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OfflineSpaceVox
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Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic).
    #18256595 - 05/13/13 07:29 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

4/20 I spawned this monotub. Now 3 weeks later it still hasn't reached 100%. Spawned:Bulk = 1:2. Rye to verm/coir/gypsum. My guess it is too wet because a dryer tub I made colonized within 2 weeks. Also I did use a 'frosting layer' of substrate when spawning (about 1cm).


This is what it looks like now:


I already drained excess water with a small hole in the bottom of the tub.

Now I was wondering what my best option was. Just give it more time? Drain more water somehow? Fruit and hope for the best?

Thanks in advance shroomery!


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OfflineProfessorPinHead
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: SpaceVox]
    #18256677 - 05/13/13 08:18 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Can you give that sucker a sniff?

If you can and it smells like gym shoes it is likely hit with bacteria.

If it smells fresh  and mushroomy it is probably fine. I would suspect the former rather than the later considering the fact it isn't finished colonizing and has taken so long,.

There is the possibility it is the genetics are just very slow also but I wouldn't put as much stock in that. 

The issue with the water shouldn't be that big of a deal with a mono because if there is a little too much the substrate will drain and the water will leak out under the liner. The mycelium will also push the water it doesn't need away after the rest has drained as it grows which also helps balance the moisture out.

Don't get me wrong though it is definitely better to start out at field capacity than over saturated but it happens and usually sorts itself out during colonization. 

If it is taking that long there may have been an issue with the pasteurization process or the grain.

DId you use the bucket tek? Sometimes this can bite you in the butt if you don't do it correctly.

If the heat cools too fast or the water raises the temp of the sub too much for too long you can end up with issues.

It is more likely the coir than the grain, if it had been the grain it would probably have gone green by now and that frosting layer wouldn't look so healthy.

In the future you are better off not adding a frosting layer.

They tend to open a small vector for contamination due to the grains being exposed to open air.

If any of them are broken and have any areas that are not colonized you are introducing unsterile food for bacteria or mold to the environment by frosting it...


If it does have a little bacteria it might still make it. Sometimes the myc will overrun it and chew through it and fruit anyway. Sometimes the opposite will happen,

Given these factors I would recommend being patient and hoping for the best.

May the Shroom Gods be with you! :shitstorm:


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OfflineSpaceVox
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: ProfessorPinHead]
    #18256699 - 05/13/13 08:28 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

I used proper pasteurization (Frank). Just gave it a sniff and didn't smell any bad thing happening in there. Just the accumulated stale air.

I will just give it some more time. My guess it went bad because of slightly too wet substrate + dunking my grains + the top layer.

Mono tubs are harder than I thought :P

Thanks a lot for your elaborate answer!


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OfflineProfessorPinHead
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: SpaceVox]
    #18256720 - 05/13/13 08:35 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

You are welcome.

I also noticed another thing... Do you have your holes taped shut?

If so that may be an issue. Sometimes a tub will take a little longer to colonize if it is taped off due to the higher CO2 levels.

I have actually even seen them contaminate in with taped off holes but the tub was also in a black trash bag at the time.

It was a long time ago, :lol:

Mushroom mycelium uses O2 to breath....

You can always colonize them with the holes plugged tightly instead of taped to eliminate the high CO2 situation.

With that set up the polyfil will wick fresh gases into the tub which will help with mycelial growth.

I hadn't realized you dunked your grains. That is not really necessary.

It is good to hear that it smells good.

I would be willing to wager that tub will pull through given that fact.

Now it is just a waiting game.


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OfflineSpaceVox
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: SpaceVox]
    #18256733 - 05/13/13 08:38 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Ow and after rereading your comment I didn't use grain as a frosting layer but coir/verm.


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OfflineSpaceVox
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: SpaceVox]
    #18256743 - 05/13/13 08:39 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

I will add one hole with polyfill (very tight)


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OfflineProfessorPinHead
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: SpaceVox]
    #18256755 - 05/13/13 08:43 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

SpaceVox said:
Ow and after rereading your comment I didn't use grain as a frosting layer but coir/verm.





Oh, I see. I thought you were referring to grain because that is what we used to refer to as a 'frosting layer'.

You do want a layer of sub on top of the last layer of grain. That you definitely did correctly. :thumbup:

Quote:

SpaceVox said:
I will add one hole with polyfill (very tight)




2 may be even better. :smile:

With two holes the wicking action will be much greater.

Think of it like this...

What happens if someone smokes in a room with 1 window open?

Not much of the smoke escapes.

WHat happens if you open a second window?

Now a current of air escapes and takes all the smoke out with it.

If you are worried about the polyfil allowing contams to enter that won't happen.

The Polyfil provides a tight enough filter to keep a pasteurized sub clean enough to colonize.


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OfflineSpaceVox
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: SpaceVox]
    #18256771 - 05/13/13 08:50 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

I just added one hole. Just one because it seems I have alot of moving air in my house. Another tub is bruising near the tight holes even without a fan running.

And you sir are awesome for taking the time to help me out like this!


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OfflineProfessorPinHead
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: SpaceVox]
    #18256880 - 05/13/13 09:47 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Sounds like a much better situation than no holes at all. :thumbup:

I'll kep my eye out for the thread. Keep me updated on your progress. :smile:


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Offlineveda_sticks
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: ProfessorPinHead]
    #18286733 - 05/19/13 06:44 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

coincedently i have 2 tubs which were spawned a day apart. the tub with holes taped up with micropore colinised in 10 days.

The other tub that had no holes in it (to test out that the imperfect fitting lid providing enough gas exchange out) is not even 50% colinsed and my other tub has been in fruiting for a few days now.

Its multispore so could just be coincedence, i have cracked the lid a couple of times over the last few days but its not seemed to speed up any.

Sorry its not really another suggestion just thought id share my experience with some form of gas exchange through the holes rather than nothing at all and relying on the lid not forming a perfect seal.

Multispore can play a big role, maybe sometimes you just get some ginetics that arnt so tolerent of co2


--------------------

PF TEK - writeup by EvilMushroom666
Lets Grow Mushrooms - RogerRabbit & RoadKills website with sample videos plus the full PF TEK video series. Alot of great information - BUY THE DVD
Cakes can and will pin! - So you think cakes suck for pins. Your wrong
Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
Franks Spawning To Bulk - Monotub
Professor Pinheads RTV Injection Port Tek
Foo Mans No Soak WBS Prep Tek


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OfflineSpaceVox
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: veda_sticks]
    #18286763 - 05/19/13 07:01 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

veda_sticks said:
coincedently i have 2 tubs which were spawned a day apart. the tub with holes taped up with micropore colinised in 10 days.

The other tub that had no holes in it (to test out that the imperfect fitting lid providing enough gas exchange out) is not even 50% colinsed and my other tub has been in fruiting for a few days now.

Its multispore so could just be coincedence, i have cracked the lid a couple of times over the last few days but its not seemed to speed up any.

Sorry its not really another suggestion just thought id share my experience with some form of gas exchange through the holes rather than nothing at all and relying on the lid not forming a perfect seal.

Multispore can play a big role, maybe sometimes you just get some ginetics that arnt so tolerent of co2




After adding the polyfill in one of the holes it seems colonizing slightly faster, but it hard to know for sure.


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Offlinexaylon420
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: veda_sticks]
    #18286885 - 05/19/13 07:58 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

i didn't read this entire thread however i know sometime's a tub seals too tight and doesn't allow enough ge. that's why some ppl tape the bottom holes and then pack the top holes VERY TIGHTLY during this phase. i think it was "citric"? don't hold me to it, but i saw pictures of tubs stacked and it explained this way. personally i haven't had a problem with just taping mine up, but it COULD be an issue. check your seals, just food for thought. :wink:


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OfflineSpaceVox
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: xaylon420]
    #18286908 - 05/19/13 08:06 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

xaylon420 said:
i didn't read this entire thread however i know sometime's a tub seals too tight and doesn't allow enough ge. that's why some ppl tape the bottom holes and then pack the top holes VERY TIGHTLY during this phase. i think it was "citric"? don't hold me to it, but i saw pictures of tubs stacked and it explained this way. personally i haven't had a problem with just taping mine up, but it COULD be an issue. check your seals, just food for thought. :wink:




I used 2 identical tubs (not stacked on each other). One of them colonized just fine. Only difference was water content. But then again it was a MS :wink:


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Offlineveda_sticks
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: xaylon420]
    #18286914 - 05/19/13 08:09 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

yeah i think the tubs i have at the moment just happen to be very well made and the lids make a good seal. they certaiinly pop on very tightly.

Not like my SAB tub which lid never sits on the tub properly due to warped plastic (plastics thinner aswell compare to my mono tubs)

yeah that could be your issue aswell moisture content will definatly effect colinisation speed especially if it was on either end of being too dry or to wet, a little to dry or a little to wet doesnt seem to be much of a problem but its its way off then its obviously bad.


--------------------

PF TEK - writeup by EvilMushroom666
Lets Grow Mushrooms - RogerRabbit & RoadKills website with sample videos plus the full PF TEK video series. Alot of great information - BUY THE DVD
Cakes can and will pin! - So you think cakes suck for pins. Your wrong
Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
Franks Spawning To Bulk - Monotub
Professor Pinheads RTV Injection Port Tek
Foo Mans No Soak WBS Prep Tek


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OfflineSpaceVox
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: veda_sticks]
    #18286922 - 05/19/13 08:12 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

veda_sticks said:
yeah i think the tubs i have at the moment just happen to be very well made and the lids make a good seal. they certaiinly pop on very tightly.

Not like my SAB tub which lid never sits on the tub properly due to warped plastic (plastics thinner aswell compare to my mono tubs)

yeah that could be your issue aswell moisture content will definatly effect colinisation speed especially if it was on either end of being too dry or to wet, a little to dry or a little to wet doesnt seem to be much of a problem but its its way off then its obviously bad.




I think I just need a lot of experimentation :smile:

Thanks for the input veda!


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Offlineveda_sticks
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: SpaceVox]
    #18286933 - 05/19/13 08:17 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

I think i might need to add holes to my tub its just going so much slower compared to my other one


--------------------

PF TEK - writeup by EvilMushroom666
Lets Grow Mushrooms - RogerRabbit & RoadKills website with sample videos plus the full PF TEK video series. Alot of great information - BUY THE DVD
Cakes can and will pin! - So you think cakes suck for pins. Your wrong
Franks Simple Coir/Verm Tek
Franks Proper Pasturisation Tek
Franks Spawning To Bulk - Monotub
Professor Pinheads RTV Injection Port Tek
Foo Mans No Soak WBS Prep Tek


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InvisibleFrankHorrigan
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: veda_sticks]
    #18286975 - 05/19/13 08:42 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

veda_sticks said:
I think i might need to add holes to my tub its just going so much slower compared to my other one




I tape all my holes up and then I also place a thick, warm blanket over my colonizing tubs.

I can't say I've ever seen a tub stall out from lack of GE in this situation.  Just my 2 cents I guess :thumbup:


--------------------

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Here is how I get things done.
You should take a look. :hehehe:


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InvisibleCitric
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: xaylon420]
    #18289399 - 05/19/13 08:09 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

xaylon420 said:
i didn't read this entire thread however i know sometime's a tub seals too tight and doesn't allow enough ge. that's why some ppl tape the bottom holes and then pack the top holes VERY TIGHTLY during this phase. i think it was "citric"? don't hold me to it, but i saw pictures of tubs stacked and it explained this way. personally i haven't had a problem with just taping mine up, but it COULD be an issue. check your seals, just food for thought. :wink:




I taped my holes off during the spawn run, and cover them with a blanket to insulate them.




Just like Frank said
*Ponders where he got it from*  :tongue:


--------------------
Self Healing lid tek ** Update 10.17.17 **
Mini casing pictures: Pins to harvest
Cup O' Shrooms
Magash:  I noticed my contams were in the shape of fingers :whack:
Hyphae:  Yes  "Loss of moisture from the substrate"  is not a casing trigger.  :cuckoo:

My final Grow!


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Offlinexaylon420
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: Citric]
    #18290083 - 05/19/13 10:17 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

well i apologize for thinking it was you citric. :shrug: i know i've read about it several times lol. searched it and found several threads on it too. the tight poly in the top hole if you have perfectly sealed lids. i know i've done it both ways, same results lol.

edit: ps i love the quilt!!  oldschool!


Edited by xaylon420 (05/19/13 10:18 PM)


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OfflineSpaceVox
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Re: Monotub slowed down colonizing, too wet and a to big top layer (pic). [Re: xaylon420]
    #18291590 - 05/20/13 08:36 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Fruited it today. It smells good and I think I spotted some knots. I will post pics as soon as something happens. Also making a new tub tomorrow without the top layer :wink:


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