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dwpineal
Psychedelic Artist



Registered: 07/20/06
Posts: 4,667
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As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits
#18598314 - 07/23/13 04:58 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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http://www.nytimes.com/2013/07/20/us/marijuana-infused-faith-challenges-the-definition-of-religion.html?ref=us&_r=0
As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits
Sixty-four-year old Roger Christie, a resident of Hawaii’s Big Island, although most recently of Cell 104 at the Honolulu Federal Detention Center, is a Religious Science practitioner, a minister of the Universal Life Church, ordained in the Church of the Universe (in Canada), an official of the Oklevueha Native American Church of Hilo, Hawaii, and the founder of the Hawai’i Cannabis THC Ministry.
As you might guess, it was the last of those spiritual vocations that landed him in prison.
In 2010, Mr. Christie, along with several co-defendants, was indicted on charges including conspiracy to manufacture and distribute marijuana. He does not dispute the facts of the case. He just believes that his operation — “a real ‘street ministry’ serving the needs of our neighbors from all walks of life,” he told me in an e-mail from prison, “busy six days a week,” employing “three secretaries and a doorman” — was protected by the First Amendment.
On July 29, Mr. Christie’s lawyer will argue in Hawaii federal court that his client should be allowed to present a religious-freedom defense at the eventual criminal trial. He will base his argument on the Religious Freedom Restoration Act, passed by Congress in 1993, which requires the government to show a “compelling interest” whenever it “substantially burdens” a religious practice. In 2006, the Supreme Court relied on the act to permit a New Mexico church to use the hallucinogen hoasca, or ayahuasca, for sacramental purposes.
But so far such exceptions have been granted to small religious communities and relatively obscure drugs: for American Indians’ use of peyote, for example, or the New Mexico church with its ayahuasca. But marijuana? That would be problematic.
“The difference is that peyote and hoasca have little or no recreational market, and that is not likely to change because they make you sick before they make you high,” Douglas Laycock, who teaches constitutional law at the University of Virginia, wrote in an e-mail in explaining why a court would be unlikely to approve of the church’s practice. “Marijuana has a huge recreational market. Diversion from religious to recreational uses, and false claims of religious use, would be major problems.”
Mr. Christie is hoping that now, as many state marijuana laws are liberalized, federal courts may allow him to argue for the sacramental needs of his ministry, where he worked full time until his arrest. First, he must convince a federal judge that his religion — or one of his religions — is not just a form of personal spirituality concocted to get stoned legally.
According to Mr. Christie’s personal declaration, filed with the court in April, he joined the Religion of Jesus in 1993, was ordained in 2000, then founded as an offshoot the THC Ministry. (THC, tetrahydrocannabinol, is the main psychoactive ingredient in marijuana.) “The THC Ministry,” he wrote, “is a universal religious organization that uses cannabis to exalt consciousness, facilitate harmony and become close to God and nature and each other.”
The Religion of Jesus, Mr. Christie wrote, holds that sacramental marijuana use is “a God-given right, as told to us in the Bible in Genesis 1:29, in which it says, ‘Then God said, I give you every seed-bearing plant’ ” Other tenets of the faith include, “Our religion does not believe in going to war” and, “Our ministers are required to use a hemp-cloth shawl for ceremonies and prayer.”
Mr. Christie’s declaration lacks the somber tone that usually distinguishes “religion.” At his Sunday services, he would “weed out, so to speak,” any visitors who seemed “insincere” about the faith — people without any sense of marijuana’s spiritual purpose. His faith’s “primary sacred day” is April 20, known to Deadheads, readers of Craigslist and High Times subscribers as “4/20,” slang for marijuana.
The Sunday service sounds like a Judd Apatow movie outtake; it requires a “volcano vaporizer” and “large clear inhalation bag.” In addition, “after services,” Mr. Christie wrote, “members would gather to drink hempseed coffee, eat and talk.” Religion, or late-morning munchies?
But the courts have offered no coherent definition of religion. “What constitutes a religion is one of the hardest questions of all, and except in the most obvious cases, the courts tend to avoid it if they can,” according to Professor Laycock. As religion scholars point out, categories like “legitimate” privilege religions that are old and established — those that have buildings, and other trappings of power.
In a telephone interview, the Rev. James D. Kimmel, who in 1969 founded the Religion of Jesus, Mr. Christie’s church, summed up the church’s beliefs as “God is our father and we’re all sons and daughters of God.” That isn’t the language that Mr. Christie uses, but for Mr. Kimmel, who is 78 and not the talk-show host, who lives in Hawaii and talks a lot about an esoteric text called the Urantia Book, such a discrepancy is no problem at all. “It’s a personal religion,” he said. “We’re not institutional.”
The courts will probably be loath to allow Mr. Christie his humorous, personal, idiosyncratic religion. If we could all have our own religions, the courts would have a lot more defendants claiming their religions require drug use. Besides, he may not be the ideal crusader for religious marijuana. According to the government, the THC Ministry offered a “sanctuary kit” that included a cognac-and-cannabis “tincture” — the recommended donation was $1,000.
And in its brief, the government quotes transcriptions of wiretapped conversations in which Mr. Christie sounds like a drug dealer haggling over prices, not a man of God serving his people’s spiritual needs.
Yet Mr. Christie’s case raises difficult, important questions. If only old or popular religions are protected, what would the First Amendment mean? If almost any belief system were a religion, then what would the word mean?
For its well-meaning efforts to carve out religious protections, government got into the business of deciding which religions count — and, to Mr. Christie’s chagrin, which ones do not.
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huffinglue
tryin to stay sober


Registered: 09/26/08
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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: dwpineal]
#18598436 - 07/23/13 06:09 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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He don't have a case imo. People try this all the time. The prosecutors will probably say, "what if a church was based around heroin, or crack, or speed?... slippery slope I tell ya jurrors..."
-------------------- I fucking hate grammer nazis! Yes, I can't spell. Yes, I don't have perfect grammer. I post from my phone and dont give a shit about people whose lifes are so boring they get off on putting people down for not having perfect fucking grammer, even though they know excactly what there saying.. Fuck You. It's just a ride mang...
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lurkmode
Stranger


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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: huffinglue]
#18598519 - 07/23/13 06:43 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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religious science
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Blanc

Registered: 03/11/12
Posts: 258
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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits *DELETED* [Re: huffinglue]
#18598664 - 07/23/13 07:53 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Post deleted by Blanc
Reason for deletion: .
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Morel Guy
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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: Blanc]
#18599551 - 07/23/13 12:20 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Crack doesn't have any human history as a religious sacrement. Nor does heroin, infact not even opium. Opium does have some mystical history, but not much of a religion. Truth is the plants have mostly a mystical history and mysticsm is pretty much illegal. They don't want you to have access to a higher power. They preach that only with Jesus, can you have any experiences....and they seem to be against mysticsm in general......they hate those that preach you can have a divine state of ecstasy, or that your dangerous because you interact with natural forces, spirits of anything.
-------------------- "in sterquiliniis invenitur in stercore invenitur" In filth it will be found in dung it will be found
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laruta_21
twat tickler



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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: Morel Guy]
#18600582 - 07/23/13 04:13 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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I think people who form a religion based around marijuana haven't tried DMT
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dwpineal
Psychedelic Artist



Registered: 07/20/06
Posts: 4,667
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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: laruta_21]
#18600784 - 07/23/13 04:56 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
laruta_21 said: I think people who form a religion based around marijuana haven't tried DMT
There are already religions based around DMT
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treesniper119
No one of Consequence



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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: dwpineal]
#18600999 - 07/23/13 05:36 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Cannabis & Christ go hand in hand Jesus abroke the tradition & annointend his diciples & common folk with an oil concocted with cannabinoids as the main psychoactive/miraculous healing ingredient. brotherhood of christ through the annointing of oil infused with kaneh-bosom.
C'mon earthlings, get with it already!
-------------------- Icelander said: I'd like to fund unlimited abortions. Finally some good coming from my tax dollars. Repetoire89 said: I love abortion and fully condone it - some should make it into a sport. Treesniper119 said: Any one who is willing to start life & also willing to deny life to their form/seed/child/offspring is cursed. For you have severed your own cord to lifes worth. Anyone who condones these actions is cursed as well...
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morrowasted
Worldwide Stepper



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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: treesniper119]
#18601580 - 07/23/13 07:29 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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opium is smoked in pakistani mosques iirc
anyway smoking pot as part of a religious practice is pretty dumb imo. just an excuse to smoke weed. if you seriously believe pot is sacred then youre just like any other religious person
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treesniper119
No one of Consequence



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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: morrowasted]
#18603693 - 07/24/13 08:08 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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I believe in being a vegetalista & fully understanding all plant technology & i have found that sentient plants exist (imo.) Cannabis is one of them & its use is ancient found in multiple mystic writings. There is evidence to suggest that mankinds endocannabinoid system formed & evolved when man began interacting with cannabis. Its a very personal individual experience (your relationship with yourself & your surroundings which are intertwined in such subtle yet powerful ways.) Even more so the paradigm of animal & plant life co-existing with us. you can sterotype it if you want to. It can be a personal sacrament with no organized religion.
-------------------- Icelander said: I'd like to fund unlimited abortions. Finally some good coming from my tax dollars. Repetoire89 said: I love abortion and fully condone it - some should make it into a sport. Treesniper119 said: Any one who is willing to start life & also willing to deny life to their form/seed/child/offspring is cursed. For you have severed your own cord to lifes worth. Anyone who condones these actions is cursed as well...
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Synthe
Gatorade me, bitch!



Registered: 11/10/12
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Loc: Three bags of Funyuns
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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: morrowasted]
#18603952 - 07/24/13 09:44 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
morrowasted said: opium is smoked in pakistani mosques iirc
anyway smoking pot as part of a religious practice is pretty dumb imo. just an excuse to smoke weed. if you seriously believe pot is sacred then youre just like any other religious person
This. Worshiping a drug is rather foolish if you ask me.
Sure, marijuana as a religion may hold more merit than, say, Christianity. In Christianity, a few extremists pop up and let their sick kids die because they think prayers can heal them. In this case, at least weed is something that can actually heal you when you pray to it.
But it's still stupid, just a little bit less stupid than the big 3 of religion.
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greencrush420



Registered: 04/14/13
Posts: 1,014
Loc: U.S.A
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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: dwpineal]
#18604791 - 07/24/13 01:28 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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I'm pretty sure that this isn't a religion worshipping and praying to cannabis. It appears to promote the use of cannabis, which is permitted by the bible, to gain a closer relationship with god, and to foster peaceful and kind Christian behavior. He seems to be saying that members of his church gain an expanded consciousness which allows them to exist in greater harmony with god, mother nature, and their fellow human beings, through the use of cannabis as a religious tool. Never does he say that they pray to the plant. They are Christians. Quote:
“The THC Ministry,” he wrote, “is a universal religious organization that uses cannabis to exalt consciousness, facilitate harmony and become close to God and nature and each other.”
The Religion of Jesus, Mr. Christie wrote, holds that sacramental marijuana use is “a God-given right, as told to us in the Bible in Genesis 1:29, in which it says, ‘Then God said, I give you every seed-bearing plant’ ” Other tenets of the faith include, “Our religion does not believe in going to war” and, “Our ministers are required to use a hemp-cloth shawl for ceremonies and prayer.”
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treesniper119
No one of Consequence



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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: greencrush420]
#18608633 - 07/25/13 08:19 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Exactly. its not plant worship. its roots (pun) dig deep into the history of man's evolving consciousness. some of the most ancient writings from sages & gurus describe cannnabis as being the ultimate tool for finding god consciousess within.
"Mushin" is a state of no mindedness where thought is suppresed while focus & awareness are heightened. cannabis naturaully trains the user into cultivating mushin. its up to the user to practice the technique & instill/incorporate your realizations into daily life...or to abuse the tools.
-------------------- Icelander said: I'd like to fund unlimited abortions. Finally some good coming from my tax dollars. Repetoire89 said: I love abortion and fully condone it - some should make it into a sport. Treesniper119 said: Any one who is willing to start life & also willing to deny life to their form/seed/child/offspring is cursed. For you have severed your own cord to lifes worth. Anyone who condones these actions is cursed as well...
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dokunai
Cactus, Cannabis, Cubensis

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Re: As a Religion, Marijuana-Infused Faith Pushes Commonly Held Limits [Re: treesniper119]
#18609959 - 07/25/13 02:26 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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You guys are missing the point here. Sure, this guy's weed religion is stupid. It's a religion... stupid by default. But, just because someone's beliefs are stupid to everyone else doesn't mean they don't have a right to them. Otherwise all mainstream religions would be banned. This is really no different than the peyote or ayahuasca or salvinorin churches. I don't think it's just an excuse to get high, but even that wouldn't really matter. And do people really need to go to this length to get away with smoking weed?
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