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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 36
#17246844 - 11/19/12 02:25 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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This is part of my series on how I get things done. I hope it helps!
This is a continuation of my my simple coir substrate prep.
This procedure is exactly the same for pasteurizing casing material as well 
I'll be taking the substrate jars and bags I loaded and pasteurizing them on the stove in a pasteurization bath.
I do this in jars or bags because I don't like letting my substrate sit and drain for hours after it comes into direct contact with the pasteurization water.
I also find it to be a relatively easy and mess-free ordeal.
Pasteurizing the substrate in jars
Quote:
This is not an exact science. You will need to tweak the timings and temps to your stove and situation. I will describe how I do it every time with success.
I use 80-90 degree water for hydrating my substrate. No specific measurements, just make sure it feels cool or "room temp."
I mix my substrate very well and make sure it is evenly hydrated.
I load my substrate into jars as described here, making sure each one has roughly the same amount of substrate as the others.
To start, place a canning rack on the bottom of the kettle.
My kettle can hold seven quart jars but for this load I am doing six.

Fill with water, 1/3 to 1/2 of the way up the jars. No need to fill until they bob around and no need to use a brick to weigh them down.
In the past I would be concerned with submerging the jars as much as possible, but they will hold temp evenly when just 1/3 of the jar is submerged.
You can use a normal meat thermometer for this but I really like these $15 digital thermometers. This one has a timer as well as an alert that sounds when the substrate hits a certain temperature. Keeps me from having to look over it constantly.

I insert it into the middle of one of the jars in the kettle. This will measure the internal temp of the substrate.

I turn my stove on medium heat.

I place the lid of the kettle loosely on top, without turning it or putting the wingnuts in place. By putting the lid on at the start of the cycle, the jars will heat more evenly.

Quote:
It is important to know how many degrees the core temperature of your substrate will climb before the heat needs to be turned off on the stove.
First, take note of the starting core temperature. My jars usually start at 80-84F.
I let the core temperature climb about 15-20F, then I turn the stove off.
Quote:
This will need to be adjusted based on the starting temp of the substrate as well as your stove and what-not. But the starting temp and timings laid out here work for me 99% of the time.
These will continue to climb in temp. Once they hit 140F, start a timer for 60 minutes.

With my timings, the substrate will continue to climb until peaking out around 160F just before the timer goes off. This is perfect.
If your temperature stops climbing or doesn't reach the high end of temps, just turn the heat back on to medium for another 5-10 minutes. It should get it climbing again without going over.
If the temp goes over 170F for more than ten or fifteen minutes, you will start to partially sterilize your substrate. It'd be best to toss it and try again. Since we spawn to bulk in open air, a partially sterilized substrate is often as shitty as an unpasteurized substrate.
Bear in mind though, if you are pasteurizing just coir and verm, you can probably get away with it. Coir is very contam resistant.
After the timer goes off, I remove the jars and put them in a tote or other container to cool overnight.
Pasteurizing the substrate in a bag
Lately I've been working on efficiency and pasteurizing the substrate in one big container is a great time saver.
I use large filter patch bags for this process.
One advantage of using filter patch bags is that you will have filtered air exchange during the cooling of the substrate. This isn't really a big deal for coir/verm but with substrates like hpoo or additives like coffee grounds, it never hurts to be as safe as possible.
One disadvantage of pasteurizing in bags is that is takes an extra hour or so to get up to temp.
I take my filter bag and fill it with substrate. Compress the substrate a bit so it stays in shape when moved around, try to get all the pockets of air out.

I twist the top of the bag and use a zip tie or twist-tie to the close it. I put the bag in my kettle (make sure to use a canning rack underneath) and I place a thermometer through the bag into the center of the substrate.

Fill the water about halfway up the bag. No need to add more water than that, no need to weigh it down. With the lid on during the whole process, the substrate will heat very evenly.

I turn my stove on medium heat.

I place the lid of the kettle loosely on top, without turning it or putting the wingnuts in place. By putting the lid on at the start of the cycle, the substrate will heat more evenly.

Quote:
It is important to know how many degrees the core temperature of your substrate will climb before the heat needs to be turned off on the stove.
First, take note of the starting core temperature. My bags usually start at 80-84F.
I let the core temperature climb 6-8 degrees F, then I turn the stove off.
Quote:
This will need to be adjusted based on the starting temp of the substrate as well as your stove and what-not. But the starting temp and timings laid out here work for me 99% of the time.
This will continue to climb in temp. Once the substrate hits 140F, start a timer for 60 minutes.

With my timings, the substrate will continue to climb until peaking out around 160F just before the timer goes off. This is perfect.
If your temperature stops climbing or doesn't reach the high end of temps, just turn the heat back on to medium for another 5-10 minutes. It should get it climbing again without going over.
If the temp goes over 165-170 for more than a few minutes, you will sterilize part of the substrate. It'd be best to toss it and try again. Since we spawn to bulk in open air, a partially sterilized substrate is often as shitty as an unpasteurized substrate.
After the timer goes off, I remove the bag and put it in a tote or other container to cool overnight.

I took some temps from around the top of the substrate to show that the temps are indeed very even throughout.


Ready to spawn? Here's how I spawn to a monotub 

Edited by FrankHorrigan (09/25/13 01:34 PM)
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TranscendingLife
I Don't Need a Life to Live



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Once I turn off the burner on my stove, I put the lid on my AA, but don't tighten the wing nuts or put the toggle weight on. Temps never exceeded 165F & it was complete set & forget, once temps were where they should be.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here "One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife “A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING      "Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung "Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs "You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Quote:
TranscendingLife said:

Once I turn off the burner on my stove, I put the lid on my AA, but don't tighten the wing nuts or put the toggle weight on. Temps never exceeded 165F & it was complete set & forget, once temps were where they should be.
Thank ye, kind sir.
I'm going to give that a shot. I usually end up having to re-heat it a bit towards the end
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YungSupreme


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nice
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: YungSupreme] 1
#17247100 - 11/19/12 03:15 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
YungSupreme said: nice
Thanks!
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Blake_Shroom
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: YungSupreme] 1
#17247103 - 11/19/12 03:16 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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exactly how i do it. Not as easy as the bucket tek, but proper pasteurization is worth it.
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FooMan



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Re: My Pasteurization Tek (with pics) [Re: FrankHorrigan] 1
#17247169 - 11/19/12 03:28 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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--------------------
Quick WBS Prep
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BargainBab
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Blake_Shroom] 1
#17248666 - 11/19/12 07:46 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Blake_Shroom said: exactly how i do it. Not as easy as the bucket tek, but proper pasteurization is worth it.

I think this shows just how easy 'that extra step' is in pasturation. Glad I'm not the only one who pasteurizes in jars.
-------------------- Oh wow, GOOD Nyborg!
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: BargainBab] 2
#17251341 - 11/20/12 09:29 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
FooMan said:

Thanks Foo!

Quote:
BargainBab said: Glad I'm not the only one who pasteurizes in jars.
I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who pasteurizes in jars either
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billb
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Nice thorough write up with pics. I like the two thermometer usage.
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Montock
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: billb] 1
#17251472 - 11/20/12 10:06 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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good stuff, this is how i do it, except i use metal candy thermometers, and i usually keep tabs on 2-3 jars, they dont all heat up at the same time, i also pasterize for 2 hrs or longer, otherswise this is spot on to my technique
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NineInchNails
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Montock] 1
#17251530 - 11/20/12 10:17 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Great writeup!
This works great with ziplok bags too! You just have to get most of the air out of each bag before pasteurizing. I monitor the temp of one of the bags through the ziplok seal and the seal is closed afterwards. Once pasteurization is complete, the bags create a vacuum inside once cool.
Edited by NineInchNails (11/20/12 10:23 AM)
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Quote:
NineInchNails said: Great writeup!
This works great with ziplok bags too! You just have to get most of the air out of each bag before pasteurizing. I monitor the temp of one of the bags through the ziplok seal and the seal is closed afterwards. Once pasteurization is complete, the bags create a vacuum inside once cool.
Interesting...sounds like more work than jars tho  What size bags do you use?
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NineInchNails
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Gallon size ziploks. Not a lot of work really. Bags are disposable so it's sometimes convenient to not have to wash the jars. You don't have to fiddle with the bags much to get most of the air out. I leave a corner of the bag unsealed and as the bag is imersed into the water most of the air escapes. I just zip the corner shut. The bags will expand if you don't get most of the air out.
I've used jars too and both do work.


Edited by NineInchNails (11/20/12 07:25 PM)
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Primal Call
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Quote:
Blake_Shroom said: exactly how i do it. Not as easy as the bucket tek, but proper pasteurization is worth it.

Quote:
NineInchNails said: Gallon size ziploks. Not a lot of work really. Bags are disposable so it's sometimes convenient to not have to wash the jars. You don't have to fiddle with the bags much to get most of the air out. The bags will expand if you don't. No jars, no foil, just bags.
I've used jars too and both do work.
Disposable is exactly why I starting using the jar method. I used to use trash bags... yuck. So much waste... plastic in the environment is incompatible. I can't make you do it, but I can ask. Please go back to jars. I mean, really? Washing jars is too much work for you?
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Montock
Time = $


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Quote:
NineInchNails said: Gallon size ziploks. Not a lot of work really. Bags are disposable so it's sometimes convenient to not have to wash the jars. You don't have to fiddle with the bags much to get most of the air out. I leave a corner of the bag unsealed and as the bag is imersed into the water most of the air escapes. I just zip the corner shut. The bags will expand if you don't get most of the air out.
I've used jars too and both do work.


ive used vaccumm bags, and just impulse sealed them, than duct thae the hole where the thermometer goes in, ill def be trying this out this weekend, gallon ziplocks are alot cheaper!
-------------------- Looking for Wife, please pm me your picture and list of skillz. I'm wrong all the time, my posts are subject to being wrong at any point or time, get butt hurt at own risk.
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elkart
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Montock] 1
#17255306 - 11/20/12 09:13 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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@NineInchNails... Do you use spacers so the bags aren't touching the bottom/sides?
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elkart
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: elkart] 1
#17255380 - 11/20/12 09:25 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Hey Frank, my problem with jars is that I can only fit 7 quarts in my PC, just undercutting the amount of substrate I need. What chamber are you growing in?
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k00laid
NEMO


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: elkart] 1
#17255528 - 11/20/12 09:47 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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this is a great thread.
-------------------- AMU - AMU Q & A - MyVideo Teks!
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: elkart] 2
#17256188 - 11/20/12 11:45 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
elkart said: Hey Frank, my problem with jars is that I can only fit 7 quarts in my PC, just undercutting the amount of substrate I need. What chamber are you growing in?
I can only fit seven in as well but I have two AA921s to make up for it. My monos hold 14 quarts of sub and 6-10 quarts of spawn, filling it right to the 4" mark. If I need to make multiple substrates in one day, I just keep cycling them, 7 at a time in each PC. You can also use large stockpots, like the one in NIN's pic.
Thanks a bunch for the feedback guys, I'm glad I can give back some to the community here, you guys have helped me out a lot
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Zarotti
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Quote:
NineInchNails said: Gallon size ziploks. Not a lot of work really. Bags are disposable so it's sometimes convenient to not have to wash the jars. You don't have to fiddle with the bags much to get most of the air out. I leave a corner of the bag unsealed and as the bag is imersed into the water most of the air escapes. I just zip the corner shut. The bags will expand if you don't get most of the air out.
I've used jars too and both do work.
Can you use your oven for your zip bags instead of a pot ?
What is the right temperature for oven sterilization ?
Edited by Zarotti (11/21/12 03:16 AM)
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Nature Boy
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Damn...why didn't I think of that? Gallon zip lock bags. Brilliant!
N.B.
-------------------- All submitted posts under this user name are works of pure fiction or outright lies. Any information, statement, or assertion contained therein should be considered pure unadulterated bullshit. Note well: Sorry, but I do not answer PM's unless you are a long-time trusted friend. If you have a question, ask it in the appropriate thread.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Zarotti]
#17257950 - 11/21/12 10:59 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Zarotti said:
Can you use your oven for your zip bags instead of a pot ?
What is the right temperature for oven sterilization ?
This thread is about pasteurizing, not sterilizing. Dry heat in the oven is no good. It doesn't even distribute the heat like water does. Most people who use their oven to pasteurize end up with contaminated bulk substrates due to partial sterilization/improper pasteurization.
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TranscendingLife
I Don't Need a Life to Live



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The only thing I use the oven for is sterilizing some verm.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here "One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife “A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING      "Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung "Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs "You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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billb
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I only use the oven to cook
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Brain Fart
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: billb]
#17258202 - 11/21/12 11:39 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
billb said: I only use the oven to cook 
 
I do what RR recommends. Fill water level to 3/4 up the jars with cold water in my PC. Light stove bring up to temp with the toggle weight off. LEt steam vent on high for a few minutes but no more then five out the top. Then cut the heat and place on a cool burner. Substrate should be ready in 2 hours. Obviously you prehydrate everything to field capacity before you load your jars
For those without a meat thermometer:)
Edited by Brain Fart (11/21/12 11:40 AM)
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NineInchNails
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: elkart]
#17258316 - 11/21/12 11:57 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
elkart said: @NineInchNails... Do you use spacers so the bags aren't touching the bottom/sides?
Absolutely. Ya never want jars, bags or anything touching the bottom of the pot.
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Zarotti
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Quote:
This thread is about pasteurizing, not sterilizing. Dry heat in the oven is no good. It doesn't even distribute the heat like water does. Most people who use their oven to pasteurize end up with contaminated bulk substrates due to partial sterilization/improper pasteurization.
Yes I meant pasteurizing-
But what if you dont have a thermometer ? Can you put your zip bags in a pot of water -put the lid on the pot and then pasteurize it in the oven ?
If yes : When I set the oven temperature to 150F would this be enough to heat up the potwater and the core of the zip bags to 140F ?
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Zarotti]
#17259397 - 11/21/12 03:59 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Zarotti said:
But what if you dont have a thermometer ?
A meat thermometer runs like $3 at a department store  Seems worthwhile. Hard to pasteurize properly without it. You won't know when to start the 60-90 min timer and you won't know if you dip under/over temps.
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Primal Call
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Quote:
TranscendingLife said:

The only thing I use the oven for is sterilizing some verm.
For casing TL? Or?
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TranscendingLife
I Don't Need a Life to Live



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Primal Call]
#17259748 - 11/21/12 05:06 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Sometimes I'll run it through the oven if it's been sitting around too long, too, for bulk substrate. But, 99.99% of the time, I never even sterilize it in the oven. Just strait outta the bag into a bucket or onto a caked.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here "One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife “A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING      "Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung "Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs "You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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Brain Fart
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Brain Fart]
#17262998 - 11/22/12 07:04 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
Quote:
Zarotti said:
But what if you dont have a thermometer ?
A meat thermometer runs like $3 at a department store  Seems worthwhile. Hard to pasteurize properly without it. You won't know when to start the 60-90 min timer and you won't know if you dip under/over temps.
Quote:
Brain Fart said:
Quote:
billb said: I only use the oven to cook 
 
I do what RR recommends. Fill water level to 3/4 up the jars with cold water in my PC. Light stove bring up to temp with the toggle weight off. LEt steam vent on high for a few minutes but no more then five out the top. Then cut the heat and place on a cool burner. Substrate should be ready in 2 hours. Obviously you prehydrate everything to field capacity before you load your jars
For those without a meat thermometer:)
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Drshroomy88
The doctor



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Quote:
NineInchNails said: Gallon size ziploks. Not a lot of work really. Bags are disposable so it's sometimes convenient to not have to wash the jars. You don't have to fiddle with the bags much to get most of the air out. I leave a corner of the bag unsealed and as the bag is imersed into the water most of the air escapes. I just zip the corner shut. The bags will expand if you don't get most of the air out.
I've used jars too and both do work.


Will the bags not melt in the heat? I suppose not if you do it that way. They will hold more than jars though right? I'll need lost of sub, as I'm doing 3 monotubs.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Drshroomy88]
#17347449 - 12/06/12 10:35 PM (11 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Drshroomy88 said: Will the bags not melt in the heat? I suppose not if you do it that way. They will hold more than jars though right? I'll need lost of sub, as I'm doing 3 monotubs.
 I run 10-20 monos at once with shiitakes. I properly pasteurize every quart in its own jar
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Drshroomy88
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
Quote:
Drshroomy88 said: Will the bags not melt in the heat? I suppose not if you do it that way. They will hold more than jars though right? I'll need lost of sub, as I'm doing 3 monotubs.
 I run 10-20 monos at once with shiitakes. I properly pasteurize every quart in its own jar 
Well my point is that a gallon baggy like that is equal to 4 quart jars. I could spend less time using the pc, which can only fit 7 qt jars in mine at a time...wouldn't it be more productive to use gallon baggy's if I need lots of sub? You must have a huge PC, or more than one. I cannot afford that right now.
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Liquid_Beef
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Drshroomy88]
#17392881 - 12/14/12 05:06 PM (11 years, 6 months ago) |
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Seemed like the right place to find an answer to a question I've been pondering and found some answers but nothing good enough. Why pasteurize a bulk sub instead of sterilize it? I plan on pasteurizing my sub just confused as to how killing all life forms instead of just some is a bad thing?
Edited by Liquid_Beef (12/14/12 05:07 PM)
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elkart
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Liquid_Beef]
#17392924 - 12/14/12 05:14 PM (11 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Liquid_Beef said: Seemed like the right place to find an answer to a question I've been pondering and found some answers but nothing good enough. Why pasteurize a bulk sub instead of sterilize it? I plan on pasteurizing my sub just confused as to how killing all life forms instead of just some is a bad thing?
sterilizing gets rid of beneficial bacteria that help protect against outside contaminants, whereas pasteurization saves those helpful friends. It's a temperature of heat thing.
Edited by elkart (12/14/12 05:15 PM)
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TranscendingLife
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: elkart] 1
#17394694 - 12/14/12 10:57 PM (11 years, 6 months ago) |
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You can sterilize you substrate. However, since pasteurized substrate can be spawned in most conditions, we prefer pasteurization. One can, easily, spawn to bulk substrate that has been sterilized. However, one must do such under aseptic conditions, which is difficult to do with bulk substrate.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here "One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife “A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
      How I Do EVERYTHING      "Your vision will become clear only when you can look into your own heart…. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks inside, awakes."- Carl Jung "Anything that can be done chemically can be done by other means."- William S. Burroughs "You are as dead now as you will ever be" - Seth
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Trippy_Smurf
Sketchy Mother Fucker




Registered: 02/14/11
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TL, I recently read something that made me think that RR was suggesting that sterilized coir may be easier for myc to colonize than non-sterilized coir. Do you have anything to say about that either way?
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eutebius



Registered: 03/18/08
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I do not mean to answer for TL, but I believe RR's sterilization of bulk subs was an older process, and pasteurization proved to be a more productive method over time. Eh?
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Montock
Time = $


Registered: 08/27/09
Posts: 1,838
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Quote:
TranscendingLife said: You can sterilize you substrate. However, since pasteurized substrate can be spawned in most conditions, we prefer pasteurization. One can, easily, spawn to bulk substrate that has been sterilized. However, one must do such under aseptic conditions, which is difficult to do with bulk substrate.
ive never had a sterlized substrate with manure in it not contam, most of them contam right in the jar/bag days afterwards, ive had a few take longer, maybe i should experiment more, but im literally 100% contam rate on bulk subs with manure that get sterlizedQuote:
Trippy_Smurf said: TL, I recently read something that made me think that RR was suggesting that sterilized coir may be easier for myc to colonize than non-sterilized coir. Do you have anything to say about that either way?
you can use straight hydrated coir, you can use pasturized coir, you can use coir with verm and a gallon of boiling water poured on it, ive use coir that has reached sterlization temps,
coir coir coir, its amazing, keep the manure out of it, and it become very forgiving, personally i always come back to coir/verm/gypsum properply pasturized
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Montock]
#17449069 - 12/26/12 12:40 AM (11 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Montock said: personally i always come back to coir/verm/gypsum properly pasturized
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Made a couple updates today. In an effort to keep my pasteurizing temps under 161F, I started turning the stove off when my substrates hit 115 internally. I also put the lid on immediately after turning off the heat. This puts me between 140-160F perfectly for up to 90 minutes 
Thanks for the feedback guys, you all kick ass! Keep it coming
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut


Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 8,598
Loc: Nibiru
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http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/17246858#17246858
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: 1) Bucket pasteurization.This is a hit-or-miss shot at best. For some people it works wonders; others it brings misery.
Yes, I'm coming to this conclusion as well. It's been very hit or miss for me...mostly miss. Kaaaaaaaahhhhhhn!
Very nice write up
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Penis Envious
Stranger, than you



Registered: 04/16/12
Posts: 104
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek (with pics) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#17504757 - 01/05/13 11:36 PM (11 years, 5 months ago) |
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heya Frank!
at one part in your tek, you say that...
"I insert it into the middle of one of the jars in the kettle. This will measure the internal temp of the substrate."
so you're inserting one of the thermometers through the foil cover on the top of the jar to get an internal temp of the substrate... doesn't that invite water to possibly splash into the hole and over saturate the substrate?
Also... what i'm trying to find out in your tek is the exact temperature that my water should be at in order to properly pasteurize my sub... from what i've read, i believe the temps you're recommending for the water to be at are between 155-160. is this correct? or should the internal temp of the substrate be 155-160 F?? if the internal temp needs to be 155-160 F, what would that make the temp of the surrounding water?
Thanks for all your knowlege, P E
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TranscendingLife
I Don't Need a Life to Live



Registered: 06/09/10
Posts: 21,627
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek (with pics) [Re: Penis Envious]
#17504764 - 01/05/13 11:39 PM (11 years, 5 months ago) |
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The water isn't high/deep enough to splash into the center jar, which has the thermometer inserted in it.
It's all about the substrate temperature, not the water temp. It's different per container used in pasteurizing the substrate. Normally, your water will be boiling when the substrate reaches 140F.
-------------------- AMU: We Quickly Answer Questions Here "One must accept the probability of failure to experience the elation of success." - TranscendingLife “A man of genius makes no mistakes; his errors are volitional and are the portals of discovery.” - James Joyce
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut


Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 8,598
Loc: Nibiru
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek (with pics) [Re: Penis Envious]
#17504786 - 01/05/13 11:44 PM (11 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Penis Envious said: so you're inserting one of the thermometers through the foil cover on the top of the jar to get an internal temp of the substrate... doesn't that invite water to possibly splash into the hole and over saturate the substrate?
There shouldn't be any splashing. The water never gets to a boil. I just started this method myself.
I put the heat on about 4. When my water gets about 170, my sub is about 130. I cut the off, put the lid on, and shortly the sub hits 140. I start my timer when the sub gets 140. It continues to rise, but never gets above 160.
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Drshroomy88
The doctor



Registered: 11/17/12
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek (with pics) [Re: Penis Envious]
#17505240 - 01/06/13 02:02 AM (11 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
Penis Envious said: heya Frank!
at one part in your tek, you say that...
"I insert it into the middle of one of the jars in the kettle... doesn't that invite water to possibly splash into the hole and over saturate the substrate?
Fill the water 2/3 up the jars, not any higher. I used this method as well for my first and current grow, works fine.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Drshroomy88]
#17730174 - 02/02/13 12:27 AM (11 years, 4 months ago) |
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Made a few revisions to the OP. nothing major. temps have been updated to reflect proper pasteurization temps. same with times. moved a couple paragraphs around.
I am glad to see this helping so many people out. it really is a simple and effective process
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LustyLocks


Registered: 01/10/12
Posts: 1,513
Loc: Mom's basement
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Tried and true. Very simple and effective!
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Joust
Mycotographer




Registered: 10/13/11
Posts: 13,392
Loc: WA
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: LustyLocks]
#17730296 - 02/02/13 12:45 AM (11 years, 4 months ago) |
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-------------------- ~~~~~~***Psilocybin Mushrooms***~~~~~~ _________A Practical Guide To Psilocybin Mushrooms_________ "Think about the species, not your scale". -NeoSporen "Mr. Joust, I see you don't actually partake in the psilocin, but it looks like it may partake in you!" -Gojira
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odbsmydog
In the Pines. . .


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Joust]
#17792704 - 02/12/13 10:36 PM (11 years, 4 months ago) |
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Another great method, definitely saving this to use as soon as my jars are ready!
Thanks for the tek!
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Sma11mau5
Stranger


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: odbsmydog]
#17795426 - 02/13/13 01:38 PM (11 years, 4 months ago) |
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Great pics and info top quality!
How long could you store any extra sub if you wanted to make up a batch but save some to use later?
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Sma11mau5]
#17795451 - 02/13/13 01:44 PM (11 years, 4 months ago) |
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 I have waited up to three days with success, but only with coir and verm and gypsum. I would not wait more than 24 hours if you have any coffee/manure/castings or anything else in your substrate
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Sma11mau5
Stranger


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Would be strait coir/verm/gypsum
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Sma11mau5]
#17795625 - 02/13/13 02:28 PM (11 years, 4 months ago) |
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I wouldn't wait more than a few days myself
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cozc
Stranger


Registered: 06/14/11
Posts: 380
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I've noticed over time that subs pasteurized like this last an extra flush or two next to my bucket tek subs. With the bucket I usually get 3-4 before I notice some green, but when done in jars Ive had subs go without contam until they were only flushing a couple grams..like 7th or 8th fush 
I will admit I usually get lazy and end up using the bucket and just making more subs
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FalseMaria
Perverted Goddess of Metropolis



Registered: 08/06/07
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Quote:
SpitballJedi said: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/17246858#17246858
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: 1) Bucket pasteurization.This is a hit-or-miss shot at best. For some people it works wonders; others it brings misery.
Yes, I'm coming to this conclusion as well. It's been very hit or miss for me...mostly miss. Kaaaaaaaahhhhhhn!
Very nice write up
Seriously, considering my Green Meanie thread I just made, I have reached the same conclusion... I will stick to coir/verm/gypsum, but go proper pasteurization all the way.
Frank, if my next batch is successful, you will be getting much kudos!
Great write up on this and the bulk sub prep write up.
-------------------- ✲゚。.(✿╹◡╹)ノ☆.
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FalseMaria
Perverted Goddess of Metropolis



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: FalseMaria]
#17870515 - 02/26/13 05:23 PM (11 years, 4 months ago) |
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Pasteurizing as we speak! Prepared my substrate 'a la' FrankHorrigan as well.
I am forecasting good things in my future... Very good things.
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Snuus
Stranger
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: FalseMaria]
#17999589 - 03/23/13 02:31 PM (11 years, 3 months ago) |
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I just tryd this method and it worked exactly as instructed. Free bump and thank you for this great pasteurization tek
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preternaturalist
On Hiatus



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Snuus]
#18058514 - 04/04/13 04:26 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Frank, I'm wondering about your meat thermometer. How far into the sub do you have the tip of it? Is it near the center of the jar?
What I'm suggesting is that the substrate further from the center and closer to the jar wall will be warmer than the substrate from which you get your readings. It wouldn't be a significant difference, but a few degrees might end up sterilizing part of someone's substrate. Wouldn't you want to keep the center cooler, say around 150-155? Still within pasteurization range.
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Jars for PF Tek!!! Frank's WBS Prep Frank's Simple Bulk - follow his links Frank's Cloning Tek A Great Gallery Play Bloxorz!!!
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Quote:
preternaturalist said: Frank, I'm wondering about your meat thermometer. How far into the sub do you have the tip of it? Is it near the center of the jar?
What I'm suggesting is that the substrate further from the center and closer to the jar wall will be warmer than the substrate from which you get your readings. It wouldn't be a significant difference, but a few degrees might end up sterilizing part of someone's substrate. Wouldn't you want to keep the center cooler, say around 150-155? Still within pasteurization range.
That's the beauty of it, really. The outer portions can and will be above 160 and that's ok. The center of the substrate is what matters. The good bacteria spreads quickly while cooling and when you spawn your tub 
I put my thermometer through the center of the foil lid and about halfway into the jar. Maybe 2/3 sometimes. Haven't had a problem yet
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EntheogenicPeace
Scholar



Registered: 10/04/05
Posts: 3,926
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From what i've observed the top portion of substrate (above the water line) lags behind in temp more so than the middle (once you go down a bit). As such i aim for to be close to 160 down in there most of the duration (turning on the heat a bit to bring it back up part way through if need be) to try & prevent the top part not getting inadequately pasteurized. I suppose i could try loading a bit less per jar & weighing them down with something on top so that it's not an issue.
-------------------- --- nothing right now ---
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Quote:
EntheogenicPeace said: From what i've observed the top portion of substrate (above the water line) lags behind in temp more so than the middle (once you go down a bit). As such i aim for to be close to 160 down in there most of the duration (turning on the heat a bit to bring it back up part way through if need be) to try & prevent the top part not getting inadequately pasteurized. I suppose i could try loading a bit less per jar & weighing them down with something on top so that it's not an issue.
I've never had this problem myself but I see where you're coming from. I fill the water up as far as I can without making the jars float. Then I weigh them down with a canning rack and brick to keep them from bobbing.
The glass is a good insulator and should transfer enough heat through the jars to heat all the substrate inside. Even if it stays a little cooler on top inside the jars, it should still be at pasteurizing temps when the center of the remainder of the jar is at 160F.
Also, putting the lid loosely on top of the pot really seems to help trap that heat inside. I'll test a few different areas in the jars today when I pasteurize and let you know what I find
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut


Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 8,598
Loc: Nibiru
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I made some slight changes to this process.
I put a few jar rings on the bottom, then I put my jars in, then the spacer that came with my PC, then a weight on top, then fill with water almost to the top of the substrate.
I've been putting the probe near the top of the substrate, for the reason mentioned above. Once the substrate gets to 140F, I push the probe farther in and it's always about 5 or so degrees warmer.
I only let the water get up to 165F.
It takes me about 2 hours for the substrate to get to 140.
I've been putting 6 quart jars in my pots, but I have 2 big canning pots that can fit 8 quart jars each. I think I will try spreading the substrate out to so the level in each jar will be lower.
My thinking is that I could then bring the water level up past the top of the substrate. I may try 7 in each pot and see how it looks and spread to 8 if I need too.
I'm not sure how much the minor discrepancy in temperature matters, but I feel more comfortable knowing no part of the substrate goes above 165F and the whole thing remains above 140F for 1 hour 45 minutes.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Quote:
SpitballJedi said: the whole thing remains above 140F for 1 hour 45 minutes.
Everything looks good except this right here. I would only recommend pasteurizing for 90 minutes at most. I keep my pasteurization times between 30 and 60 minutes. Never caused me an issue
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut


Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 8,598
Loc: Nibiru
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K. I'll give 60 minutes a go.
Again, congrats on your TC tag. Do you have to get out of the shower to pee now?
-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
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LD50

Registered: 03/31/04
Posts: 63
Last seen: 10 years, 10 months
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek (with pics) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18081774 - 04/09/13 12:59 PM (11 years, 2 months ago) |
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Nice thread! Is there anyway to favorite threads so you can find them easily in the future?
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Quote:
LD50 said: Nice thread! Is there anyway to favorite threads so you can find them easily in the future?
Yep, it's under "Extra Information" at the bottom of the page. It says "toggle favorite" 
Quote:
SpitballJedi said: K. I'll give 60 minutes a go.
Again, congrats on your TC tag. Do you have to get out of the shower to pee now? 

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bassclef
Stranger

Registered: 02/09/13
Posts: 115
Last seen: 9 years, 3 months
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giving this tek a try, failed my first time trying the bucket tek, but I made a lot of mistakes last time anyway.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek (with pics) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18383369 - 06/07/13 02:13 PM (11 years, 23 days ago) |
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Here's a big update today:
Quote:
Pasteurizing the substrate in a bag
Lately I've been working on efficiency and pasteurizing the substrate in one big container is a great time saver.
I use extra long filter patch bags for these pictures but this can also be done with an oven bag or even poly tubing.
One advantage of using filter patch bags is that you will have filtered air exchange during the cooling of the substrate. This isn't really a big deal for coir/verm but with substrates like hpoo or additives like coffee grounds, it never hurts to be as safe as possible.
One disadvantage of pasteurizing in bags is that is takes an extra hour or so to get up to temp.
Take your substrate bag and fill it with your hydrated substrate mixture. Compress the substrate a bit so it stays in shape when moved around, try to get all the pockets of air out.

I use a tie wire and twist-n-tie off the top of the bag and place it in my kettle. Place a thermometer through the bag into the center of the substrate.

Fill the water up about an inch or two from the top of the bag. I place two bricks on either side of the thermometer to keep the bag from floating.

I put the lid on and turn the heat to medium. I set my alarm on my timer for 96F, a good internal temperature to turn the heat off at IME. The water will boil and that is completely fine.

When the center climbs to 140F, I start my timer for 75-90 minutes.
When time is up, I take the substrate out of the kettle and place it in a closed box to cool.
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cronicr



Registered: 08/07/11
Posts: 61,462
Loc: Van Isle
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek (with pics) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18383391 - 06/07/13 02:19 PM (11 years, 23 days ago) |
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Solipsis
m̶a̶d̶ disappointed scientist



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: cronicr]
#18385239 - 06/07/13 09:09 PM (11 years, 23 days ago) |
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Not everyone has remote thermometers, can this tek work with just a lab thermometer? Of course to read a normal thermometer on the inside of a kettle it cannot be a sealed PC. Will a normal cooking pan suffice or is the steam not enough? What about submerging the substrate bags or jars a bit more and putting the lid on the pan (hopefully the lab thermometer can still fit diagonally)?
Can you enlighten me what difference a PC compared to normal pan has here and how to do this with a lab thermometer? (With sterilisation I understand the point of a PC: to 'bomb the shit out of it'. But if nothing above 212F / 100C is needed it is not strictly necessary?)
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tko
Stranger

Registered: 05/08/13
Posts: 496
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Solipsis]
#18385752 - 06/07/13 11:00 PM (11 years, 23 days ago) |
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solipsis, you dont want to sterilize the substrate this is simply steaming till you hit 140 160 inside the sub then set timer and hell correct me if im wrong but think he just puts lid once its at 96 degrees and the heat builds when covered.
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Maya Boomba
Stranger

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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: tko]
#18433331 - 06/17/13 06:46 PM (11 years, 13 days ago) |
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Hey Frank!
I was just pasteurizing some Hpoo/coir/verm mix and I see you updated this thread with the bag filter method. I got a big ass pot (68qt) and I was wondering if there's a bag big enough so I could do all my substrate at the same time if I ever wanted to get that many.
Did you get yours from Mad Season?
Let me know which sponsor you are using, and if anyone knows of a CANADIAN sponsor that sells them, i'd LOVE to save the extra fee I have to pay everytime something cross the border.
Thanks in advance!
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tko
Stranger

Registered: 05/08/13
Posts: 496
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Maya Boomba]
#18436010 - 06/18/13 09:43 AM (11 years, 13 days ago) |
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i had asked him same question and he recommended an ove bag or just a big ziplock.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: tko]
#18436151 - 06/18/13 10:25 AM (11 years, 12 days ago) |
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I actually just got another 100 large size filter bags from TMS and I've started using one bag to one brick's worth of substrate 
Ziplocks or oven bags work as well.
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Mike12000
Experienced Wanderer


Registered: 05/05/13
Posts: 110
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
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Hi Frank!! Being new to this I truly appreciate your teks and the detail you put into them. They've really helped me get over a lot of the learning curve with this hobby, though I'm sure there's more to always learn.
I'm currently doing a side by side with your wbs prep tek and TL's and do far 4 of your jars have growth to 0 of TL's!!! The only difference I've found between the teks is he suggests soaking in hot water, you don't. I wonder if the alteration you made here with gypsum being added after water but before pc/pasturizing will work on wbs to eliminate the sludge at the bottom??
Now to the reason of my post, while grabbing more wbs at Walmart today I came across a thermometer that is a little better IMHO than the one you posted. This one can release from the dock and alert you in a 100 foot range!! It was about $15. Just trying to give a little back for what this forum has shown me.
Edited by Mike12000 (06/18/13 04:51 PM)
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10KOysters
Food Cultivator
Registered: 04/18/13
Posts: 429
Last seen: 11 years, 7 days
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Mike12000]
#18461035 - 06/23/13 01:48 PM (11 years, 7 days ago) |
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I found the setting on my stove that allows me to walk away and leave it.
The water sits at approximately 150F and the substrate stays at around 140F in the middle. This allows me to do an easy 2hr pasteurization run and no worries about sterilizing parts of it. Just turn it on and set the timer when it reaches temp. Most references to pasteurization in commercial setups (I've found) recommend maintaining the 140F for 2hrs or longer. The point is to maintain the temp where beneficial bacteria thrives and multiplies; should anyone be having trich issues and you know you're not sterilizing, a higher beneficial bacteria count may assist.
What do I know though? lol 
Your stuff is good, Frank. Thanks for posting this.
-------------------- I object to the prolific use of 'Submit' buttons on the internet
Edited by 10KOysters (06/23/13 01:54 PM)
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: 10KOysters]
#18461535 - 06/23/13 04:19 PM (11 years, 7 days ago) |
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Actaully 10k I have found that I prefer to let the water boil when bringing the core to 140-160F.
The bacteria you want will thrive in the center of the substrate while everything else begins to die at 170F+ on the outer areas. While cooling and especially while spawning, this bacteria will propagate and take hold of the whole substrate as it should.
I would venture to guess it might even be easier for the thermophiles to spread if the outer parts of the sub get excessively heated.
The key is to not go over 160-165F at the core of the substrate for more than a few minutes. That, with temps in the center held between 140-160 for 60-90min and you have a well-prepared substrate ready for open air spawning.
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KingCloyster
Forest Mushroom 🍄



Registered: 05/27/13
Posts: 597
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Is there any way to modify the tek for an AA 50x sterilizer or do I need a stock pot?
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twistedty
Forcefully Retired



Registered: 07/01/12
Posts: 5,487
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Quote:
KingCloyster said: Is there any way to modify the tek for an AA 50x sterilizer or do I need a stock pot?
pressure cookers are recommended becuase they are insulated and hold heat well
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Vire
Pleasure Seeker


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: twistedty]
#18496205 - 07/01/13 09:04 AM (11 years, 57 minutes ago) |
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Quote:
twistedty said:
Quote:
KingCloyster said: Is there any way to modify the tek for an AA 50x sterilizer or do I need a stock pot?
pressure cookers are recommended becuase they are insulated and hold heat well 
If ya wanna hold the heat well, do what I do. Do all your pasteurization in a big camping cooler. I use a temp control device, a bucket heater & an aquarium water-fan (for circulation of all that water).
Two biggest benefits to this method: 1). You can pasteurize a lot of sub all at the same time. 2). This method gets the water right where you want it and holds it there. Bucket heater + a temp control device = no worries of ever accidentally sterilizing.
There is a tek on this somewhere on the forums....And it does have its downsides. Size is an issue. I do all my pasteurization outside on my deck so I have room to work. It's also the best place for me to drain all that hot water once I'm done.
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twistedty
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Vire]
#18496211 - 07/01/13 09:07 AM (11 years, 54 minutes ago) |
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sounds like alot of work compared to just raising water to temp on a stove top
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KingCloyster
Forest Mushroom 🍄



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: twistedty]
#18496274 - 07/01/13 09:37 AM (11 years, 24 minutes ago) |
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Quote:
Vire said:
Quote:
twistedty said:
Quote:
KingCloyster said: Is there any way to modify the tek for an AA 50x sterilizer or do I need a stock pot?
pressure cookers are recommended becuase they are insulated and hold heat well 
If ya wanna hold the heat well, do what I do. Do all your pasteurization in a big camping cooler. I use a temp control device, a bucket heater & an aquarium water-fan (for circulation of all that water).
Two biggest benefits to this method: 1). You can pasteurize a lot of sub all at the same time. 2). This method gets the water right where you want it and holds it there. Bucket heater + a temp control device = no worries of ever accidentally sterilizing.
There is a tek on this somewhere on the forums....And it does have its downsides. Size is an issue. I do all my pasteurization outside on my deck so I have room to work. It's also the best place for me to drain all that hot water once I'm done.
Quote:
twistedty said: sounds like alot of work compared to just raising water to temp on a stove top
I think my best option would be to get a big stock pot with a lid from Walmart... I would do the camping cooler but I live in a 1 BdRm apartment
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twistedty
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: KingCloyster]
#18496284 - 07/01/13 09:42 AM (11 years, 19 minutes ago) |
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stock pot would work you jsut have to baby sit the jars alot more since its not insulated
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Uhurungus
Avoiderer of Bullshit


Registered: 04/20/13
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: twistedty]
#18496292 - 07/01/13 09:45 AM (11 years, 16 minutes ago) |
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out of curiosity, have you taken a temp reading near the outside of your bags toward the end of the process? or toward the end of the actual "heating up" of the water (before you turn off the heat)?
-------------------- I'm never 100% on anything, just close enough to risk looking foolish.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
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Quote:
Uhurungus said: out of curiosity, have you taken a temp reading near the outside of your bags toward the end of the process? or toward the end of the actual "heating up" of the water (before you turn off the heat)?
Not sure if you were asking me or ty, but I have taken temps from all over the top half of the bag (top edges to different parts of the center). Most variance I've ever seen from the center is about two degrees F.
Placing the lid on the stockpot when you turn the heat on will keep that whole sub nice and evenly heated.
I've run this pasteurization hundreds of times by now, with everything from coir to poo and it has yet to let me down.
Quote:
KingCloyster said: Is there any way to modify the tek for an AA 50x sterilizer or do I need a stock pot?
Use the stock pot
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Uhurungus
Avoiderer of Bullshit


Registered: 04/20/13
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this is perfect timing for me. after having done 3 various bulks with damion5050 tek and having issues i decided to bite the bullet with my presto and do the next one with your tek frank. i was so stoked to see this addendum this morning!
-------------------- I'm never 100% on anything, just close enough to risk looking foolish.
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KingCloyster
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Uhurungus]
#18496478 - 07/01/13 10:39 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Thanks frank!
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Vire
Pleasure Seeker


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Vire]
#18497068 - 07/01/13 12:58 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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In case anyone was actually looking, here is the Cooler tek. It's not for everyone, but it does work.
Easy, Inexpensive & Scalable Bulk Pasteurizer - Requires No Monitoring & is Hands Free in Operation http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/17076834/page/1
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Vire]
#18497284 - 07/01/13 02:00 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Thanks for plugging an old tek on my tek.
Do you mind?
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twistedty
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: Thanks for plugging an old tek on my tek.
Do you mind? 
rehahhaha
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Vire
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: Thanks for plugging an old tek on my tek.
Do you mind? 
Sorry, I never intended to bruise any egos.
The floor is all yours.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Vire]
#18499024 - 07/01/13 08:13 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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It's not an ego thing, it's an inferior tek you're recommending on a tek that is (fairly) widely referenced at the moment. Just seemed a bit weird to me considering 
There is also no reason not to let your water boil. The center of the substrate is the temp that matters, the rest can hit 200F+ no problem so long as the center remains under 165F.
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Uhurungus
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isn't that the major problem with damions bucket tek? pouring the boiling water over the sub over cooks some but not all of it while properly pasteurizing the majority of it? (assuming you watch the temps etc)
-------------------- I'm never 100% on anything, just close enough to risk looking foolish.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Uhurungus]
#18499968 - 07/01/13 11:10 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Damions tek is not proper pasteurization because it is too hot for too long sometimes and heats very unevenly. Coir can sometimes handle this partial sterilization but not always.
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magicman80
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Love your teks Frank! I am already having success with my monotub using this pasteurization tek! I have a question with regards to using bags. I have to use my pc to sterilize grains tonight & I'm going out of town for July 4th weekend, so I'm going to have to use my stock pot to pasteurize substrate tonight for another batch that's ready to go.
Since my stock pot isn't large enough to accommodate jars, I'll be using ziploc bags. When inserting the thermometer, how do I ensure that water doesn't get into the bag?
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~Finding inner peace is not a destination, it's a journey~ Girl Growers FTW!
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tko
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: magicman80]
#18501783 - 07/02/13 11:14 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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seal the bag around the thermometer with a bread tie or wire...or even duct tape.
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tbagtag
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Registered: 01/16/13
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Loc: Amsterdam
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Thanks for the update, glad you're finally ok with the bags. I love using bags as I can fit more into a bag than a jar and do more in one session.
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DeadPhan


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: tbagtag]
#18511200 - 07/04/13 10:34 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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So, I can't do steam pasteurization? I have an AA930 which holds 14 quart jars with 7 on top of the rest, so not submerged In water. Or 4 half gallons in water, with option of two on their side on top. Can I pasteurize with it full? Or better yet, can I not just straight up sterilize them by PCing?
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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DeadPhan


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18511215 - 07/04/13 10:38 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Sorry. Just read about sterilization, but still curious about utilizing the capacity of my PC
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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KingCloyster
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18514229 - 07/05/13 01:37 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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How long do we have before the pasteurized sub needs to be mixed with spawn?
Edited by KingCloyster (07/17/13 10:14 PM)
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cheesyincident
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I just poured 14 quarts of water into my monotub to get the total amount needed. I I can only fit 7 jars in my PC to pasteurize, would it be ideal to just do this one round with 7 jars and then just use 7 quarts of spawn?
However, my colonized jars aren't truly full quarts, so I guess I would be short probably by about 2 quarts.
Do most people just do 2 rounds of pasteurizing back to back and then them all cool over night, ready to go the next day?
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wwjddarkmon

Registered: 04/26/13
Posts: 38
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you could just get them bags from uline with no filter also for the folks that use just coir/verm/gypsum
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cheesyincident
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: Made a couple updates today. In an effort to keep my pasteurizing temps under 161F, I started turning the stove off when my substrates hit 115 internally. I also put the lid on immediately after turning off the heat. This puts me between 140-160F perfectly for up to 90 minutes 
Thanks for the feedback guys, you all kick ass! Keep it coming 
In the original tek you say to turn the heat off at 96, but here you mention 115. Does it matter or is a higher internal temp of 115 better?
Also, I have some turkey bags that measure 19.5 by 23 inches. How does these compare to your long filter bags? Can I fit a single batch of sub in this?
Edited by cheesyincident (07/17/13 09:49 PM)
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cheesyincident
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When using an oven bag, how long does it typically take to get the temp reading from the thermometer inside the sub to read 115 when you turn off the heat, wait until it reaches 140 and start the timer for 60 mins?
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KingCloyster
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Someone wanna answer why we have to replace this lids with foil?
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Scarg
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Will the boiling water not get the outside of the substrate too hot..thus partially sterilizing it before the centre is even near proper temps? Im constantly monitoring my water temp to make sure it doesnt go above 160...but its a serious pain in the ass.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Scarg]
#18574067 - 07/17/13 11:47 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
KingCloyster said: How long do we have before the pasteurized sub needs to be mixed with spawn?
I wouldn't go more than 48 hours.
Quote:
wwjddarkmon said: you could just get them bags from uline with no filter also for the folks that use just coir/verm/gypsum
Oh yeah, that will work perfect as well. I have tons of filter bags though, and I prefer the gusseted bags for holding large amounts of substrate. I also have a huge roll of uline poly tubing but it's just for my gourmets on straw.
Quote:
DeadPhan said: So, I can't do steam pasteurization? I have an AA930 which holds 14 quart jars with 7 on top of the rest, so not submerged In water. Or 4 half gallons in water, with option of two on their side on top. Can I pasteurize with it full? Or better yet, can I not just straight up sterilize them by PCing?
You will not have even heating between the top layer of jars and the bottom which are partially submerged. Use a filter bag or similar for doing large amounts of substrate at once 
Quote:
cheesyincident said: When using an oven bag, how long does it typically take to get the temp reading from the thermometer inside the sub to read 115 when you turn off the heat, wait until it reaches 140 and start the timer for 60 mins?
This will vary from stove to stove and pot to pot.
I use filter patch bags. I load an entire tub's worth of substrate into one bag, zip tie the top and stick a probe in the center. I place them in the pot and fill with water about halfway up the bag. I put the lid on the pot and turn the heat on medium.
I let my temp rise 6-8 degrees from the original temp in the core of the substrate. Then I turn off the heat and start the timer when the temp climbs to 140. Usually this keeps it above 150 but below 165 for 60+ minutes.
Quote:
KingCloyster said: Someone wanna answer why we have to replace this lids with foil?
You don't. I just prefer to be able to stick my temp probe through the foil so there is a nice tight seal around it.
Quote:
Scarg said: Will the boiling water not get the outside of the substrate too hot..thus partially sterilizing it before the centre is even near proper temps? Im constantly monitoring my water temp to make sure it doesnt go above 160...but its a serious pain in the ass.
You are mistaken about partial sterilization.
Partial sterilization is not the outer parts of the substrate being sterilized due to high temps. It is when the core temp of the substrate is above 170F for more than a few minutes.
It is preferable the water boils and heats the outside of the substrate up to near boiling temps. This ensures the microbes in the center will be able to spread quickly as it cools.
So yes, you are sterilizing the exterior of your sub. But as long as the interior stays between 140-165F for 60 minutes that is completely fine.
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cheesyincident
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You wait until it rises 6-8 degrees? What is your typical starting temp of your sub core? In the tek you mention waiting until it is 96 and in a post above you mention you wait until is 115. Is your sub always around 109 or so to start?
Do you put bricks on top of your bag? I will be using 2 gallon ziplocks - I plan to just flatten the top of each ziplock, put a brick on them, poke my probe through he top of one of them, fill water halfway up the sides of the bags, just rest my PC top on, and go.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Quote:
cheesyincident said: You wait until it rises 6-8 degrees? What is your typical starting temp of your sub core? In the tek you mention waiting until it is 96 and in a post above you mention you wait until is 115. Is your sub always around 109 or so to start?
Do you put bricks on top of your bag? I will be using 2 gallon ziplocks - I plan to just flatten the top of each ziplock, put a brick on them, poke my probe through he top of one of them, fill water halfway up the sides of the bags, just rest my PC top on, and go.
Let me preface this response by saying that all of my teks are a work in progress. I am always working on perfecting things, be that by gathering data on temps vs heat vs time or what have you.
Timings are going to be different for everyone's stove. You're probably going to have to fuck up until you learn yours, like I did with mine 
For me, now, just like I did it yesterday and again this morning:
Load filter bag, check temp. Usually it's around 80F.
Fill pot with water. Cover loosely. Turn on medium heat.
I let the temp climb 6-10 degrees in the center of the substrate then turn off the heat. In my case that is between 86-90F.
Temp continues rising, start timer at 140F mark.
Make sure it doesn't go over 165F for any extended amount of time. If it does, well, risk it or toss it.
If I could give you a more clearly defined description of my personal timings, I would...unfortunately since every stove and bag and substrate is different, I can only provide you with a set of basics to go in with.
You will need to tweak it to your personal liking. It's a shame it's not so simple as "Add BRF/verm and boil the jars" hey? 
I do not weigh them down any longer. Unnecessary. I really need to update this today.
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KingCloyster
Forest Mushroom 🍄



Registered: 05/27/13
Posts: 597
Loc: Quetico, Canada
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Quote:
KingCloyster said: Someone wanna answer why we have to replace this lids with foil?
You don't. I just prefer to be able to stick my temp probe through the foil so there is a nice tight seal around it.
So couldn't I just get away with using foil for one of the jars? Or would they heat up differently n stuff?
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bEelzeBosS
Swing on the spiral

Registered: 06/15/13
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How long will the substrate stay pasteurized? Can I pasteurize it right now and leave it in the bags 24 hours before I add it/spawn to my tub?
Also, Im using these, will they work ok?
Edited by bEelzeBosS (07/18/13 02:12 PM)
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rulesq
Bad Mogambo



Registered: 05/10/13
Posts: 5,317
Loc: Суомалиа
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: bEelzeBosS]
#18576321 - 07/18/13 02:28 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Scroll a bit up dude and you'll find your answer on the first question
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rulesq
Bad Mogambo



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: bEelzeBosS]
#18576338 - 07/18/13 02:31 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Although it's rather an opinion but I'd take franks word for it
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bEelzeBosS
Swing on the spiral

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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: rulesq]
#18576348 - 07/18/13 02:33 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Heh I read the last two pages and somehow missed that
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rulesq
Bad Mogambo



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: bEelzeBosS]
#18576365 - 07/18/13 02:37 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Too close huh? I know that feeling too well
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bEelzeBosS
Swing on the spiral

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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
I do not weigh them down any longer. Unnecessary. I really need to update this today.
So its ok if my bags are just floating on top?
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twistedty
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: bEelzeBosS]
#18577501 - 07/18/13 06:01 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
chaotic646 said:
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
I do not weigh them down any longer. Unnecessary. I really need to update this today.
So its ok if my bags are just floating on top?
not really, you want them at least 3/4 submerged for even heat distribution. which is why when using jars i use a brick to keep them down in the water bath
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cheesyincident
Cheese Head



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: twistedty]
#18577521 - 07/18/13 06:03 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
twistedty said:
Quote:
chaotic646 said:
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
I do not weigh them down any longer. Unnecessary. I really need to update this today.
So its ok if my bags are just floating on top?
not really, you want them at least 3/4 submerged for even heat distribution. which is why when using jars i use a brick to keep them down in the water bath
Do you just place a brick directly on top of the jars? I don't have a second canning plate to out on them to out the brick on.
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twistedty
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i use a trivet on the bottom, and then lay a hunk of brick to weigh them down. but lately i have been packing the jars a little tighter and they dont bob in the water near as much.
i fill to 3/4 up the sides of the jars with water. this isnt a pasteurize run but you get the idea.

just be resourceful i found this brick outside my house.
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bEelzeBosS
Swing on the spiral

Registered: 06/15/13
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Quote:
cheesyincident said:
Do you just place a brick directly on top of the jars? I don't have a second canning plate to out on them to out the brick on.
Depending on the size of your PC you could put a plate on top then the brick on the plate.
Edited by bEelzeBosS (07/18/13 07:21 PM)
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Quote:
twistedty said:
Quote:
chaotic646 said:
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
I do not weigh them down any longer. Unnecessary. I really need to update this today.
So its ok if my bags are just floating on top?
not really, you want them at least 3/4 submerged for even heat distribution. which is why when using jars i use a brick to keep them down in the water bath
You don't want them floating but you certainly don't need to keep them 3/4 submerged. If you put the lid on at the start of the cycle, the whole bag or jar will heat evenly enough if only half submerged. I've probed and checked on many different batches to make sure. You can do the same.
At the end of the bath I never see more than 1-2 degrees F variance between the center of the substrate and the top portion of the bag. It will certainly get up to temp with all the steam trapped in the pot.
One time I accidentally pasteurized jars in only an inch or so of water. They actually worked out just fine
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DeadPhan


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: bEelzeBosS]
#18578138 - 07/18/13 08:14 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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I can't imagine doing this with jars each time. I'm gonna go with bags. In that case, what's the largest amount of sub I can pasteurize at once using bags. Considering I have an AA 930 with 14 quart jar capacity. Is it possible to get 2 monotubs worth of sub in one cook?
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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Scarg
Self Defecator


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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek (now using jars or bags) [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18578886 - 07/18/13 11:48 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
I put the lid on and turn the heat to medium. I set my alarm on my timer for 96F, a good internal temperature to turn the heat off at IME. The water will boil and that is completely fine.
I'm wondering why you only put your stove on medium? If it's all good for the water to boil, why not put it on high and get that sucker cooking?
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Posts: 10,573
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek (now using jars or bags) [Re: Scarg]
#18579816 - 07/19/13 07:30 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
DeadPhan said: I can't imagine doing this with jars each time. I'm gonna go with bags. In that case, what's the largest amount of sub I can pasteurize at once using bags. Considering I have an AA 930 with 14 quart jar capacity. Is it possible to get 2 monotubs worth of sub in one cook?
Hell yeah, if you can fit the bags in there go for it. I'd separate them with jar rings though.
Quote:
Scarg said: I'm wondering why you only put your stove on medium? If it's all good for the water to boil, why not put it on high and get that sucker cooking?
Because it climbs too high too fast if I put my stove on high. It's more difficult to gauge when to turn off the heat if I need to turn it off before my core temp even rises a degree 
It boils like crazy on medium. I have a pretty hot stove.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Posts: 10,573
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18581331 - 07/19/13 03:38 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Basically re-wrote most of the tek. Enjoy!
Edited by FrankHorrigan (07/19/13 03:56 PM)
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DeadPhan


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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18581389 - 07/19/13 03:53 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Frank.....do they have oven bags and whatnot that might fit 2 tubs worth of sub in one bag? In where I can just stuff one big bag filled with twice as much, add water about a third a way up or so and let er rip. then when adding to tubs just add half of each to each tub. On that not I gather its not a big deal if the bag touches the side walls? I've yet too see how two bags would fit side by side but I guess I'll try. Just assumed two tubs worth would come up farther in which case being in one bag and filling water higher might suffice.
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rulesq
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18581406 - 07/19/13 03:59 PM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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I'm waiting for my jars to finish colonizing, so I can try out your TEK's dude!
I'll be doing everything as per your teks, with the exception of using RR's rye tek for my grains(I'll give your WBS tek a go sometime in the future!), seems like a good way to get a kickstart to this hobby 
I'm fairly interested in agar works and its benefits, any chance you'd be making a "agar working a la FrankHorrigan"-tut sometime?
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FrankHorrigan
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: rulesq] 1
#18593612 - 07/22/13 09:44 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
DeadPhan said: Frank.....do they have oven bags and whatnot that might fit 2 tubs worth of sub in one bag? In where I can just stuff one big bag filled with twice as much, add water about a third a way up or so and let er rip. then when adding to tubs just add half of each to each tub. On that not I gather its not a big deal if the bag touches the side walls? I've yet too see how two bags would fit side by side but I guess I'll try. Just assumed two tubs worth would come up farther in which case being in one bag and filling water higher might suffice.
I'm not sure but oven bags are slightly porous, I would try to steer clear if you can.
But yes, if you can fit the sub in the bag and the bag in the pot, then have at it! You will need to adjust your timings accordingly. I honestly prefer as much substrate in one container as possible, I don't like multiple core temps at once.
For example when I need to case six trays and five tubs, I'll just pasteurize 12 quarts of 50/50+ in one big filter bag.
Quote:
rulesq said: I'm fairly interested in agar works and its benefits, any chance you'd be making a "agar working a la FrankHorrigan"-tut sometime? 
Possibly, but RR covers it pretty perfectly in his video segments. I have not deviated much from that technique because it just works better than anything else I've tried.
I'm working on some photography for casing layer tutorials that will include instances where casing layers are very beneficial. I think there has been neglect in the casing teks around here and if I hear "Bubblewrap is just as good as a real casing layer!!" one more time, I may puke a little bit
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bEelzeBosS
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18593651 - 07/22/13 09:53 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: Possibly, but RR covers it pretty perfectly in his video segments. I have not deviated much from that technique because it just works better than anything else I've tried.
The only agar video I found just shows how to pour, is there a video or tek somewhere that explains how to inoculate your petri dishes and what to look for or expect while they colonize? My petris arrived today and my agar ingredients should be here tomorrow so Im pretty excited to try this out.
Edited by bEelzeBosS (07/22/13 09:55 AM)
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rulesq
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan] 1
#18593661 - 07/22/13 09:56 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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Fair enough.

I'll buy the RR series ASA I get more money, $9.99 isn't too bad for a lot of useful information
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FrankHorrigan
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: bEelzeBosS]
#18593669 - 07/22/13 09:57 AM (10 years, 11 months ago) |
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You should be excited, agar is the best thing you will ever do for your success rate.
http://www.mushroomvideos.com/Strain-Isolation
http://www.mushroomvideos.com/Mushroom-Cloning
You may have missed the follow up chapters. Have you purchased the downloadable videos? You should. They are cheap.
Quote:
rulesq said: $9.99 isn't too bad for a lot of useful information 
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DeadPhan


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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18609841 - 07/25/13 02:01 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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How about doubling up on an oven bag? Also, where might find oven bags? I only ask because I don't have a debit card ATM so need to just go to a store for bags to pasteurize with. On that note can I get any other bags for pasturizing at a store?
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SamGopal
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: DeadPhan]
#18609876 - 07/25/13 02:10 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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i use 1 gallon ziplock bags doubled up my PC holds 7 quart jars or 5 one gallon ziplocks (20 quarts).works great and saves time.i even mix my coco/verm in the bag and then hydrate right in the bag.about 1 qt per bag to get to field capacity.the five bags (20) quarts are a tight fit but it works great.i think 1 bag would work but i double bag just in case.i love proper pasturazation thanks for the good info spreading Frank.
Edited by SamGopal (07/26/13 10:48 AM)
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FrankHorrigan
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: SamGopal]
#18613703 - 07/26/13 08:35 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I would try the ziplock bags first myself, but doubling the oven bag might work DP! 
I would just beware of a pocket of air forming between the two bags, throwing off the even heating of the substrate.
Edited by FrankHorrigan (07/26/13 10:43 AM)
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SamGopal
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18614198 - 07/26/13 10:55 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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the 2nd doubled up ziplock is a very tight fit over the first bag.no air gaps at all.it works very nicely.i use my pressure cooker im not sure how the ziplock would hold up in a thin walled regular pot.im guessing it would be fine since the water gets to just a very light boil and is there only a short time before the sub hits the right temp.
Edited by SamGopal (07/26/13 12:53 PM)
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FrankHorrigan
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: SamGopal]
#18614246 - 07/26/13 11:06 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Very nice
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JohnnieYen
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18615697 - 07/26/13 03:49 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I just pasteurized 3 tubs worth of sub in one go. Used 3 lrg canning pots and 3 electric burners


and used 3 gallon ziplocks in each pot, with a digital thermometer in one of the three bags. Worked like a charm! Thanks Frank!
I turned off the burners at 110 degrees and all peaked out at 159 and held heat very well. I went for 90 minutes due the amount of sub in each pot (equivalent to 10 quarts coir and 2 qt verm)
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grainbrain
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: JohnnieYen]
#18615796 - 07/26/13 04:04 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I can't tell you how perfect this tek is. I turn the heat off when the water hits 170 degrees, cover for 90 minutes and the sub peaks out at 150.
Thanks Frank.
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cheesyincident
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: grainbrain]
#18623297 - 07/28/13 10:37 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I know it differs for everyone, but what is the general time frame this takes when using jars? Specifically the time it takes for the sub to rise a few degrees enough to turn the heat off?
On average, are we talking about 30 mins, 45 mins or 2 hours for the temp to reach the right number before setting the timer for 60 min?? Just so I have a general guideline...
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cheesyincident
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How long until the jars are cool enough to spawn? Overnight is ideal, but does anyone do it same day, so after waiting 4 hours or so?
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cheesyincident
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: cheesyincident]
#18624872 - 07/28/13 05:08 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
cheesyincident said: I know it differs for everyone, but what is the general time frame this takes when using jars? Specifically the time it takes for the sub to rise a few degrees enough to turn the heat off?
On average, are we talking about 30 mins, 45 mins or 2 hours for the temp to reach the right number before setting the timer for 60 min?? Just so I have a general guideline...
I just tried it. Sub was 87 to start and took ~25 minutes to get to 102. Shut the heat off and it got to 140 about ~25 minutes later. Stopped climbing at 141, fell to 140 so I turned the heat back on for 15 minutes and it climbed to 155 and stayed there until the 60 minutes was up.
Doing round two of my jars now. Will crank the heat up a little bit to try and avoid having to reheat it during the 60 minute window.
Pretty easy, thanks Frank!!
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FrankHorrigan
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: cheesyincident]
#18626277 - 07/28/13 10:40 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I'm glad you figured it out. I have yet to actually take timings
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Diamonds808
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I was wondering if this was possible to do with turkey oven bags (doubled up) with coir/verm/gypsum.
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psykonautix
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 - rewritten [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18635647 - 07/30/13 07:13 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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BUY A DIGITAL THERMOMETER!!! Just bought one today and it makes it almost idiot proof.
-------------------- Everything I say or post is a work of fiction and should be considered a lie.
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Diamonds808
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 - rewritten [Re: psykonautix]
#18635858 - 07/30/13 07:53 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Where did you purchase yours? The $15 on amazon is on back order.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18636240 - 07/30/13 09:09 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I get mine at bed bath and beyond 
Quote:
Diamonds808 said: I was wondering if this was possible to do with turkey oven bags (doubled up) with coir/verm/gypsum.
Worth a shot, I don't use them myself though.
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Diamonds808
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OOh, I shall try there! It always seems so expensive though. >.<
Yeah, I'm pretty sure they're cheaper? $1 a bag.
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JohnnieYen
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18638041 - 07/31/13 09:42 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Diamonds, use gallon ziplock freezer bags. you can get 100 for around 15$ I think (costco).
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Diamonds808
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: JohnnieYen]
#18642373 - 08/01/13 02:06 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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JonnieYen,
Thank you! Fill them up to the top and seal it except for a corner? Put lids in between bags in PC?
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18642736 - 08/01/13 06:49 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Diamonds808 said: Yeah, I'm pretty sure they're cheaper? $1 a bag.
That's more than I pay for my filter bags, they are about 20-40 cents a piece if you find a good deal and buy in bulk.
As far as ziplocks and spacing them in the pot, I can't imagine it would hurt to try. Again, I don't use them though, so perhaps someone with more ziplock experience can chime in
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JohnnieYen
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18643086 - 08/01/13 09:36 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
Diamonds808 said: JonnieYen,
Thank you! Fill them up to the top and seal it except for a corner? Put lids in between bags in PC?
I get the coir/verm/gypsum to field capacity, then load them into 3 - 1 gallon ziplocks. Squeeze the air out and in one of the bags, put the digi thermometer in the middle of the bag about 5 inches down. Seal around the probe as much as possible. I fill water to the first tier of the canning pot, and when the 3 bags go in the water is around the halfway point of the bag.
I use a trivet on the bottom of the canning pot but nothing in between the bags. I turn on the stove before I load my bags so when they are ready, the water has already started.
turn off stove when temp hits 108-110 and it should climb slowly to 150-160. takes a bit to get timing down but it works great.
if you notice that the heat is climbing too fast throw some ice cubes in the water.
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DeadPhan


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: JohnnieYen]
#18643188 - 08/01/13 10:06 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Do you keep the other two bags fully open or seal for the most part. Also, what do you mean by filling water to the first tier?
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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DeadPhan


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18643194 - 08/01/13 10:08 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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And the three ziplock bags, are the relatively full? This is enough sub for just one monotub?
Also, I'm not sure if this question has been asked in this thread yet, but how long can one wait to spawn to pasteurized sub?
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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JohnnieYen
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18643242 - 08/01/13 10:22 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Quote:
DeadPhan said: Do you keep the other two bags fully open or seal for the most part. Also, what do you mean by filling water to the first tier?
the other 2 bags are sealed once air is removed.
first tier is until the first line in the canner.
Quote:
DeadPhan said: And the three ziplock bags, are the relatively full? This is enough sub for just one monotub?
the ziplocks are almost full, about an inch from the top. You can flatten them out once air is out too. There is 10 qt coir, 2 qt verm and some gypsum between the 3 bags, so enough for a 55-65 L tub
Also, I'm not sure if this question has been asked in this thread yet, but how long can one wait to spawn to pasteurized sub?
I usually wait until the next night so around 24 hr, but it should be cool enough after 6-8 hr
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DeadPhan


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: JohnnieYen]
#18643496 - 08/01/13 11:49 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Right on thanks. I don't have one of those canner pots. Just my PC or a big regular pot. So as long as water comes up about halfway I'm good? And about how long you can wait, I more meant, up to how long. I am curious on how long after cooking I can feasibly wait to spawn with no ill effects. Like if I was to cook enough sub for x amount of tubs over weekend but couldn't get to spawning until a couple days later is that alright?
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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LustyLocks


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18643574 - 08/01/13 12:07 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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The sooner the better, but I think a couple of days wouldn't be a problem.
I just tried this for the first time with a spawn bag. Wow. It sure beats having to load up all the individual jars. The temp and timing was a bit tricky at first, but I'll get the hang of it.
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FrankHorrigan
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: LustyLocks]
#18645983 - 08/01/13 08:12 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Johnnie, please don't take offense to this, but...this thread is not about your pasteurization methods and while I see no issue with your methods differing from mine, it is confusing for everyone else if they have to sift through this sort of stuff while trying to find info in this thread.
Please start your own thread or take this to PMs with different users.

Quote:
DeadPhan said: Do you keep the other two bags fully open or seal for the most part. Also, what do you mean by filling water to the first tier?
Seal the bags. First squeeze out all the air you can to avoid cooler pockets of air (which will occur if you don't).
Also you don't need to fill the water any more than half way 
Quote:
DeadPhan said: Like if I was to cook enough sub for x amount of tubs over weekend but couldn't get to spawning until a couple days later is that alright?
48 hours is fine but I never go more than that.
Quote:
Claybuddy said: I just tried this for the first time with a spawn bag. Wow. It sure beats having to load up all the individual jars. The temp and timing was a bit tricky at first, but I'll get the hang of it.
Right? I'll never go back to jars again 
Glad to see you around every so often clay
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LustyLocks


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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
Right? I'll never go back to jars again 
Glad to see you around every so often clay 
It's good to be seen!
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JohnnieYen
Okay



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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
As far as ziplocks and spacing them in the pot, I can't imagine it would hurt to try. Again, I don't use them though, so perhaps someone with more ziplock experience can chime in 
Didn't mean to jack your thread Frank, but I was responding to the above quote...
no offense taken, you have provided me with a wealth of info and brought me from the dark ages (bucket tek)
edit: if anyone has questions, feel free to PM me!
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Edited by JohnnieYen (08/02/13 10:28 AM)
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: JohnnieYen]
#18648685 - 08/02/13 10:28 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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That's fair, and I'm glad I didn't come off as too harsh 
Thank you for sharing the ziplock info. I just did not expect it to turn into a half-page of discussion! No worries though mate
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Uhurungus
Avoiderer of Bullshit


Registered: 04/20/13
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i tried bags for the first time last night. i used 1 bag with about 11quarts sub in a 23q presto. sub started at 75 degrees. took about 2 hours to get up to 90 degrees at which point i turned the burner off. by this time it was way too late to stay up and monitor the process to the end so i decided to redo it today. no idea it would take this long. i got up about 6 hours later and the core temp was reading about 135. i really wish i could still use it but it's toast. no idea how hot it got and for how long. total loss was about $5 and a small amount of attention.
does 90 minutes sound like the right amount of time for a single 10-12 quart bag?
-------------------- I'm never 100% on anything, just close enough to risk looking foolish.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Uhurungus]
#18648755 - 08/02/13 10:46 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Anywhere between 60-120 minutes sounds about right for when I turn my stove off.
I am working with the grains for this month's projects right now but in a couple weeks I will have some substrate to take timings with.
I will say that it probably hit temp and receded very slowly over the course of the night. I would not risk it but I live in a high-contam environment as it is.
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Uhurungus
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when you say "risk it" do you mean risk of over pasteurization as in too long? or just not knowing where the temps were officially at?
i'd be willing to risk that it didn't get too hot, but if being in there at the correct temp for say 5 hours would mess it up then i'd rather just pass on it. unless you think it would be worth doing for the sake of sharing results... which i'd be willing to do. but i have no issues just throwing it out either. i do know my spawn is golden this time so if it contams it aint the grain!
-------------------- I'm never 100% on anything, just close enough to risk looking foolish.
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FrankHorrigan
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Uhurungus] 1
#18649754 - 08/02/13 02:42 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I meant risk it as in it may have gotten too hot, and it also sat at high temps all night.
Part of proper pasteurization is rapidly cooling the substrate by removing it from the bath when the time is up.
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Uhurungus
Avoiderer of Bullshit


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roger that, to the garden it goes.
-------------------- I'm never 100% on anything, just close enough to risk looking foolish.
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Diamonds808
New love formushies.



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Uhurungus]
#18650744 - 08/02/13 05:51 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Thanks everyone! I'm going to be doing this method in a few days!
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Uhurungus
Avoiderer of Bullshit


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18651172 - 08/02/13 07:20 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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i've seen a few posts where people say they have reused bags a few times in the past. curious what peoples experience is reusing them in this situation, pasteurizing subs at 160 instead of sterilizing at much higher temp.
-------------------- I'm never 100% on anything, just close enough to risk looking foolish.
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Diamonds808
New love formushies.



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Uhurungus]
#18651191 - 08/02/13 07:22 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Anyone know if you would be able to seal the bags with a paper wire twist tie like this? http://www.supplyplaza.com/images/uploaded/110-08%20WEB.jpg
Can you leave it in the pot/pc to cool overnight? Or is there a specific reason in transferring it? How many hours is overnight (if you do the bags)?
Edited by Diamonds808 (08/02/13 09:35 PM)
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Uhurungus]
#18653553 - 08/03/13 08:53 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Diamond, I answered your question not even six posts prior..
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: Part of proper pasteurization is rapidly cooling the substrate by removing it from the bath when the time is up.
No, do not leave it in the bath over the time it takes to pasteurize.
And I would not trust those pieces of shit.
Just pick up a bag of zip-ties, it's like $3 for a hundred. They are prime.
Quote:
Uhurungus said: i've seen a few posts where people say they have reused bags a few times in the past. curious what peoples experience is reusing them in this situation, pasteurizing subs at 160 instead of sterilizing at much higher temp.
I have four filter patch bags dedicated to the cause.
They work great over and over again, so long as I am gentle enough to not rip the seals on the bottom
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Diamonds808
New love formushies.



Registered: 07/12/07
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Sorry Frank,
Thanks! I bought some zipties and wire. I think due to the fact that the turkey bags don't have a filter patch, it would probably take 8-10hrs to cool off.
Sorry, I'm super finicky with making sure I follow a structured schedule with approx. times.
Edited by Diamonds808 (08/04/13 09:44 PM)
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Diamonds808
New love formushies.



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18725729 - 08/19/13 01:31 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Alright everybody,
Substrate in two turkey oven bags (double bagged): 77F 8PM: Placed in pot with hot tap water: 85F (turned stove on med heat) 8:30PM: 140F (this is when I turned the stove off-- I totally forgot that I was suppose to turn it off wayy earlier so I freaked out and took off the lid for a minute) 8:47PM: temperature continued to rise to about 145F and then went down to 141 8:47-8:50PM: Turned stove back on for 3 minutes (med heat) till temp rose to 145F 8:58PM: Temp @ 149 (started decreasing again) 9:03PM: Temp @ 146 - turned stove back on to med. heat 9:06PM: Temp @ 148- turned stove off 9:13PM : Temp @ 152 (started decreasing again) 9:30PM: Temp @ 143 wasn't in a rush so I just left it. 9:38PM: Temp went down to 139F.
Edited by Diamonds808 (08/19/13 01:39 AM)
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mthawkins
T-Mobile

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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18738431 - 08/21/13 04:22 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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If the lid on my PC isn't locked closed, am I able to remove the lid to check temperature? Or does thermometer somehow stay in the jar? I assume ill have the thermometer sticking through the jar lid into the middle somehow
-------------------- “Never laugh at live dragons.” - J.R.R Tolkien
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: mthawkins]
#18738458 - 08/21/13 04:29 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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poke the thermometer through the foil lid. You don't need to lock down the lid.
When I used a PC as a big pot, I removed the rubber gasket so it was easier to deal with. Now I a have a couple of big steam canning pots.
If you have a digital thermometer with the long cord, the lid can just rest on the cord.
-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
Edited by SpitballJedi (08/21/13 04:44 PM)
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LustyLocks


Registered: 01/10/12
Posts: 1,513
Loc: Mom's basement
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Those thermometers in Spitballs photo are excellent. I believe Frank uses the same ones. You never have to take the lid off to check the temp and there is a timer and an alert If you go over a certain temp.
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mthawkins
T-Mobile

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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: LustyLocks]
#18741831 - 08/22/13 11:02 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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Can I get a link to it so I can purchase the same kind ? Or what's the brand
-------------------- “Never laugh at live dragons.” - J.R.R Tolkien
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: mthawkins]
#18741865 - 08/22/13 11:14 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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quisp65
Stranger


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: mthawkins]
#18741874 - 08/22/13 11:18 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I use this method, but when I switch over to poo, I was thinking about using a scientific thermometer and mainly just measure the temp of the water and have it get no higher than 165. Let it drop to 140 and then reheat to about 160.
Think this would take too long? Allowing the water to boil brings the substrate against the glass above optimal temperature. This method would improve it if it didn't take an ungodly amount of time. Though with coir/verm/gypsum... * it!
I think I'll try it once and see how long it takes for the middle substrate to reach 140.
-------------------- A bit expensive but the largest clear tote I've found. Great if you want a large SGFC that can easily do both trays and cakes. If you decide to go all out on a SGFC, be sure to get coarse perlite. It keeps it cleaner and allows better FAE and humidity.
Edited by quisp65 (08/22/13 11:20 AM)
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: quisp65]
#18741884 - 08/22/13 11:23 AM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I think you're overthinking it.
Pasteurization temps are measured at the core for a reason.
When the outer edges are sterilized and the core still contains a lot of healthy thermophilic bacteria, this bacteria will take over the sub very quickly when cooling.
Pasteurization is a rise in temp until the core is help at 140-160F for 60-90 minutes and then cooled quickly.
The "cooled quickly" part is very important. After too long of being held at high temps, your bacteria will start to suffer. This is why you do not let the substrate cool in the pasteurization bath but rather at room temp.
And starting at 165 is going to do away with a lot of the bacteria you want in your substrate. Your performance will vary but your contam risk with hpoo is going to be increased as you climb to the higher temps.
I pasteurize at 145-150F now, no higher, for at least 90 minutes. My substrates and mycelium thank me with beautiful bounties
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spacechildo
proletarians rise up



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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
The "cooled quickly" part is very important. After too long of being held at high temps, your bacteria will start to suffer. This is why you do not let the substrate cool in the pasteurization bath but rather at room temp.
Is it just my or is this another reason why the bucket tek doesn't always work? Don't remember any steps to cool mah bucket after the 60-90 mins is up..
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: spacechildo]
#18742112 - 08/22/13 12:12 PM (10 years, 10 months ago) |
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I would have to agree with you.
There aren't any controls for bucket tek, that's for sure.
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut


Registered: 10/13/12
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: I use an oneida digital thermometer probe.
Works fantastic!
Exactly what I got. Seem rock solid.
I had some cheaper ones, but all 4 of them had a different temperature reading. After experimenting, I think the probes actually went bad.
-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
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Diamonds808
New love formushies.



Registered: 07/12/07
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FYI, 2:30P: Started at 97F 2:377: 127F 3:22: 137F 327: 132F (Took bag out cuz it reached 132 (yeah, i forgot again to turn off the heat AND I had it on high so boo me) 3:36: 165F (Of fuck it's been over 40 --took OFF lid and took bag OUT) 3:40: 141 (*So it was at least 4 minutes after passing 140 (reaching to 165!F))) 4:13PM: Closed lid. 3:42: 147F 4:06: 144F Turned heat on high: 4:12: 158 (turned heat OFF, took off lid, & took bag OUT) 4:13: 162 Figues I'd just leave everything in...
Hopefully those... several minutes didn't fucked up my whole procedure.;but we shall.. see!
Edited by Diamonds808 (08/25/13 09:50 PM)
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18757314 - 08/25/13 09:46 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yikes!
Using a large bag of substrate I take it?
I turn mine off after it climbs only a few degrees if it starts at above 80F.
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Diamonds808
New love formushies.



Registered: 07/12/07
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I suppose (2 double bagged turkey oven bags...)?
I did 1 brick of coir + 2 Qts of verm
Within 4 minutes it went from 165 to 141... is it still good..?
Edited by Diamonds808 (08/25/13 09:52 PM)
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18757345 - 08/25/13 09:52 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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I mean, if you wanna risk it, go for it...those crazy swings in temp though, it will be a risk.
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Diamonds808
New love formushies.



Registered: 07/12/07
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You say over 160F for a minutes but I don't think it was for a few minutes (BUT I DON'T KNOW FOR SURE).... so I thin it'll be okay? AND, I won't do the coir/verm layer over... cuz I feel like my subs colonize faster/better w/o it.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Diamonds808]
#18757535 - 08/25/13 10:34 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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It's a risk.
Your call
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



Registered: 10/13/12
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18777823 - 08/30/13 03:02 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Frank, I was looking over your OP, it's been a while since I read it and it appears you have made some changes.
If I remember, you used to use 2 thermometers, one in the jar and one in the water. That's what I do.
Do you no longer worry about the water temp anymore? I set my heat on medium and don't let the water get above 175F.
I also noticed you now use 80-90 degree water to mix with your sub. I like that idea. I imagine using hot tap water would be fine too. What say you?
Sorry if this has been addressed, but this thread is a monster.
-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: SpitballJedi]
#18782247 - 08/31/13 05:58 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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I searched through the thread and found my answer.
-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
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HypnotoadCroaked
Retired, but will check MSGs

Registered: 01/05/13
Posts: 1,168
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18782367 - 08/31/13 06:31 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: This is not an exact science. You will need to tweak the timings and temps to your stove and situation. I will describe how I do it every time with success.
This is the best description of the process. Every stove and stock pot is different. The amount of water in the pot, the amount of jars, type of jar (plastic or glass) AND their ambient temp can all determine exact cook times and temps. EVERY SITUATION WILL BE SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT.
As an example, I use a large stock pot and not my PC base. At 120F, I pull the whole pot off of the range and put the lid on. Temps will rise to 160 and hold steady for well over an hour. My stock pot will hold up to 7 quart sized jars......While this is the exact method that works for me, individual miles will vary.
Each of us needs to determine the least common denominator, which is keeping the sub at 160f for an hour. The methods contained in this post provide a great baseline, but probably need altered for the individual situation.
I've gotten quite a good deal of great info from FH's very nice logs. I have recently taken the "next step" from supplied MSS, to using my own prints on agar. I Really couldn't have done it without the help of ALL of the TCs and a number of regular users...some of whom have no idea I am emulating their methods (Roger Rabit/Frank/Tmethyl/Citric/TrancendingLife/Notahacker420/Ohmatic etc). It feels good to be able to do what I do without ever spending a cent on another print, and knowing how clean your print can be...versus the guess of what the Trusted Sponsor is supplying.
Keep on keeping on!
-W
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MaJiK_420
...lost



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Just because the thread was at the top... I figured I'd say I'm kicking the bucket(tek) and my probe thermometer is on the way.
I've had great success with the bucket so far, but my buddy just had 13 tubs bite it, and since I am thinking about stepping up production too, I figure I'm not willing to take that kind of risk for loss. He's going back to PF cakes haha.
But I'll step things up. Thanks for a great tek to follow Frank, I look forward to much success.
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Nakor420
Fun Guy



Registered: 05/02/13
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: MaJiK_420]
#18806920 - 09/06/13 10:41 AM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Just ordered this. 
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



Registered: 10/13/12
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Nakor420]
#18808541 - 09/06/13 06:04 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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I had 4 of those. They all read different temps after 4-5 uses. Some were 20F apart.
I figured out it was the probes by doing boiling water and ice water tests. 3 of the probes were bad
-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
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immure


Registered: 09/02/13
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This might be a stupid question, but how do you measure the core temp? and how do you measure the temp with the lid on?
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druranium
Farmer


Registered: 09/10/12
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: immure]
#18808976 - 09/06/13 07:32 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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The first time I tried this "by the guide" my temp took a long time to start rising so I kept turning up the heat in very small increments. After a while temp went up 15-20 so I turned off the stove and let it climb...120, 130, 140, timer for 60 min, 150, 160, uh oh it's only been 15 minutes and the fracking temp is still climbing!
Remove from stove, remove from hot pot, put in cast iron pot with cold water...shit...165 and climbing still... ice in the pot, pot in front of a fan, and after what felt like an eternity but was probably only 10 min. temp finally dropped back down to 160. I have an old electric stove which seems to play by its own rules when you adjust the dial. I've gotten used to cooking with it and it doesn't bother me but doing this with a big heavy pot full of sub jars + water is another matter. Definitely are a lot of variables to consider as mentioned above, guess next time I just need to stay low on the heat and let it do its thing as slow as it wants to go.
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druranium
Farmer


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: immure]
#18809007 - 09/06/13 07:37 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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immure, you get one of those digital cooking thermometers with the metal probe on a cord. The lids are just foil with a band so you stick it through into one of the jars.
I got mine at target for $15, amazon has 'em too. You can rest the lid on the pot sitting on the cord...wouldn't wanna clamp a pc lid down on it but that's entirely not necessary for this procedure.
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headofmike
trich. farmer



Registered: 08/09/07
Posts: 374
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: druranium]
#18809143 - 09/06/13 08:07 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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I had great success with this tek this week. I used 1 gallon bags. Took about 1.5 hours to get the temp to 120. At 120 turned the stove off. Another half hour to get the core up to 140f. I turned the stove off and let pasteurize for 45 minutes, it was at 160 at the end of the cycle. At 45 minutes I pulled the bags out and let them sit. They'll continue to pasteurize until the temp drops. This is why I only go for 45 mins. Pretty easy, and makes you feel a lot more confident about the whole process. I also took some straight out've the pc and placed them in the fridge. In an hour they were cool enough to use. SO fairly fast it you do it this way too.
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Nakor420
Fun Guy



Registered: 05/02/13
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Quote:
SpitballJedi said: I had 4 of those. They all read different temps after 4-5 uses. Some were 20F apart.
I figured out it was the probes by doing boiling water and ice water tests. 3 of the probes were bad
I got it on Amazon for $18.. the customer reviews on this one were great. One guy said he bought his 7 years ago and it's still working great. Though he did suggest purchasing a spare probe with it.
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Sma11mau5
Stranger


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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: FrankHorrigan]
#18829508 - 09/11/13 07:33 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
I'm not sure but oven bags are slightly porous, I would try to steer clear if you can.
But yes, if you can fit the sub in the bag and the bag in the pot, then have at it! You will need to adjust your timings accordingly. I honestly prefer as much substrate in one container as possible, I don't like multiple core temps at once.
For example when I need to case six trays and five tubs, I'll just pasteurize 12 quarts of 50/50+ in one big filter bag.
Great tek thanks for the help and a single oven bag worked great for me with no leaking or problems
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: Frank's Proper Pasteurization Tek 3.0 [Re: Sma11mau5]
#18837028 - 09/13/13 01:39 PM (10 years, 9 months ago) |
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Good stuff! And good to know!
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Quote:
FrankHorrigan said:
If the temp goes over 170F for more than ten or fifteen minutes, you will start to partially sterilize your substrate. It'd be best to toss it and try again. Since we spawn to bulk in open air, a partially sterilized substrate is often as shitty as an unpasteurized substrate.
Bear in mind though, if you are pasteurizing just coir and verm, you can probably get away with it. Coir is very contam resistant.
Clarified a bit of the OP, added addendum about coir.
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36fuckin5
Alchemycologist


Registered: 08/11/03
Posts: 12,095
Loc: Diving into Mystical Territori...
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I wouldn't necessarily toss my sub automatically if it gets too hot. Just let it sit out till it dries out, and maybe a bit longer. Outside would be best. Let it get all the contams and bacteria back in it. Then you can rehydrate and pasteurize again.
-------------------- Pat The Bunny said: A punk rock song won't ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me. bodhisatta said: i recommend common sense and figuring it out. These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: 36fuckin5]
#18889419 - 09/25/13 01:51 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
36fuckin5 said: I wouldn't necessarily toss my sub automatically if it gets too hot. Just let it sit out till it dries out, and maybe a bit longer. Outside would be best. Let it get all the contams and bacteria back in it. Then you can rehydrate and pasteurize again.

I've done this before too. I just never thought about it while writing this 
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TheRealGohan
NewbSoloCultivator

Registered: 09/14/12
Posts: 6
Loc: Texas
Last seen: 8 years, 4 hours
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Frank my man, reading through your list of write-ups is confirming some things that I have learned from the site already, and adding some new techniques that I am going to try on my next grow.
I'm too new to rate you but give it time and I will be posting loads of questions or praises...
Cheers for the help to us lesser cultivators
-------------------- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Do you know where your towel is? I do! I have just started cultivation on my own and here are some links that I have found quite useful. FrankHorrigan's Tips and Tricks FrankHorrigan's Getting things done series
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TheRealGohan
NewbSoloCultivator


Registered: 09/14/12
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Loc: Texas
Last seen: 8 years, 4 hours
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Quote:
SpitballJedi said:
Quote:
FrankHorrigan said: I use an oneida digital thermometer probe.
Works fantastic!
Exactly what I got. Seem rock solid.
I had some cheaper ones, but all 4 of them had a different temperature reading. After experimenting, I think the probes actually went bad.
I have used these ones for working with cooking meat for quite a while. As with any temp reading device you need to periodically test its calibration and re-calibrate it if needed.
Easy calibration test: Fill plastic cup (better insulated better result) full with ice water, put in probe and walk away for about 15 mins. It should read 32 degrees. If it does not, calibrate it according to the product manual.
Hopefully that helps
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DeadPhan



Registered: 05/05/04
Posts: 5,260
Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
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i just got my digital thermometer. i was curious, and im sorry if its already been mentioned, if there is a difference when loading substrate in half gallon jars. i have a case of them and figure i could cut down on the prep by loading less of them versus more of quart jars. thats if i dont go the ziplock bag route which i might possibly. im gonna take a stab at it tommorow, but until then, curious as if the half gallons are too packed with substrate and the middle maybe takes to long to reach proper temp, and in turn, almost over cooking the outer areas. again, if this has been adressed,. moght one be able to just forward a link explaining as much to me? ill read over the whole thread all the same, but assume it wouldnt take much if someone can think off top of their head. thanks in advance. psyched to get started. i finally have clean spawn after like 2 months of working on it. ready to pasteurize some sub using this tek!
--------------------
Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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36fuckin5
Alchemycologist


Registered: 08/11/03
Posts: 12,095
Loc: Diving into Mystical Territori...
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18958720 - 10/10/13 10:52 AM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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Over-cooking the outer are won't hurt anything as long as you keep the center at proper temperatures.
Every time you pasteurize in a pot of water, the outside of your substrate is going to get too hot.
-------------------- Pat The Bunny said: A punk rock song won't ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me. bodhisatta said: i recommend common sense and figuring it out. These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



Registered: 10/13/12
Posts: 8,598
Loc: Nibiru
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: 36fuckin5]
#18958780 - 10/10/13 11:05 AM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
36fuckin5 said: Over-cooking the outer are won't hurt anything as long as you keep the center at proper temperatures.
This may be true and I have no reason to doubt it, but..
Quote:
36fuckin5 said: Every time you pasteurize in a pot of water, the outside of your substrate is going to get too hot.
...this is a matter of process and is not always true. It depends on how you are doing it. If you are following this tek, then yes, it's true.
Just hijacking to split hairs. Sorry Frank
-------------------- The Basics A little civility goes a long way The Noob Forum The Hammock Hangers' Forum
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36fuckin5
Alchemycologist


Registered: 08/11/03
Posts: 12,095
Loc: Diving into Mystical Territori...
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Quote:
SpitballJedi said: ...this is a matter of process and is not always true. It depends on how you are doing it. If you are following this tek, then yes, it's true.
What method does this not hold true in? Hot water bath will do it. Steam will do it. How else would you pasteurize? If you're trying to measure by water temperature, you're wasting your time.
Partial sterilization isn't sterilizing part of your substrate. That's just going to happen anyway and isn't a problem. Partial sterilization is heating the entire thing to over 160F but not to 250F, and/or not for the proper amount of time.
As long as you have a good center mass of substrate at the proper temperature for the proper time, the beneficial bacteria will repopulate the rest of your substrate quicker than you'd think, especially when you go to mix it up with your spawn and redistribute the center part of your sub into the rest of it.
-------------------- Pat The Bunny said: A punk rock song won't ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me. bodhisatta said: i recommend common sense and figuring it out. These are the TEKs I use. They're all as cheap and easy as possible, just like your mom.
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DeadPhan



Registered: 05/05/04
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Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: 36fuckin5]
#18959155 - 10/10/13 12:25 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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im worried i may have messed up. i forgot to bring it to heat on medium i started it on high it reached 140 degrees fairly soon. got to 160 20 minutes later. i figured it was only going to continue to climb, so i dumped a bunch of ice in there. it leveled out at 162. been stuck on 162 for proly at least 5 minutes. thats the highest it went though. i just looked and its down to 161. i have 25 minutes since i started timer for an hour at 140 degrees.
is there anything i can do did it being at 162 fuck it up, or am i good?
also, i squuezed all the air out of the bags what i thought was plenty. but when i checked on them, they kinda inflated a lil. is that normal>
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
Edited by DeadPhan (10/10/13 12:27 PM)
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18959158 - 10/10/13 12:26 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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You should be just fine.
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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DeadPhan



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: PussyFart]
#18959203 - 10/10/13 12:34 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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slowly dropping. its at 153 ive got 15 minutes left for an hour since it hit 140
basically am i fine as long as it doesnt drop below 140 in that amount of time? i just turned the heat back on few a few in case it drops too quick
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18959209 - 10/10/13 12:35 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
DeadPhan said: basically am i fine as long as it doesnt drop below 140 in that amount of time?
Pretty much....or go above 165F-170F.....
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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DeadPhan



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: PussyFart]
#18959275 - 10/10/13 12:51 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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lol@ so it dropped to 139 with 1 and a half minutes to go. i left the heat on and it came back up to 140 30 seconds after the hour was up.
do i still have a chance if i leave it on for another half hour keeping it between 140 and 160 or the fact that it dropped to 139 for even that small time mean im screwed?
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18959287 - 10/10/13 12:55 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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Lol....you should be ok.....lol that's funny....goddam 1 degree @$#@#$!
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THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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DeadPhan



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: PussyFart]
#18959303 - 10/10/13 01:00 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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i know right. this was frustrating, but i realize where i went wrong bringing it up to heat so fast considering, its still heating up from the outside in. honestly, i didnt even think about it. i just did what i usualy do with pressure cooking.
just curious. so the fact that it got up to 160 so fast shouldnt necesarily be of any concern. pretty much all we are shooting for in pasteurization is maintaing a temperature between 140 and 160 for a certain amount of time?
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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PussyFart
Retired Cultivation Extrodinaire



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#18959383 - 10/10/13 01:21 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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Quote:
DeadPhan said: so the fact that it got up to 160 so fast shouldnt necesarily be of any concern. pretty much all we are shooting for in pasteurization is maintaing a temperature between 140 and 160 for a certain amount of time?
Exactly....now if it goes above 170F or below 140F for an extended period of time, then that is bad.
--------------------
THIS HOBBY IS NOT FOR THE IMPATIENT! PLEASE BE PATIENT, DON'T BE A PATIENT! A Tale of 10 Isolates, GT Cluster Clone Monotubs, RR's Let's Grow Mushrooms DVD, SGFC(Shotgun Fruiting Chamber), Monotub Tek, Damion5050's Coir Tek, TL's Tek List, Frank's Tek List, EvilMushroom666's Pasteurization Tek, How It Should & Shouldn't Look - NEW CULTIVATORS GUIDE *** *** AFGHAN KUSH GROW LOG *** ***
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: PussyFart]
#18963413 - 10/11/13 10:58 AM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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140-160 for 30-90 minutes.
Sounds like it'll work to me, DP
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JMcDoogle
A Serious Scholar

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I may come off as an idiot, but out of pure speculation, could one skip the PC and use something along the lines of a large pasta pot with a secure top to do the sterilazation using say Ziplock Baggies -
Perhaps something like this,
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The ego is nothing other than the focus of conscious attention.
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: JMcDoogle]
#18993680 - 10/17/13 11:46 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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Yep, that will work perfectly fine. I only use my PCs because of their large capacity and heat retention
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chols
Stranger

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Thank you this helped me Alot.
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DeadPhan



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: chols]
#19018065 - 10/23/13 09:21 AM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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Now that its getting chilly I now have this question. I did some bags yesterday when it was warmer out and my sub started at like 84 as per usual. Today, one its just generally chillier out, and two, I reused the water from yesterday's bath for today. However, my bags today started at 77 have since dropped to 73 from sitting in the cold water as it heats up.
So should I turn off heat once it gets 6-8 degrees above the initial temp if 77 or 6-8 degrees above the 73?
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Moosehead905
Stranger


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#19020361 - 10/23/13 04:45 PM (10 years, 8 months ago) |
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anyone know a good site to get the filter patch bags at a good price...?
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TrentBoyett
Aspiring Mycologist



Registered: 11/29/12
Posts: 16,000
Loc: Kazakhstan
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Out-Grow
They are a very good company to deal with, their service is amazing, I always get my stuff on time and packaged well from them.
Plus they're a shroomery sponsor....
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: TrentBoyett]
#19035028 - 10/26/13 10:45 AM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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Yep, pretty much any sponsor carries them.
I get mine from the mad season in packs of 100.
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Brain Fart
Mushroom Nerd



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: TrentBoyett] 1
#19039876 - 10/27/13 09:28 AM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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I case anyone is wondering like I was....a brick of coir hydrated with 4 quarts of water makes about 9-10 quarts of hydrated substrate when 2 quarts of vermiculite is added.
I reason that their are about 8 quarts of hydrated coir per brick you plan on using. Im sure this was answered before but I have not seen it so now when I search I will find my own answer
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TrentBoyett
Aspiring Mycologist



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Brain Fart]
#19039908 - 10/27/13 09:36 AM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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Yeah I had a hard time finding that info on here, I did find it though after searching for a while.
That info really should be more readily available, idk why people don't include it in teks/guides.
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: TrentBoyett]
#19039973 - 10/27/13 09:50 AM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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Likely because this thread is about Frank's pasteurization process, not substrate recipes.
Frank's simple coir substrate prep is linked in the second sentence of the OP. Volume of the substrate is presented there.
This is part of a series and the details of most information can be found in the appropriate "episode".
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TrentBoyett
Aspiring Mycologist



Registered: 11/29/12
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Yeah I wasn't talking about this thread, I was just talking in general.
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blindingleaf
blue collar underworld



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: TrentBoyett]
#19076650 - 11/02/13 07:14 PM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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could I, in theory, make those 9-10 quarts of hydrated substrate (from brain farts above post), and keep it in the bucket it was mixed in, and just pasteurize as needed? I really only need 4 quarts of substrate every 3 weeks, and I hate cutting those coir bricks up!! Or does anyone have a good way to either make coir easier to break up (I have no blender or money to buy a good one) or maybe hydrate it ever so slightly so that I can measure it out easier? It would be nice if I could do that and just keep it a Homer bucket and use (pasteurize) it as needed, but I am just worried about contams over time from it not being sterilized or pasteurized.
Any ideas?
-------------------- A few thoughts on cultivation MICROBIAL HUSBANDRY!!!! The whole is greater than the sum of its parts
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Nakor420
Fun Guy



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Quote:
blindingleaf said: could I, in theory, make those 9-10 quarts of hydrated substrate (from brain farts above post), and keep it in the bucket it was mixed in, and just pasteurize as needed? I really only need 4 quarts of substrate every 3 weeks, and I hate cutting those coir bricks up!! Or does anyone have a good way to either make coir easier to break up (I have no blender or money to buy a good one) or maybe hydrate it ever so slightly so that I can measure it out easier? It would be nice if I could do that and just keep it a Homer bucket and use (pasteurize) it as needed, but I am just worried about contams over time from it not being sterilized or pasteurized.
Any ideas?
I do it...as long as the water you use to make your bulk sub isn't too hot, it won't STERILIZE it in the bucket...thus is will be naturally contam resistant. If you totally sterilize it you kill the "good" bacteria.They are in essence holding your myceliums seat for it so no contams can sit down to the dinner table. If you just use luke warm water to hydrate your coir it should stay fine in the bucket until you pasteurize as needed. It will eventually dry out but you can add moisture back if you go to take some and it's dried out...and that's a good thing anyway, because the longer it stays moist in there the more risk of something germinating.
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shroomseng
Stranger


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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: quisp65]
#19077065 - 11/02/13 08:56 PM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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Praise you for pointing out that Bed Bath and Beyond has this, because Home Depot and Target were giving me crap, Walmart doesn't exist here, and I was down to the last straw, HALLELUJAH!
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Quote:
blindingleaf said: could I, in theory, make those 9-10 quarts of hydrated substrate (from brain farts above post), and keep it in the bucket it was mixed in, and just pasteurize as needed? I really only need 4 quarts of substrate every 3 weeks, and I hate cutting those coir bricks up!! Or does anyone have a good way to either make coir easier to break up (I have no blender or money to buy a good one) or maybe hydrate it ever so slightly so that I can measure it out easier? It would be nice if I could do that and just keep it a Homer bucket and use (pasteurize) it as needed, but I am just worried about contams over time from it not being sterilized or pasteurized.
Any ideas?
Yes, you can just keep the hydrated substrate in the bucket and pasteurize as needed. Or just pasteurize the whole thing and then use what you need as you need it. Coir+verm is remarkably contam-resistant.
Think of horse manure- it has mold and bacteria growing in it for quite some time before it is aged enough to use for cultivating. If proper pasteurization takes care of that, then it will certainly take care of your coir that has been sitting for even months at a time.
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DeadPhan



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so, my temperature in 3 ziplock bags in my AA930 level out between 150-153 at around half an hour in. they stay in that range the rest of the time. is this ok? as long as it stays between 140 and 160 im good right?
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#19136360 - 11/14/13 02:25 PM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
DeadPhan said: so, my temperature in 3 ziplock bags in my AA930 level out between 150-153 at around half an hour in. they stay in that range the rest of the time. is this ok? as long as it stays between 140 and 160 im good right?
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: bodhisatta]
#19136381 - 11/14/13 02:30 PM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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That's what mine do.
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DeadPhan



Registered: 05/05/04
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awesome. it took me till my 4th pasteurization to really get it down. for the first one i did a major fuck up and got it up to heat on high. totaly overlooked the reason for getting it up to heat on medium was because it takes a while for the middle to get hot, so, overheating the water faster only makes it keep climbing after your reach optimal temps. i was lucky enough to counteract that with ice just barely reaching 165, and then dropping close to below 140 before the hour was up, but i kept it within range.
second time, i doubted my gas range. my medium seems to be pretty high heat. ive been around alot of ranges, and my medium, for some reason, reminded me of highs on some. i might have been mistaken. apparently i was, but, i still remember some ranges in places i live being where mine was at, at medium, when they were on full blast. anyhoo, my second batch, i brought to heat between low and medium. it took forever to get to 140, and climbed a little bit before starting to dip. causing me to fiddle with throwing the heat on now and again so it wouldnt go under. honestly i dont even know what i did wrong on my third go at it, but im pretty sure i still had to do some tweeking here and there. possibly due to starting out with a warmer or colder substrate, and/or a warmer or colder bath water.
yesterday, and today, i made sure i hydrated my sub with room temp, to a lil bit warmer, due to the house being a tad colder this time of year. as well as making sure my bath water started out warm.
and like i said, my sub started out at 83-84 degrees. left it on medium until it got to 91-92, started timer, and it peaked at 53.
pretty psyched i can just walk away at this point and not have to constantly check. definitly took a little dialing in, but ive got it down now! i gather i might have to fiddle around when the temps get up in general as im guessing that effects timing and climbing and dipping ratios.
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: DeadPhan]
#19136526 - 11/14/13 02:58 PM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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It took me a few tries to dial it in too. Like you, I now know where to set the dial.
As the OP points out, the center is all that really matters and it's okay to let the outside get hot. My only issue with this is if I let the water boil, ultimately my core gets too hot, like yours.
If I remember correctly, the OOP, before the revisions, even instructed us to only let the water get to, I think, 185. That's how I still do it. I only let the water get to 170 though.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent



Registered: 04/30/13
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Loc: Milky way
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I'm very patient and the water comes out of my tap at 140-145F which i think is illegal but what ever I don't have kids to worry about scalding themselves.
I chop up the coir a bit before pouring 140F water into it then load it into the vessel I'll be using for pasturization. (brewing gloves help to mix that shit when its so hot) I keep my water bath at 160F. The coir+verm is about 100F by the time I'm done mixing it. It doesn't take but 30M for the center to hit 140F just sitting in 160F water. I usually pasteurize for 2+ hours then since I can set the stove on about 1 and it will hold 155-160 in the water bath when it's on
Edited by Trusted cuItivator (11/14/13 06:17 PM)
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SpitballJedi
Ancient Astronaut



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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: bodhisatta]
#19137512 - 11/14/13 06:31 PM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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I'm not an expert on proper pasteurization and I'm certainly not gonna try and say what's what on FH's thread, but
...you really only need to pasteurize for 1 hour once your temperature is correct. I can't say 2+ hours is harmful, but I'm sure it's not necessary.
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent



Registered: 04/30/13
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Loc: Milky way
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Quote:
SpitballJedi said: I'm not an expert on proper pasteurization and I'm certainly not gonna try and say what's what on FH's thread, but
...you really only need to pasteurize for 1 hour once your temperature is correct. I can't say 2+ hours is harmful, but I'm sure it's not necessary.
I'm almost positive its unnecessary. I just have the time to spare.
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screamingdeal
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: bodhisatta]
#19138068 - 11/14/13 08:05 PM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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Do you need to use spawn bags if your not using jars? I got some gallon ziplocks i can load into my stock pot easier since i dont have a lot of space for all the jars and i dont have spawn bags
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bodhisatta 
Smurf real estate agent



Registered: 04/30/13
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Does the substrate know what kind of bag it's in?
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screamingdeal
Stranger
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: bodhisatta]
#19138105 - 11/14/13 08:12 PM (10 years, 7 months ago) |
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well i feel like an idiot
-------------------- There are two kinds of people in this world, ones who can finish lists and.... No cutting in the Kool-Aid line. -Jim Jones
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Yuri.Pono
MAD SCIENTIST


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hey frank you ever think about trying one of these out Larynx's Automated Temp Controller
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FrankHorrigan
The Inquisition



Registered: 01/04/11
Posts: 10,573
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Yuri.Pono]
#19226499 - 12/04/13 12:40 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
SpitballJedi said: I can't say 2+ hours is harmful, but I'm sure it's not necessary.
Over 60-90 minutes and you start hurting the good bacteria.
2 hours won't hurt coir, because coir is forgiving. But your other, more "sensitive" substrates such as hpoo can suffer for it.
Quote:
Yuri.Pono said: hey frank you ever think about trying one of these out Larynx's Automated Temp Controller
No, it would be completely unnecessary.
The only temp that matters is the core temperature of the substrate
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DeadPhan



Registered: 05/05/04
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Last seen: 4 years, 7 months
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Re: My Pasteurization Process [Re: Yuri.Pono]
#19226685 - 12/04/13 01:21 PM (10 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
Yuri.Pono said: hey frank you ever think about trying one of these out Larynx's Automated Temp Controller
this only works for an electric heat source yes?
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Big Gulps! Alright! Well, See ya later! And if i claim to be a wise man, well, it surely means that i dont know!
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