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InvisibleSwami
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Is criticism negative?
    #1822841 - 08/17/03 03:29 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Was Abe Lincoln being negative when he criticized slavery?

Were 1960's hippies negative when they protested the Vietnam War?

(Insert one of a million other examples.)

Yet when an unsound idea on these boards is challenged, it is automatically assumed that the poster has a negative outlook on life. Why is this?



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The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineEarth_Droid
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Swami]
    #1822850 - 08/17/03 03:31 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Of course not all criticism is negative.


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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Swami]
    #1822852 - 08/17/03 03:31 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

because you are on a spirituality board run by hippies and people that use drugs.

dont be such a bummer, mang :smile:


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peace, pot, and microdot!


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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #1822866 - 08/17/03 03:36 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Also, there's a big difference between criticizing someone who says:

"This is the way it is for everyone. believe it without question. I know everything. Send me all your money."

and criticing someone who says:

"You guys are perfectly entitled to your own opinion but this is the way I think and it makes sense to me."


--------------------
peace, pot, and microdot!


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OfflineRastafari
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #1822893 - 08/17/03 03:46 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

i agree with doctorJ

well put


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I&I


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OfflineMalachi
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Rastafari]
    #1823259 - 08/17/03 05:32 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

yeah no doubt, don't try to clothe the issue as good intentioned and helpful criticism, what people get irate about is your obstinate tone.

in other words, I agree with doctor j too.


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The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: DoctorJ]
    #1823774 - 08/17/03 08:26 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

If you don't want your ideas criticized, then why are you posting them in a philosophy debate forum?

If someone's ideas are silly, illogical or downright stupid, I'll point that out.

It's not like believers don't act superior and condescending. There's lots of folks here who are pretty sure that they're superior to the unenlightened masses.

The only people who have a problem with Swami's posts are those that can't hold their own in a debate with him. Anyone who truly enjoys thinking will cherish the opportunity to have their ideas challenged by the harshest critics.


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"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineRastafari
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Phluck]
    #1823787 - 08/17/03 08:31 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

"*Spirituality and Philosophy*
A place to discuss spirituality, philosophy and religion."


i dont know why people say this is a debate forum... I think people would be able to understand each other alot better if they kept their mind open and were respectful towards each others beleifs/religion/cast/creed


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I&I


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Anonymous

Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Phluck]
    #1823798 - 08/17/03 08:36 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

If someone's ideas are silly, illogical or downright stupid, I'll point that out.

The problem is, what people consider "silly, illogical or downright stupid" is totally subjective. Even logic can be subjective in certain circumstances.


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OfflineRastafari
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: ]
    #1823819 - 08/17/03 08:43 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

subjectiveness is definitely abundant.


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I&I


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Rastafari]
    #1823820 - 08/17/03 08:43 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Obviously you've never taken any philosophy courses or read any books on philosophy.

Debate is what philosophy is based on. It is how ideas are refined and formed. If your ideas have huge logical flaws, sometimes you need someone else to point them out to you so you can refine them. If criticism of your ideas offends you, maybe you need to rethink the reasons you hold these beliefs.

I think that understanding others also involves understanding the psychology behind believing strange and illogical ideas.


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineRastafari
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Phluck]
    #1823832 - 08/17/03 08:46 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

strange and illogical idea's are subjective, and oftenly only interpreted as such by the person crowning them so

understanding others requires the respect of inquiry rather than an attack


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I&I


Edited by Rastafari (08/17/03 08:48 PM)


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InvisibleTrippeeChik
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Rastafari]
    #1823843 - 08/17/03 08:50 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

if your belief(s) cant hold up to criticism, maybe its a sign to rethink it.


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look buddy,,


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OfflineCleverName
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Swami]
    #1823855 - 08/17/03 08:53 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

i welcome contructive criticism...i believe its another way of learning and growing. i suppose many people feel that criticism on their thoughts is direct criticism on them or perhaps they feel that criticism=judgement...i dont know...i think at the bottom of things most people want to be understood and appreciated.


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if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?

this is the purpose


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OfflineRastafari
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: TrippeeChik]
    #1823861 - 08/17/03 08:54 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

perhaps if you like to critisize people all day long in the spiritulity forum, then maybe you should rethink going there... maybe it would feel like removing a sack of bricks from your shoulder

teacher's usually only allow consructive critisism during critiques... When you involve peoples spiritual beleifs (their highest goals and virtues) then you will definitely get people who are going to take offense when they receive no respect.

there is such of a thing called constructive critisism


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I&I


Edited by Rastafari (08/17/03 08:56 PM)


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OfflinePhluck
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Rastafari]
    #1823864 - 08/17/03 08:55 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Debate is a game, not an attack. It is a civil exchange of ideas.

If someone tries to tell you that 1 + 1 = 3 would you not correct the flaw in their logic?


--------------------
"I have no valid complaint against hustlers. No rational bitch. But the act of selling is repulsive to me. I harbor a secret urge to whack a salesman in the face, crack his teeth and put red bumps around his eyes." -Hunter S Thompson
http://phluck.is-after.us


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OfflineRastafari
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Phluck]
    #1823873 - 08/17/03 08:58 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Sure you would, but you wouldnt go about it by saying, "You know nothing about math, I'm afraid you wont ever"

how would you expect them to learn from that

so I think there needs to be some qualities of respect when your introducing a new idea to somone else


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I&I


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Phluck]
    #1823885 - 08/17/03 09:02 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I hate it when diss others for questioning their ideas. I love debate. I like to test the soundness of my ideas. I have some beliefs which I cannot prove, such as the oneness of all things, but I state it anyway just to be sure nobody can disprove it.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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InvisibleTrippeeChik
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: Rastafari]
    #1823908 - 08/17/03 09:08 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

you posted I'm please asking anyone who concludes that this story is invalid, please to not respond. (i hope thats not too much to ask) unless of course you have something positive to say

how is that welcoming constructive criticism? and sirreal asks you what your point is, and you call it negative? how does that make sense?


--------------------
look buddy,,


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OfflineMalachi
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Re: Is criticism negative? [Re: silversoul7]
    #1823916 - 08/17/03 09:09 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

ok, virtually anyone would rally behind the banner of the great dialectic- that's not the what the criticism (the criticism of criticism) is about. the rasta fellow is all mad cause swami is hating on his faith with logic, which in the realm of faith is an irrelevant ground.


--------------------
The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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