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Offlines240779
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Book on the psychiatry industry
    #18711280 - 08/15/13 08:31 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)
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Text version is EPUB, a format growing in popularity, specially made for portable devices. Can be opened on a computer using Mobipocket Reader. See attached.

Audio book version: http://depositfiles.com/folders/4BUPJ9Z2I


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Anonymous #1

Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: s240779]
    #18714049 - 08/16/13 10:52 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

A friend let me borrow a copy of that a year back... the gist of it is what most people on this forum have sniffed out already.  Pharmaceuticals are bad, they make mental illness worse, create more long-term issues, only reason it's still around is because it makes people a lot of money.  If you have a mental illness it's better to do your best to ignore it than to get help.

A shitty reality but a good read for skeptics.


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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Anonymous #1] * 2
    #18716178 - 08/16/13 07:54 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous said:
A friend let me borrow a copy of that a year back... the gist of it is what most people on this forum have sniffed out already.  Pharmaceuticals are bad, they make mental illness worse, create more long-term issues, only reason it's still around is because it makes people a lot of money.  If you have a mental illness it's better to do your best to ignore it than to get help.

A shitty reality but a good read for skeptics.




:whippedcreamhead:

That is fucking retarded. You can't just ignore mental illness anymore then you can ignore a physical illness.
Psychiatry isn't great but in my experience most people can't handle the alternative.
If it wasn't for psychiatry there would be a lot more suicides/involuntary committed schizophrenics/homeless people.

You need to get off your soap box and actually think about what you are saying.


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Anonymous #1

Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18716720 - 08/16/13 10:28 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Psilopsychosis said:
:whippedcreamhead:

That is fucking retarded. You can't just ignore mental illness anymore then you can ignore a physical illness.
Psychiatry isn't great but in my experience most people can't handle the alternative.
If it wasn't for psychiatry there would be a lot more suicides/involuntary committed schizophrenics/homeless people.

You need to get off your soap box and actually think about what you are saying.




I didn't say it's possible to ignore a mental illness, I just stated that it's better long-term to do your best to ignore it.  Not because you'll get better, but because when other people find out, it only ends up getting worse, so if you can find ways to cover it up and hide it from people, that's currently the best approach for self-preservation.  I understand the desperation a person needs to have to take psychotropic drugs, but it often only gets worse by letting people try and tinker with your brain chemistry when they admit they don't understand what it is they're playing with.  No point getting into a debate about it, the science to back the fallacies of popular psychiatric belief is there.  We can either look into new means of assisting the sick, or continue using treatments that simply put, don't work most of the time, and often create new problems.

Either way, people have a right to be informed of the good and bad of a health resource, and books like what the OP have provided give solid, unbiased, scientific evidence that contradicts a lot of what the health system currently feeds to people in regards to mental illness and available treatments.  Not in inflammatory manners, but dry, mechanical procedures that produce unnerving results.

You can call it fucking retarded, a soapbox, or a poorly conceived opinion, and that's your call to make.  In a forum that's generally inhabited by people who go against popular opinion and ingest mushrooms for betterment of self and consider themselves free-thinkers, I'm always amused to find a poster who unabashedly shuts down unpopular opinions in the way you attempted to, really just because they're unpopular and disconcerting.


Edited by Anonymous (08/16/13 10:36 PM)


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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #18718581 - 08/17/13 11:46 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Ok well I apologize for calling your stance retarded. That was unnecessary.

I was however not calling you out because it is revolutionary and it hurt my comfortable assumptions about the magic of modern psychiatric medicine. I called you out because I hear this stance all the fucking time and it is my opinion that it is bullshit.

Of course psychiatry is bullshit. I don't need to read a book to make that startling realization. I can just ask my psychiatrist (in a respectful tone of course)  any number of questions and the stench of bullshit will become far too strong to ignore.

Why does psychosis damage some people's cognitive faculties but not others?
Why do some people react to some drugs but not others?
Why does symptom come to the surface on drug X but not drug Y and why does a symptom I've never seen before come up on drug Y?
How can you diagnose someone with a disease with no proof?

The answer to any hard question from any mental health nurse, psychiatrist and psychologist is, of course:

"We do not know. We do not understand much about the brain, son."

It is actually incredibly depressing. I have half a dozen friends with schizophrenia or unspecified psychosis and the trend seems to be to spend about two-weeks to a month on a drug, then switch, repeat, over and over again until they put the kid on clozapine. I don't know if you know much about clozapine but it is one of the most powerful anti-psychotics and it also has some of the worst side-effects. It makes you sleep like 14 hours a day, have gain epic weight and also dicks around terribly with your white blood cell count. So you have to get blood tested every two-weeks to see how your blood is. Isn't that fucked up? Worst part of all is that some people don't even react well to that drug, so they just get doses increased until well I guess you get involuntarily committed to a mental hospital for years I guess.


So I agree with you on that point but my problem with this stance is that it offers absolutely no solutions at all.

Our western culture is so materialistic that it thinks it can find a miracle drug in psychedelics but life doesn't work like that man.

Psychosis is 33% bio-chemical, 33% psychological, 33% spiritual. The remaining 1% I do not understand to be honest but it might be luck. That is my experience with it at least. I imagine that if you are a devout atheist (nothing wrong with that) spirituality would take a much smaller percentage, but that doesn't matter.

That is why these psychiatrists are scratching their heads, completely stumped because they are only treating a small part of the illness. They are not addressing the spiritual or psychological issues behind the psychosis.

To recover from psychosis, one either builds a gigantic fucking wall to keep it from coming back (think Pink, from The Wall) or they tear apart their deeply held beliefs and ego until they find something that is solid enough to be a foundation.  I don't think most people can handle the latter option. People with psychosis are not much different from any other demographic. They are materialistic  not because there is something wrong with them, just that almost everyone nowadays is materialistic. Because of this materialism, all they can do is take the drugs and build a very tall wall.

I used psilocybin mushrooms extensively in high school to deal with depression and bring me closer to God. Along the way I learned to ignore the hallucinations and use the HPPD as a sort of heightened awareness.  As a result, I don't see gremlins or hear voices and I have learned to live with some shitty depression. A lot of my trips had a manic element but one trip was all mania and grandiosity. I later had a flashback that triggered my first manic episode.

I could probably go off my meds and be ok, but I have too  many people keeping tabs on me and our culture has no medicine man, guru, shaman, whatever to talk with to keep one grounded in the spiritual and material realities. If I get a little hypomanic my circle of care shits a gigantic brick and ups my meds or switches them. So I have to be incredibly careful.





So that is why I will stay on abilify for the time being.
:yinyang:


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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18718586 - 08/17/13 11:48 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Sorry for being a dick though.


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Anonymous #1

Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18719027 - 08/17/13 02:01 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Don't worry about it... any time mental illness gets discussed there's a lot of emotion involved.  Everyone knows someone who has a mental illness, or has personally gone through it, and I think we end up taking our frustrations out in debate because what else can we do about it right now?

One thing I remember the book touching on was genuine rehab centers for the mentally ill, before medication was bigger... there were places that were like monasteries, so people who had psychotic breaks went to these beautiful getaways for a month or two where they were treated with respect and dignity, while having a space to learn to cope with their illness, and then released back into society.  Not all of them became high-functioning but the recovery rate as opposed to medication was much higher, with relapse rates being lower.

The problem with that is the time it takes... I think that's why meds are so popular.  You can prescribe it to someone within 30 minutes of meeting them, and then schedule a follow-up meeting in four weeks for a 15 minute catch-up and refill.  Too many people, not enough time.

Also there are ways to measure if someone has the disease or not... apparently MRI's of schizophrenics and the chronically depressed show different brain imaging and in the case of schizophrenia the size of certain parts of the brain are different (schizophrenics' have smaller frontal lobes I think).  As for the chronically depressed people they call it a chemical imbalance, usually citing it as a serotonin imbalance, but there were tests run to measure that as well and they found no difference in serotonin levels between the chronically depressed and people who were deemed "normal" and "happy".  Which makes it seem more like environmental/intellectual causes, rather than obvious physical ones, which means, at least in the majority of cases, depression probably isn't a disease, just how a person has become based on life experience, and the only way to really change that is to give them better life experiences or find a way to let them re-live life so they can maybe have a better one.

Which is why, I think, it's easier to just keep plugging the "chemical imbalance" theory - it may have been proven wrong several times (at least in the case of depression and anxiety), but it's pretty depressing to tell people the reality of it.

This isn't to say that I think it's hopeless for people who are depressed or have anxiety, but I don't think there's a quick fix.  Society preaches that we do have tools to accelerate the process (in mood medication), and people want to believe this because it makes it sound like any rough-patches in life can be more easily overcome.  But, like you (at least if I'm inferring correctly), I don't think that works.  I think people need to take time to build themselves up and overcome it.  Some people are socially anxious because they lack social skills.  Some people are depressed because they can't hold a job, are in a relationship they no longer find fulfilling, or have lost their sense of purpose in life.  Some people can exhibit bi-polar behaviors because they're going through an emotional crisis and the extreme stress makes them temporarily portray themselves as mentally-ill when they really just need time to figure it out and get through their emotional state.  Schizophrenia is an interesting one, because you end up experiencing visual and auditory hallucinations, but I think this too can sometimes be the mind responding to temporary, extreme duress, as opposed to a full-blown disease (which isn't to say it can't be a disease).

If you haven't read the book, I'd suggest reading it, if for nothing else but to have an in-depth, scientific explanation from another viewpoint.


Edited by Anonymous (08/17/13 02:30 PM)


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OfflineXUL
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #18720186 - 08/17/13 07:25 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Anonymous said:
A friend let me borrow a copy of that a year back... the gist of it is what most people on this forum have sniffed out already.  Pharmaceuticals are bad, they make mental illness worse, create more long-term issues, only reason it's still around is because it makes people a lot of money.  If you have a mental illness it's better to do your best to ignore it than to get help.

A shitty reality but a good read for skeptics.




Hah. That statement is a laugh.

When my father was a young man he had panic attacks so badly that he could not even walk into a room of people without suffering. Eventually the doctors prescribed him a low dose of Klonopin(0.5mg) and his entire life changed. He was finally able to communicate with people, avoid panic attacks, and ultimately he worked his way to manage around 70-100 employees for the Department of Environmental Protection and made 90,000 dollars a year. He took the drug his entire life and is still taking it while he currently basks in retirement, a happy old man.


So much for your hypothesis. :shrug:


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: XUL]
    #18721888 - 08/18/13 07:15 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

XUL said:
Quote:

Anonymous said:
A friend let me borrow a copy of that a year back... the gist of it is what most people on this forum have sniffed out already.  Pharmaceuticals are bad, they make mental illness worse, create more long-term issues, only reason it's still around is because it makes people a lot of money.  If you have a mental illness it's better to do your best to ignore it than to get help.

A shitty reality but a good read for skeptics.




Hah. That statement is a laugh.

When my father was a young man he had panic attacks so badly that he could not even walk into a room of people without suffering. Eventually the doctors prescribed him a low dose of Klonopin(0.5mg) and his entire life changed. He was finally able to communicate with people, avoid panic attacks, and ultimately he worked his way to manage around 70-100 employees for the Department of Environmental Protection and made 90,000 dollars a year. He took the drug his entire life and is still taking it while he currently basks in retirement, a happy old man.


So much for your hypothesis. :shrug:




NOTICE something? He had to keep taking the drug. As though his 'anciety' was a biological disease. Where's the proof of that? there isn't any. Someone who driks or tokes or takes heroin could say the same thing. But the ROOTS of why your dad felt that anxiety isn't addressed. he is made rather a life-long patient dependent on a pharma drug prescribed by a shrink to be 'normal'. And what this also does is back-up the myth. What about those who get terrible affects from the drug like this person:


Quote:


“Klonopin ruined my lie. It takes away your drive, and in the morning, you don't want to get out of bed, because you feel so groggy. I don't even know what it's like to feel normal. This is my world. Things don't get me as excited as most people because I'm in a constant state of sedation. It should never have been prescribed for long-term use.”

― Robert Whitaker, Anatomy of an Epidemic: Magic Bullets, Psychiatric Drugs, and the Astonishing Rise of Mental Illness in America




Now please understand, I at least am not saying that people like your dad who chose to take that drug should not be allowed to take it, I am rather saying there MUST be informed consent. Informed consent is the person knowing ALL the information. In your dad's case it would include the reality that anxiety is not a biological disease, and there is no medical science to prove that is the case. I assume you would not be against people knowing this?


Edited by zzripz (08/18/13 07:16 AM)


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #18721900 - 08/18/13 07:22 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

I find your 'critique' of biopsychiatry when you seem to share their belief that MRIscans show that 'depressed' people and 'schizophrenic' people have different sized brains contradictory. But rather look here:

Quote:

More Evidence That Antipsychotics Shrink the Brain: [emphasis mine]
European researchers who reviewed 43 imaging studies of first-episode psychosis found evidence that antipsychotics cause a decrease in gray matter volumes in the brain. Seventy-five percent of the studies of patients who were receiving antipsychotics or had taken the drugs found a decrease in gray matter volumes; only 25% of studies in which most of the patients were drug naive or drug-free “reported such abnormalities.” The abnormalities, the researchers noted, “were significantly more severe in medicated patients.” They observed that antipsychotics may “reduce frontal cerebral blood flow,” and speculated that this “could be a mechanism underlying smaller brain tissue volumes.”




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Offlines240779
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: zzripz]
    #18722160 - 08/18/13 09:50 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)



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Anonymous #1

Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: zzripz]
    #18722248 - 08/18/13 10:23 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
I find your 'critique' of biopsychiatry when you seem to share their belief that MRIscans show that 'depressed' people and 'schizophrenic' people have different sized brains contradictory. But rather look here:

Quote:

More Evidence That Antipsychotics Shrink the Brain: [emphasis mine]
European researchers who reviewed 43 imaging studies of first-episode psychosis found evidence that antipsychotics cause a decrease in gray matter volumes in the brain. Seventy-five percent of the studies of patients who were receiving antipsychotics or had taken the drugs found a decrease in gray matter volumes; only 25% of studies in which most of the patients were drug naive or drug-free “reported such abnormalities.” The abnormalities, the researchers noted, “were significantly more severe in medicated patients.” They observed that antipsychotics may “reduce frontal cerebral blood flow,” and speculated that this “could be a mechanism underlying smaller brain tissue volumes.”






To be honest I didn't completely understand what it is you're trying to say with your opening there - if you were disagreeing or agreeing?  Your post seems to agree in a sense that medication can essentially cause more problems than it helps, especially when it results in negative brain changes...

But for schizophrenia vs normal, here's one example:

http://apt.rcpsych.org/content/11/3/195/F1.expansion.html

Taken from http://apt.rcpsych.org/content/11/3/195.full

This isn't right out of birth, but some years after a person has been suffering from schizophrenia, the brain shows more visual differences.

And for depression: https://www.ohiohealth.com/PageLayouts/Mayo.aspx?id=6986

This isn't to say MRI scans are a means to diagnose (see: http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/18/health/psychology/18imag.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0), but there are visual differences between "healthy" and "mentally ill" brains - it's a matter of further isolating what differences are related to the illness, and then figuring out what we can do about it to more directly address it in a more scientific approach, instead of talking to someone who diagnoses based on words and prescribes doses of medication and hopes for the best.  There's been some recent talk about how mental illness may not necessarily be the direct result of "chemical imbalances" anyway (which is a belief that took hold in the 1950s, has been disproved/proven/disproved/proven enough to make it a shaky theory at best, yet it's continually preached because what else does psychiatry have to sound legitimate right now?), but instead the result of circuits in the brain literally being turned off, and that causing issues.  So instead of boosting power in the brain, perhaps we need to find all the broken circuits and reactivate them (like if a fuse shorts in an electrical circuit - you can pump as much power as you want into it, it won't function properly until the blown fuse is replaced).

If that theory turns out to be true, then it means that we've spent the last 40ish years treating mentally ill patients with methods that have been considered, on the whole, more harmful than helpful.  I have a variety of possible reasoning for this, but this post has already gotten pretty long, so I'll just leave a couple links to add insight to this potential discovery:

http://www.newscientist.com/article/mg21628954.300-target-faulty-brain-circuits-to-treat-mental-illness.html#.UhD843_08mg
http://alert.psychiatricnews.org/2013/06/miswired-brain-circuits-may-lead-to.html


Also, glad that the drug helped your dad... the issue is that success like that is not typical.  Especially with Klonopin, that's a drug that's known to cause severe issues after the very short-term for a lot of people.  Your dad is, well, unlucky to have mental illness, but lucky to take a drug that'd make most people worse, and find real quality-of-life success with it (clinical success is generally sedation and reduced agitation, which often doesn't translate to the ability to hold a career, live independently, and maintain relationships like healthy people).

That isn't standard.  It's actually pretty rare.


Edited by Anonymous (08/18/13 11:13 AM)


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Offlinecircastes
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Anonymous #1] * 1
    #18722512 - 08/18/13 11:37 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Good luck while doing your best to ignore these diseases. Only medication or miracle can help you when you have them.


--------------------
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My shield...
My armour...

TESTED
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FULL
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OfflineXUL
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #18722538 - 08/18/13 11:46 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

But the ROOTS of why your dad felt that anxiety isn't addressed




Sure they were, by a psychologist counselor.

Quote:

I am rather saying there MUST be informed consent. Informed consent is the person knowing ALL the information




And he, according to his own account, was informed. He saw many doctors and many psychologists who explained to him many ideas. And I was counseled when before I ever took Klonopin to battle the exact same issue as my father. I had to go through a process of therapy and counseling.



Quote:

“Klonopin ruined my lie. It takes away your drive, and in the morning, you don't want to get out of bed, because you feel so groggy




This person's account is extremely trivial.

Different drugs effect different people differently. Klonopin does not make me groggy at all. In fact since I have been taking it I have been able to sleep an uninterrupted 8 hours and when I wake up I pop out of bead ready to take on the day. I haven't slept so well since I was 17 years old; 10 years ago. And since I have been able to sleep I have been feeling better in the weight room, probably because my body has been able to actually repair during solid sleep. And since my body and mind now get rest I find that my anxiety is even less and that I don't need to take the medication as often.

Ever since I started the drug/counseling I have been doing things in my life that I never thought I could do. It seems to me that I am following in my father's footsteps.


I think what it comes down to for a person with social anxiety is: are you willing to be addicted temporarily or permanently to a drug in order to fulfill your life goals. I am. The results for my father and I have been profound and life changing.


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InvisibleThe Lizard King
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #18722540 - 08/18/13 11:46 AM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Hey anon1, quit Googling all the info for your responses and then editing them to sound smart.

Also, why are you even posting anonymously?

Is it because you're "ignoring" your mental illness and are afraid of posting without anonymity? :paranoid:


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #18722579 - 08/18/13 12:02 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Can you not see how they are now trying to yet again move the goalposts whilst maintaining the myth we are robots which can become 'defective' and need their 'treatment'?

You admit--rightly--that the 'chemical imbalance' BS is exactly that, bullshit? It was all phony from the beginning yet reams have been written about it by the same scamsters pushing the myth. masquerading as medical science, which they still do.

But NOW they are trying to create a 'new' nyth 'ohhh no not that. NOW it is electrical circuits in the brain'. Can you not see this is the same old crap?

They are looking at at problems of living as biological diseases and thus this absolves them and you and peoples familiesm who scapegoat people with 'mental illnesses', and divide 'them' from the 'norms' looking deeper at the culture they get paid by and operate in?


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Anonymous #1

Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: The Lizard King]
    #18722620 - 08/18/13 12:14 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

XUL said:
Quote:

“Klonopin ruined my lie. It takes away your drive, and in the morning, you don't want to get out of bed, because you feel so groggy




This person's account is extremely trivial.

Different drugs effect different people differently.



If we write off negative experiences as trivial, then should we also write off positive experiences as trivial?

Quote:

The Lizard King said:
Hey anon1, quit Googling all the info for your responses and then editing them to sound smart.



Not Googling for info, I'm googling for the info I've used to form some of my opinions.  If I post information I've gathered without providing some kind of source, then I might as well be saying I'm providing an uninformed opinion, which to me is quite reckless.  It's also worth mentioning that not everything I discuss can be as easily validated as a link to a website, but when I'm able to do this, I like to, just so people can see the source and consider it for themselves.

I edit to add more detail where I feel it needs it and provide easier readability.

Quote:

The Lizard King said:
Also, why are you even posting anonymously?




I prefer posting anonymously when discussing hot topics - people end up associating a name with a point of view and as such, can end up writing off what that person has to say before giving it a chance to be weighed intellectually.

Quote:

The Lizard King said:
Is it because you're "ignoring" your mental illness and are afraid of posting without anonymity? :paranoid:




I'm not sure what you're trying to say here.


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Offlinezzripz
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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: XUL]
    #18722621 - 08/18/13 12:15 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

How do I know the roots of your dad's problems were addressed? In what way? By pushing a lifelong supply of drugs onto him? Where is the evidence anxiety is a biological disease? Understand? I am saying the shrinks who push drugs work withingn the biopsychiatric worldview. they dont DO roots. They too busy pushing drugs which they get a good cut from doing so.

If he was really informed he would know that being anxious is not a biological disease, as blushing isn't. If after being informed of that he yet still chooses to take their psychiatric medication for life then that is his informed choice. That is what I meant.

WHy is that person's account of the terrible effects of that drug 'trivial'? To you that may well be because your not them, but you seem not to have any empathy to even use that term.

I just dont get why you feel you need their pills. And why you think that other people having bad effects from them is trivial? Do you realize other terrible effects people have got from psychiatric medication? Or does this not matter to you. Often people have been forced to take it also. Are you thinking that is fine?

Do you know the roots of why you feel anxious? You are here, your dad isn't to answer my question. What did you psychologist tell you were the roots of your social anxiety?


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Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: Anonymous #1]
    #18722641 - 08/18/13 12:18 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Also, I am curious. Why are you anonymous? Are you a doctor, and do you work in the mental health movement. You seem to me VERY contradictory--on one hand seeming to speak up for victims of biopsychiatry and on the other trying to show 'evidence' their brains are damaged and need treatment.


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Anonymous #1

Re: Book on the psychiatry industry [Re: zzripz]
    #18722645 - 08/18/13 12:19 PM (10 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

zzripz said:
Can you not see how they are now trying to yet again move the goalposts whilst maintaining the myth we are robots which can become 'defective' and need their 'treatment'?

You admit--rightly--that the 'chemical imbalance' BS is exactly that, bullshit? It was all phony from the beginning yet reams have been written about it by the same scamsters pushing the myth. masquerading as medical science, which they still do.

But NOW they are trying to create a 'new' nyth 'ohhh no not that. NOW it is electrical circuits in the brain'. Can you not see this is the same old crap?

They are looking at at problems of living as biological diseases and thus this absolves them and you and peoples familiesm who scapegoat people with 'mental illnesses', and divide 'them' from the 'norms' looking deeper at the culture they get paid by and operate in?




Yes, I can see this, I can understand psychiatry as being nothing but a bullshit medicine trying to make social norms the only form of "healthy" and anything else mental illness.

But

I've also known and encountered people who came across as truly mentally ill, as in they literally seemed to suffer real symptoms as the result of something that could be explained by a crippled mind, in which case, while psychiatry may have a lot of bullshit, I also think it's beneficial to see if they can define "crippled mind" in a truly scientific sense that can actually be measured, and find ways to treat it.  Like a cast to a broken arm, insulin for a diabetic, or radiation therapy for a cancer patient.  Actual results, not the psychotropics that, as another poster said, can affect everyone differently, and as such, creates such wildly varying results that it's laughable to consider it scientific at all.

They could be moving goalposts, or they could be on to something new.  Time to create new treatments, and time for unbiased research to occur, will tell.


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