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InvisibleSynthe
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Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly".
    #18690854 - 08/11/13 11:13 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I honestly think that the statement saying it PERMANENTLY lowers IQ even after quitting is :bs:.
No study/proof to collaborate this, so I'm assuming it's the docs personal opinion.

Honestly, I think that this article is ironically positive.
It was clearly written n the attempt to make parents fear marijuana around their teens, but the fact that more of them are using vaporizers is an overwhelmingly positive occurrence, given the health benefits.


Quote:

Smoke shops selling everything from colorful bongs and pipes to incense and earrings line an entire block in Manhattan's East Village, a neighborhood popular with teens and the college crowd, and a magnet for young people from all over.

I found the G-Pen, a top-of-the-line vaporizer, for $90. They're used by patients who are prescribed medicinal marijuana so they can have the benefits without harmful smoke or the tell-tale odor. They're also used for aromatherapy.

Because they look like pens or electronic cigarettes and are discreet, they're becoming more popular with teens.

That concerns Dr. Alan Ravitz, the director of Forensic Psychiatry at the Child Mind Institute.

The G-Pen's main website offers a vaporizer kit called The Game / G-Box, which is currently sold out. It's named after the popular rapper The Game, who is currently the star of his own VH-1 reality show. He's in his 30s, but appeals to a younger audience.

Dr. Ravitz said research indicates there is little harm to adults from occasional marijuana use, but for those in their teens and early 20s, it's a different story: marijuana use can lower their IQ, and even if they quit they don't get back those lost IQ points.

The vaporizer pens come in less expensive models, and are in use by those who want to have their marijuana wherever they want, wherever they want, and not have anyone know.

You may think this is all okay, but remember that even though possession of a G-Pen won' t land you behind bars, you could still get in trouble for what you're putting in it if you don't have a prescription.

Read more: http://www.myfoxny.com/story/23078184/vaporizer-marijuana-use-popular-with-teens#ixzz2bgJFhZ7m




Time for me to listen to the game :rockon:


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InvisibleSynthe
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Synthe]
    #18690859 - 08/11/13 11:14 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

:rofl: he makes IQ points sound like a physical entity...


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OfflineWScott
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Synthe]
    #18690948 - 08/11/13 11:37 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

corroborate* :bongload:


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InvisibleSynthe
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: WScott]
    #18690980 - 08/11/13 11:45 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

:grammarnazi: :ohyou:


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Invisiblejellyfish


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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Synthe]
    #18690984 - 08/11/13 11:47 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I hate that rapper cause every time I hear his name I lose the game. God damn.

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InvisibleSynthe
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: jellyfish]
    #18691016 - 08/11/13 11:53 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I think I just lost the game





:datass:


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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Synthe]
    #18691071 - 08/11/13 12:04 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

What do they call it when you lower someone elses IQ?

reproduction

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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Konyap]
    #18691237 - 08/11/13 12:41 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

That concerns Dr. Alan Ravitz, the director of Forensic Psychiatry at the Child Mind Institute.





Sounds like a retarded thing to  say but he is the director of Forensic Psychiatry at the Child Mind Institute. I mean I've definitely met some idiot psychiatrists but I imagine one has to be kinda good at psychiatry to get such a job...
Maybe he is just good at playing politics but maybe there is something to it.
So I am on the fence but definitely leaning hard to one side because the other smells a lot like horseshit.

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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18691247 - 08/11/13 12:43 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I don't see how cigarettes don't do the same.:shrug:

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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Konyap]
    #18691257 - 08/11/13 12:46 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

aiyobro said:
I don't see how cigarettes don't do the same.:shrug:




Why would tobacco do the same thing to the brain as ganja?

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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18691268 - 08/11/13 12:48 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

when you do the combustion , I don't know how but I know it lowers oxygen levels in your brain.

That's why I laugh at people trying to be smart asses in my class.

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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Konyap]
    #18691276 - 08/11/13 12:50 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

aiyobro said:
when you do the combustion , I don't know how but I know it lowers oxygen levels in your brain.

That's why I laugh at people trying to be smart asses in my class.





But there is no combustion when you vape weed.
I don't understand.

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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18691310 - 08/11/13 12:59 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

:foreheadslap:

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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18691313 - 08/11/13 01:00 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

This guy is legit.



Quote:

Alan Ravitz, a leading child and adolescent psychiatrist, is one of the nation’s foremost experts in the diagnostic evaluation and treatment of children and teens with psychiatric disorders. He has extensive experience collaborating with families, helping them to determine when and how medication can safely and effectively be included in a child’s treatment. He has provided psychopharmacological and psychotherapeutic treatment to thousands of children, adolescents, and adults over the past 30 years

A widely respected forensic psychiatrist, Dr. Ravitz also has exceptional expertise working with families and the legal system to help ensure that divorce, custody disputes, and other kinds of family dysfunction don’t interfere with children’s ability to get the mental health care and support they need. As a child-trained forensic psychiatrist, he has conducted hundreds of custody evaluations. Dr. Ravitz’s wealth of experience working with the legal system has provided him with a unique perspective on the varying needs of children from different backgrounds.




source




He might be playing angles and he might be full of shit but I don't think this guy is just some idiot.

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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18691324 - 08/11/13 01:04 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I don't know how weed effects oxygen levels, but they played that odd brain development awhile back and it's linked to developing cases of schizophrenia, not saying schizophrenia is directly caused by weed since it's already like 1/100, but yeah something about sections of tissues in the brain not developing properly, but I think a lack of oxygen to the brain is bad, cause it fucks up your memory at the very least, I know people who smoke cigs put some nasty shit in their body and I don't want to see weed as the scape goat.

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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18691345 - 08/11/13 01:13 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Maybe he is saying that ingested THC lowers IQ permanently if ingested in the formative years. Vaped, smoked, eaten, fucking plugged doesn't matter.

Fuck man I started burning when I was 15.

And ya dude weed causing psychosis isn't all that uncommon.

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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18691358 - 08/11/13 01:18 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Yeah but do you think one person smoking one plant  their whole life and another smoking another plant is going to be the same?

You could just grow them with out as much THC and people wouldn't be getting the problems they do, all this research would be moot.

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Invisible1ve5w4hu


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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Konyap]
    #18691461 - 08/11/13 01:47 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I imagine what happened was in attempt to represent themselves as a fair and balanced news source, the writer got on the phone and called somebody capable of saying something negative about weed in general to counteract the various pro-legalization stories of Colorado and Washington state, and then they decided to apply it to vaporizers only because it's the buzz so it'll attract more readers. I take this as fake news. Otherwise, they'd have linked to the study and really gotten into the nitty gritty of what they did to prove it.


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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Konyap]
    #18691537 - 08/11/13 02:06 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Well they are different chemicals man. THC is a hallucinogen (I think... don't quote me on that) and nicotine is a  stimulant.
A stimulant wouldn't effect the brain in same way.


On the other hand though... excessive ethanol use also permanently damages IQ.

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InvisiblePsilopsychosis
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: 1ve5w4hu]
    #18691563 - 08/11/13 02:12 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

That makes sense. Thats what I thought, just political bullshit.

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OfflineBrakepad
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18691622 - 08/11/13 02:26 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Doubt this is true I want to see the proof that weed lowers teens IQ


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Offlinedextroacidsoul19
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Brakepad]
    #18691917 - 08/11/13 03:35 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

:rofldrunk:


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Offlinewintertime2
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: dextroacidsoul19]
    #18691992 - 08/11/13 03:56 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/803197

The study of kids in Dunedin looks pretty solid, and suggests a permanent drop of 8 IQ points, not to mention the fact that usually IQ goes up over time.

There's a new study objecting to it, discussed here:

http://healthland.time.com/2013/01/15/new-research-questions-marijuanas-impact-in-lowering-iq/

but it's based on computer simulations, which are a pretty poor substitute for a study on real people.

As someone who fits this category, it sucks, but it seems a few of you are resisting the idea just because you don't want it to be true. There is no such thing as "proof" in the scientific world, just varying degrees of substantiation, so if you're waiting for 100% proof of anything, you'll be waiting forever.

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OfflineCamwritesgonzo
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: dextroacidsoul19]
    #18692019 - 08/11/13 04:07 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

The key factor in this equation though is that each individual's brain chemistry is slightly different and what might happen for some might not happen for others. Using any drug at any age always has at least some slight risk to it, but in moderation and under applicable circumstances the risk can be significantly reduced. It's all a matter of trial and error and figuring out what works and doesn't work for you as an individual, as are a vast array things in this world.


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"I've always maintained that reality is for those who can't face drugs."-Tom Waits
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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Synthe]
    #18692189 - 08/11/13 04:59 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Interesting to note that although the article in the OP claims marijuana lowers IQ, Wikipedia lists cannabis as a nootropic smart drug, stating "Cannabis Due to its AChE-inhibiting properties, Cannabis appears to highten acetylcholine levels and therefore studies suggest it as a treatment for Alzheimer's.[40] Anxiolytic and analgesic found in cannabis. Neuroprotectant, possible Alzheimer's prevention and possible neurogenesis inducer.[41] "

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nootropic#Stimulants


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Invisiblejellyfish


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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Moonshoe]
    #18692344 - 08/11/13 05:40 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I don't think any drug use while your brain is still growing is a good idea.

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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: jellyfish]
    #18692353 - 08/11/13 05:44 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

That may well be true. I started smoking at 14 or so and have always been at the very highest levels of academic performance, but maybe I would have been even smarter if I never started smoking pot.
Too late now, in any case!

I still think the science on marijuana and IQ is unclear at best

I would say it is better for teens to be smoking weed than drinking alcohol or smoking cigarettes.

But yes, abstinence would be the safest course for the young.


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Offlinek00laid
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Moonshoe]
    #18692499 - 08/11/13 06:23 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

i think smoking weed should be at least an 18+ thing


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InvisibleStygianKnight
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: k00laid]
    #18692544 - 08/11/13 06:35 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

:ahahaha:
Scare the parents!  Charge them big $ for drug youth consultations.  Profit!

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InvisibleMoonshoe
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: StygianKnight] * 1
    #18692567 - 08/11/13 06:41 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Its also worth noting that IQ tests themselves, and IQ scores, have been so heavily criticized as to be  completely invalidated. In school we watched a documentary on IQ scores and it basically said the whole concept of IQ scores, the way the test them, and the idea that IQ actually measures intelligence have all been shown to be complete  bullshit.

The gist of the documentary was that IQ is almost meaningless. So even if weed does cause a drop in IQ, its hard to say if that actually matters.


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OfflineDr.Tooty
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Moonshoe]
    #18692661 - 08/11/13 07:03 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Moonshoe said:
Its also worth noting that IQ tests themselves, and IQ scores, have been so heavily criticized as to be  completely invalidated. In school we watched a documentary on IQ scores and it basically said the whole concept of IQ scores, the way the test them, and the idea that IQ actually measures intelligence have all been shown to be complete  bullshit.

The gist of the documentary was that IQ is almost meaningless. So even if weed does cause a drop in IQ, its hard to say if that actually matters.




This

Also, and this gets said a lot, Correlation does not imply causation.


Also, I would think that as a forensic psychiatrist this guy would mainly check children to see if they're competent enough to stand trial...


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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Psilopsychosis]
    #18692987 - 08/11/13 08:33 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Psilopsychosis said:
That makes sense. Thats what I thought, just political bullshit.




I actually don't think its political, it seems to me more of an issue with IQ tests. There is simply no way to reliably measure intelligence, so whatever facet they're measuring could well be something which you get worse at after smoking. Does that mean your actual intelligence has lowered? No.

My "IQ" is very high, less than 1% of people have a score as high as mine. But in my personal experience there are many ways which I do not excel mentally. My work is very mental, in some ways I have a clear advantage over my peers and in others a disadvantage just as clear. So I happen to excel in the areas they test in, but they obviously can't test for everything and neglect areas which are my weaknesses. That's why I have a "high" "IQ"

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InvisibleRepertoire89
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Moonshoe]
    #18692998 - 08/11/13 08:36 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Moonshoe said:
Its also worth noting that IQ tests themselves, and IQ scores, have been so heavily criticized as to be  completely invalidated. In school we watched a documentary on IQ scores and it basically said the whole concept of IQ scores, the way the test them, and the idea that IQ actually measures intelligence have all been shown to be complete  bullshit.

The gist of the documentary was that IQ is almost meaningless. So even if weed does cause a drop in IQ, its hard to say if that actually matters.




Agreed on all points

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Offlinemindapparatus
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Repertoire89]
    #18693058 - 08/11/13 08:50 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

The first time I used a vap:

wake n baked at 6 am
packing it like you would a bowl sesh
didn't know, we didn't know
packing multiples with a homie
went full derp
closest to 10/10 I'd been
passed out by 7
woke up at noon
made blueberry pancakes
chillin flying like a rock on the ground

My I.Q. dropped significantly for the short term

:derp:

Long term is speculative and cannot be concluded with confidence

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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: mindapparatus] * 2
    #18694365 - 08/12/13 04:43 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Putting your kid in front of spongebob lowers his IQ

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Offlinewintertime2
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Konyap]
    #18700398 - 08/13/13 04:54 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Whether you agree with IQ scores or not, you can't disagree that they measure something, and whatever they measure is consistent since the tests are the same. Therefore, whatever it is they measure, the evidence suggests you get worse at it, whereas people who don't smoke get better at it. Whether you can call it "intelligence" as a global thing might be up for debate, but they seem to measure reasoning, organizing and spatial negotiating skills.

You guys just seem to dislike the repercussions so you are psychologically resisting what is quite good research.

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OfflineKonyap

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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: wintertime2]
    #18700436 - 08/13/13 05:05 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I still don't think IQ test measure intelligence. There is more to intelligence then a 100 year old test meant to separate the minorities from the whites.

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Offlinewintertime2
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: Konyap]
    #18701769 - 08/13/13 09:41 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

OK, so forget "intelligence". How about "abstract reasoning"? I think that's fair.

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InvisibleStygianKnight
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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: wintertime2]
    #18701854 - 08/13/13 09:55 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

More like stress test.  A real IQ test is done under timed conditions with questions that slowly get more challenging.  It's impossible to finish the booklets so you spend the entire time solving problems.  Multiple areas are tested but it's generally limited to single answer questions and because of the problems with how questions are worded skewing the results many modern tests have dropped or gutted complex language skills.  Creating a test that is heavily logical & mathematical which doesn't show a very good picture of someone's Inteligence.  IQ tests don't test intelligence, they test your ability to take IQ tests.  IMO how you slept and what you've recently eaten probably has a much bigger effect than Marijuana 12 months ago.

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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: StygianKnight]
    #18704427 - 08/14/13 01:11 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Yeah on the documentary I mentioned there was a guy who scored extremely low on his IQ test and was labelled and treated as a "moron" . He went on to be an award winning phd holding nuclear physicist.

IQ doesn't mean shit.


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Re: Vaporizer marijuana use popular with teens, marijuana "lowers teen IQ permanantly". [Re: wintertime2]
    #18718302 - 08/17/13 09:43 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

wintertime2 said:

You guys just seem to dislike the repercussions so you are psychologically resisting what is quite good research.




:curbyourenthusiasm:

I suppose you believe in polygraph tests as well.

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