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OfflineSandoz
Ridin that wave


Registered: 08/18/08
Posts: 550
Last seen: 1 year, 9 months
States Wrestle With How to Label Pot
    #18732004 - 08/20/13 12:19 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)


Derek Houston, an employee of Cannatest in Bainbridge Island, Wash., took microscopic photos of cannabis plants.



Under Colorado's new recreational-marijuana law, all retail pot products—from joints to laced brownies—will have to be labeled according to their potency starting next January.

But pot growers are running into a hurdle: There are no state or industry standards to test marijuana for tetrahydrocannabinol, or THC, the substance mainly responsible for its high-inducing properties.

The labels are intended to inform consumers on the nature of the product they are buying, not unlike alcohol-content labels on beer or wine. But current test results are haphazard, owners of medical-marijuana dispensaries complain, with the same marijuana receiving different marks depending on where it was analyzed.

Laboratory owners acknowledge results vary due to differing methodologies and advise growers not to compare ratings from different labs.

"The standard margin of error is like 25%," said Evan Anderson, who has used several labs to test the medical marijuana he sells at his Boulder, Colo., dispensary, 14er Holistics. "That's unacceptable in any kind of scientific setting."

The uncertain testing standards underscore the challenge facing Colorado as well as Washington, where voters also approved recreational marijuana for anyone 21 and over last year, as state officials race to develop regulations to police a complicated new legal pot industry that is the first of its kind in the U.S. The states are operating under a legal cloud because the measures flout federal law prohibiting sale and possession of the substance.

For now, all state officials have to go on are the existing laws and standards that govern medical marijuana, which is legal in 20 states including Colorado and Washington, as well as in the District of Columbia.

But officials in both states have to develop frameworks before recreational-pot entrepreneurs can begin applying for the necessary licenses this fall and begin selling to customers in January.

A spokeswoman for the Colorado Department of Revenue said officials are still crafting testing rules. Beginning Tuesday, the agency will be holding public hearings to discuss specific proposals that include everything from lab-technician qualifications to how to dispose of tested samples.

Uwe Christians, who serves on a government-assembled working group on testing regulations, said cannabis labs should produce accurate results if the proposed rules are adopted.

It can take six to nine months to set up a reliable lab, according to Mr. Christians, who runs a drug-testing lab at the University of Colorado, Denver.

"Writing good standard operating procedures is very, very time-consuming," he said.

The Washington State Liquor Control Board, which regulates marijuana, was scheduled last week to adopt rules for the recreational-marijuana industry, including how labs should be run, but pushed back its timeline to October to incorporate public input.

Brian Smith, a spokesman for the agency, said the rule-making process shouldn't delay labs from setting up. "Our requirements are basic, which most any lab should already be following," he said.

Sorting out testing is particularly difficult because there is little academic or commercial research, given that marijuana remains illegal under federal law. Even labs with government permission to study cannabis are forbidden to work with samples from states that have legalized pot such as Colorado and Washington, said Mahmoud ElSohly, who runs one such outfit at the University of Mississippi.

So, commercial pot labs have cobbled together their own system based on techniques and methods developed by Mr. ElSohly's lab and others to chemically analyze marijuana seized by law enforcement, or to test other herbs such as St. John's wort or chamomile. Testing a sample usually runs at about $50.

"Every lab at this point has a 'six months in the garage' story," said Ian Barringer, owner of Rm3 Labs in Boulder, Colo., referring to months of effort spent refining methods. Mr. Barringer, who warns clients via his website that results aren't comparable with those of other labs, said the only way to standardize testing is to do more of it, which won't happen until labeling requirements kick in.

Klaas Hesselink, owner of Cannatest on Washington's Bainbridge Island, got into the testing industry because as a chef, he was having trouble baking consistent marijuana-infused brownies for medicinal use.

He said he is now happy with testing protocol he found in his native Netherlands after coming up empty-handed in his U.S. search. But he added that to ensure industrywide accuracy, cannabis labs need third-party supervision.

Colorado and Washington will require lab certification.

"It's the wild world of testing," Mr. Hesselink said. "Without oversight, who's going to do everything the right way?"

The American Herbal Pharmacopoeia, a Scotts Valley, Calif., nonprofit that creates guidelines for herbal testing for products used in dietary supplements and teas, is working on a set of standards for cannabis cited as a reference in Washington's proposed rules. Roy Upton, the group's executive director, said he hoped it could help laboratory results become comparable.

Mr. Anderson, the Boulder dispensary owner, said he would do the required testing, but is also sticking with the only method that has rendered accurate results so far: Smoking his pot himself.

"The personal tests are far more valuable in selling the product than anything that we've gotten from the lab," he said.

Write to Ana Campoy at ana.campoy@wsj.com

A version of this article appeared August 20, 2013, on page A6 in the U.S. edition of The Wall Street Journal, with the headline: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323971204578629941694599774.html?mod=e2fb


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OfflineLuSiD enthusiast
Stranger

Registered: 03/14/13
Posts: 4,325
Last seen: 4 years, 9 months
Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: Sandoz]
    #18732356 - 08/20/13 01:35 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Just mail you're samples to me, i'll give you all the details you need. :awehigh:

On a more serious note this is why i never take a strains name seriously. I mean if you buy from the same grower yeah x always equals x, but when twenty growers bring sour diesel even to the same dispensary, how the fuck is the dispensary supposed to even know whether it is or some jackass just wants to make more money calling trainwreck sour diesel. (Or is that backwards?)

Point is dro or regs dealer thats pretty fucking easy to distinguish, if i pay 20 a gram it better get me high as balls, and quit trying to throw pretty names on an already beautiful thing.


--------------------
I'm addicted to coke, weed, booze, ludes and speed.
Not LSD, you can't get addicted to LSD, it was built by scientists.

I ain't got no demons that gonna get woke.


In erowid we trust.

Just take your damn pills and don't ask any questions, you'll be fine.


Edited by LuSiD enthusiast (08/20/13 01:41 PM)


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OfflinePsilosopherr
A psilly goose
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Registered: 02/15/12
Posts: 12,278
Last seen: 1 month, 10 days
Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: LuSiD enthusiast]
    #18732559 - 08/20/13 02:18 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

How is it that hard to have a good chemical process to test how much of one chemical there is in plant matter?


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Invisiblewhitelights
Stranger
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Registered: 11/25/11
Posts: 1,559
Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: Psilosopherr]
    #18733689 - 08/20/13 06:58 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

say you have a pound or two of pot in a bag and you take 3 nuggets out of it and send them too three different labs. who says that each nugget you took is from the same plant. although its the same "batch" it probably is many different plants of the same strain in one bag. I would even bet money to say there is a difference of THC content by 25% in different buds on the same plant.:rolleyes:


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its that bitter-sweet-sour, electric-smooth-twang. everything you ever have, are. or will feel along with every emotion, joy, hate, love, fear or aspiration burning down your nerves and into the fabric of your place in this existence at ten thousand degrees above and below zero will you find yourself wondering if you've been dead or alive this whole time. being born over and over only to die over and over hoping the wheel stops in the same place it started when you spun it, and when it finally does and you can step back and take a nice deep breath you realize how beautiful life is, remember, wake up to the most beautiful day of your life every single day, its just the way.


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OfflineAbsent Minded
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Registered: 04/13/12
Posts: 3,300
Loc: Way Down South Flag
Last seen: 8 years, 9 months
Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: whitelights]
    #18733792 - 08/20/13 07:19 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

So I guess all the dispensaries labeling their buds certain percentages per each different strain is largely flawed then. Oh well, guess we'll have to rely on the tried and true method, until they figure something more accurate out: how it looks and smokes:bigjoint:


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sheekle: fuck peace love and unity
sheekle: death despair and misery
sheekle: is where it's at


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OfflineSeriously_trippin
Cosmic Guru Ganesh
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Registered: 07/12/13
Posts: 14,471
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Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: Sandoz]
    #18733816 - 08/20/13 07:22 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Why don't they just put a warning label saying what chemicals are known to be in cannabis something like "HAZARD the following chemicals are known to be present in cannabis"


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R.I.P
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Modest Mouse
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ShLong
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split_by_nine
& Big Worm Forever
Etched in the sands of time in the shroomery and ever so beloved and deeply missed by many :heart:


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OfflineAbsent Minded
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Registered: 04/13/12
Posts: 3,300
Loc: Way Down South Flag
Last seen: 8 years, 9 months
Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: Seriously_trippin]
    #18733913 - 08/20/13 07:42 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

My understanding of the article was that they were trying to devise a method to accurately determine the amount of cannabinoids in the buds, be it THC, CBD, etc. But I read it quickly so I might not have grasped the full thing.


--------------------


Beats
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sheekle: fuck peace love and unity
sheekle: death despair and misery
sheekle: is where it's at


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OfflineChuckfinely
another round for me an my buddy

Registered: 06/27/13
Posts: 628
Last seen: 4 years, 3 months
Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: Absent Minded]
    #18734197 - 08/20/13 08:38 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Testing pot isnt really something you can do

there are 100s of canabanoids responsible for the effect of smoking pot, and probably more that we haven't found yet. so we need to measure more then just thc.

Top buds will always be a little better the bottom buds, especially if the bottoms had less light, which is usually the case. This means each plants will have multiple grades depending on where the bud is on the plant.

Strains really mean nothing. You could plant 100 white widow seeds and get 100 diff pheno types. Each plant with diff growth characteristics, potency, yield, etc. you couldn't mark one white widow the same as the next, you would pretty much have to map out the exact genetic sequence of each plant

The only way to label how strong say 1g of some bud vs 1g of the next bud would be to label strain name, exact genetic sequence of the plant, number of days flowered before harvest, day by day nutrient and watering schedule, position of bud on the plant, drying and curing process spelled out, thc %, cdb %, all other canabanoid %



point is its really hard to say what pot is stronger other then the diff between kush and reggie. its like food. no one person can say this 5 star restaurant is better then the next, but they can say its better then fast food


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Invisiblewhitelights
Stranger
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Registered: 11/25/11
Posts: 1,559
Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: Chuckfinely]
    #18734407 - 08/20/13 09:16 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

see. chuckfinely gets it.


--------------------
its that bitter-sweet-sour, electric-smooth-twang. everything you ever have, are. or will feel along with every emotion, joy, hate, love, fear or aspiration burning down your nerves and into the fabric of your place in this existence at ten thousand degrees above and below zero will you find yourself wondering if you've been dead or alive this whole time. being born over and over only to die over and over hoping the wheel stops in the same place it started when you spun it, and when it finally does and you can step back and take a nice deep breath you realize how beautiful life is, remember, wake up to the most beautiful day of your life every single day, its just the way.


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Offlinesearching
Male User Gallery


Registered: 06/08/11
Posts: 4,128
Last seen: 5 months, 4 days
Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: whitelights]
    #18734451 - 08/20/13 09:27 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

There is just no testing specification yet.  They will just make a standard testing method that all labs use.  I doubt that 25% variability is common.


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Offlinemeatables
Psychonaut
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Registered: 08/13/13
Posts: 82
Loc: Innerspace
Last seen: 5 years, 7 days
Re: States Wrestle With How to Label Pot [Re: Chuckfinely]
    #18739442 - 08/21/13 07:58 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Chuckfinely said:
Testing pot isnt really something you can do

there are 100s of canabanoids responsible for the effect of smoking pot, and probably more that we haven't found yet. so we need to measure more then just thc.

Top buds will always be a little better the bottom buds, especially if the bottoms had less light, which is usually the case. This means each plants will have multiple grades depending on where the bud is on the plant.

Strains really mean nothing. You could plant 100 white widow seeds and get 100 diff pheno types. Each plant with diff growth characteristics, potency, yield, etc. you couldn't mark one white widow the same as the next, you would pretty much have to map out the exact genetic sequence of each plant

The only way to label how strong say 1g of some bud vs 1g of the next bud would be to label strain name, exact genetic sequence of the plant, number of days flowered before harvest, day by day nutrient and watering schedule, position of bud on the plant, drying and curing process spelled out, thc %, cdb %, all other canabanoid %



point is its really hard to say what pot is stronger other then the diff between kush and reggie. its like food. no one person can say this 5 star restaurant is better then the next, but they can say its better then fast food




I agree as well though cloning I'm sure will yeild a smaller degree of variation between the plants though it is still not perfect


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Just because you're paranoid, don't mean they're not after you!


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