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Invisiblewhitey
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Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions
    #18347704 - 05/31/13 04:55 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

My goal with this thread is to post my first attempt at a bulk spawn from rye grass seed. I am looking for information to better my technique, comments on completely idiotic decisions I made and to create a general thread of do's and d0 not's learned from experience with bulk spawns. :whatdoyouthink:

Spawn Attempt #1

I have a half pint jar and a pint jar that were both fully colonized with rye grass seed. I pasteurized approximately 1 pound of manure/humus mixture by moistening the mixture inside of a tall metal pan and covering it with foil, then baking it in an oven until the internal temperature reached 160oF. Once cooled I mixed in about 1/2 quart of dry vermiculite with very little BRF that I had laying around and some re-hydrated coco coir to create a consistency similar to a BRF cake. I added this mixture to a 5 gallon sterilized cooler and crumbled both jars into it and mixed thoroughly in a clean environment.

For a casing layer I put down a 1/2 inch thick layer of dampened but not soaking wet vermiculite. I added about an inch of DRY vermiculite over that. For added protection against contamination I applied a very light mist of extremely dilute H2O2 (approximately 8oz of 3% H2O2 to 32oz water)to the entire inside of my cooler.

Future Plans/ expectations

I will let this sit for about a week in a temperature range between 74-82o F (night lows to day highs) untouched before beginning to fan the container regularly and monitor for contams and mushroom growth.

Please no flaming here but feel free to tell me I am an idiot as long as you explain why :crazy2:


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Invisiblewhitey
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Re: Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions [Re: whitey]
    #18347708 - 05/31/13 04:57 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

On a side note I can't figure out how to bump a thread. Can someone explain how to go about doing this? So as to keep this thread current from time to time and not to abuse the ability. Thanks so much in advance for the helpful insight I hope to accumulate for all to enjoy!


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Invisiblejboredone
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Re: Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions [Re: whitey]
    #18347714 - 05/31/13 05:00 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

whitey said:
On a side note I can't figure out how to bump a thread. Can someone explain how to go about doing this? So as to keep this thread current from time to time and not to abuse the ability. Thanks so much in advance for the helpful insight I hope to accumulate for all to enjoy!



I think you just bumped you thread  2 mins after you made it and I just bumped it again.......:lmafo:


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OfflinePussyFart
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Re: Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions [Re: whitey]
    #18347722 - 05/31/13 05:05 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

You just bumped your thread by posting.

A casing layer is not there for protection against contams, it creates a microclimate for pinning and moisture retention.

It gets applied to a bulk substrate, after the substrate is fully colonized, and contam resistant by itself.

Furthermore, we only use peroxide to combat cobweb mold, if you have it already.

It gets used straight out of the bottle, not diluted...it can actually damage mushroom mycellium.

Oven pasteurization sucks, the 2 teks in my signature are better.

If you added BRF to the mix, you just messed up...that is not a bulk substrate additive, and will most likely contaminate.

You are supposed to wait until full colonization before introducing fresh air, not just a week.

Edited by PussyFart (05/31/13 05:05 AM)

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Invisiblewhitey
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Re: Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions [Re: PussyFart]
    #18347789 - 05/31/13 05:48 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Well great info already.. Thanks lol. I have a back up quart jar of rye seed colonizing so this was my trial and error learning experience.

I know peroxide can damage mycelium which is why I applied such a dilute mist to the dry verm and container so as not to reach the mycelium. I also know that peroxide is primarily only used for cobweb mold but have found that it is rather effective at killing a wide variety of fungal spores prior to germination. I figure it can't hurt anything by having it present.

Will my casing layer by itself completely screw me over or could my grow still succeed with it if everything else I screwed up doesn't ruin it first?


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InvisibleStropharis
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Re: Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions [Re: whitey]
    #18347822 - 05/31/13 06:06 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

whitey said:
then baking it in an oven until the internal temperature reached 160F.




How long did you keep you temps stead and in what range? As stated by Hack, oven pasteurization sucks, in addition to the good links he provided,  you can also check out Stro's Take On Pasteurization.


Quote:

whitey said:
Once cooled I mixed in about 1/2 quart of dry vermiculite with very little BRF that I had laying around and some re-hydrated coco coir to create a consistency similar to a BRF cake.




Unless I am reading this wrong it sounds to me like you mixed un-pasteurized materials into your poorly pasteurized substrate thus really accomplishing nothing. In addition BRF would have to be sterilized.

Quote:

whitey said:For a casing layer I put down a 1/2 inch thick layer of dampened but not soaking wet vermiculite.




You did this before it was colonized?


Quote:

whitey said: I added about an inch of DRY vermiculite over that.For added protection against contamination I applied a very light mist of extremely dilute H2O2 (approximately 8oz of 3% H2O2 to 32oz water)to the entire inside of my cooler.




Already discussed



Quote:

whitey said:Future Plans/ expectations
I will let this sit for about a week in a temperature range between 74-82o F (night lows to day highs) untouched before beginning to fan the container regularly and monitor for contams and mushroom growth.
:crazy2:




"monitor for contams" for sure.

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Invisiblewhitey
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Re: Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions [Re: Stropharis]
    #18347843 - 05/31/13 06:17 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Yeah I realized after pasteurizing my hpoo (which I held the temp for little over an hour) that it was firstly, way too wet and secondly I had coco coir left over that I use for my reptile's bedding so I added the dry verm and coco coir to improve the texture and moisture content.

Rephrasing my earlier question: In the future if I create a properly pasteurized spawn and case it immediately without letting it fully colonize will it cause problems?

Also what is so special about BRF that it has to be sterilized? Is it just too nutrient rich?

<< The coco coir I used was not removed from my reptiles cage! it was an unused dehydrated brick that I hydrated (should have pasteurized) then added to the hpoo/humus mixture>>

Edited by whitey (05/31/13 06:20 AM)

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InvisibleStropharis
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Re: Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions [Re: whitey]
    #18347893 - 05/31/13 06:51 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

whitey said:
In the future if I create a properly pasteurized spawn substrate and case it immediately without letting it fully colonize will it cause problems?




You mean a properly pasteurized substrate, typically spawn is your grains that you let colonize inside a sterile environment, i.g. bags, jars. Although not something I would recommend, BRF/Verm would be considerd spawn if you are "spawning it" to a substrate i.g. coir, poo.  As far as casing before full colonization; to be honest  I have neve tested this method, I always let my substrate fully colonize before casing, I am sure you can run a search on the topic for more details.

Quote:

whitey said:Also what is so special about BRF that it has to be sterilized? Is it just too nutrient rich?




A typical answer would be as such yes, but I am not entirely sure that it is accurate. At the moment I am currently sterilizing a wood based substrate opposed to pasteurizing it because it is enriched with a nitrogen-rich additive; grains. This will also be spawned in and let colonize in a sterile environment. I am on the hunt for an accurate answer for you.

Edited by Stropharis (05/31/13 06:53 AM)

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InvisibleStropharis
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Re: Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions [Re: Stropharis]
    #18347902 - 05/31/13 06:56 AM (11 years, 7 months ago)

More or less what I thought and almost said; nitrogen-rich materials are more susceptible to contamination.

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Invisiblewhitey
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Re: Bulk Spawn Q, A and Opinions [Re: Stropharis]
    #18439093 - 06/18/13 08:17 PM (11 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks for the help. I pitched the substrate and started a new attempt the proper way. So far its going well. I cased the spawn about a week ago and it is fully colonized and has been in fruiting conditions (75 degrees with a light that i just leave on 24/7)for the last two days. How long should I expect to wait for fruiting to begin with a bulk substrate? Is it any different than with BRF cakes at this point? I was also wondering if having a small aquarium air pump simply pumping filtered air into the cooler I have my substrate in constantly is sufficient for FAE. Other than the pump running into the lid I keep pollyfill in the rest of the gap between the lid and cooler body.


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