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 lucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness
Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
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 Re: problem with meditation.  [Re: gnrm23]
#1833539 - 08/20/03 01:10 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
gnrm23 said:
(from the lutheran liturgy: a brief order for public confession):
"oh most heavenly father, i confess that i am by nature sinful and unclean, and have sinned against you in thought, word, and deed; not only by outward transgressions but also by secret thoughts and desires which i cannot fully understand but which are all known unto thee..."
~
tell me about it, friend...
~
~
damn, guilt is insidious  on an intellectual level
I know this, and yet it's hardwired into my emotions
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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."
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fireworks_god
Sexy.Butt.McDanger
Registered: 03/12/02
Posts: 24,855
Loc: Pandurn
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: lucid]
#1833540 - 08/20/03 01:10 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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Lucid, your long post is great. You touched on a lot of things that harmonize with some of my thoughts (the good thoughts, hehe).
Too often our thoughts end up creating and destroying our experiences here.. we can get caught in thoughts that are traps, catching us in an emotional roller coaster that we don't always like being in... Depression, negative feelings, etc are ushered in, and a lot of thoughts keep coming that keep us locked in these feelings... it isn't healthy, to say the least.
Sometimes it only takes one thought to bring us back up, it just depends.. our thoughts definitely flow, and in some way, we definitely control what thoughts we have.
Perhaps actively controlling most of our thoughts would produce some astoundingly positive results within us.. I have thought a lot about this, but have never really disciplined my mind much.. I am really starting to see the benefits, and am going to have to make it an important part of my day....
One of the very best benefits of this for me would be the possibility of full focus.. there are certain situations where not having full focus is possible, and therefore we would benefit immensely from the possibility of full focus... whether it be studying, sports, guitar playing (which is where this ties in with me), or conversation.. we have poweful minds, and we should probably learn how to use them...
Isn't this what Zen is about? I've heard about Zen tennis and such.. I need to really read into Zen. Anyone here have some good links or some information? I remember reading that Arnold Palmer basically went into a Zen state everytime he played golf... I could really apply this to playing guitar.
Anyways.. free your minds.. hehe
Peace.
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If I should die this very moment
I wouldn't fear
For I've never known completeness
Like being here
Wrapped in the warmth of you
Loving every breath of you
  
 
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lucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness
Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
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Thanks fireworks_god 
I've been intruiged by Zen for some time now, I even wanted
to go to the Montreal Zen Center, but they seemed a
bit intimidating - tough love Zen. I guess that works for
some, but I need more support, perhaps I'll find a Tibetten
Buddhist Monastary nearby...
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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."
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Seuss
Error: divide byzero
Registered: 04/27/01
Posts: 23,480
Loc: Caribbean
Last seen: 2 months, 7 days
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: lucid]
#1833651 - 08/20/03 01:40 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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> I even wanted to go to the Montreal Zen Center, but they seemed a
bit intimidating - tough love Zen.
See if they have an open meditation/sitting for the public. These are often very informal sittings that last thirty minutes or so.
Don't be intimidated by people you meet. If they send you away, go with a smile on your face, and come back the next day. Eventually they will see that you are serious and want to learn.
It is very nice to have other people to sit with.
> went into a Zen state
Oh, the irony... 
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Just another spore in the wind.
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gnrm23
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 08/29/99
Posts: 6,488
Loc: n. e. OH, USSA
Last seen: 6 months, 9 days
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: Seuss]
#1833683 - 08/20/03 01:45 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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a good buddhist website/magazine with some links & stuff as well
www.tricycle.com
& www.buddhanet.net
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old enough to know better
not old enough to care
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lucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness
Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: Seuss]
#1833806 - 08/20/03 02:04 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Seuss said:
> I even wanted to go to the Montreal Zen Center, but they seemed a
bit intimidating - tough love Zen.
See if they have an open meditation/sitting for the public. These are often very informal sittings that last thirty minutes or so.
Don't be intimidated by people you meet. If they send you away, go with a smile on your face, and come back the next day. Eventually they will see that you are serious and want to learn.
It is very nice to have other people to sit with.
Thanks for the encouragement, I've decided to go when their
open meditations start next month. I meditated with a friend
recently and was surprised at how different my exp was.
Just something about the presence of another person.
Quote:
Seuss said:
> went into a Zen state
Oh, the irony...
hehe...good catch
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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida 
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: gnrm23]
#1834306 - 08/20/03 04:08 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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Hey!
Forget Boehme?! Why, if you look closely at my avatar (click to enlarge), you'll see a 400 year old drawing of the Trinity by Boehme, with a mushroomic shape superimposed on the upper Heart, which symbolizes the Second Person, namely, Christ.
Lent LeShan's book to a counseling client about 1984...last I saw of it, but you're right, it is useful. I always liked Christopher Isherwood's 'How to Know God,' based on Patanjali's Eight-Limbed Yoga.
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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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MarkostheGnostic
Elder
Registered: 12/09/99
Posts: 14,279
Loc: South Florida
Last seen: 3 years, 2 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: lucid]
#1834346 - 08/20/03 04:22 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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"At the center of our being is a point of nothingness which is untouched by sin and by illusion, a point of pure truth, a point or spark which belongs entirely to God, which is never at our disposal, from which God disposes of our lives, which is inaccessable to the fantasies of our our own mind or the brutalities of our own will. This little point of nothingness and of absolute poverty is the pure glory of God in us. It is so to speak his name written in us, as our poverty, as our indigence, as our dependence, as our sonship. It is like a pure diamond, blazing with the invisible light of heaven. It is in everybody, and if we could see it we would see these billions of points of light coming together in the face of a sun that would make all the darkness and cruelty of life vanish."
- Thomas Merton, quoted in 'Paths to the Heart: Sufism and the Christian East'
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γνῶθι σαὐτόν - Gnothi Seauton - Know Thyself
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lucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness
Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
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That... is one of the most beautiful, moving things I've ever read...
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"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."
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 Hermes_br
~~~
Registered: 04/24/01
Posts: 546
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 Re: problem with meditation. [Re: kaiowas]
#1834442 - 08/20/03 04:58 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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try this light and easy book " What is meditation ? " by Osho .
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sirreal
devoid
Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 1,775
Loc: In the borderlands
Last seen: 16 years, 11 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: Malachi]
#1834961 - 08/20/03 07:39 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
not as bad as meth, but worse than coke.
What are you talking about?!
Worse than coke? Not as bad as meth? WTF?
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I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------
I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!
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Earth_Droid
Stranger
Registered: 04/19/02
Posts: 5,240
Last seen: 17 years, 8 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: sirreal]
#1835197 - 08/20/03 08:36 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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Yoga does have one universal meaning. That is it means union. The comming together off.
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kaiowas
lest we baguette
Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 5,501
Loc: oz
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: Earth_Droid]
#1835511 - 08/20/03 09:55 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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thanks for all of the input as I see what I can start working on. SWEET !
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Annnnnnd I had a light saber and my friend was there and I said "you look like an indian" and he said "you look like satan" and he found a stick and a rock and he named the rock ooga booga and he named the stick Stick and we both thought that was pretty funny. We got eaten alive by mosquitos but didn't notice til the next day. I stepped on some glass while wading in the swamp and cut my foot open, didn't bother me til the next day either....yeah it was a good time, ended the night by buying some liquor for minors and drinking nips and going to he diner and eating chicken fingers, and then I went home and went to bed.
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Earth_Droid
Stranger
Registered: 04/19/02
Posts: 5,240
Last seen: 17 years, 8 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: sirreal]
#1835767 - 08/20/03 11:18 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
sirreal said:
Quote:
not as bad as meth, but worse than coke.
What are you talking about?!
Worse than coke? Not as bad as meth? WTF?
I thought that was odd too.
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Ped
Interested In Your Brain
Registered: 08/30/99
Posts: 5,494
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: Earth_Droid]
#1837994 - 08/21/03 04:21 PM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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Your adversities with meditation are the tools you are using to sharpen your mind. If you cleared your mind right away, what would there be to learn!
Try counting your breaths, 1-10, over and over again. If your mind wanders, that's okay. Just conciously bring yourself back to your breathing. Every time you take note of your mind straying, you are flexing the muscle of awareness which will eventually make an impact on your mind and your outlook on the world. Be happy with your troubles, as they are your greatest teachers.
--------------------
 Dark Triangles - New Psychedelic Techno Single - Listen on Soundcloud
Gyroscope full album available SoundCloud or MySpace
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Clover
phenomenal woman
Registered: 07/31/03
Posts: 99
Loc: Beyond the Veil
Last seen: 20 years, 6 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: gnrm23]
#1893831 - 09/08/03 11:00 AM (20 years, 7 months ago) |
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Meditation does in fact, involve varying degrees and how "deep" a meditation relies on the condition or phase of brainwaves (alpha, beta, etc). If you have ever been driving down the road thinking of something and minutes later suddenly realize you have driven 2 miles with no recollection of driving or what has passed, then you have used the same brain wave condition needed for deep meditation. Daily practice is the key.
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"Those sweet excesses I do adore."
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Rose
Devil's Advocate
Registered: 09/24/03
Posts: 22,518
Loc: Mod not God
Last seen: 1 year, 8 months
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: kaiowas]
#15560166 - 12/23/11 04:35 AM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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Nice double post.
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Fiddlesticks.
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: kaiowas]
#15560226 - 12/23/11 05:18 AM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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People who meditate can easily quit unhealthy habits such as smoking, drugs or drinking.
Alan Watts comes to mind. 
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"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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redgreenvines
irregular verb
Registered: 04/08/04
Posts: 38,173
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Re: problem with meditation. [Re: Icelander] 1
#15560556 - 12/23/11 08:08 AM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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Markos first post was excellent in that it explains why a person may expect different things from "meditation", and it suitably de-emphasizes the importance of sweeping the mind clear of thoughts.
in the end, thoughts or mental objects are the terrain and contents of mind.
who we are as living beings forms a yin yang relationship with this terrain.
Supressing thoughts is a dark action, or an exercise in denial, being in-touch with them as they arise and pass away is good, not reacting or adding to them is as close to clearing the mind as you can aspire to.
For me, meditation is the barest observation of what is happening and I approach that by following the breath.
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 _  🧠 _ 
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Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
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--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
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