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Offlineinvitro


Registered: 05/03/13
Posts: 2,529
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How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? * 1
    #18373016 - 06/05/13 02:45 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I bought a light meter that measures lumens or lux.  For plants, the intensity of the light matters.  So naturally I want to know how much light I need for colonization or fruiting.  I read through some posts and found one guy recommended 200 lumens in colonization.  I never could get a number for fruiting but I recall someone said to get a florescent tube as close to the tub as possible without heating the tub.  That might be 2000 lumens as a rough estimate.  Since mushrooms don't photosynthesize I imagine lighting requirements are not intense.

Edited by invitro (06/05/13 02:51 PM)

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OfflineCMOS
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: invitro] * 1
    #18373151 - 06/05/13 03:21 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

My 18watt daylight CFL puts out around 1200 lumens.  I've heard minimum of 2000 lux recommended for fruiting. 

If you have a 1200 lumen bulb, you should be getting above 2000 lux if your lighting an area less then a square meter. (1000 lumen = 1000 lux when lighting 1 square meter) I think for my monotub I was getting around 4000 lux at the substrate level.

Light intensity is inversely proportional to distance, so minimize your bulb distance to increase the light intensity(lux).


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OfflineLeper
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: CMOS] * 1
    #18373169 - 06/05/13 03:24 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Eh, not sure if the lumens matter much, more the color temperature.
7500k lightbulb works fine for me.
Daylight bulbs simulate daylight, gives them a day/night cycle to start fruiting.
Light is a pinning trigger, so ambient light is fine for colonizing mycelium.


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Leper is a fictitious entity using images supplied by google to mask his/her inability to form normal social habits within society.

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Offlineinvitro


Registered: 05/03/13
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: CMOS] * 1
    #18373852 - 06/05/13 05:33 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Hmm, I wonder what would happen at higher lumen ratings, like 3000? 

Edited by invitro (02/22/14 06:12 PM)

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OfflineLeper
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: invitro] * 1
    #18374382 - 06/05/13 07:18 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

The lumen rating is your human ability to sense light brightness, or the AMOUNT of visible light. Something like that is irrelevant to a fungus, they don't have eyes, and can care less about how bright a light is, they care about the wavelength.

What you should note is the color temperature, which is represented in Kelvin on a light bulb box. Any color temperature over 5000k is known as cool light, and anything lower 2000k-3000k would be warm light, reds, yellows, orange ect.

As you know, physics says that colors travel in different wavelengths. A certain wavelength (7500k) is referred to as daylight, something that mushrooms respond to, as it mimics the sun's relative brightness (on earth through the atmosphere) and triggers pinning.
They're two separate things.

For instance, you can have a light bulb that is 3000 lumen and has a color temperature of 3000k. That doesn't suit the mushroom's trigger as anything more than ambient lighting, it's like throwing the mushroom into perpetual dawn or dusk. Cubensis is a late summer species, and needs a certain amount of daylight to fruit - circa 12 hours.

I use a Utilitech 13W CFL Bulb with 830 lumen and a color temperature of 5000k (I know 2500k below, I didn't search the lowe's racks enough). I could get 2000 lumen and 5000k bulbs and still get the same effects, albeit a little more power consumption and annoyance from the 12 hours of bright light during my daytime sleep schedule.

In conclusion, the lumen of your bulb isn't important, just ensure you get 7500k or at least 5000k bulbs. Color TEMPERATURE is important, not brightness.


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Leper is a fictitious entity using images supplied by google to mask his/her inability to form normal social habits within society.

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Offlinefungitarian
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: Leper] * 1
    #18374412 - 06/05/13 07:27 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

6500k is the best in my opinion


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Invisible36fuckin5
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: Leper] * 1
    #18374456 - 06/05/13 07:37 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Leper said:
Cubensis is a late summer species, and needs a certain amount of daylight to fruit - circa 12 hours.





This isn't right. Cubensis prefers about 12 hours of 7500K-or-so light per day, but it doesn't require it at all. The amount of ambient room light it would receive while you're doing work would be enough to get it to fruit, you'd just do better with a proper light.


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Pat The Bunny said:
A punk rock song won't ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me.

bodhisatta said:
i recommend common sense and figuring it out.

These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.

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OfflineLeper
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: 36fuckin5] * 1
    #18374752 - 06/05/13 08:27 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

36fuckin5 said:
Quote:

Leper said:
Cubensis is a late summer species, and needs a certain amount of daylight to fruit - circa 12 hours.





This isn't right. Cubensis prefers about 12 hours of 7500K-or-so light per day, but it doesn't require it at all. The amount of ambient room light it would receive while you're doing work would be enough to get it to fruit, you'd just do better with a proper light.




You're right, need is a little strong.

I meant to say that it's a trigger to start throwing up pins.
It doesn't rely on the light for nutrition, nor as a reproductive trigger, but the light is an indicator of an environment worth colonizing. My point was the brightness of the light is irrelevant, it's the color temperature of that light that the mushroom responds to.

My theory for the relative necessity of light in the wild is since the environment of the mushroom revolves around its habitat; herbivorous mammals, which eat grass, which needs sun, the mushroom itself responds to the environmental stimuli that grass responds to: light, humidity, and temperature. 

Also as Violet has pointed out, the mycelium finding sustenance IN grass seeds themselves point to a environmental similarity between species of grass and cubensis.

If I knew more about grass and its seeding habits I would be as bold as to say that rye grass probably starts seeding in late-summer to have viable seeds for the next spring (rye grass needs to be planted WAY early in the spring to survive the summer).

Grass seed as food, dung to provide essential nutrients for colony development, and the right amount light to trigger the mushroom into fruiting WHILE the grass is seeding.
The perfect environment for a wild mushroom involves the sunlight, for an entirely different reason than plants.
A lack of light in indoor cultivations results in skinny, slow-growing, and malformed mushrooms (as shown in Tmethyl's how it shouldn't look thread). Ambient light results in slower growth, and a long wait to pinning.

In indoor cultivation, there's an advantage; you can provide a nutritionally perfect environment for a mushroom, and can coax it into fruiting in almost any environment, if you're patient enough.
But,
It's inefficient to not provide a direct 7500k light, and stupid not to provide any light at all.
Necessary to grow and fruit? No.
Necessary to a halfway decent fruit? Absolutely, at least have some sunlight on it.

Sorry to derail with my wild-cubensis light theory.
I'm pretty sure the only thing you disagreed with was the semantics and not the thought.

Case and point, physics wants you to get a light based on light wavelength, not brightness.


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Leper is a fictitious entity using images supplied by google to mask his/her inability to form normal social habits within society.

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Invisibleanne halonium
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Registered: 05/07/13
Posts: 1,908
Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: Leper] * 1
    #18375298 - 06/05/13 10:25 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

^ i know leper, they are testy on the  blue lights.
alot of them dont have access to advanced light systems,
and ,lack experience on low energy high output grow lights.



everyone wants to aim a tube array at a plastic tub 12/ 12.

it simply not needed.

it not even an argument anymore really.
its down to rounding up the resistors with a fax memo.

they still go wild though on the topic though.
:monkeydance:

Edited by anne halonium (06/05/13 10:33 PM)

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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: Leper] * 1
    #18375333 - 06/05/13 10:33 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Lighting requirements of mushrooms

Brighter light helps pinning better than dimmer light.  There's certainly a point of diminishing returns though as the mycelium isn't using light the same way plants do.  During colonization, regular ambient room light will speed up colonization over total darkness.  However, very bright light such as if you're growing plants under HPS and put the jars there will slow down colonization.  MH will give a great pinset, but only if you already have one running.  Otherwise, a bright window or bright fluorescent lamp nearby is sufficient.
RR


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Invisibleanne halonium
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: RogerRabbit] * 1
    #18375341 - 06/05/13 10:35 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

RR, im always most impressed ,
with your grow light experiments.
especially the LED grows.


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:aliendance:

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OfflineBloodKil
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: anne halonium] * 1
    #18375501 - 06/05/13 11:10 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

anne halonium said:
^ i know leper, they are testy on the  blue lights.
alot of them dont have access to advanced light systems,
and ,lack experience on low energy high output grow lights.







For gods sakes I'm all for led lighting, but what you are showing here is neither advanced, efficient, nor high output.

Don't get me wrong ill gladly go against the grain and use 470nm lighting,(blue) but to talk shit about others who use tube lights then show off these relics you own and call them advanced is like a kid rolling up on my car with his bike and bragging about his sweet ride...  We can't say that our narrow band lighting is better without a full range of experimentation, and the only one I've seen that delt with mushrooms didn't really show much of a difference at all in lighting until you got into ir or uv (in which case it showed them suffering iirc)  It does however seem that if 6500k is optimal than "blue spectrum lighting" with leds would be as well.  (3,000,000/#k=#nm)

I'm not sure where all the 7500k talk in this thread came from as it's the first I've heard of it as optimal, however I'm not sure anyone here (myself especially) knows the full range of spectrum that is beneficial to mushrooms...  it could be quite narrow, or a broad spectrum may prove to be best...

That said...  The few experiments I have seen on here to point to brighter lights producing a better flush... 

So op it would seem as long as your not throwing off your heat values with your light source, a higher lux may prove beneficial,  but it doesn't take much at all to actually produce fruit, as many fruit through rather thick plastic containers with low wattage cfl bulbs and do just fine...  As far as your spectrum though. Keep it towards the cool end and you'll do fine. :shrug:

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OfflinecronicrMFacebook
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: BloodKil] * 1
    #18375509 - 06/05/13 11:12 PM (11 years, 7 months ago)

:logic:


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InvisibleFrankHorrigan
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: cronicr] * 1
    #18375886 - 06/06/13 12:39 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

:trololol:

470nm light is just as good as almost no light :thumbdown:


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You should take a look. :hehehe:


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Offlinefunkerdslr
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #18375923 - 06/06/13 12:47 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

FrankHorrigan said:
:trololol:

470nm light is just as good as almost no light :thumbdown:




How is that spectrum useless? that doesn't make sense. maybe if its lumen output was terrible.

(not specifically cubensis, but a study on fruiting bodies and wave length) http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Enlighten me please.


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RIP Alice

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Edited by funkerdslr (06/06/13 12:52 AM)

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OfflineBloodKil
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #18375933 - 06/06/13 12:50 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Like a lot of what you have to say Frank, but please point me to a place where this has been shown to be true in any fashion...

As I said above the only real light study I could find where people attempted usage of independent spectrums showed little to no discernable difference, until reaching the far end spectrums. (ir and uv)

Please point me in the direction of some written results, or if you have had time to do this on your own please do post as I am always eager to learn something new about this stuff.

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InvisibleFrankHorrigan
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: BloodKil] * 1
    #18375940 - 06/06/13 12:51 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

I did a test with my friends LEDs, he has quite the variety, and the mushrooms I got from anne's few seconds/minutes of recommended blue light a day were long, stringy, tiny capped sad little mushrooms. That's why I say that.

I don't base most of my opinions that I can test on other people's work. Neither should you. Do the test yourself and find out :thumbup:

edit: note that this was not with a standard 12/12 cycle but rather with what anne has recommended in his threads.


--------------------

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Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:


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AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

Edited by FrankHorrigan (06/06/13 12:59 AM)

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OfflineBloodKil
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #18376045 - 06/06/13 01:16 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Fair enough...

My next batch of oysters will have a bag or two under blue light (fruiting only as space where I have lights up is limited)  I should have a post in the edibles section soon as my jars are ~90% (tops are going a bit slow as I experimented with 90mm single layer ez felt filters....  bad idea btw as the bottom 80% was done a few days ago)

I'm also in the process of setting up a bit bigger grow area/lab at a friends, so hopefully will be able to do a side by side with some cubes in the coming months.

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InvisibleFrankHorrigan
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: BloodKil] * 1
    #18376065 - 06/06/13 01:24 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Make sure to use isolates :thumbup:

Is the top layer of your grains drying out? I dont follow you on the problem...


--------------------

Yes, you can bump my old threads with a question.
Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:


Frank's tips and tricks. Updated on 3/21/14
AMU- Get an answer here -AMU

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OfflineBloodKil
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Re: How many lumens do I need in colonization, fruiting? [Re: FrankHorrigan] * 1
    #18376146 - 06/06/13 01:49 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Will do...

Yeah, too much ae and or evaporation I think...  I watched it stall for a couple days on the top only, then dropped a piece of plastic over the tops blocking ae and evap and they started moving again.  I call it an experiment,  but it was in fact me being to lazy to get up and get another sheet of ez felt to double layer them when I was making larger filters...  The three jars that did have a double layer have been fully colonized waiting for their buddies. 

I had just bought some more jars and as they were just going for g2g, decided to try not even modifying lids, but just switching them out for circles of felt...:shrug:





(Sry for the ot)

Edited by BloodKil (06/06/13 02:02 AM)

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