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Swami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Shroomism]
#1793694 - 08/08/03 08:00 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Actually it was the Swami Remote Viewing Challenge. He should know by now that Remote Viewing and Astral Projection are two *completely* different things, but I guess his brain still does not make that distinction.
The open-minded Challenge allowed for remote-viewing, clairvoyance, ESP, astral travel and any other non-physical means of viewing the object. Naturally, all methods failed miserably.
Sorry shroomism that I cannot determine the difference between one method that doesn't work from another method that doesn't work.
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The proof is in the pudding.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1793946 - 08/08/03 09:41 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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In science, when trying to determine whether something exists or not, do you conduct ONE test, with limited variables, and a sketchy hypothesis to begin with.. and then when you fail to achieve your desired results, conclude that it was all a waste, and from that point on base your whole opinion on that subject from that single, limited test? Because that's what it seems like to me.
No, you make more tests, with different variables, a different hypothesis, and a few constants. That one test, which you mention a lot, was not the test to end all tests. Besides, no one even claimed to have mastered clairvoyant sight, the test relied heavily on our trust with you, as you could have easily switched objects. It was not a very scientific test.
I'm up for any future challenge you may have, as I am eager to prove the existance of altered state of consciousness/perception and beyond.
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Swami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Shroomism]
#1794147 - 08/08/03 10:55 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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I'm up for any future challenge you may have, as I am eager to prove the existance of altered state of consciousness/perception and beyond.
YOU DESIGN the test and I will just put in some basic constraints to rule out fraud, collusion or misinterpretation. Now how fair is that?
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The proof is in the pudding.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1794159 - 08/08/03 10:57 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Alright, you meet me, on the astral plane, and I'll tell you something.
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1794160 - 08/08/03 10:58 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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How about this:
I'll design a test to test which on of your guy's tests is more accurate. Then Ill take the findings, sub-mulitply them by the root-factor of the square pentametre of the base-sub-con of the original data-plex, and then multiply that by the ratio sub-portion between the electronic/chemical boundry layer between my skin and my keyboard and the end product will eventually result in a by-product of my original, INTENDED predictionisisms.
-------------------- enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
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DoctorJ


Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 8,846
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Shroomism]
#1794181 - 08/08/03 11:09 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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"Oh, i see....and that is based on what exactly? How about all of the "advanced" astral travellers and remote viewers that failed the Swami Challenge in identifying a specific object in my house in a specific location?"
The CIA had a well-documented remote viewing program that was actually quite successful. I believe there is documented evidence of a team of remote viewers succesfully locating a downed russian spy jet in the middle of the wilderness.
I also recall one documented case of a CIA remote veiwer repeatedly getting the same image... a triangular shape with wings... whenever he drew it, the air force would confiscate the drawing. He found out why when the air force declassified the stealth fighter. it was that exact shape. He was trying to spy on russian planes but ended up getting classified american ones.
remote viewing works but isnt always accurate or easy to control...
the program eventually lost funding because the congressmen thought it was a frivolous expense and didn't want the taxpayers to think the government was wasting their money.
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Swami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: DoctorJ]
#1794248 - 08/08/03 11:38 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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the program eventually lost funding because:
*drum roll please*
It didn't work.
The amount of money spent was quite small and Congress has little fear of the public when it comes to defense spending. Last year alone, the GAO failed to account for over a TRILLION dollars!
How much does it cost to put a few guys in an empty room with pencil and paper?
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The proof is in the pudding.
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Autonomous
MysteriousStranger

Registered: 05/10/02
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Loc: U.S.S.A.
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1794254 - 08/08/03 11:41 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Swami said:How much does it cost to put a few guys in an empty room with pencil and paper?
If the government pays for it? Millions!!!
-------------------- "In religion and politics people's beliefs and convictions are in almost every case gotten at second-hand, and without examination." -- Mark Twain
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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1794260 - 08/08/03 11:43 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Too much, that money can be better spent, keeping drugs illegal and making lots of money, and building bigger weapons to kill people with. And buy more mansions. Oh, and making sure everyone keeps occupied watching TV and buying things and not questioning their authority.
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DoctorJ


Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 8,846
Loc: space
Last seen: 1 year, 2 months
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Shroomism]
#1794285 - 08/08/03 11:54 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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"It didn't work."
No, actually it worked quite well. The funding was cut because congess couldn't justify the expense (keeping uniquely gifted people on salary can be quite expensive) to the unenlightened public (ie- you and your ilk)
here is a link to CIA remote viewing info netted by FOIA: http://www.bvalphaserver.com/secartprint72.html
read it and make your own decision, although I'll say the stuff they release to the public is pretty watered down compared to the REAL dirt...
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: DoctorJ]
#1794385 - 08/09/03 12:54 AM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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im the invisible man, im your shadow, im the true reflection that you can never see because your eyes dont work properly.
-------------------- enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
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merlink
IntergalacticTraveler

Registered: 04/30/03
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1794456 - 08/09/03 01:32 AM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Swami,
Do you not believe that we are composed of particles which are vibrating at different rates/frequencies? 
-Merlin
-------------------- "Once you have an experience, you experience it for the rest of your life ? as time is a man-made relativity, expiration of experience is a thought." - Merlin
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Jellric
altered statesman

Registered: 11/07/98
Posts: 2,261
Loc: non-local
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: YellowSubmarine]
#1794606 - 08/09/03 03:02 AM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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As I understand your question, you mean do shrooms or pot have an effect of AP/OBEs in general, not necessarily while you are actually on them? I can' t speak from personal experience, but I've read quite a bit on the subject and the concensus seems to be yes, and a positive one. And there are some qualifiers there, such as are you using those substances to expand your mind or merely as recreation? If you are using them to expand your mind it could be helpful, because in order to have a self-willed OBE you need a belief system that allows for the possibility of AP/OBE's. Using them may allow you to mentally "clear the brush* so to speak to make way for a path of travel. I wouldn't start using just to achieve this state however- you can probably do it on your own almost as easily. As for the argument about whether some part of oneself actually leaves the body during an OBE, I view it as a distinction without a difference. To me, all things exist in the mind of God, and to OBE is to "borrow his eyes" and remotely see something that exists in his mind which ultimately is your mind. You didn't travel there, you just brought it to mind. Remote-viewing is a detached experience, OBEs are interactive.
-------------------- I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.
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Swami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Jellric]
#1795454 - 08/09/03 01:51 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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I view it as a distinction without a difference.
Sorry Jello, but it makes a HUGE difference when someone claims to have ACTUALLY travelled to a friend's house. If there is no travel to real locales, then it is pure imagination and nothing out of the ordinary.
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The proof is in the pudding.
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YellowSubmarine
Soviet Pig

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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Jellric]
#1795496 - 08/09/03 02:07 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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To asnwer your question. I began using this substances out of curiosity. It is now to a point where I strictly use them for spiritual purposes and investigation. Marijuana is used more recreationally, lately however I have strictly used the high to make induction of OBEs a little easier on my mind and body. I will bounce back and forth from meditative work stoned and sober and so far have felt no negative side effects. If anything I feel more energetic.
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Jellric
altered statesman

Registered: 11/07/98
Posts: 2,261
Loc: non-local
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1796108 - 08/09/03 05:40 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Sorry Jello, but it makes a HUGE difference when someone claims to have ACTUALLY travelled to a friend's house. If there is no travel to real locales, then it is pure imagination and nothing out of the ordinary.
It makes a difference when ppl use it to argue about, but no real difference.
If there is no actual travel, it doesn't automatically follow that it's imaginary! Just as I see distant places through my tv set and what I am seeing is real, ppl can view these very real places without actually being there. Go back and re-read the ideas I presented in my earlier post about there being little practical difference and why.
-------------------- I AM what Willis was talkin' bout.
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Rhizoid
carbon unit


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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Jellric]
#1797036 - 08/10/03 12:04 AM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
If there is no actual travel, it doesn't automatically follow that it's imaginary!
Whether or not something is actually travelling is not important. The point is that if you can access previously unknown information located at a distant place, then something is going on that is different from pure imagination.
If no information is transferred to you from outside your head, then the entire experience must be constructed from information already present inside your head.
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Shroomism
Space Travellin


Registered: 02/13/00
Posts: 66,015
Loc: 9th Dimension
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1797855 - 08/10/03 10:37 AM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Swami, ever heard of "consciousness"?
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Azmodeus
Seeker

Registered: 11/27/02
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1801823 - 08/11/03 01:18 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Swami said: Actually it was the Swami Remote Viewing Challenge. He should know by now that Remote Viewing and Astral Projection are two *completely* different things, but I guess his brain still does not make that distinction.
The open-minded Challenge allowed for remote-viewing, clairvoyance, ESP, astral travel and any other non-physical means of viewing the object. Naturally, all methods failed miserably.
Sorry shroomism that I cannot determine the difference between one method that doesn't work from another method that doesn't work. ----------------------------------------------- from a popular MysticWeb website: Within the Astral Plane there exists all that exists in the Physical Plane.
That means my object d'art that was the prize of the Swam Challenge should have been readily visible to ANY EXPERIENCED traveller.
Well mystic web says "within the astral plane there exists all that exists in the physical plane". And no-one identified your object. So the logical swami conclusion is that such a feat is impossible, and methods used to achieve such a result are discredited or "don't work".
Could not all that exists in the material plane existing in the astral mean it all exists, but in a different form? Mabye its unrecognizable? I find it interesting how you would not even practice such a technique, but having such a ridiculous contest is proof enough for you. I'd be surprised if anyone even did your challenge.
To me your arguments do not represent logic, or rationality. In fact they seem to epidomise the linear thinking, and closemindedness so common to our society today. I know your older than most, but it is never to late to gain a new perspective....
-------------------- "Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source. Lest we forget. "
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Azmodeus
Seeker

Registered: 11/27/02
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Re: Do Mushrooms Affect One's Ability to Astral Project? [Re: Swami]
#1801834 - 08/11/03 01:22 PM (20 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Swami said: the program eventually lost funding because:
*drum roll please*
It didn't work.
The amount of money spent was quite small and Congress has little fear of the public when it comes to defense spending. Last year alone, the GAO failed to account for over a TRILLION dollars!
How much does it cost to put a few guys in an empty room with pencil and paper?
Yeah, they probably did a test for it similar to a swami challenge.....WELL THAT SETTLES THAT!!!....no remote viewing exists.
-------------------- "Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source. Lest we forget. "
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