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Sillyputty67

Registered: 10/06/12
Posts: 2,239
Loc: Netherlands
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Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin 1
#17956628 - 03/14/13 06:46 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Its completely reasonable that a plasmid auto replicating sequence could be isoloated from active mushrooms. This sequence could in turn be give to yeast, who will then assemble the sequences into their own.
Apparently fungi are the easiest lifeform to engineer.
The implications are mind numbing. Brew a pail of sugar/nutrients for a week or 2 etc...
Edited by Sillyputty67 (03/14/13 06:47 PM)
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Tmethyl
Smear in the shale


Registered: 07/16/12
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Sillyputty67]
#17956735 - 03/14/13 07:02 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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-------------------- ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Amphibolos
Le bourgeois gentilhomme




Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 626
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Tmethyl] 2
#17957398 - 03/14/13 09:06 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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I think the problem atm is that the genome of the psilocybe species arent sequenced.
Also it is hard to implement the psilocybin pathway if you dont know the enzymes implicated in the process itself. Also, to get a suitable yield, you would have to find the limiting steps in the pathway and find a way to bypass its limitations.
However, i think that sequencing the genome would cost us like what 500$? And i'm sure that some enthusiasts (myself included) wouldnt mind working on the sequence. I dont have experience regarding to genome annoting but they are developping alot of tools that make it somewhat easy.
It could be made in a kickstarter form, its a nice project and im sure alot of people would enjoy it 
It could be possible to do the same thing for the THC biosynthesis pathway since im sure they already managed it for some opiates
Here is a metabolic pathway of another basidiomycete (Coprinus cinerea), it give you an idea of the work that needs to be done. Coprinus cinerea
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"Homo sum ; humani nihil a me alienum puto"
Edited by Amphibolos (03/14/13 09:21 PM)
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Sexycybe
bio-nut


Registered: 05/03/11
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Amphibolos]
#17959150 - 03/15/13 05:57 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Saw a post on this 2 years ago but instead of psilocybin they proposed THC. they only estimated it to be around $40,000-$60,000 from memory..
-------------------- Successful indoor psilocybe subaeruginosa grow Nothing written above is real; it is merely a fabricated story of nonsense. Nothing said is to be believed in any way or taken seriously in the slightest.
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Sillyputty67

Registered: 10/06/12
Posts: 2,239
Loc: Netherlands
Last seen: 9 years, 8 months
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Sexycybe]
#17959192 - 03/15/13 06:27 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Wow,very nice Guys!!!!! I saw some kits for around 600$ on a science site a few months back, for genetic engineering, and biotech. I dont have the foggiest idea where to begin isolating a sequence. Perhaps if we all put our heads together, pooled some money, we could make this happen. 
edit. I think a huge difference between thc and psilocybin, is psilocybin is water soluble, making it much easier to deal with post production.
-------------------- 1) Everything I ever posted or say is a lie.
Edited by Sillyputty67 (03/15/13 06:34 AM)
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Sexycybe
bio-nut


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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Sillyputty67]
#17962813 - 03/15/13 11:59 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Yeah it was said the oil would have to be skimmed daily, more demand for it as apposed to psilocybin too. seeing as it is legal in some areas and used for medicine, it would be possible to get a research grant so they don't have to bother growing marijuana and then refine the oil.
-------------------- Successful indoor psilocybe subaeruginosa grow Nothing written above is real; it is merely a fabricated story of nonsense. Nothing said is to be believed in any way or taken seriously in the slightest.
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nooneman


Registered: 04/24/09
Posts: 14,700
Loc: Utah
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Sillyputty67]
#17962930 - 03/16/13 12:54 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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First, this really isn't advanced mycology.
Maybe it would be possible for a team of people with PhDs and millions of dollars of grant money and access to high end professional labs to attempt something like this, but for all practical purposes what you're proposing is totally impossible.
It's also totally useless. Isn't not like cubes are hard to grow. Psilocybin is already insanely easy to make in the form of psilocybin producing mushrooms. There would be no benefit to making psilocybin producing yeast.
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cli_hlt
Beshroomed



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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: nooneman]
#17963512 - 03/16/13 06:53 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Maybe there's an escape route.
I heard that the (almost) spent substrate - if it's edible like rice - can make you trip is you eat it.
Maybe someone can brew an LC and extract the (possible) psilocybin content.
Any thoughts?
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Sexycybe
bio-nut


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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: cli_hlt]
#17963534 - 03/16/13 07:03 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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why not just eat the mushrooms and drink a beer? There is not much point in making an alcoholic LC solution... plus ethanol tends to kill mycelium
The idea here is that instead of the yeast producing ethanol as a waste it produces psilocybin but as nooneman stated, may as well just grow the mushrooms, it's not hard
-------------------- Successful indoor psilocybe subaeruginosa grow Nothing written above is real; it is merely a fabricated story of nonsense. Nothing said is to be believed in any way or taken seriously in the slightest.
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



Registered: 03/26/03
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Sillyputty67] 1
#17963628 - 03/16/13 07:57 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
malicom said: Its completely reasonable that a plasmid auto replicating sequence could be isoloated from active mushrooms. This sequence could in turn be give to yeast, who will then assemble the sequences into their own.
If it's completely reasonable then do it and tell us how it went. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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cli_hlt
Beshroomed



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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Sexycybe]
#17963640 - 03/16/13 08:03 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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I phrased it bad sorry. I did not mean alcoholic fermentation of course.
I tried to say that by making a thick LC you can get active compounds quickly. Quicker than growing the actual mushrooms. It would be interesting to see how potent an LC could be.
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Sillyputty67

Registered: 10/06/12
Posts: 2,239
Loc: Netherlands
Last seen: 9 years, 8 months
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: RogerRabbit]
#17964096 - 03/16/13 11:33 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said:
Quote:
malicom said: Its completely reasonable that a plasmid auto replicating sequence could be isoloated from active mushrooms. This sequence could in turn be give to yeast, who will then assemble the sequences into their own.
If it's completely reasonable then do it and tell us how it went. RR
RR your a smart fucker with a lot of experience, but your angles here are often times hostile, or ultra condescending. If anyone were to give some good input i would hope it were you. Instead you hint that im on my own, and this is not a place to share ideas, only methods.
Yeast are fungus. Hence mycology.
An invention always starts as an idea. I assumed the place for input on this idea was here, and a place like this could make this kind of idea a reality. I guess not. I guess this is only a place for methods already accomplished, and not bleeding edge science. I guess im the ass for assuming....
-------------------- 1) Everything I ever posted or say is a lie.
Edited by Sillyputty67 (03/16/13 12:34 PM)
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cli_hlt
Beshroomed



Registered: 10/29/11
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Sillyputty67]
#17964179 - 03/16/13 12:03 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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To be more on-topic and hopefully release some pressure from above this topic I'd like to give you a few pieces of information I've recently acquired during my adventures in hobby-biotech (yepp, there IS such thing).
There is a worldwide movement called DIYBio.
TED talk: http://www.ted.com/talks/ellen_jorgensen_biohacking_you_can_do_it_too.html
There's also a google group.
Those gals and guys are doing some pretty amazing stuff.
The $600 kit you've talked about is probably the OpenPCR wich is a polymerase chain reaction thermocycler. It does not sequences the DNA, but can produce a lot of DNA from very little. Can be used to multiply DNA or certain DNA pieces (like a specific gene).
The result can be used to draw scientificly-looking colored bars wich can be compared to see if the neighbour's dog pissing on your plants, or can be put into a sequencing machine.
Home biotech is bit like home computers were in the mid-late 75's or early 80's. No ordinary people could acquire them and use them.
But similarly to early computers biotech is growing and evolving very rapidly. This is the next big thing. The price of full DNA sequencing fell down from millions on dollars to thousands in maybe ten years.
There are free, open source software packages (like gentle, http://gentle.magnusmanske.de/) that can be used to edit/design DNA, protein analysis/secondary structure prediction, and a lot more.
Good luck with your plans
Edited by cli_hlt (03/16/13 02:09 PM)
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Sillyputty67

Registered: 10/06/12
Posts: 2,239
Loc: Netherlands
Last seen: 9 years, 8 months
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: cli_hlt]
#17964188 - 03/16/13 12:06 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Very nice Sir. 
Now thats what im talking about!!
Perhaps something like this could be on the horizon for ordinary folk.
-------------------- 1) Everything I ever posted or say is a lie.
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Mr.Al
Alphabet soup


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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Sillyputty67]
#17964302 - 03/16/13 12:37 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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It would make an eye-catching headline if something like that happened.
Mycology works best the cleaner everything is.
Beyond that increase efficiencies of work, methodological work, work that improves your economy of motion and concentrated Awareness in the Laboratory; that will accelerate Productive Capacity.
Get rid off EVERYTHING extraneous in the WOrk Room. No artwork, Nothing on the Floors. Store extra materials in a separate clean room that is for storage of Professional materials only.
Take a THOROUGH SHOWER before entering room, WOrk room Clothes only.
DO not work when out of FOCUSED CONCENTRATION is GOOD ADVICE:
Avoiding COntamination of LAB is PAramount Indeed.
[i]Working Drunk or EVEN SLIGHTLY intoxicated could possibly, It has Before, wipe out months of work.
If you are Truly Patient you will show Discipline and become Professional in your Avocations and Hobbies.
WHy not check out HErmes' poll in Golden Dawn Thread you Fungi Noshing Fuckers...If you'd like, or are you fright of Bamboozles or Confounmnents?
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PsilyPhily
Stranger


Registered: 02/07/13
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Mr.Al]
#17973241 - 03/18/13 09:38 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Not trying to be condescending but wouldn't it be easier and cheaper to make pure psilocybin with a child's chemistry set?
I'l admit I loved the idea its just that with a single chemist's help we could make pure chemical with easy to get hold of elements, Probably alot easier than transforming yeast using genetic modification..
Phil.
-------------------- "If a drug (or technique or process) were ever to be discovered which would consistently produce a plus four experience in all human beings, it is conceivable that it would signal the ultimate evolution, and perhaps the end, of the human experiment." — Alexander Shulgin, PiHKAL, 1991 "Well Shulgin, you clearly haven't tried salvia 150X extract, good effort though."
Phil.
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Amphibolos
Le bourgeois gentilhomme




Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 626
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: nooneman] 1
#17978501 - 03/19/13 09:10 AM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
nooneman said: First, this really isn't advanced mycology.
Maybe it would be possible for a team of people with PhDs and millions of dollars of grant money and access to high end professional labs to attempt something like this, but for all practical purposes what you're proposing is totally impossible.
It's also totally useless. Isn't not like cubes are hard to grow. Psilocybin is already insanely easy to make in the form of psilocybin producing mushrooms. There would be no benefit to making psilocybin producing yeast.
I think you are wrong for most of what you wrote,
Since when mycology is only about cultivating techniques? Mycology is about the study of the Biology of fungi and Saccharomyces cerevisiae is still classified as an ascomycete therefore it is a fungus.
You have to see the project that OP has mentionned in several steps, it wont and cant be done in an instant but some of it could be done with basic biological knowledge. As someone pointed out, there are alot of programs that are open source that could permit us to manage the sequencing of the genome of P. cubensis. Once that is done we could work on annoting the genome based on the similitude of already sequenced fungi (like Coprinopsis cinerea).
I thought of it, and i agree that producing psilocybin in yeast wouldnt be that useful since the cubes are already easy to grow and spread. However, having a better understanding of P.cubensis genomic structure could make us able to produce strains with desired traits with higher efficiency and high success rates.
However, i dont think we could go that far without a proper lab, but the genome sequencing and annoting is done in silico so that could be done with the help of motivated members.
I checked at my university, we dont have access to the illumina sequencing technology, so we have to find a place where they have those installations. I contacted one of my friend relating to cost of sequencing a 36 to 50mb genome. Ill post it when its done.
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"Homo sum ; humani nihil a me alienum puto"
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Sillyputty67

Registered: 10/06/12
Posts: 2,239
Loc: Netherlands
Last seen: 9 years, 8 months
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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Amphibolos]
#17979325 - 03/19/13 01:01 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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The benefit of yeast producing active compounds is for industrial scale production. You can scale yeast fermentation way beyond mushroom cultivation much simpler and cheaper. Not to say I per se need an industrial producer. But I wouldnt mind.... You could literally reduce a 30 hour process to 2, and if thats not a good enough reason, im not sure what is..
When i make moonshine. It takes 30 min to prepare the mash, and add the yeast. It takes 2 weeks of unattended time. Unlike a fruiting chamber. It takes 3 hours to distill the alcohol. Granted you would need to find another extraction process instead of distillation. Perhaps just evaporation. If you had a product that was 1% active compounds, You could simply evap to a powder and press into tabs. The leftover metabolites of the yeast are healthy, and would make a good buffer.
The other thing to keep in mind here, is if any of us can source a machine to sequence, we need to be able to get a sample of p. Cubensis to the machine without getting incarcerated.
Edited by Sillyputty67 (03/19/13 01:34 PM)
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: Sillyputty67]
#17988333 - 03/21/13 07:09 AM (11 years, 1 month ago) |
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Quote:
malicom said:
Quote:
RogerRabbit said:
Quote:
malicom said: Its completely reasonable that a plasmid auto replicating sequence could be isoloated from active mushrooms. This sequence could in turn be give to yeast, who will then assemble the sequences into their own.
If it's completely reasonable then do it and tell us how it went. RR
RR your a smart fucker with a lot of experience, but your angles here are often times hostile, or ultra condescending. If anyone were to give some good input i would hope it were you. Instead you hint that im on my own, and this is not a place to share ideas, only methods.
Yeast are fungus. Hence mycology.
Wow.
I was hoping to gently prod you into discovering/learning the difference between a single celled organism and mushroom mycelium where the alkaloids are produced. Us science-type people like to classify things. However, yeast doesn't really care if we call it 'fungi' because of its reproductive method. My point was to get you to look closer at what you proposed by investigating rather than sitting in front of the computer waiting for someone to tell you. I apologize for asking too much. RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



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Re: Genetically modify yeast to produce psilocin/psilocybin [Re: RogerRabbit]
#17988563 - 03/21/13 09:00 AM (11 years, 1 month ago) |
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--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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