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OfflineLed Zeppelin
Tripper


Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 3,962
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: st1llnox]
    #18725172 - 08/18/13 10:26 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

st1llnox said:
Quote:

LoveYourLife said:
I think Suboxone would be a more suitable first line of treatment than jumping straight into Ibogaine treatment.

Ibogaine is really for people who are SEVERE addicts.

She could detox using Suboxone/Subutex with minimal withdrawal symptoms.





Don't let a doctor rush her though. This can be EXTRAORDINARILY discouraging to opiod-dependent brothers and sisters. I've seen people crying and shaking in rehab after they stepped down a dose on their taper because they were given yet another taste--a warning, if you will--of what withdrawal has in store for them.

Quote:

LoveYourLife said:
^ This.  But quite honestly since she isn't a junkie, she could probably do it in an outpatient setting with Suboxone. Get a script for a week or two, take it, be finished.
Simple as that really.
No need to put her though a hellish trip that is potentially lethal.




What I was warning you about ties directly into what the quality shroomerite with good intentions above me is saying. Fentanyl IS NOT A FUCKIN GAME and she needs to be on suboxone for at least 6 months.

Find a doctor that will take it slow and go with her pace, not one who's going to rush her like a junkie off of the high.





:kingcrankey:

You fucking piss me off I dont even know where to start with you.

she needs to be on suboxone for atleast six months!?!? do you know anything? suboxone withdrawals are a hell of alot worse than fucking fentanyl. fentanyl is not a fucking game because its so easy to OD, not because of w/ds.


Edited by Led Zeppelin (08/18/13 10:30 PM)


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OfflineLoveYourLife
MDMA


Registered: 08/05/09
Posts: 2,076
Loc: Cincinnati
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: st1llnox]
    #18725186 - 08/18/13 10:29 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

st1llnox said:
Quote:

LoveYourLife said:
I think Suboxone would be a more suitable first line of treatment than jumping straight into Ibogaine treatment.

Ibogaine is really for people who are SEVERE addicts.

She could detox using Suboxone/Subutex with minimal withdrawal symptoms.





Don't let a doctor rush her though. This can be EXTRAORDINARILY discouraging to opiod-dependent brothers and sisters. I've seen people crying and shaking in rehab after they stepped down a dose on their taper because they were given yet another taste--a warning, if you will--of what withdrawal has in store for them.

Quote:

LoveYourLife said:
^ This.  But quite honestly since she isn't a junkie, she could probably do it in an outpatient setting with Suboxone. Get a script for a week or two, take it, be finished.
Simple as that really.
No need to put her though a hellish trip that is potentially lethal.




What I was warning you about ties directly into what the quality shroomerite with good intentions above me is saying. Fentanyl IS NOT A FUCKIN GAME and she needs to be on suboxone for at least 6 months.

Find a doctor that will take it slow and go with her pace, not one who's going to rush her like a junkie off of the high.




Yeah Fetanyl is definitely not a fun one to come off of. A longer period on Subs definitely might be necessary, but then you're looking at having to taper off Bupe which isn't fun either. I've went through withdrawal on it, it's not fun, but a lot easier than fucking Fetanyl.


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OfflineLoveYourLife
MDMA


Registered: 08/05/09
Posts: 2,076
Loc: Cincinnati
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: LoveYourLife]
    #18725195 - 08/18/13 10:31 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

With Fetanyl versus. Suboxone withdrawl you're looking at Fetanyl being a more intense withdrawal and suboxone being a more prolonged one.

It's really up to how well you handle it to choose which would be better :shrug:


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OfflineLed Zeppelin
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Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 3,962
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: LoveYourLife]
    #18725204 - 08/18/13 10:32 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

If I was her I would start tapering off but not a long slow pussy taper just get the dose lower and lower for just a few days and then take suboxone for a just a few days.


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Invisiblemillzy
Male

Registered: 05/12/10
Posts: 12,404
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: HeyImShroomy]
    #18725211 - 08/18/13 10:34 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

HeyImShroomy said:
I've done a shit ton of research on it. Only 7% of opiate addicts relapse after their first experience. So far I'm thinking I will have to take her to a clinic in mexico, but I'd like to find a way to bring it here.

I am an experienced user of many types of psychedelics, and would more than likely try a dose before she did, just to know the experience. I also want to warm her up to mushrooms, to help her get an understand of what she will have to experience. Iboga trips usually last anywhere from 12 hours to upwards of 24.

But at this point, it's about the only option we have. She is very open to the idea. She isn't even cutting back on her pain medications right now, and she still goes through withdraws. Her tiny frame is overloaded with opiates, and has hit its peak. It can no longer help her, and is only hurting her.

I really appreciate the responses guys... anything will do at this point to help relieve some of my tension and emotional pain over this situation.




i don't have any personal experience with ibogaine, but i would strongly advise against attempting anything on your own. ibogaine is not to be trifled with and has killed a few people including someone during a study in '93 (they were secretly using opiates if i recall correctly). your sister might even be contraindicated for the treatment from having a heart related condition. in any case it isn't a risk you should be taking on your own. i urge you to speak with a professional to see what your options are before doing anything. i would surmise that clinics and doctors who emply ibogaine treatment would be fairly easy to locate on the internet.

i hope your sister gets the help that she needs.


--------------------
I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger


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Offlinest1llnox
dx'd PTSD/ADHD--please don't ask
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Registered: 11/27/12
Posts: 7,312
Loc: 913 KANSAS CITY 816 Flag
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Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: millzy] * 1
    #18725229 - 08/18/13 10:37 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

millzy said:
Quote:

HeyImShroomy said:
I've done a shit ton of research on it. Only 7% of opiate addicts relapse after their first experience. So far I'm thinking I will have to take her to a clinic in mexico, but I'd like to find a way to bring it here.

I am an experienced user of many types of psychedelics, and would more than likely try a dose before she did, just to know the experience. I also want to warm her up to mushrooms, to help her get an understand of what she will have to experience. Iboga trips usually last anywhere from 12 hours to upwards of 24.

But at this point, it's about the only option we have. She is very open to the idea. She isn't even cutting back on her pain medications right now, and she still goes through withdraws. Her tiny frame is overloaded with opiates, and has hit its peak. It can no longer help her, and is only hurting her.

I really appreciate the responses guys... anything will do at this point to help relieve some of my tension and emotional pain over this situation.




i don't have any personal experience with ibogaine, but i would strongly advise against attempting anything on your own. ibogaine is not to be trifled with and has killed a few people including someone during a study in '93 (they were secretly using opiates if i recall correctly). your sister might even be contraindicated for the treatment from having a heart related condition. in any case it isn't a risk you should be taking on your own. i urge you to speak with a professional to see what your options are before doing anything. i would surmise that clinics and doctors who emply ibogaine treatment would be fairly easy to locate on the internet.

i hope your sister gets the help that she needs.




Sister being contraindicated... I would take this VERY seriously. A big buzzword around ibogaine dangers from what I've read is Cardiac, cardiac, cardiac.

I haven't bought weed in ages. The next time I do, next toke is for your sister. Vibes all you guys way. :heart:

She will get through this and you will only admire your sister more when this is all said and done. Please keep us posted, brother.


--------------------
Back, bitches.
st1lln0x: so i'm on weed, temazepam, adderall, dexedrine, dxm, dph, alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, tryptophan, GABA, and kratom
Cavemen_savemen: st1lln0x, do you feel like a robot yet?
st1lln0x: I feel like a fucking Gundam
Click to friend me on Steam for Counter-Strike
:crankey: IS LIFE SKULLFUCKING YOU!? HAVE SOME FREE MORALE! :awesomenod:
Click if you want to feel you alone can do it! Click if you want to feel confident and beastly! Click if you want courage to let go and move on! And click the message if you need someone to talk to -- I'll understand, even if we "hate" each other on here :hug: :sun:


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OfflineLed Zeppelin
Tripper


Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 3,962
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: millzy]
    #18725239 - 08/18/13 10:39 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

but really OP, lets be practical. since she is not trying to get high we dont have to worry about relapse (I mean dont get me wrong, its very possible but my gut tells me no). all she has to do is get through the withdrawals. send her to detox or lock her in a room for 5 days. problem solved. im serious, ask her if she is willing to have you force her to stay in her room for 5 days. Im actually looking for a friend to do the same thing to me right now because I cant get into detox.


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Invisiblemillzy
Male

Registered: 05/12/10
Posts: 12,404
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: Led Zeppelin]
    #18725361 - 08/18/13 11:13 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

i wrote a paper on the drug war the other semester and used this website as one of my sources on the subject of ibogaine.

http://www.ibogaine.co.uk/

i can't access it right now, but it might just be temporarily down. it's run by the guys who basically brought iboga to the west. i am fairly certain that there are ways to contact them through there.


--------------------
I'm up to my ears in unwritten words. - J.D. Salinger


Edited by millzy (08/18/13 11:18 PM)


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OfflineZippyHippyinWA
Stranger and Stranger
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Registered: 04/14/13
Posts: 493
Loc: Tucson
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: millzy]
    #18725480 - 08/18/13 11:52 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Hey brother, sorry to hear about your predicament. If you did your research then you know that ANY heart condition is contraindicated with ibogaine therapy and no reputable provider will probably touch her. But, not my business. That being said, here is a link to providers worldwide(including USA, complete with contacts).  http://www.myeboga.org/providers.html Hope this helps you both.
Peace to you both and good luck.

Zippy


--------------------
“If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on.”
― Terence McKenna


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Offlinest1llnox
dx'd PTSD/ADHD--please don't ask
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Registered: 11/27/12
Posts: 7,312
Loc: 913 KANSAS CITY 816 Flag
Last seen: 5 years, 1 month
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: ZippyHippyinWA]
    #18725511 - 08/19/13 12:00 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

ZippyHippyinWA said:
Hey brother, sorry to hear about your predicament. If you did your research then you know that ANY heart condition is contraindicated with ibogaine therapy and no reputable provider will probably touch her. But, not my business. That being said, here is a link to providers worldwide(including USA, complete with contacts).  http://www.myeboga.org/providers.html Hope this helps you both.
Peace to you both and good luck.

Zippy




You can't do it. Here's all the places you can do it.


--------------------
Back, bitches.
st1lln0x: so i'm on weed, temazepam, adderall, dexedrine, dxm, dph, alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, tryptophan, GABA, and kratom
Cavemen_savemen: st1lln0x, do you feel like a robot yet?
st1lln0x: I feel like a fucking Gundam
Click to friend me on Steam for Counter-Strike
:crankey: IS LIFE SKULLFUCKING YOU!? HAVE SOME FREE MORALE! :awesomenod:
Click if you want to feel you alone can do it! Click if you want to feel confident and beastly! Click if you want courage to let go and move on! And click the message if you need someone to talk to -- I'll understand, even if we "hate" each other on here :hug: :sun:


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OfflineZippyHippyinWA
Stranger and Stranger
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Registered: 04/14/13
Posts: 493
Loc: Tucson
Last seen: 1 month, 21 days
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: st1llnox]
    #18725624 - 08/19/13 12:40 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Not legally no. But not everyone on that list is legal or even reputable. Not for me to judge. Got a bud in NY that got treated in his home off that list. Do I recommend it? No. But once again was just trying to help in some small way. Its also EXTREMELY expensive(I think his family paid like $3000!). Anyway best of luck.

Zippy


--------------------
“If the words 'life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness' don't include the right to experiment with your own consciousness, then the Declaration of Independence isn't worth the hemp it was written on.”
― Terence McKenna


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InvisibleTantrika
Miss Ann Thrope
Female


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Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: HeyImShroomy]
    #18725850 - 08/19/13 02:33 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

HeyImShroomy said:
... So far I'm thinking I will have to take her to a clinic in mexico, but I'd like to find a way to bring it here.

I am an experienced user of many types of psychedelics, and would more than likely try a dose before she did, just to know the experience. I also want to warm her up to mushrooms, to help her get an understand of what she will have to experience. Iboga trips usually last anywhere from 12 hours to upwards of 24.
...




Canada is also home to Ibogaine clinics.

Contact a clinic; explain to them clearly and concretely what your sister's present situation is.

Though I do not think they will treat her, given the dynamics of her health condition, perhaps they can give you further input on alternative options to inquire about.

You clearly care for your sister very deeply.  I cannot advise toying with her health on Ibogaine regardless of how experienced with tripping you are.

Your top priority is her health; if she qualifies at all, it is best to do it with the best resources possible.  If she does not qualify, it is important to comprehend which potential risks disqualify her.


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Offlineteamkiller
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Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: Tantrika]
    #18725881 - 08/19/13 03:06 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

i don't remember the specifics, but iboga works for people because it nukes the shit out of ur brain.  Something about stripping glutamate i don't know i'm not a scientist.

But yeah i've met a couple people who've done iboga.  You feel pretty fucked up (physically weak, nasuea, stuff i can't remember) and weird (spacybrained) for months afterward i've been told.

That 7% relapse figure sounds like total baloney too.


--------------------


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OfflineLoveYourLife
MDMA


Registered: 08/05/09
Posts: 2,076
Loc: Cincinnati
Last seen: 9 years, 6 months
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: teamkiller] * 1
    #18725950 - 08/19/13 04:13 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

teamkiller said:
i don't remember the specifics, but iboga works for people because it nukes the shit out of ur brain.  Something about stripping glutamate i don't know i'm not a scientist.

But yeah i've met a couple people who've done iboga.  You feel pretty fucked up (physically weak, nasuea, stuff i can't remember) and weird (spacybrained) for months afterward i've been told.

That 7% relapse figure sounds like total baloney too.




Yeah I'm pretty sure that ANYTHING that had a success rate of over 90% for treating addiction would be considered basically medical fact and be a wider spread treatment.
I'm not denying that it works, but that number seems wayyyyy too fucking high.
I am not aware of any mental disorder that can be cured with any treatment even close to 90%.
And addiction is incredibly complex with deep rooted issues often being the reason.


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Offlinest1llnox
dx'd PTSD/ADHD--please don't ask
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Registered: 11/27/12
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Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: teamkiller]
    #18727144 - 08/19/13 11:37 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

teamkiller said:
i don't remember the specifics, but iboga works for people because it nukes the shit out of ur brain.  Something about stripping glutamate i don't know i'm not a scientist.

But yeah i've met a couple people who've done iboga.  You feel pretty fucked up (physically weak, nasuea, stuff i can't remember) and weird (spacybrained) for months afterward i've been told.

That 7% relapse figure sounds like total baloney too.




I could see that as a plausible way for it to so broadly circumvent withdrawal... by just completely lifting the mechanism by which you feel stress off your brain.

God I fucking love the glutimate system. I'm fighting the temptation to recommend a DXM trip for the sister here... I'm gonna end up like that guy in Big Fat Greek Wedding who thinks Windex can cure everything :lolsy:


Back on point... again, keep us posted OP. It doesn't look like this is the best thing for your sister unless she's for sure peacing out of this world anyway.


--------------------
Back, bitches.
st1lln0x: so i'm on weed, temazepam, adderall, dexedrine, dxm, dph, alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, tryptophan, GABA, and kratom
Cavemen_savemen: st1lln0x, do you feel like a robot yet?
st1lln0x: I feel like a fucking Gundam
Click to friend me on Steam for Counter-Strike
:crankey: IS LIFE SKULLFUCKING YOU!? HAVE SOME FREE MORALE! :awesomenod:
Click if you want to feel you alone can do it! Click if you want to feel confident and beastly! Click if you want courage to let go and move on! And click the message if you need someone to talk to -- I'll understand, even if we "hate" each other on here :hug: :sun:


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OfflineHeyImShroomy
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Registered: 08/18/12
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Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: st1llnox] * 1
    #18727242 - 08/19/13 12:00 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Once again, I am so thankful for all of your and your opinions on this matter.

After consulting a clinic, we DO NOT BELIEVE it is in her best interest to take the Ibogaine. I was worried that her heart condition might pose a problem, and after speaking with the professional, we came to the conclusion that it would be highly dangerous and irresponsible for us to jump directly into Ibogaine treatment.

As much as she is against the idea, we are more than likely going to go with a suboxone therapy. Her primary physician also recommends this. We have explained to her that it will still be a tough road, but it is one she can walk without endangering herself. With everything she has been through the last 4 years, I know a detox is the last thing that will kill her. She just needs to find the strength within herself to conquer it.

Thank you all so much for your helpful tips, links, and thoughts. I took what everyone said into careful consideration, and I believe that this is the smarter of my choices. Hopefully in the near future, I will be making a post or thread on how the detox went.


--------------------
BrehBrehBreh  :werewolf: :frenchie:


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OfflineLed Zeppelin
Tripper


Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 3,962
Last seen: 3 years, 4 months
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: HeyImShroomy]
    #18728555 - 08/19/13 04:47 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

HeyImShroomy said:
Once again, I am so thankful for all of your and your opinions on this matter.

After consulting a clinic, we DO NOT BELIEVE it is in her best interest to take the Ibogaine. I was worried that her heart condition might pose a problem, and after speaking with the professional, we came to the conclusion that it would be highly dangerous and irresponsible for us to jump directly into Ibogaine treatment.

As much as she is against the idea, we are more than likely going to go with a suboxone therapy. Her primary physician also recommends this. We have explained to her that it will still be a tough road, but it is one she can walk without endangering herself. With everything she has been through the last 4 years, I know a detox is the last thing that will kill her. She just needs to find the strength within herself to conquer it.

Thank you all so much for your helpful tips, links, and thoughts. I took what everyone said into careful consideration, and I believe that this is the smarter of my choices. Hopefully in the near future, I will be making a post or thread on how the detox went.





wait wait wait hold on? shes going to detox and THEN be put on suboxone? thats ridiculous. if she detoxes then she doesn't need any suboxone. that doctor just wants money out of you there is absolutely no reason to  be put on suboxone


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Invisiblepassifloracaerulea
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Registered: 11/13/10
Posts: 10,485
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: LoveYourLife]
    #18729032 - 08/19/13 06:30 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

LoveYourLife said:
Quote:

teamkiller said:
i don't remember the specifics, but iboga works for people because it nukes the shit out of ur brain.  Something about stripping glutamate i don't know i'm not a scientist.

But yeah i've met a couple people who've done iboga.  You feel pretty fucked up (physically weak, nasuea, stuff i can't remember) and weird (spacybrained) for months afterward i've been told.

That 7% relapse figure sounds like total baloney too.




Yeah I'm pretty sure that ANYTHING that had a success rate of over 90% for treating addiction would be considered basically medical fact and be a wider spread treatment.
I'm not denying that it works, but that number seems wayyyyy too fucking high.
I am not aware of any mental disorder that can be cured with any treatment even close to 90%.
And addiction is incredibly complex with deep rooted issues often being the reason.



deep rooted issues for sure. when i'm addicted to opiates for pain, I always continue taking them long after the pain goes away and lie to doctors about the pain to get more and more. they help me release deep rooted emotions about my divorce and kids. i'm aware of this yet I still use them for this reason whenever I get the chance. no other drug does what opiates do for me emotionally, but I feel like I need years of opiate addiction to get over it all. I don't want to take ssri's and become a zombie. etizolam was bad enough. I lost all desire to do any work.


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InvisibleTantrika
Miss Ann Thrope
Female


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Registered: 03/26/12
Posts: 17,138
Loc: Lashed to the pyre
Re: Does anyone have experience with Iboga or Ibogaine? Need help! [Re: HeyImShroomy]
    #18730794 - 08/20/13 02:58 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

HeyImShroomy said:
Once again, I am so thankful for all of your and your opinions on this matter.

After consulting a clinic, we DO NOT BELIEVE it is in her best interest to take the Ibogaine. I was worried that her heart condition might pose a problem, and after speaking with the professional, we came to the conclusion that it would be highly dangerous and irresponsible for us to jump directly into Ibogaine treatment.

As much as she is against the idea, we are more than likely going to go with a suboxone therapy. Her primary physician also recommends this. We have explained to her that it will still be a tough road, but it is one she can walk without endangering herself. With everything she has been through the last 4 years, I know a detox is the last thing that will kill her. She just needs to find the strength within herself to conquer it.

Thank you all so much for your helpful tips, links, and thoughts. I took what everyone said into careful consideration, and I believe that this is the smarter of my choices. Hopefully in the near future, I will be making a post or thread on how the detox went.




I am glad you could investigate the manner in a forward and responsible way, though it is unfortunate that she is unable to take this route.

I wish the best to yourself and your sister and strength for the process. :hug:


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