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OfflineRatatoskr
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Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain
    #18700501 - 08/13/13 05:20 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-23672150

Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain'
By Rebecca Morelle
Science reporter, BBC World Service
13 August 2013 Last updated at 01:04

Near-death survivors have reported seeing bright white lights and having out-of-body experiences
A surge of electrical activity in the brain could be responsible for the vivid experiences described by near-death survivors, scientists report.

A study carried out on dying rats found high levels of brainwaves at the point of the animals' demise.

US researchers said that in humans this could give rise to a heightened state of consciousness.

The research is published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences.

The lead author of the study, Dr Jimo Borjigin, of the University of Michigan, said: "A lot of people thought that the brain after clinical death was inactive or hypoactive, with less activity than the waking state, and we show that is definitely not the case.

"If anything, it is much more active during the dying process than even the waking state."

Consciousness

From bright white lights to out-of-body sensations and feelings of life flashing before their eyes, the experiences reported by people who have come close to death but survived are common the world over.

However, studying this in humans is a challenge, and these visions are little understood.

To find out more, scientists at the University of Michigan monitored nine rats as they were dying.

In the 30-second period after the animal's hearts stopped beating, they measured a sharp increase in high-frequency brainwaves called gamma oscillations.

These pulses are one of the neuronal features that are thought to underpin consciousness in humans, especially when they help to "link" information from different parts of the brain.

In the rats, these electrical pulses were found at even higher levels just after the cardiac arrest than when animals were awake and well.

Dr Borjigin said it was feasible that the same thing would happen in the human brain, and that an elevated level of brain activity and consciousness could give rise to near-death visions.


Neurons in the brain may go into overdrive around the point of death
"This can give us a framework to begin to explain these. The fact they see light perhaps indicates the visual cortex in the brain is highly activated - and we have evidence to suggest this might be the case, because we have seen increased gamma in area of the brain that is right on top of the visual cortex," she said.

"We have seen increased coupling between the lower-frequency waves and the gamma that has been shown to be a feature of visual awareness and visual sensation."

However, she said that to confirm the findings a study would have to be carried out on humans who have experienced clinical death and have been revived.

Commenting on the research, Dr Jason Braithwaite, of the University of Birmingham, said the phenomenon appeared to be the brain's "last hurrah".

"This is a very neat demonstration of an idea that's been around for a long time: that under certain unfamiliar and confusing circumstances - like near-death - the brain becomes overstimulated and hyperexcited," he said.

Striking

"Like 'fire raging through the brain', activity can surge through brain areas involved in conscious experience, furnishing all resultant perceptions with realer-than-real feelings and emotions."

But he added: "One limitation is that we do not know when, in time, the near-death experience really occurs. Perhaps it was before patients had anaesthesia, or at some safe point during an operation long before cardiac arrest.

"However, for those instances where experiences may occur around the time of cardiac arrest - or beyond it - these new findings provide further meat to the bones of the idea that the brain drives these fascinating and striking experiences"

Dr Chris Chambers, of Cardiff University, said: "This is an interesting and well-conducted piece of research. We know precious little about brain activity during death, let alone conscious brain activity. These findings open the door to further studies in humans.

"[But] we should be extremely cautious before drawing any conclusions about human near-death experiences: it is one thing to measure brain activity in rats during cardiac arrest, and quite another to relate that to human experience."



----------------------------------------

I wonder how much gamma oscillation occures in psychadelic states?


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Offlinedokunai
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: Ratatoskr] * 1
    #18700548 - 08/13/13 05:33 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I don't know why, but these types of articles always make me think of the very last words of mycologist Minakata Kumagusu. "I see purple flowers blooming on the ceiling."

Kumagusu was quite a pimp ass mycologist, and at one point even met with and presented a gift of slime mold samples to the emperor of Japan.  Many people probably don't know this, but Emperor Hirohito had an intense fascination with slime molds.

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InvisibleK1ngSp4de
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: dokunai]
    #18700659 - 08/13/13 05:59 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

A. Found DMT in the pineal gland of rat.

B. Rat at time of death has hyperactive brain.

Hmm. We need more research but it seems to be piecing together.


--------------------
                                    PC Repair and Troubleshooting Forum

If a law is unjust, a man is not only right to disobey it, he is obligated to do so.
                                                - Thomas Jefferson

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Offlinefunkerdslr
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: K1ngSp4de]
    #18700864 - 08/13/13 06:40 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

A mental supernova, cool. :mindblown:


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OfflineSpiderbaby
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: Ratatoskr]
    #18700960 - 08/13/13 06:58 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I would love to be able to read the ethical approval application form for this animal study. Interesting though

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OfflineLuSiD enthusiast
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: Spiderbaby]
    #18701097 - 08/13/13 07:24 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Isn't everything we percieve the result of electrical surges in our brain?


--------------------
I'm addicted to coke, weed, booze, ludes and speed.
Not LSD, you can't get addicted to LSD, it was built by scientists.

I ain't got no demons that gonna get woke.


In erowid we trust.

Just take your damn pills and don't ask any questions, you'll be fine.

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InvisibleDoes

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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: LuSiD enthusiast]
    #18701272 - 08/13/13 07:55 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

maybe we could hook us up to a machine that can stimulate the brain into thinking we're experiencing death, then we wouldnt have to smoke dmt ever again

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Offlinedark3st
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: K1ngSp4de]
    #18701323 - 08/13/13 08:06 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

K1ngSp4de said:
A. Found DMT in the pineal gland of rat.

B. Rat at time of death has hyperactive brain.

Hmm. We need more research but it seems to be piecing together.



rats...
Not humans.


--------------------
Back.. I'm going to do it...I'm getting sober from opiates ... I got weed, gabapentin, propranolol, and GHB, I have 100mg tramadol left. I can do this. I can do this.

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Offlinefunkerdslr
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: dark3st]
    #18701450 - 08/13/13 08:29 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

dark3st said:
Quote:

K1ngSp4de said:
A. Found DMT in the pineal gland of rat.

B. Rat at time of death has hyperactive brain.

Hmm. We need more research but it seems to be piecing together.



rats...
Not humans.




The brain of a rat is an accurate analog to a humans brain, as it contains the same structures in roughly the same proportions and connectivity.


--------------------
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<3 Chinacat72 <3

Edited by funkerdslr (08/13/13 08:30 PM)

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Offlinedark3st
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: funkerdslr]
    #18701458 - 08/13/13 08:32 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

A gun is accurate but not dead on. A pool player can be accurate, but not 100% pin point

Its not a human brain so untill proved otherwise its just a theory.


--------------------
Back.. I'm going to do it...I'm getting sober from opiates ... I got weed, gabapentin, propranolol, and GHB, I have 100mg tramadol left. I can do this. I can do this.

OFINTQWGVGAKGCYKBUBX
free dark P. Tampanensis prints to ODD members.

no stamps atm

FREE SEEDS for ODD WCA  members ONLY

I have these seeds:
Orange, red, and yellow sweet peppers, Purple poppies, White Habanero, Yellow Thai, Bolivian rainbow peppers, milk thistle, red chilly pepper, HBWR.

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Offlinefunkerdslr
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: dark3st]
    #18701544 - 08/13/13 08:48 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

dark3st said:
A gun is accurate but not dead on. A pool player can be accurate, but not 100% pin point

Its not a human brain so untill proved otherwise its just a theory.




Lmao, if science worked in absolutes, humanity wouldn't  be where it is today. Before you make outlandish statments, you should educate yourself.

Rat Brain A Closer Analog To Humans Than Previously Thought.


--------------------
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<3 Chinacat72 <3

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Invisibleopenmind
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: K1ngSp4de]
    #18701686 - 08/13/13 09:23 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

K1ngSp4de said:
A. Found DMT in the pineal gland of rat.

B. Rat at time of death has hyperactive brain.

Hmm. We need more research but it seems to be piecing together.






Thing is...Studies with psilocybin show that it actually decreases brain activity, not increase. I know the brain is more complicated than that, but generally findings show a decrease in brain activity with psilocybin. Particularly in areas in the brain that deal with "self awareness".

Huxley, and something I kinda always thought about as well, thought of the brain more as a "reducing valve" or sorts, like a filter. So normal waking consciousness with higher brain activity is actually limiting incoming stimuli, keeping us from being over whelmed...With a psychedelic in there, brain activity is decreased, filters are off, more stimulus is allowed in. Very basically put....




-OM


.


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OfflineManic626
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: openmind]
    #18701699 - 08/13/13 09:26 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

see guys, science just proved there is no afterlife, its all in your head

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Offlinefunkerdslr
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: openmind]
    #18701709 - 08/13/13 09:27 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

openmind said:
Quote:

K1ngSp4de said:
A. Found DMT in the pineal gland of rat.

B. Rat at time of death has hyperactive brain.

Hmm. We need more research but it seems to be piecing together.






Thing is...Studies with psilocybin show that it actually decreases brain activity, not increase. I know the brain is more complicated than that, but generally findings show a decrease in brain activity with psilocybin. Particularly in areas in the brain that deal with "self awareness".

Huxley, and something I kinda always thought about as well, thought of the brain more as a "reducing valve" or sorts, like a filter. So normal waking consciousness with higher brain activity is actually limiting incoming stimuli, keeping us from being over whelmed...With a psychedelic in there, brain activity is decreased, filters are off, more stimulus is allowed in. Very basically put....




-OM


.





I was under the impression that psilocin turned off the regulator neurons that keep your brain working in a systematic way (like opening the flood gates of consciousnesses), everything I've read eludes to more, sporadic brain activity.

Do you have any links to back up the decrease hypothesis?


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Offlinedark3st
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: funkerdslr]
    #18702079 - 08/13/13 10:30 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

funkerdslr said:
Quote:

dark3st said:
A gun is accurate but not dead on. A pool player can be accurate, but not 100% pin point

Its not a human brain so untill proved otherwise its just a theory.




Lmao, if science worked in absolutes, humanity wouldn't  be where it is today. Before you make outlandish statments, you should educate yourself.

Rat Brain A Closer Analog To Humans Than Previously Thought.




Holy hell, that's my point it's still not 100% not 99% not 97% brains also don't mean that we have the same biosynthisis


--------------------
Back.. I'm going to do it...I'm getting sober from opiates ... I got weed, gabapentin, propranolol, and GHB, I have 100mg tramadol left. I can do this. I can do this.

OFINTQWGVGAKGCYKBUBX
free dark P. Tampanensis prints to ODD members.

no stamps atm

FREE SEEDS for ODD WCA  members ONLY

I have these seeds:
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Invisiblegreencrush420
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: funkerdslr]
    #18702121 - 08/13/13 10:38 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

funkerdslr said:

I was under the impression that psilocin turned off the regulator neurons that keep your brain working in a systematic way (like opening the flood gates of consciousnesses), everything I've read eludes to more, sporadic brain activity.

Do you have any links to back up the decrease hypothesis?




From what I understand, it causes a reduction of activity in certain areas of the brain (dealing with things like ego/self-awareness), resulting in increased activities in other parts of the brain and the opening of new neurological pathways. This is due to the fact that the brains normal systematic activity is disrupted, forcing it to adapt and form these new pathways.

Also, DMT is released into the bloodstream of pregnant mothers, by their brain, at around 46 days into the pregnancy. So, there is a correlation between DMT and the beginning of life in humans, and we know there is a correlation between DMT and the end of life in rats, which are a viable model for human brain function. I find this highly fascinating. I wonder if DMT has anything to do with the entrance/exit of our souls from the physical body.

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Invisibleopenmind
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: funkerdslr]
    #18702183 - 08/13/13 10:50 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

funkerdslr said:
Do you have any links to back up the decrease hypothesis?






I read an article in regards to it a while back...



Found this>>>


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22308440

"Psychedelic drugs have a long history of use in healing ceremonies, but despite renewed interest in their therapeutic potential, we continue to know very little about how they work in the brain. Here we used psilocybin, a classic psychedelic found in magic mushrooms, and a task-free functional MRI (fMRI) protocol designed to capture the transition from normal waking consciousness to the psychedelic state. Arterial spin labeling perfusion and blood-oxygen level-dependent (BOLD) fMRI were used to map cerebral blood flow and changes in venous oxygenation before and after intravenous infusions of placebo and psilocybin. Fifteen healthy volunteers were scanned with arterial spin labeling and a separate 15 with BOLD. As predicted, profound changes in consciousness were observed after psilocybin, but surprisingly, only decreases in cerebral blood flow and BOLD signal were seen, and these were maximal in hub regions, such as the thalamus and anterior and posterior cingulate cortex (ACC and PCC). Decreased activity in the ACC/medial prefrontal cortex (mPFC) was a consistent finding and the magnitude of this decrease predicted the intensity of the subjective effects. Based on these results, a seed-based pharmaco-physiological interaction/functional connectivity analysis was performed using a medial prefrontal seed. Psilocybin caused a significant decrease in the positive coupling between the mPFC and PCC. These results strongly imply that the subjective effects of psychedelic drugs are caused by decreased activity and connectivity in the brain's key connector hubs, enabling a state of unconstrained cognition. "


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22308440








-OM

.


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Offlinefunkerdslr
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: openmind]
    #18702218 - 08/13/13 10:56 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

openmind said:
Quote:

funkerdslr said:
Do you have any links to back up the decrease hypothesis?






I read an article in regards to it a while back...



Found this>>>


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22308440

"Psychedelic drugs have a long history of use in healing ceremonies, but despite renewed interest in their therapeutic potential, we continue to know very little about how they work in the brain. Here we used psilocybin, a classic psychedelic found in magic mushrooms, and a task-free functional MRI (fMRI) protocol designed to capture the transition from normal waking consciousness to the psychedelic state. Arterial spin labeling perfusion and blood-oxygen level-dependent (BOLD) fMRI were used to map cerebral blood flow and changes in venous oxygenation before and after intravenous infusions of placebo and psilocybin. Fifteen healthy volunteers were scanned with arterial spin labeling and a separate 15 with BOLD. As predicted, profound changes in consciousness were observed after psilocybin, but surprisingly, only decreases in cerebral blood flow and BOLD signal were seen, and these were maximal in hub regions, such as the thalamus and anterior and posterior cingulate cortex (ACC and PCC). Decreased activity in the ACC/medial prefrontal cortex (mPFC) was a consistent finding and the magnitude of this decrease predicted the intensity of the subjective effects. Based on these results, a seed-based pharmaco-physiological interaction/functional connectivity analysis was performed using a medial prefrontal seed. Psilocybin caused a significant decrease in the positive coupling between the mPFC and PCC. These results strongly imply that the subjective effects of psychedelic drugs are caused by decreased activity and connectivity in the brain's key connector hubs, enabling a state of unconstrained cognition. "


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22308440








-OM

.





Very interesting, thank you so much for finding that.


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Offlinedokunai
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: funkerdslr]
    #18702448 - 08/13/13 11:54 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

funkerdslr said:
Quote:

dark3st said:
Quote:

K1ngSp4de said:
A. Found DMT in the pineal gland of rat.

B. Rat at time of death has hyperactive brain.

Hmm. We need more research but it seems to be piecing together.



rats...
Not humans.




The brain of a rat is an accurate analog to a humans brain, as it contains the same structures in roughly the same proportions and connectivity.




Sir, I must sincerely disagree.  A rat brain, or rat body, is truly no such thing.  Please do read more deeply into the literature.

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Offlinefunkerdslr
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: dokunai]
    #18702618 - 08/14/13 12:42 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

dokunai said:
Quote:

funkerdslr said:
Quote:

dark3st said:
Quote:

K1ngSp4de said:
A. Found DMT in the pineal gland of rat.

B. Rat at time of death has hyperactive brain.

Hmm. We need more research but it seems to be piecing together.



rats...
Not humans.




The brain of a rat is an accurate analog to a humans brain, as it contains the same structures in roughly the same proportions and connectivity.




Sir, I must sincerely disagree.  A rat brain, or rat body, is truly no such thing.  Please do read more deeply into the literature.





I accept your disagreement, I can only say my original statement was based off these links. 



http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19479992

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat#Subjects_for_scientific_research

http://learn.genetics.utah.edu/content/addiction/genetics/neurobiol.html

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2077812/

http://www.npr.org/blogs/health/2013/03/07/173531832/Human-Cells-Invade-Mice-Brains-And-Make-Them-Smarter

http://www.danerwin.com/research/pdf/rat_science_human_brainpower.pdf


  I went about reading up on this because of the thread, and from what i gather, rat brains (like all mammalia brains) are strikingly similar to our own. I think the reason they're primarily used in research though is because they're cheap and easy to maintain.

I have pet rats, so the thought of any of this is kind of a bummer to me.


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OfflineMycjunky
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: dokunai]
    #18703014 - 08/14/13 04:11 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Disagree all you want but much scientific research that has used rats as tests subjects has produced useful drugs to be used on humans. There are a lot of similarities, but no it's not entirely similar.

Using rats in research is common in science so I think you'd be disagreeing with a lot of people by saying research done using rats doesn't provide useful information into understanding our own biology.

Edited by Mycjunky (08/14/13 04:14 AM)

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OfflineKada
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: Mycjunky]
    #18704349 - 08/14/13 12:43 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

God is drugs.


--------------------
~The Cultivators Motherload~

"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them.
I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do." -Robert A. Heinlein

"There is no need for temples, no need for complicated philosophies.
My brain and my heart are my temples; my philosophy is kindness."-Dalai Lama

Live long and prosper.


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InvisibleCidneyIndole
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: greencrush420]
    #18704423 - 08/14/13 01:10 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Manic626 said:
see guys, science just proved there is no afterlife, its all in your head






:facepalm:



Learn to read.


"My mother called me 'her little genius' therefore, it's safe to say I'm smarter than Albert Einstein, therefore, I believe I am actually the inventor of the theory of general relativity"


^^^^  This is the kind of logical leap you just employed.


Don't hurt your head on that analogy.





Quote:

greencrush420 said:
Also, DMT is released into the bloodstream of pregnant mothers, by their brain, at around 46 days into the pregnancy. So, there is a correlation between DMT and the beginning of life in humans,






Can you share with us where you got this information? I was under the impression this was only hypothetical at this point, and there wasn't any proof yet. If you have any info, I'd love to see it.





Quote:

greencrush420 said:
and we know there is a correlation between DMT and the end of life in rats





Do we know this?  I thought it was only shown that DMT was found in the rat pineal, and it was the "DMT is formed in the pineal" theory that had some minor evidence going for it, not the "DMT is released upon death" theory, which I thought was still unproven speculation.

Again, if you have solid info otherwise, I'd love to see it. But as far as I know, it is still hugely unproven that DMT is released upon death, in any species-- and it's still technically unproven that DMT is formed in the pineal. If I'm remembering correctly, the study with the rats does prove that DMT can be found in the pineal of rats-- which is a step in the right direction toward possibly proving Strassman's hypothesis-- but it did not outright prove it.



If you wanted to put some of these ideas to the test-- perhaps give some rats large doses of DMT, record their brain activity, then compare it to the data from this study.


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OfflineHardTrippin
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Re: Near-death experiences are 'electrical surge in dying brain [Re: Manic626]
    #18704432 - 08/14/13 01:14 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Manic626 said:
see guys, science just proved there is no afterlife, its all in your head



Just because near-death experiences can be explained scientifically does not mean there is no afterlife. If you can explain to me how the first spec of matter/energy that started the big bang came to be then I may begin to believe there is no afterlife.

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