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OfflineCleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
Last seen: 11 years, 19 days
gay marriage
    #1827987 - 08/18/03 10:45 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

i was watching a news show where they had on a reverend and a gay man that was the head of somekind of gay coalition, the topic was gay marriage. the rev. became so enthralled that he was screaming slander and foaming it the mouth. persoanlly i dont see why gays dont get the right to be joined by law. it seems like such a trivial thing. i cant believe that this is in this post-modern age. isn't not letting them get married an infridgment on the constitution on the grounds of not letting one pursue happiness? who has the right to siay thiat it isnt morial? if i was gay i would be very upset it the way many people try to pass moral judgement. also, wouldnt having two parents (nuclear family) be a more stable enviroment?


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if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?

this is the purpose


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Offlinenubious
1up on the rest

Registered: 10/20/02
Posts: 534
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 6 years, 4 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: CleverName]
    #1828000 - 08/18/03 10:49 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I totally agree. I feel that religious people are the downfall to the global society. Remove religon and you no longer have wars in the middle east, you no longer have contraversy like you mentioned, and all in all people are free to believe what they want, and more importantly discover their own beliefs.

Heaven is the product of the death of religon.


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No one knows the worth of innocence till he knows it is gone forever, and that money can't buy it back. Not the saint, but the sinner that repenteth, is he to whom the full length and breadth, and height and depth, of life's meaning is revealed. Good and evil loose all objective meaning and are seen as equally necessary and contrasting elements in the masterpiece that is the universe.


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OfflineMalachi
stereotype

Registered: 06/19/02
Posts: 1,294
Loc: Around Minneapolis.
Last seen: 7 years, 6 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: nubious]
    #1828178 - 08/18/03 11:59 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

the only problem with that is that man seems to be incapable of creating value without religion. ???


--------------------
The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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OfflineRhizoid
carbon unit
Male

Registered: 01/23/00
Posts: 1,718
Loc: Europe
Last seen: 19 days, 12 hours
Re: gay marriage [Re: CleverName]
    #1828427 - 08/19/03 02:26 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Marriage is just a contract between two people. The law should be completely neutral about such contracts. If two gay people want to marry each other, let them. If seven dwarfs and a woman wants to marry each other, let them. Keep the laws about the responsibilites that parents have toward their children, but let marriage be a private thing.


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Offlineneutralizer
Spiritual beinghaving a Humanexperience
Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 635
Loc: This Planet Earth
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: Rhizoid]
    #1828627 - 08/19/03 04:13 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

But it's against God! He'll send us all to hell if we allow it! He'll allow the terrorists to create another 9/11!


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There are things known, and there are things unknown, and in between are the doors - Morrison


Edited by neutralizer (08/19/03 04:18 AM)


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Offlineneutralizer
Spiritual beinghaving a Humanexperience
Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 635
Loc: This Planet Earth
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: neutralizer]
    #1828665 - 08/19/03 04:33 AM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Sigh...
From http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=519&e=8&u=/ap/gay_marriage_ap_poll:
Quote:

WASHINGTON - More than half of Americans favor a law barring gay marriage and are opposed to allowing civil unions that could provide gay couples with the same benefits as marriage, an Associated Press poll found.

The survey also indicated presidential candidates could lose the backing of some voters if they support gay marriage or civil unions.

The poll, conducted for the AP by ICR-International Communications Research of Media, Pa., found 52 percent favor a law banning gay marriages, while 41 percent oppose such a law.

About four in 10 ? 41 percent ? support allowing civil unions, roughly the same level found in an AP poll three years ago. But 53 percent now say they oppose civil unions, up from 46 percent in the earlier survey.

The increase came largely from people who previously were undecided, the poll suggested.

Close to half of those surveyed said they would be less likely to support a presidential candidate who backs civil unions (44 percent) or gay marriage (49 percent), while only around 10 percent said they would be more likely.

"I don't think it's a great idea; the whole idea of marriage is bringing up children," said Jim Martin, a 64-year-old engineer from Alexandria, Va. "If somebody was promoting it, I would vote against them."

The issue poses a challenge for the Democratic presidential candidates in the 2004 election. The six leading candidates say they oppose gay marriage but are sharply critical of efforts to legally ban it, either with a law or by amending the Constitution.

Four of the six ? former Vermont Gov. Howard Dean, Missouri Rep. Dick Gephardt (news - web sites), Florida Sen. Bob Graham (news, bio, voting record) and Massachusetts Sen. John Kerry (news, bio, voting record) ? say they support civil unions. North Carolina Sen. John Edwards (news, bio, voting record) and Connecticut Sen. Joe Lieberman (news - web sites) say they favor benefits for gay partners, but say states should decide on civil unions.

President Bush (news - web sites) has said he supports efforts to legally ban gay marriage, but encourages tolerance of gays and lesbians.

In the AP poll, about one-third of people who identified themselves as Democrats and independents said they would be less likely to support a candidate who backs civil unions. Twice as many Republicans said they feel that way.

More than four in 10 Democrats support passing laws against gay marriage, according to the poll. Two-thirds of Republicans support passing such laws.

The issue of gay rights has gotten increased attention since June, when the Supreme Court threw out a Texas law prohibiting gay sex, saying such a ban violates constitutionally guaranteed privacy rights. The decision mobilized both gay rights advocates and conservatives, who said it could lead to legalization of gay marriage.

Conservative leaders rallied supporters to oppose legal gay marriage. In late July, the Vatican (news - web sites) urged Catholics and non-Catholics to unite in campaigning against gay marriages and gay adoptions.

The poll found 54 percent favor a constitutional amendment barring gay marriage and specifying that marriage only be between a man and a woman, while 42 percent oppose it.

"The public clearly draws the line at gay marriage," said Karlyn Bowman, a public opinion analyst at the American Enterprise (news - web sites) Institute, a think tank in Washington. She said it's less clear if civil unions will be a significant issue by the election in November 2004.

"There's often a bit of rethinking on an issue after a big development like a Supreme Court decision," she said.

At least some of those surveyed who back gay marriage say the issue could determine how they vote in 2004.

"It might make a significant difference in whether I would support a candidate," said Jody Moore, a graduate student living in the suburbs of Los Angeles, who favors gay marriage. "It's a question of dignity."

The AP poll also suggested public attitudes vary by age. Support for civil unions and opposition to laws against gay marriage were significantly higher among young adults and dipped progressively among older age groups. Men were more likely than women to oppose gay marriage and support laws against it.

Residents of more rural areas were significantly more likely to favor laws against civil unions and gay marriage.

The poll of 1,028 adults conducted from Aug. 8-12 and has an error margin of plus or minus 3 percentage points.




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There are things known, and there are things unknown, and in between are the doors - Morrison


Edited by neutralizer (08/19/03 04:36 AM)


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Offlineentiformatie
EvolutionaryMovements
Male
Registered: 03/06/03
Posts: 1,043
Loc: miami, florida
Last seen: 8 years, 29 days
Re: gay marriage [Re: neutralizer]
    #1830826 - 08/19/03 07:29 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

good fucking god. i thought we were in some... progressive age or something. you know, people starting to break down the walls of ignorance that seperate us all. goddamn.

shit like this really upsets me, and gets me cynical. now i'ma fantasize about killing people and shit.


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/opinion
.sean


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Offlineneutralizer
Spiritual beinghaving a Humanexperience
Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 635
Loc: This Planet Earth
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: entiformatie]
    #1830832 - 08/19/03 07:31 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

President Bush (news - web sites) has said he supports efforts to legally ban gay marriage, but encourages tolerance of gays and lesbians.



In a way, this reminds me of the whole "seperate but equal" thing that was done to minorities decades ago.


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There are things known, and there are things unknown, and in between are the doors - Morrison


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Offlinedibbles
Just a normalguy with nothingto lose.

Registered: 06/09/03
Posts: 554
Loc: Exactly where you'd never...
Last seen: 5 years, 2 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: neutralizer]
    #1831322 - 08/19/03 10:41 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

People are morons, if 2 people want to get married, let them A) it wont negativly effect you B) it should be there human right, as much as you have the right to marry a women, its unfortunate are society is still plagued with ignorance


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You've succumb to an empty fate, your false prophets are gone, your life,meaningless, your heart and head broken, and we're all laughing.


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OfflineDeiymiyan
I AM

Registered: 04/17/03
Posts: 656
Loc: Within the Realm of Imagi...
Last seen: 7 years, 4 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: neutralizer]
    #1834570 - 08/20/03 07:39 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Rhizoid: "Marriage is just a contract between two people. The law should be completely neutral about such contracts. If two gay people want to marry each other, let them. If seven dwarfs and a woman wants to marry each other, let them. Keep the laws about the responsibilites that parents have toward their children, but let marriage be a private thing."
--------------------


Agreed.  It should be  their private descision.
=============



neutralizer: "But it's against God! He'll send us all to hell if we allow it! He'll allow the terrorists to create another 9/11!"
--------------------


If it WAS against the rules, then it would not exist...  It is obviously natural: there are examples of it in nature..

I'm pretty sure we are an integral part of nature as well.  Why not just accept it as natural?



The concept of Hell and the events of 911 have nothing to do with being gay.  :oogle:


 


--------------------


Dei Gratia de integro,

Veni Vidi Vici:

In Nomine Domini..



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Offlineneutralizer
Spiritual beinghaving a Humanexperience
Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 635
Loc: This Planet Earth
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: Deiymiyan]
    #1834719 - 08/20/03 08:26 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Sorry Deiymiyan, I was trying to be clever and make fun of Jerry Fallwell when he said that God allowed the Sept. 11 attacks because of our tolerance of homosexuality (and abortion and other stuff). To be fair, he did later retract his statement. But it was as good of a reactionary fundamentalist reaction as you could hope for.


--------------------
There are things known, and there are things unknown, and in between are the doors - Morrison


Edited by neutralizer (08/20/03 08:27 PM)


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Offlinesirreal
devoid
Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 1,775
Loc: In the borderlands
Last seen: 9 years, 7 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: nubious]
    #1834748 - 08/20/03 08:38 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

How can you "remove religion" in a world were people are supposed to be free to believe what they want? People obviously want religion. The majority, anyway.


I agree that people should be allowed to pursue happiness.


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I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


Edited by sirreal (08/20/03 08:40 PM)


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OfflineOtto
observer

Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 33
Loc: the middle of somewhere
Last seen: 8 years, 7 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: sirreal]
    #1834783 - 08/20/03 08:51 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I find it funny (and very hypocritical) that Americans don't have a problem with watching 5 gay men give a straight man a makeover, yet when it comes to giving them legal rights the majority of people are against it.

The legal rights are very important too. For tax purposes, hospital visitation, esate issues, etc...


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Anonymous

Re: gay marriage [Re: Otto]
    #1834804 - 08/20/03 08:57 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

To hell with gays, burn them all to the stake.


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Anonymous

Re: gay marriage [Re: ]
    #1834814 - 08/20/03 08:58 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

just another intelligent post by me....


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Offlineneutralizer
Spiritual beinghaving a Humanexperience
Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 635
Loc: This Planet Earth
Last seen: 9 years, 9 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: ]
    #1834828 - 08/20/03 09:01 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

I feel the same way, but about straight people :wink:


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There are things known, and there are things unknown, and in between are the doors - Morrison


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OfflineChimera
Eyes wide open!

Registered: 06/27/03
Posts: 112
Loc: Great Smoky Mountains
Last seen: 2 years, 6 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: neutralizer]
    #1834853 - 08/20/03 09:10 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Straight people are so gay.

:grin: :grin: :grin: 


--------------------


"Climb the mountains and get their good tidings.  Nature's peace will flow into you as sunshine flows into trees.  The winds will blow their own freshness into you, and the storms their energy, while cares will drop off like autumn leaves." - John Muir


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OfflineAmnesiac
Re-memberingcosmic wisdom

Registered: 03/30/03
Posts: 188
Loc: Unknown
Last seen: 12 years, 2 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: neutralizer]
    #1834903 - 08/20/03 09:24 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

America, land of freedom and liberty... except, of course, if the majority of old white people think you don't deserve it.

To continue this sort of persecution and bigotry under the name of freedom is the most hypocritical pile of horse shit I've ever had the displeasure of inhaling.

The real America died a long time ago. I just can't believe so many Americans are still living under the illusion that they are the "free world".


--------------------
Here we are, in these bodies, on this planet in an endless universe. This is not the extent of who we are... merely an extension of who we really are.


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Offlinesirreal
devoid
Registered: 01/11/03
Posts: 1,775
Loc: In the borderlands
Last seen: 9 years, 7 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: Amnesiac]
    #1834919 - 08/20/03 09:28 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

The real America died a long time ago.







America has never been tolerant of gay people.


--------------------
I may not always tell the truth, but atleast I'm honest
-----------

I see what everyone is saying. It is so hard to form an opinion when you see both sides so clearly!


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OfflineMurex
Reality Hacker

Registered: 07/28/02
Posts: 3,599
Loc: Traped in a shell.
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
Re: gay marriage [Re: sirreal]
    #1835365 - 08/20/03 11:17 PM (13 years, 3 months ago)

Damn straight!


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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