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Offlineshakta
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: Azmodeus]
    #1813501 - 08/14/03 02:30 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Well, since no one here has seen that happen, I am hoping it is not the norm. We already have many socialist programs in existance. I just don't think we need any more.


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OfflineCornholio
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Registered: 01/13/03
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: shakta]
    #1813518 - 08/14/03 02:35 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

shakta said:
The only other major problem I see with it are the amount of private jobs that will be lost, and the cost of implementing such a thing.


As long as doctors are paid at a rate similar to what they're getting now, most probably wouldn't mind working for the Govt.
Quote:

Can you imagine how much that would cost?


Well, the healthcare we're getting now isn't exactly free. All the money that we're spending now on insurance would be freed up, and that same money would go to taxes. The only new expense would be to cover the 20% of Americans that currently don't have insurance.
Quote:

I don't think the issue is all about selfishness either. I think a lot of people here don't want to live in a socialist country and they see this as the first step.


I don't follow that logic at all. This is how I would paraphrase that: "Better to let people die than to follow a socialist policy". Sadly though, I think that's how many people think.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: Cornholio]
    #1813546 - 08/14/03 02:42 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

"Better to let people die than to follow a socialist policy". 



See, even you are right once in awhile.  :wink:


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineCornholio
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1813563 - 08/14/03 02:48 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

:lol:  :lol:  :lol: 


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Offlineshakta
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: Cornholio]
    #1813570 - 08/14/03 02:50 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I wasn't talking about the doctors only. They make up a small amount of the people affected. How about all the people that work at the insurance companies? Also, the cost of converting to such a large system would be huge.


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OfflineCornholio
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: shakta]
    #1813594 - 08/14/03 02:56 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Like I said, so long as we're the only country that opposes healthcare for everyone, I have to respect the majority opinion.


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Offlineshakta
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: Cornholio]
    #1813613 - 08/14/03 03:01 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Why? You don't on any other issue. :smile:


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OfflineCornholio
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: shakta]
    #1813628 - 08/14/03 03:05 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Oh that doesn't mean I agree with the selfish majority opinion!!!  :wink: 


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: shakta]
    #1813631 - 08/14/03 03:06 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Because he has a job WITH health insurance and it relativly inexpensive.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: Cornholio]
    #1813637 - 08/14/03 03:07 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

The majority also thinks Bush is OK, guns are good, and affirmative action is bad.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineCornholio
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1813672 - 08/14/03 03:15 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

...so I've got to educate them about Bush (actually, I consider myself relatively neutral on gun control and affirmative action; I couldn't care less which way those laws go).


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1814182 - 08/14/03 05:42 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

The Wonders of Socialized Medicine, the Horrors of British Teeth

We have to salute the New York Times, for a change. Though it frequently agitates for the feds to impose socialized medicine on Americans, it is honest enough to expose the nightmare of the United Kingdom's government health system.

In one of the funniest episodes of "The Simpsons," a deranged dentist terrifies children into improving their brushing and flossing by forcing them to page through the ghastly "Big Book of British Smiles." Americans have long wondered why our English friends have such horrible teeth. Even the likes of Tony Blair and Prince Charles have choppers like those of a Detroit crack addict or San Francisco vagrant.

Here's one reason: The so-called National Health Service has wreaked havoc on the U.K.'s dental care.

The Times reports that things are so bad that 600 dentally challenged Welshmen laid siege to one dental office in Carmarthen in a desperate effort to get an appointment. People came from 90 miles away, pitched tents and even attempted bribery.

The article features a frightening photo of an unfortunate man named Steven Ackworth attempting a grin.

"My crowns all fell off," he said. "I got some really bad dentistry, and it ruined all my root work. I have no front teeth and one pair of molars, which meet on the right side of my mouth. I can't bite anything."

The dentist in Carmarthen had to turn away 300 angry citizens.

"Because they are paying national insurance, people feel they are entitled to service," said Heather Davies, the office manager.

Imagine that. What nerve, expecting to get what you pay for.

What remains of the free market is keeping the U.K. from losing its last molar and bicuspid. More and more docs are fleeing for private practice.

"Dentists do go private because they don't have to work at the same frenetic pace they do at the NHS, and there is a better quality of care for the dentists," said Stuart Geddes, director of British Dental Association.

Whereas an American dentist sees 12 patients a day, Britain's government dentists must tend to 30, 40 or even 50 mouths a day, the newspaper says.



How nice that we know what to expect when HillaryCare becomes the law of the land.


Bad teeth


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineCornholio
A liberal guy(on hiatus)

Registered: 01/13/03
Posts: 845
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1814512 - 08/14/03 07:30 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
What remains of the free market is keeping the U.K. from losing its last molar and bicuspid. More and more docs are fleeing for private practice.

"Dentists do go private because they don't have to work at the same frenetic pace they do at the NHS, and there is a better quality of care for the dentists," said Stuart Geddes, director of British Dental Association.


Sounds like people who want private dental care are getting it! Besides, do you think there's no American medical horror stories?


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: Cornholio]
    #1814719 - 08/14/03 08:20 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Quote:

Sounds like people who want private dental care are getting it! Besides, do you think there's no American medical horror stories?





It's not the ones who want private care who are suffering. The poor are suffering as a result of the system so many here desire.

Of course there are American horror stories. I just happened to like this story because it's both true and funny. (as relates to the stereotypical Englishman) (which by the way Alpo & Gazz, I'm aware it is a stereotype)  :kiss:


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinemonoamine
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Registered: 09/07/02
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1815381 - 08/15/03 12:05 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I think you righties can calm down.I don't see any chance in hell that the whole medical industry could be socialized in the U.S.,there are too many lobbies and other vested interests. I'm sure the insurance industry wouldn't go down without a huge battle.

When people point out flaws with Canada and Britain's socialized system, I think they tend to oversimplify the whole thing. You also have to remember cultural,economic,and political differences. It's like comparing apples and oranges. And with America basically being the leader in medicine,these other countries have to do things like import expensive drugs on patent,lack of competant doctors,etc. (as that article pointed out,dentists in the U.K. are seeing three times as many patients a day,which probably means there is a lack of dentists).

And what about other countries with socialized health care? I could be wrong,be I hear the Scandinavian countries and such with socialized systems are doing pretty well.


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People think that if you just say the word "hallucinations" it explains everything you want it to explain and eventually whatever it is you can't explain will just go away.It's just a word,it doesn't explain anything...
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Edited by grandmasterfat (08/15/03 12:10 AM)


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Offlineshakta
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Re: U.S. doctors call for Canadian-style health insurance [Re: monoamine]
    #1816249 - 08/15/03 09:09 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I agree with your points. The Scandinavian countries do have good systems from what I have heard. The taxes there are also outrageous.


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