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InvisibleEvilMushroom666
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Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures
    #14797602 - 07/20/11 12:37 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Here are a few pictures of some fruits from a block I over supplemented.
I used hardwood fuel pellets supplemented with to much oat bran(1/2 a cup
per block) and soon realized my errors. These where made when I was first
starting my experiments and before I knew any better. I sterilized them
at 15 PSI for 2 hours and inoculated with shiitake 75 spawn. Since I over
supplemented them I let them colonize, popcorn, brown and then sit for
close to three and a half months before I even thought about birthing
them.

I was hoping the extended period of time in spawn bags before
birthing would allow the mycelium to digest some of the excess
nutrition and allow a somewhat normal first flush. I still noticed
a few mutations along with smaller caps and larger/lengthier stems.
I have since learned my lesson with over supplementation along with
just how finicky Shiitake 75 can be. Either way I just wanted to
share some beautiful pictures of Shiitake with you all:





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Offlinetrout
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: EvilMushroom666]
    #14797858 - 07/20/11 01:33 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

They still look tasty.  I have it get these things going for fall!!!


--------------------
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OfflineNSF
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: trout]
    #14800011 - 07/20/11 08:17 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Over supplemented you say...pfft, hardly, check this out.  Here is some shiitake on grain that i completely forgot about.  I decided to fruit it anyway to see just how bad things went.  Well, they went ugly.

Early stages:


Full grown mutant:


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InvisibleEvilMushroom666
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: NSF]
    #14800227 - 07/20/11 08:56 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Im sure if I would have birthed them at two months they would have looked
the same, here is a few pictures of an over supplemented block that I
did not leave in the bag for 3 and a half months. The over supplementation
was provided by 1L of Shiitake 75 grain spawn for the block below, but
I have a feeling If I had left it for longer before birthing the mutations
would not have been as severe:





Edited by EvilMushroom666 (07/20/11 09:08 PM)


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: EvilMushroom666]
    #14800472 - 07/20/11 09:44 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Here's another 75 block which was over supplemented.  In this case, it was about 1/3 cup of oat bran per block.  Not only are the non-edible stems large and a waste of biomass, but the total B.E. is drastically lower if you over supplement.
RR



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InvisibleJavadog
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #14801078 - 07/20/11 11:55 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Wow.  Interesting.  I knew of this concern, and am happy to hear some numbers.

1/2, and 1/3, are too much.  Wow again...that does not seem like very much.

I finally got some bran to use. 

How much, per block, is recommended?

Thanks for sharing EM!

JD


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Offlinecurry
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: Javadog]
    #14801204 - 07/21/11 12:37 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

If those first pictures you showed were over-supplemented, I'd say you need to over-supplement every time.  Nice job.


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InvisibleEvilMushroom666
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: curry]
    #14802112 - 07/21/11 08:21 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Java: If I remember correctly RR says he uses 2-3 cups of bran per 20 6lb
blocks that he mixes using a cement mixer daily.(Correct me if I am wrong).
He suggested for my next supplemented run that I use 1/2 a cup to make
4 of my 6lb substrate blocks.

Curry: Sadly all the fruits did not look as beautiful as those pictures.

Also note the total harvest weight was 11.7 ounces or almost 3/4ths of
a lb. The actual BE for this block was sitting at roughly 29.25%, worse
then what I get from my pasteurized blocks on the first flush. I am
getting 3/4ths of an ounce min. for my pasteurized blocks, and now
that I have a few more factors dialed in I am getting 16-24 ounces
per pasteurized block more consistently.

With properly supplemented blocks from what I understand you can easily
achieve 100% BE on the first flush, which would work out to around
2.5lbs per block in my case.

Here are some pictures of today's harvest, and some fruits that are
not all that pretty:






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InvisibleJavadog
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: EvilMushroom666]
    #14802137 - 07/21/11 08:32 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

OK. 1/8 cup per 6 lb block.

I will figure out the volume of 6 lbs of sawdust, and I am good to go.

Thanks again bro.  This is good timing.  I have your 75 G2Ged to a set
of quarts that I will be using soon.

Take care,

JD


--------------------
Boyd Rice told my brother that life is a corny pack of freesakes

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InvisibleEvilMushroom666
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: Javadog]
    #14802150 - 07/21/11 08:36 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Javadog said:
OK. 1/8 cup per 6 lb block.

I will figure out the volume of 6 lbs of sawdust, and I am good to go.

Thanks again bro.  This is good timing.  I have your 75 G2Ged to a set
of quarts that I will be using soon.

Take care,

JD




:cheers: and of course :goodluck:


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InvisibleAleon
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: EvilMushroom666]
    #14802309 - 07/21/11 09:35 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Hey evil, do you know the % of bran in the mix by wieght?  I do things by weight for higher accuracy, and i was curious what the weight % would be.  I have been making 24 sup. sawdust blocks of shiitake a week for the past few weeks,  using FP strain, Night velvet, and just started G2G w/ 75. I have been supplementing with %5 (dry weight) bran to my dry sawdust and inoculating with 5-10% (wet weight to dry weight) rye grain spawn.  Hopefully this rate of sup. is satisfactory.  I was thinking about experimenting with stamets style shiitake: 20% bran, high inoc rate, fruit from white block at 35 days (ie. brown out of the bag), etc...  I think it is worth experimenting with different grow styles, what works for 1 may or may not work for another. Also, is this supplementation issue just for shiitake 75 or do most shiitake get mutants from excessive (more than %5 bran) supplementation?


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InvisibleEvilMushroom666
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: Aleon]
    #14802363 - 07/21/11 09:46 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

I honestly could not tell you the weight I use at this time, and seeing
as the density of different types of bran will all be slightly different,
I do not see an accurate way to give you that information.

RR will hopefully chime in on your ratio's , but as far as I
can tell from my speculation that should be fine.

Experimentation is never a bad thing, that is for sure. I have talked
to a few Canadian shiitake growers and every single one has a different
method, style and way of going about things.

So far out of those three strains 75 is VERY VERY VERY finicky with over
supplementation, even as far as adding grain spawn goes. Any more then
200ML of grain spawn in my pasteurized blocks tends to result in mutants.
When spawning to 75 I am very light handed.

As far as the FP and NV go they are not as finicky, will allow a bit
more supplementation before throwing blobs and mutants, BUT past a
certain point they will start throwing mutant fruits, blobs, and perform
poorly. Less is more it seems as far as supplementation goes.

Every strain you play with will have its own unique characteristics as
far as acceptable levels of supplementation, fruit size, smell, texture, etc etc.
Finding out those variables is half the fun;-)


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: EvilMushroom666]
    #14802439 - 07/21/11 10:06 AM (12 years, 7 months ago)

Try 1/8 to 1/4 cup of bran for each large substrate block and then adjust from there based on your experiences at fruiting time.  It's all going to depend on the quality of the sawdust you're using and how much natural sugar is in the wood, based on species and season of harvest.  It's all fluid, and needs to change with the seasons.

Growing shiitake truly is half art and half technique/science.  You have to be able to bend and flex as required, based on the parameters at your exact location.
RR


--------------------
Download Let's Grow Mushrooms



semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat

"I've never had a failed experiment.  I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work."
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #14805193 - 07/21/11 07:57 PM (12 years, 7 months ago)

...added to the log.

Thank you both.

JD


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InvisibleFractalXplora
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: Javadog]
    #18560327 - 07/15/13 02:45 AM (10 years, 7 months ago)

so if im using 1/8 to 1/4 cup bran per 6lb block, how much gypsum should be going in there?

Cant seem to find an answer on a rather large search!

IM guessing its reduced significantly as well, 50 -100g? per bag?

Cheers Frac.


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OfflineOICU812
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: FractalXplora]
    #18560640 - 07/15/13 05:17 AM (10 years, 7 months ago)
Log in to view attachment

Quote:

FractalXplora said:
so if im using 1/8 to 1/4 cup bran per 6lb block, how much gypsum should be going in there?

Cant seem to find an answer on a rather large search!

IM guessing its reduced significantly as well, 50 -100g? per bag?

Cheers Frac.




My moisture calculator spreadsheet might help.  I have attached a copy for you to use.


--------------------
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InvisibleFractalXplora
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Re: Over Supplemented Shiitake 75 Pictures [Re: OICU812]
    #18560788 - 07/15/13 06:37 AM (10 years, 7 months ago)

excellent cheers OICU812, i will have a look at that now, thanks for posting it up :super:


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