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OfflinemotamanM
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White House escalates pot war
    #1706241 - 07/11/03 04:42 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2003/07/11/MN290994.DTL

White House escalates pot war
It asks high court to let doctors be punished

Bob Egelko, Chronicle Staff Writer Friday, July 11, 2003


The Bush administration, pressing its campaign against state medical marijuana laws, has asked the U.S. Supreme Court to let federal authorities punish California doctors who recommend pot to their patients.

The administration would revoke the federal prescription licenses of doctors who tell their patients marijuana would help them, a prerequisite for obtaining the drug under the state's voter-approved medical marijuana law.

Justice Department lawyers this week asked the high court to take up the issue in its next term, which begins in October. The department is appealing a ruling by an appellate court in San Francisco that said the proposed penalties would violate the freedom of speech of both doctors and patients.

If the justices agree to review the case, it would be their first look at medical marijuana since May 2001, when they upheld the federal government's authority to close down a pot dispensary in Oakland and others in the state.

The October decision by the U.S. Court of Appeals in San Francisco "effectively licensed physicians to treat patients with prohibited substances" and interfered with the government's authority "to enforce the law in an area vital to the public health and safety," Justice Department lawyers Mark Stern and Colette Matzzie wrote in court papers.

The appeal "is a sign that this administration will do everything they can to defeat the will of the voters of California and many other states," said Graham Boyd, an American Civil Liberties Union lawyer for doctors, patients and AIDS support groups. Those groups sued the federal government in 1997 over the policy, which the Clinton administration originally introduced but later decided not to pursue.


STATE LAWS WOULD BE MOOT
If the Supreme Court takes the case and ultimately rules in the government's favor, Boyd said, "it would make all of the states' marijuana laws a dead letter. . . . If a physician can't recommend marijuana, then no patient can qualify" to use it under state law.

The federal action was in response to California voters' 1996 approval of Proposition 215. The initiative, a trailblazer for laws in eight other states, allows seriously ill patients to use marijuana with their doctors' approval. Prop. 215 specified that the approval would take the form of a recommendation rather than a formal prescription.

The federal government, which classifies marijuana in the same prohibited category as heroin -- drugs with a high potential for abuse and no medical value -- has fought Prop. 215 since its passage. The reaction began under former President Bill Clinton and has escalated under President Bush, whose drug enforcers have raided local pot clubs and filed criminal charges against their suppliers.

The Bush administration also revived the effort to target doctors' federal licenses, which started under the Clinton administration. When a federal judge issued a permanent injunction against the policy in 2000, Clinton's Justice Department did not appeal, but the new administration took up the case after taking office in 2001.

Under the administration's policy, doctors who recommended marijuana would lose their licenses to prescribe federally regulated narcotics. Doctors in many fields need federal licenses to remain in practice.


GIVING ADVICE RULED LEGAL
The government's attempt to enforce the policy was rejected in October by the U.S. Court of Appeals in San Francisco.

In the 3-0 appellate decision, Chief Judge Mary Schroeder said federal authorities can prosecute doctors for helping patients acquire illegal drugs, but not for simply giving medical advice that might let a patient obtain marijuana.

She said the federal policy clashed not only with free speech but also with the states' traditional authority over the practice of medicine. That issue is central to another case now pending before the appeals court, involving Attorney General John Ashcroft's attempt to punish doctors who prescribe lethal drugs for patients under Oregon's assisted-suicide law.

The Justice Department's Supreme Court appeal argues that a physician's "recommendation" under California law is the equivalent of a prescription for illegal drugs, an action the government can forbid without violating free speech.

Department lawyers said the federal policy would not penalize a doctor for merely discussing marijuana with a patient -- as long as the doctor makes it clear that the drug is illegal under federal law, that federal authorities consider it dangerous and medically useless, and that the doctor is not recommending it.


'WAR AGAINST PATIENTS'
News of the administration's appeal dismayed two patients who are plaintiffs in the lawsuit.

"I wish the government would stop this war against patients and doctors," said Keith Vines, 53, a San Francisco assistant district attorney who lost 50 pounds and nearly died from a wasting syndrome associated with AIDS. He credits medical marijuana with restoring his appetite and saving his life.

"Medical marijuana is keeping me with the ability to continue treatment," said Judith Cushner, 58, director of Laurel Hill Nursery School in San Francisco, who is undergoing chemotherapy after suffering a relapse of breast cancer. The government's bid for Supreme Court intervention, she said, is "absolutely frightening." . The case is Walters vs. Conant, No. 03-40.




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InvisibleTinMan
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: motaman]
    #1709113 - 07/12/03 07:08 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

How can you be punished for recommending something to someone? They might as well punish doctors for prescribing painkillers and benzos...


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OfflinemotamanM
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: TinMan]
    #1709228 - 07/12/03 07:50 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

They might as well punish doctors for prescribing painkillers and benzos




The sad thing is.. that they already do .. :frown: 


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InvisibleIrradiated_Feces
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: motaman]
    #1709270 - 07/12/03 08:03 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

.


Edited by Irradiated_Feces (11/26/12 12:39 AM)


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OfflineHans_Moleman
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Irradiated_Feces]
    #1711469 - 07/13/03 03:10 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

bush is way too power happy!!!!


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InvisibleTinMan
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: motaman]
    #1711783 - 07/13/03 05:32 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

motaman said:
Quote:

They might as well punish doctors for prescribing painkillers and benzos




The sad thing is.. that they already do .. :frown: 




I hope some day if painkillers are banned, that when Bush or Ashcroft need painkillers, they can't get them...


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InvisibleStarter
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: TinMan]
    #1713443 - 07/14/03 04:51 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

TheInvizibleMan said:
I hope some day if painkillers are banned, that when Bush or Ashcroft need painkillers, they can't get them...




That's a fair point. We all get old, we can all have misfortune at any time, like a car accident. Pain and the management of it, is part of life. No point outlawing what can deal with it.

Interesting to muse how RepubliKKKan Reagan set about with no end of social cutbacks which slashed research to alzheimers...and guess what happened to that sad-sack-o-shite. Too funny. Bush and his ilk have it coming to them too.


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InvisibleIrradiated_Feces
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Starter]
    #1715197 - 07/14/03 07:01 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

.


Edited by Irradiated_Feces (11/26/12 12:41 AM)


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InvisibleStarter
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Irradiated_Feces]
    #1716302 - 07/14/03 11:30 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Will they get whatever they want?

IMO, it's not a case of strange eastern philosophy called karma, it's statistical probability as one ages. The odds of probability are stacked against these aging men, they are mere mortals and not gods or agents of god...like they profess.

For example, all the wealth of Christopher Reeves (and in all truth he'll never regain full function of his spine) speaks volumes about how much of a vacuum there is in the US on health awareness. It took his misfortune as a millionaire and a celebrity to jolt the Hollywood worshipping American culture to action. True, his disaster was a horse riding accident but the R&D into stem cell research also ties into age related diseases. Research that takes years, despite the 5th gear pace of millions of dollars from his personal coffers. Money alone will not achieve what requires long term community will.

Put bluntly, national health is not a case of pots of personal money from individuals of the rich and famous, it's the national health belief of a society morally committed to investing to medical R&D. This takes years, even decades and many may not even see the outcome of it in their life time. It is a culture. One America lacks.

This is why Australia -- a nation that values the National Health at a cultural level -- is leading the world in cancer reseach (John Curtain Medical School CSIRO ANU) and has, though the NSW ALP, taken the steps of medical Cannabis to patients in New South Wales. It will in time forge itself to a national level conscious, despite the lunatic American global WOD bullying. Australia will prevail.

Clearly the sensible path for middle aged to nearing elderly aged men (Bush, Ass-croft ect) is to facilitate a societal medical awareness of Cannabis pain management. If this were me, I'd be softening up the medical establishment and public opinion today to get it underway, just incase I ended up an old krusty in pain tomorrow. Now even if I personally never become a statistic, my aging peers, be it friends and family could. I'd be thinking about how Reagan slashed the Alzheimers funding in his relentless cuts on all manner of social services and there he be in later life a victim to that very brain degenerative tissue disease.

It's not a maybe...the older you get, the more likely you are of medical problems. This is rock hard medical science fact. They will get theirs, directly or on people they love and yet they had it all in their grasp to fix it today. What evil stupid men.

America for all the reasons of logic must make Cannabis available to their medical needing people. The short sighted greed of protecting the share holders of pharmaceutical companies is financially bankrupt in the long running balance sheet. From this, and many American failings, stems a systemic moral bankruptcy. America does not value human life, only profits. A society of usury and in god we trust. A society that will kick her own people in the guts in their worst hour of pain and need.

In a society so soulless there is nothing to be patriotic about. I suggest Americans use their guns, shoot their TV sets and march on Washington DC and burn it down. Take a leaf out of the Canadian book. A smart and compassionate people.


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OfflineAdamist
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Irradiated_Feces]
    #1716434 - 07/14/03 11:58 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

I thought americans had big balls and bigger guns, when the fuck is someone gunna take out bush and his cronies???



Give me a super-soaker filled with LSD.


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InvisiblePapaverS
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: motaman]
    #1716721 - 07/15/03 12:58 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I just heard about this at the Oregon Country Fair on Sunday. Sad news, indeed... :frown:


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Starter]
    #1717297 - 07/15/03 04:55 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

>>>>>Interesting to muse how RepubliKKKan Reagan set about with no end of social cutbacks which slashed research to alzheimers...and guess what happened to that sad-sack-o-shite. Too funny. Bush and his ilk have it coming to them too. <<<<<<

It would be even more interesting if he knew at the time that he had Alzheimer's.


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OfflineTheHobbit
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1724806 - 07/17/03 03:03 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

I don't think they even know why they hate pot so much, there's nothing about it that's such a threat that they have to prevent the ill from receiving it. I've found that, though, even otherwise conservative people believe that medical marijuana is fine, and that the gov is wrong in what they're doing. These right wing Christian Fundamentalist loonies just seem like little spoiled kids determined to have their way whether it makes any sense or not. This fuckin' country has become the most backwards place to live, getting the public to believe that it's the land of the free and all that shit, when it's completely something else.

"I thought americans had big balls and bigger guns, when the fuck is someone gunna take out bush and his cronies??? "

The government has big balls and big guns, the citizens have tv and prozac. Oh, and supposedly the power of the vote - ha ha ha ha ha...they probably know ten years in advance whose turn it's gonna be then. Well, Rome fell eventually too, maybe there's hope.


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OfflineTwirling
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: TheHobbit]
    #1727263 - 07/18/03 11:21 AM (14 years, 5 months ago)

This thing could bite Bush in the ass for two reasons...

1. The majority of the public is generally disgusted by federal raids of people who are sick. The big problem is that people actually have to be aware of it, and if there isn't any major coverage of it, there is no way for there to be any kind of public outcry over it.

2. Asking for a ruling or appeal to the Supereme Court could make the medical marijuana reform stronger if the Supereme Court rules in their favor. I don't know what the outcome would be, but I honestly doubt a panel of judges would rule that the goverment can strip a doctor's licesnes to prescribe medicine for recommending marijuana. Now this is just my opinon, but I think it would take a REALLY strong case to punish doctors for offering advice.

The US has a $455 Billion federal budget deficit, and this is what the president wastes his time & money with? I sincerly think Bush is the worst president the US has had since Nixion.


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The very nature of experience is ineffable; it transcends cognitive thought and intellectualized analysis. To be without experience is to be without an emotional knowledge of what the experience translates into. The desire for the understanding of what life is made of is the motivation that drives us all. Without it, in fear of the experiences what life can hold is among the greatest contradictions; to live in fear of death while not being alive.



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Offlinecrazycanadian
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Twirling]
    #1727607 - 07/18/03 02:35 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

Bush is really bad. If i have to live for another 4 years with this ass hole i will shoot myself. What has America come to? I thought that the US was supposed to be the best country? According to "The Top 10 of Everything" the US is ranked #6 is terms of best places to live in the world. I think Canada was eith #2 or #3. Denmark may have been #1. I dunno...ill check it out


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InvisibleIrradiated_Feces
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Twirling]
    #1727620 - 07/18/03 02:41 PM (14 years, 5 months ago)

.


Edited by Irradiated_Feces (11/26/12 12:41 AM)


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OfflineJameZTheNewbie
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Irradiated_Feces]
    #1746167 - 07/24/03 11:41 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

can someone explain what the fuck the hate about weed...i mean its costing them alot of money to "anti" it , i just dont get why.


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OfflineHans_Moleman
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: JameZTheNewbie]
    #1746685 - 07/25/03 02:28 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

read my sig


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OfflineJameZTheNewbie
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: Hans_Moleman]
    #1758084 - 07/29/03 01:13 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

why would cotton growers see it as competition if they grow cotton?


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InvisibleKOPELANDIAA
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Re: White House escalates pot war [Re: crazycanadian]
    #1759388 - 07/29/03 01:16 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

crazycanadian said:
I thought that the US was supposed to be the best country?



??????????????????? really ?!


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