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krunkmaster
Cannibal


Registered: 04/26/13
Posts: 117
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: HankMarducas]
#18411619 - 06/12/13 11:41 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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I was actually referring to this part:
Quote:
HankMarducas said: Once it's fully colonized and without consolidation, it's time to prepare the simple coir substrate tek and dumping it into the mono.
if I'm reading that correctly, you actually want to avoid the consolidation when you're using that bulk method, rather than encouraging consolidation as with PF. your explanation makes sense though, I kind of figured from the name consolidation that it was about making it denser, but I didn't realize that identifying the consolidation stage was as simple as waiting till the outside edges were colonized.
fortunately, I (inadvertently) let my PF jars consolidate for a decent amount of time, because the timing worked out that I went on vacation right when I was thinking it was time to birth the cakes. that extra period was actually concerning me a bit, because I thought I'd come back to see it had started pinning and they died off because I wasn't there to birth them. but when I came back, everything just looked... whiter. I was pretty happy with how it worked out
-------------------- Thou shalt not kill my vibe
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 62,899
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 6 hours, 17 minutes
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: krunkmaster]
#18411636 - 06/12/13 11:44 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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1 week is just recommended for our inpatients, you can go over a month if it doesn't pin. pf jars also don't lose a whole lot of moisture in the jars
-------------------- It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor
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One Love
Surrealist



Registered: 07/02/12
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: krunkmaster]
#18412340 - 06/13/13 06:20 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
krunkmaster said: I was actually referring to this part:
Quote:
HankMarducas said: Once it's fully colonized and without consolidation, it's time to prepare the simple coir substrate tek and dumping it into the mono.
if I'm reading that correctly, you actually want to avoid the consolidation when you're using that bulk method, rather than encouraging consolidation as with PF. your explanation makes sense though, I kind of figured from the name consolidation that it was about making it denser, but I didn't realize that identifying the consolidation stage was as simple as waiting till the outside edges were colonized.
fortunately, I (inadvertently) let my PF jars consolidate for a decent amount of time, because the timing worked out that I went on vacation right when I was thinking it was time to birth the cakes. that extra period was actually concerning me a bit, because I thought I'd come back to see it had started pinning and they died off because I wasn't there to birth them. but when I came back, everything just looked... whiter. I was pretty happy with how it worked out 
The reason you do not consolidate the jars when doing a bulk is because say they are 100% colonized - rather than waiting the extra days/weeks you are then breaking up the colonized cakes (if BRF, if it is grain it should crumble in pieces) all throughout your bulk substrate in the mono tub. then they have to colonize the tub as they did the jars. Once the tub is colonized 100% you can let it consolidate in the tub a bit before fruiting.
I could be wrong, but I believe the thinking behind this is due to the fact that at the point of 100% colonization the growth speed of the mycelium would actually be faster than mycelium that has sat consolidating, for purpose of wanting the mycelium to colonize the tub. I would guess the consolidated myc would be in a more dormant state, waiting to fruit, so it is not ideal for moving to a bulk substrate.
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spirit_shadow
Never knows best



Registered: 08/15/11
Posts: 32,618
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: One Love]
#18412927 - 06/13/13 10:31 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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also, because you dont want you're jars to initiate fruiting before you transfer to bulk.
-------------------- I think, therefore.....I'm still thinking.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011
Ban lotto
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krunkmaster
Cannibal


Registered: 04/26/13
Posts: 117
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: spirit_shadow]
#18413059 - 06/13/13 11:02 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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cool, that all makes sense to me! it's interesting how it doesn't seem much more complicated/expensive yet is much more intimidating to new growers. I'm still glad I started with PF tek but it's funny that I was initially thinking I'll probably stick with it forever just because it's so easy.
new question(s) for you guys. there are fat mushrooms popping up all over the place, which is good. but I noticed a few of the bigger ones are starting to turn discolored, which doesn't seem like a huge deal if I get a few aborts, but I'm worried that the conditions in the chamber aren't right since it seems like any of them over a certain size are affected. I'm going to include a few pictures including one pic of my chamber so you guys can offer criticism. one thing that might be worth noting is that I am not using artificial lighting. I have it sitting on a table in my sunroom and I have just been using natural sunlight (but with all of the blinds almost completely closed 24/7).
and one more question. the biggest mushroom (I posted a pic on page 3) has already got a pretty flat cap. my understanding is that happens pretty late in the lifecycle, and you want to pick them before that point when the veil is starting to break. I am having trouble identifying the veil and whether it already broke. I've seen pictures online but I can't tell in my own setup what's going on. I do see a ring much closer to the base of the stem but it seems very early for the veil to have broken there. did this mushroom just not grow very large and is already mature? is it possible that this is another symptom of something wrong in my chamber, together with the discolorations?
sorry, I know it's a lot of questions, but I want to fix this ASAP if something is amiss!
pics:
   
thanks as always!
-------------------- Thou shalt not kill my vibe
Edited by krunkmaster (06/13/13 11:13 AM)
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 62,899
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 6 hours, 17 minutes
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: krunkmaster]
#18413242 - 06/13/13 12:04 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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that discoloration is telling you it's ready
-------------------- It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor
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krunkmaster
Cannibal


Registered: 04/26/13
Posts: 117
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: cronicr]
#18413269 - 06/13/13 12:10 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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interesting.. is it just normal then for a whole flush to sometimes just not grow very large? it feels like that's indicating I'm doing something wrong in my chamber. maybe I'm just paranoid though lol
I tend to assume I'm doing everything wrong
-------------------- Thou shalt not kill my vibe
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 62,899
Loc: Van Isle
Last seen: 6 hours, 17 minutes
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: krunkmaster]
#18413380 - 06/13/13 12:34 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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don't expect monsters on your first flush especially with any pe variety, they love consolidation and most pe varietys i've seen on cakes are second flush flourishers, just cut aback on the misting for a few days before dunking for the second flush
-------------------- It doesn't matter what i think of you...all that matters is clean spawn
I'm tired do me a favor
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spirit_shadow
Never knows best



Registered: 08/15/11
Posts: 32,618
Last seen: 28 minutes, 37 seconds
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: cronicr]
#18413696 - 06/13/13 01:43 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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THINE VEIL HATH BROKETH!!!! IT IS COMPLETE!
-------------------- I think, therefore.....I'm still thinking.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011
Ban lotto
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krunkmaster
Cannibal


Registered: 04/26/13
Posts: 117
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: spirit_shadow]
#18413779 - 06/13/13 02:02 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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crazy, I would have expected the first flush to be huge with diminishing returns on each consecutive flush. this life form continues to surprise me. I will start picking tonight then!
-------------------- Thou shalt not kill my vibe
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spirit_shadow
Never knows best



Registered: 08/15/11
Posts: 32,618
Last seen: 28 minutes, 37 seconds
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: krunkmaster]
#18414856 - 06/13/13 05:23 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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some people like to pick the biggest fruits(ones that are already mature)and let the rest catch up but In my personal experience if you pick them all per flush, each of the next flushes are more uniform. but that may just be me, cos you never really know with multispore lol do what you think is best man and if it fails, you will know what not to do next time
-------------------- I think, therefore.....I'm still thinking.....(this account is automated, all posts related to illegal activities or advice thereof are strictly from numerous online sites and are for informational purposes only)- Circa 2011
Ban lotto
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HankMarducas



Registered: 08/15/11
Posts: 18
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: krunkmaster]
#18417379 - 06/14/13 02:57 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
krunkmaster said: crazy, I would have expected the first flush to be huge with diminishing returns on each consecutive flush. this life form continues to surprise me. I will start picking tonight then!
Isolation of the biggest monster and the first to pin will solve some issues with the plethora of different fruits from a multi spore. Place a piece of the mushrooms tissue onto agar and then transfer that to your grains once it has been split up to several other agar dishes.
-------------------- "Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed."
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krunkmaster
Cannibal


Registered: 04/26/13
Posts: 117
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: HankMarducas]
#18418062 - 06/14/13 09:43 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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I wish I had any of the equipment for that at the moment... I was expecting thefirst grow to be an experiment before I grow the APE and start cloning, but as I said I accidentally used the APE immediately! is it easy to work with agar? I could still try to do some isolation of the biggest specimens with future flushes I reckon.
-------------------- Thou shalt not kill my vibe
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HankMarducas



Registered: 08/15/11
Posts: 18
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: krunkmaster]
#18418928 - 06/14/13 01:31 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
krunkmaster said: is it easy to work with agar?
Sure is! The only concern is having an even more sanitized area than you'd have when knocking up some PF jars.
It's simple to make a collapsible sealed plastic tent (as seen below) Inoculation Tent
-------------------- "Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed."
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krunkmaster
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Registered: 04/26/13
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: HankMarducas]
#18419167 - 06/14/13 02:41 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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woah, that's awesome. the layout of my apartment is not great for something like that but I could probably make it work. nice link Hank, thank you!
I picked some of the larger mushrooms last night and began drying, and now I'm working my way through the smaller ones. I was wondering whether I need to be aware of whether I'm leaving a small amount of the base behind on some of them. most pop off easily from rocking them but a few tore and left a tiny bit of flesh behind. I could certainly see it being vulnerable to mold. if so, how do you recommend removing it?
also, the closer I look the more extremely tiny aborts I find. they're especially prevalent around the layer of verm on top of the cakes. I'm picking them as I go, but it's tough with the verm there. should I remove all the verm somehow to make it easier? if so, is there a good way of doing it other than just wiping it with my hand?
-------------------- Thou shalt not kill my vibe
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HankMarducas



Registered: 08/15/11
Posts: 18
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: krunkmaster]
#18419740 - 06/14/13 05:01 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
krunkmaster said: a few tore and left a tiny bit of flesh behind. I could certainly see it being vulnerable to mold. if so, how do you recommend removing it?
should I remove all the verm somehow to make it easier? if so, is there a good way of doing it other than just wiping it with my hand?
Mine have left some flesh behind quite a few times but never posed as a problem for any molds. Nothing to worry about. The best way for removal of the stubborn stems to to give a light rocking back'n'forth followed by a twisting motion.
There isn't any reason to remove verm. Mushies love that stuff for moisture purposes but, if you felt the need to for experimental purposes, a light shaking of the cake and/or a very gentle brush of your finger will remove anything loose.
Off topic but equally exciting.... I also picked some fruits today from a few cakes. Ban Hua Thanon strain.
-------------------- "Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed."
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krunkmaster
Cannibal


Registered: 04/26/13
Posts: 117
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: HankMarducas]
#18419851 - 06/14/13 05:27 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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I only wanted to remove the verm because I was thinking I was done with my first flush. my understanding is that it's common to dunk again for ~12 hours at this point after letting the cakes dry out for a day or two. I figured that would involve getting rid of the existing verm that I added for the double end casing.
I have picked pretty much everything at this point, although there are some very tiny guys still hanging around. I'm assuming there is no problem with leaving them on for the dunk? I could also wait to see if they grow, or just pick them. they are quite small though and there are a decent number of them so picking them would be a pain lol
and that's awesome man, do you have any pics? I've started to become really fascinated with how different these strains can look. that's why I'm excited to see the results of my next syringe (Ecuador). I think I am not going to bother with clones/prints on this current grow since I have been figuring this out as I go and it's been less than ideal. next time I will nail it!
-------------------- Thou shalt not kill my vibe
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HankMarducas



Registered: 08/15/11
Posts: 18
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: krunkmaster]
#18419922 - 06/14/13 05:47 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Just pick the cakes up and submerge them in cool water for 12-16 hours. I advise to not re-roll cakes after the first flush because nothing will hold onto the verm resulting in a very messy fruiting chamber when misting.
As for pictures, I don't have a digital camera and the cell phone battery gets removed when I'm within a mile of the laboratory.
-------------------- "Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed."
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HankMarducas



Registered: 08/15/11
Posts: 18
Last seen: 11 years, 5 months
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: HankMarducas]
#18420229 - 06/14/13 06:55 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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In addition to the whole stubborn fruit situation, you can always let them mature a bit more. I've found it to be MUCH easier to remove fruits from substrate when they've matured a while longer than the ideal harvest point. You know, the whole "pick them right before the veil breaks" speak? That's not necessary. It's quite alright to let the caps flatten out but in the case of a Penis Envy, I really don't know much about the whole flattening-out with that strain.
-------------------- "Never turn your back on fear. It should always be in front of you, like a thing that might have to be killed."
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krunkmaster
Cannibal


Registered: 04/26/13
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Re: Should I be concerned with this or is it just a pin? [Re: HankMarducas]
#18422339 - 06/15/13 07:51 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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I was really wondering about the "pick before the veil breaks" thing. it was never clear whether that was supposed to maximize potency (somehow) or if it was to avoid dropping spores or something. thanks for the tip, that's really great to know
and good idea with the cell phone battery. I'd do the same if it wasn't in my house lol
-------------------- Thou shalt not kill my vibe
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