|
 Jackal
Well Versed In Etiquette
Registered: 10/16/02
Posts: 4,576
Last seen: 1 month, 7 days
|
 Is Fire Alive? 
#1705113 - 07/11/03 04:19 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
It consumes.
It produces waste.
It produces offspring.
It uses oxygen.
Its mobile.
It reacts to its environment.
This is how we classify if something is alive, so is fire alive?
--------------------
|
johnnyfive
Burning withCircles!
Registered: 07/02/02
Posts: 886
Loc: Hell
Last seen: 20 years, 4 months
|
 Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Jackal]
#1705646 - 07/11/03 11:36 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Hey man that was a homework asignment once in 7th grade science, but i forget the answer!
lol
--------------------
And the gameshow host rings the buzzer (brrnnntt) oh and now you get a face full of face!
|
Rhizoid
carbon unit
Registered: 01/22/00
Posts: 1,739
Loc: Europe
Last seen: 7 months, 3 days
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Jackal]
#1705729 - 07/11/03 11:58 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
According to that definition, yes, fire is alive. Next question. 
Is it a useful definition? It depends on what things you want the word "alive" to describe. One extreme is to say that anything that reacts to the environment is alive. This leads to the conclusion that all material things are alive. In a certain philosophical context this makes perfectly good sense. The other extreme is to say that it must be a creature made from DNA and that has brain activity in order to be (legally) alive. You can draw the line anywhere in between.
|
Strumpling
Neuronaut
Registered: 10/11/02
Posts: 7,571
Loc: Hyperspace
Last seen: 13 years, 3 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Jackal]
#1706875 - 07/11/03 07:02 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
hehe I've heard this before and its certainly a tricky topic to discuss
--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE
|
Earth_Droid
Stranger
Registered: 04/19/02
Posts: 5,240
Last seen: 18 years, 1 month
|
|
I think everything is alive in a sense.
|
Scarfmeister
Thrill Seeker
Registered: 10/31/02
Posts: 8,127
Loc: The will to power
Last seen: 5 years, 2 months
|
|
Fire isn't biological
--------------------
--------------------
We're the lowest of the low, the scum of the fucking earth!
|
Strumpling
Neuronaut
Registered: 10/11/02
Posts: 7,571
Loc: Hyperspace
Last seen: 13 years, 3 months
|
|
first definition of "biological" at www.dictionary.com :
"Of, relating to, caused by, or affecting life or living organisms: biological processes such as growth and digestion."
--------------------
Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
In addition: SHPONGLE
|
 chunder
marker
Registered: 08/11/02
Posts: 966
Loc: The City
|
|
Many times when tripping, I've come to the realization that fire is very much alive. I always bring a lighter with me tripping, its a great comfort to whip out the little guy and just be amazed by the flickering flame.
--------------------
|
trendal
J♠
Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 20,815
Loc: Ontario, Canada 
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Jackal]
#1707800 - 07/12/03 01:58 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Fire is a chemical reaction. Life is also, arguably, a chemical reaction, although much more complex 
--------------------
Once, men turned their thinking over to machines in the hope that this would set them free.
But that only permitted other men with machines to enslave them.
|
mntlfngrs
The Art of Casterbation
Registered: 07/18/02
Posts: 3,937
Last seen: 6 years, 21 days
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: trendal]
#1707814 - 07/12/03 02:09 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
human life is a chemical reaction that turns something into nothin.;)
--------------------
Be all and you'll be to end all
|
pattern
multiplayer
Registered: 07/19/02
Posts: 2,185
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 4 years, 6 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Jackal]
#1707857 - 07/12/03 02:43 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
> is fire alive?
yes, but is it conscious? probably not.
--------------------
man = monkey + mushroom
|
gnrm23
Carpal Tunnel
Registered: 08/29/99
Posts: 6,490
Loc: n. e. OH, USSA
Last seen: 2 months, 12 days
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: pattern]
#1713696 - 07/14/03 08:28 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
umm, since the transer of the rapid oxidative process of combustion is not mediated by any form of genetic information transfer --- fire is most certainly not alive in the sense that plants, animals, fungi, protists (all the eukaryotes) of bacteria & other monerans (the prokaryotic organisms) are alive... (and "organisms" like viruses & prions are more on the order of "wild messenges" rather than "wild messengers")...
but fire (and crystals) can indeed "grow" under the proper conditions...
perhaps examining the entropy & enthalpy of these activites can give us some clues ...
(maybe life can be considered to be a dynamic balance of the crystalline world and the world of the flame... small pockets of anti-entropic processes in the surrounding sea of chaos... (inset stock footage of 4 elements here --- earth, air, fire, water; & optional fifth element (spirit, prana, wood, metal, space... whatever...) as local culture allows ...) hehheh...)
~
~
--------------------
old enough to know better
not old enough to care
|
Sclorch
Clyster
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
|
 Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: gnrm23]
#1714956 - 07/14/03 04:07 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
hehehe
You make me giggle, gnrm...
--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...
|
Static
Can you hear menow?
Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 113
Last seen: 20 years, 8 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Sclorch]
#1715140 - 07/14/03 04:48 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
I have to vote no. I see it as an elemental force like gravety or the wind or rain even.
--------------------
Astronauts get all the tang they want.
|
pattern
multiplayer
Registered: 07/19/02
Posts: 2,185
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 4 years, 6 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: gnrm23]
#1715185 - 07/14/03 04:58 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
fire is most certainly not alive in the sense that plants, animals, fungi, protists (all the eukaryotes) of bacteria & other monerans (the prokaryotic organisms) are alive...
Thats true. By the same reasoning, if you were looking at rocks your whole life and found fire, you might think it was alive.
I'm a little biased: I think everything that exists is alive.  
--------------------
man = monkey + mushroom
|
pacodestroys
late nightresearcher
Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 35
Loc: colorado
Last seen: 19 years, 11 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: pattern]
#1715281 - 07/14/03 05:23 PM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
all living things have cells
--------------------
He wear no shoeshine he got toe-jam football
He got monkey finger he shoot coca-cola
He say "I know you, you know me"
One thing I can tell you is you got to be free
Come together right now over me
|
bandaid
clever title
Registered: 05/14/03
Posts: 340
|
|
Just a general statement of perspective, we relate to things we understand as being alive having a nervouse system, eating, pooing, being like us, ect (in general), for all we know rocks feel intense pain when you step on it and wind hurts when you compress it and atoms live a daily hell *slight sarcasm*. Though if thats even true it would be a much different form of existance of "feeling". In life we dont know why we feel and why we are concsious (we can creat robots eventualy that to our understanding can do what we do and better but not be conscious and not have feelings to our defenitions), though you could get technical and say its the connections inside your brain releasing chemicals or whatever but IMHO I think its a phylosophical issue.
If it cant express itself like US we are use to calling it not living, aside from the dictionary term, technically you can view the person next to you as not living so long as you dont feel what they feel, torture them and you wont physicaly feel anything and emotionaly well that depends on your mental state hehe, my point is, so long as your not "it" it can always be in YOUR perspective as not alive in a sense if you get what Im saying.
Kind of an extreme example I suppose, just throwing in my giberish 
Edit: I dont want to sound like a shuv in your face know it all, I just believe what I wrote/write, and I like to express it strongly to an extent to make it look like facts, to me they are, its all interpretational.. perspective.. bleh
Edited by bandaid (07/14/03 10:57 PM)
|
Albino_Jesus
Clearly Retarded
Registered: 09/14/02
Posts: 1,698
Loc: Construction ahead...
Last seen: 14 years, 7 months
|
|
define 'cell'
--------------------
The only difference between the Republican and Democratic parties is the velocities with which their knees hit the floor when corporations knock on their door.
-Ralph Nader
|
pacodestroys
late nightresearcher
Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 35
Loc: colorado
Last seen: 19 years, 11 months
|
|
a cell that contains a working, active, LIVING nucleus
--------------------
He wear no shoeshine he got toe-jam football
He got monkey finger he shoot coca-cola
He say "I know you, you know me"
One thing I can tell you is you got to be free
Come together right now over me
|
pattern
multiplayer
Registered: 07/19/02
Posts: 2,185
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 4 years, 6 months
|
|
What about self-replicating molecules? RNA, DNA, arent those alive?
--------------------
man = monkey + mushroom
|
Albino_Jesus
Clearly Retarded
Registered: 09/14/02
Posts: 1,698
Loc: Construction ahead...
Last seen: 14 years, 7 months
|
|
define 'living nucleus'
--------------------
The only difference between the Republican and Democratic parties is the velocities with which their knees hit the floor when corporations knock on their door.
-Ralph Nader
|
Static
Can you hear menow?
Registered: 06/15/03
Posts: 113
Last seen: 20 years, 8 months
|
|
Living things contain carbon. Fire doesn't contain carbon but it does free it from what it consumes.
--------------------
Astronauts get all the tang they want.
|
pacodestroys
late nightresearcher
Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 35
Loc: colorado
Last seen: 19 years, 11 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Static]
#1716931 - 07/15/03 12:26 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
albino... www.dictionary.com
go look... be back when normal again
--------------------
He wear no shoeshine he got toe-jam football
He got monkey finger he shoot coca-cola
He say "I know you, you know me"
One thing I can tell you is you got to be free
Come together right now over me
|
pacodestroys
late nightresearcher
Registered: 06/30/03
Posts: 35
Loc: colorado
Last seen: 19 years, 11 months
|
|
A large, membrane-bound, usually spherical protoplasmic structure within a living cell, containing the cell's hereditary material and controlling its metabolism, growth, and reproduction.
--------------------
He wear no shoeshine he got toe-jam football
He got monkey finger he shoot coca-cola
He say "I know you, you know me"
One thing I can tell you is you got to be free
Come together right now over me
|
Fliquid 
Back from being gone.
Registered: 03/18/02
Posts: 6,953
Loc: omotive
Last seen: 9 years, 1 month
|
|
I think everything is alive in a sense.
I agreed buddy. 
--------------------
 My latest music! 
|
Ped
Interested In Your Brain
Registered: 08/30/99
Posts: 5,494
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 7 years, 8 months
|
 Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Fliquid]
#1724192 - 07/17/03 07:08 AM (21 years, 2 months ago) |
|
|
This is one of the confounding questions Lt. Commander Data had to deal with when trying to define himself as a living being.
--------------------
 Dark Triangles - New Psychedelic Techno Single - Listen on Soundcloud
Gyroscope full album available SoundCloud or MySpace
|
oroboros
Stranger
Registered: 10/29/05
Posts: 16
Last seen: 18 years, 10 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Ped]
#4895115 - 11/04/05 07:00 PM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Fire may not be a living organism in the classic biological sense.But life hitches one hell of a ride on the broad shoulders of elemental foundation.WHEW! IE:earth,air,fire,water.Dig it.Without which there would be no life.Anyway it sure does a lively dance,[could've fooled me.]DANCE ON FIRE IF YOU DARE.
|
Icelander
The Minstrel in the Gallery
Registered: 03/15/05
Posts: 95,368
Loc: underbelly
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: oroboros]
#4895183 - 11/04/05 07:15 PM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Fire=  =life=consciousness
--------------------
"Don't believe everything you think". -Anom.
" All that lives was born to die"-Anom.
With much wisdom comes much sorrow,
The more knowledge, the more grief.
Ecclesiastes circa 350 BC
|
SkorpivoMusterion
Livin in theTwilight Zone...
Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 9,954
Loc: You can't spell fungus wi...
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Jackal]
#4895539 - 11/04/05 09:16 PM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Is "Freezing" alive?
--------------------
Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.
|
Grok
Has Been a Bad Boy
Registered: 12/03/03
Posts: 1,262
Loc: Greener Pastures
Last seen: 10 years, 4 days
|
|
Everything is alive. We are made up of a wide array of things which ordinarily by themselves are not considered living. Look at it this way; a combination of things which aren't 'living' are 'alive' as we define it in our perception. Each one of the atoms that make us up contributes to life, so how could it not be alive? At what point does this non-living matter become living? When it can replicate itself? If nothing was 'alive' in the first place, how did life come to be? Everything living must die. But everything is alive.
--------------------
Entropy is increasing.
To send me a PM, go to my journal
|
onceinawhile
for you
Registered: 09/20/05
Posts: 95
Loc: in a book of dreams
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Ped]
#4896667 - 11/05/05 06:41 AM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Ped said:
This is one of the confounding questions...
get it over with you fuck.
--------------------
You are complicit if you see or suspect on the basis of reliable evidence that harm is being done to an Other, and in the absorption of your own daily routine say nothing, do nothing, keep the silence that permits hegemonic domination.
|
BlueCoyote
Beyond
Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 7 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Jackal]
#4896699 - 11/05/05 07:09 AM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
onceinawhile, come on, comtribute something here with some sense..any suggestion ?
Hmmm... old question and I thought I did know an answer somewhere, but I searched and didn't find some
Indeed, very strong similarities, but I stumbled over something, that said, fire is more the 'life-energy' itself. As all organisms recieve their energy through oxidation, as I can remember, and fire is the 'quality' of oxidation, it is somehow the quality of life itself. Perhaps do the strange similaties stem from there ?
I love to see fire as something conscious, a proto-form of life, a deamon, an angel..our saviour and destroyer 
|
Jared
Stranger
Registered: 04/22/01
Posts: 8,783
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Jackal]
#4896722 - 11/05/05 07:21 AM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
It doesn't produce offspring. It grows. No transfer of genetic information occurs.
Fire is nifty, but by most accepted definitions, It isn't alive. :P
|
BlueCoyote
Beyond
Registered: 05/07/04
Posts: 6,697
Loc: Between
Last seen: 3 years, 7 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Jared]
#4896806 - 11/05/05 08:29 AM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Jared said:
It doesn't produce offspring. It grows. No transfer of genetic information occurs.
Fire is nifty, but by most accepted definitions, It isn't alive. :P
It produces offspring. Think of the 'fire jumping over' (to a next house, or over a gap). That can happen without the fire directly 'touching' another object, but causing it to start burning indirectly by heat, so you suddenly have two fires.
The growing is the same as with every living 'family' (edit: or society or individuum...)
No genes needed, because every fire is the same in its essence.
edit: ... and if fire-brigade arrives, they often ask if they have extiguished all 'nests' (expression in german language, at least)
Edited by BlueCoyote (11/05/05 11:46 AM)
|
Gomp
¡(Bound to·(O))be free!
Registered: 09/11/04
Posts: 10,888
Loc: I re·side [primarily] in...
Last seen: 1 year, 6 months
|
Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Rhizoid]
#4897177 - 11/05/05 11:52 AM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Quote:
Rhizoid said:
According to that definition, yes, fire is alive. Next question.
--------------------
--------------------
Disclaimer!?
|
Yatchak
Stranger
Registered: 11/02/05
Posts: 24
Last seen: 18 years, 9 months
|
 Re: Is Fire Alive? [Re: Gomp]
#4898359 - 11/05/05 08:02 PM (18 years, 10 months ago) |
|
|
Depends in what context.
For a shaman fire IS defenetly alive
For most of us it is obvious that fire is not alive like a cow or a carrot is, even if it feets that description.
More "spiritual" people may say that everything is alive.
Nick question!
|
|
Threaded
Previous
Index
Next
Edit 
Reply 
eMotionALLmotion
1 2 3 4 all )
Frog
RebelSteve33
Gomp
Swami
ekomstop
pattern
Icelander