs today, will be granted the license to administer psychedelics. Although you never know. I recommend that you 'wet your whistle' with The Secret Chiefs Revealed: Conversations With Leo Zeff, Pioneer in the Underground Psychedelic Therapy Movement by Myron J. Stolarff. http://www.amazon.com/Secret-Chief-Revealed-Myron-Stolaroff/dp/0966001966/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1377451692&sr=8-1&keywords=secret+chiefs+revealed




All of this, basically. Grof is the main man as far as LSD psychotherapists who wrote a significant body of work go. Leary is trash, and Humphrey Osmond didn't write very much at all.


--------------------
Disclaimer: If you have any kind of heart condition, my posts are not for you. You could literally die from reading the first couple of words in any one of them. Scroll down the page, live your life and prosper, but don't read my posts because your heart will probably explode. I am not joking.


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineMarkostheGnostic
Elder
Male User Gallery


Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida Flag
Last seen: 3 years, 2 days
Re: Psychotherapy and Psychedelics [Re: KGB Is Go] * 1
    #18759709 - 08/26/13 02:01 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Funnily enough, I studied Chemical Engineering (and have been working in it for last 3 years since grad).

DISCLAIMER: The following pamphley by Adam Gottlieb, entitled The Book of Acid, is intended for inspirational and educational purposes only, and should not be attempted due to current local, state, and federal laws. (However, I sent this to Dr. Albert Hofmann in the early 1980s, and he recognized its basis in his and Dr. Stoll's work. He also wrote back that this would work). Just saying. First Amendment to the United States Constitution Evoked.

Some enterprising anarchistic underground chemist might pick up where Owsley, Nick Sands, and Pickard/Apperson left off. I've reproduced these pages before in the Chemistry & Pharmacology forum. I don't want any feedback from anyone who is considering this, but I'd like to spread the knowledge around anyway. It's the consequences of being discovered that I wouldn't want for myself or anyone else, which were and are being suffered by those martyrs named above. The danger of LSD lies not in the rare freak-out, but rather, to the values that drive a consumerist and capitalistic culture and economy. But I quote Du Pont's former motto until the Psychedelic 60s: "Better Living Through Chemistry." :wink:







--------------------
γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself


Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1

Shop: PhytoExtractum Kratom Powder for Sale   Kraken Kratom Kratom Capsules for Sale   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Bridgetown Botanicals CBD Concentrates


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* Nice movies and books on psychedelics and related research
( 1 2 all )
redtailedhawk 3,392 24 04/06/07 09:51 AM
by Icelander
* Psychotherapy dblaney 1,840 19 05/26/06 05:01 PM
by Icelander
* Psychology question regarding Dr. Stanislav Grof OMniversal 1,736 9 02/27/07 02:02 PM
by redtailedhawk
* Rebirthing experiences on psychedelics FreakQlibrium 2,458 10 06/11/02 03:32 PM
by FreakQlibrium
* Maurice Merleau-Ponty, phenomenology Malachi 847 4 12/17/03 10:24 AM
by fireworks_god
* Review of the last century's phenomenology
( 1 2 3 4 all )
Swami 4,723 68 11/21/02 11:42 PM
by Jellric
* Quintessential psychedelic literature
( 1 2 all )
skaMariaPastora 2,981 25 10/22/08 10:35 AM
by Icelander
* Ram Dass on Sacramental Psychedelics Anonymous 1,896 16 12/20/03 04:42 PM
by Anonymous

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: Middleman, DividedQuantum
878 topic views. 2 members, 5 guests and 4 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.027 seconds spending 0.007 seconds on 14 queries.