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Anonymous #1
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Linking an account to a person
#17005735 - 10/10/12 02:54 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Say someone has motive to try and use my posts on here against me in court. If they knew my username, how easy/hard would it be for them to associate it with me and actually be able to submit it as evidence?
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Anonymous #2
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: Anonymous #1]
#17007412 - 10/10/12 07:26 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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This scares me.
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ch1ck3n.s0up
Troubled Loner



Registered: 10/03/08
Posts: 2,573
Loc: Hunting Fungi
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: Anonymous #2]
#17007893 - 10/10/12 08:24 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Technically, unless you take some precautions, it is pretty easy to associate your Shroomery account with your real identity.
Legally, ask Enlil in his "Ask a Defense Attorney" thread (if it hasn't been asked already).
-------------------- "Inspiration ~ Move me brightly ~ light the song with sense and color ~ hold away despair ~ more than this I will not ask ~ faced with mysteries dark and vast ~ statements just seem vain at last" --Jerry Garcia, Terrapin Station "Officer, I'm going to remain silent, and I would like to speak with a lawyer. I'm not resisting, but I don't consent to any searches.
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Anonymous #3
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: ch1ck3n.s0up]
#17009070 - 10/10/12 11:20 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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ch1ck3n.s0up please elaborate on these technical methods of associating an account to a person.
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ch1ck3n.s0up
Troubled Loner



Registered: 10/03/08
Posts: 2,573
Loc: Hunting Fungi
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: Anonymous #3]
#17009216 - 10/10/12 11:49 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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There's about 1000 ways to do this, but here's an easy example. Every time you hit a Web site, your browser passes all sorts of information about your computer: your IP address, the type of computer your using, your browser, etc. This is called HTTP header information, and is a piece of cake to get. Just to show you how ridiculously easy it is, look at my signature. With absolutely no special privileges, and about one minute of work, I am able to display your IP address, ISP, provider, and computer type in my signature!
Any ISP would open their logs to a police investigation. Find out who is paying the ISP for a specific IP address, and voila! you've been identified. Not to freak you out, but, honestly, I'd be willing to bet that everyone who visits this site is already logged in a DEA database.
If you're interested here's all the info that your browser passes when you visit a site. It's a technical spec, but you get the idea: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_HTTP_header_fields
-------------------- "Inspiration ~ Move me brightly ~ light the song with sense and color ~ hold away despair ~ more than this I will not ask ~ faced with mysteries dark and vast ~ statements just seem vain at last" --Jerry Garcia, Terrapin Station "Officer, I'm going to remain silent, and I would like to speak with a lawyer. I'm not resisting, but I don't consent to any searches.
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist

Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 48,392
Last seen: 2 days, 23 hours
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: ch1ck3n.s0up] 2
#17009397 - 10/11/12 12:47 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
ch1ck3n.s0up said: With absolutely no special privileges, and about one minute of work, I am able to display your IP address, ISP, provider, and computer type in my signature!
So...What is my IP address, ISP, provider, and computer type?
I don't mind if you post the answer publicly.
Quote:
Any ISP would open their logs to a police investigation.
Not any ISP. Most though...
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Find out who is paying the ISP for a specific IP address, and voila! you've been identified.
Umm...I live with 20 people sharing the connection.
Quote:
Not to freak you out, but, honestly, I'd be willing to bet that everyone who visits this site is already logged in a DEA database.
If not, they are seriously wasting my tax money!
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Anonymous #1
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But what if its a civil suit, a custody battle, not criminal drug charges? I understand the technical methods, I guess my question should have been more whether it is actually legal in a civil suite for an ISP to turn over that info?
Edited by Anonymous (10/11/12 05:00 AM)
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ch1ck3n.s0up
Troubled Loner



Registered: 10/03/08
Posts: 2,573
Loc: Hunting Fungi
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
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Quote:
Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:
ch1ck3n.s0up said: With absolutely no special privileges, and about one minute of work, I am able to display your IP address, ISP, provider, and computer type in my signature!
So...What is my IP address, ISP, provider, and computer type? I don't mind if you post the answer publicly.
I have a business trip this week... going to a computer programmer's conference, and don't have time right now to write the script. Maybe next week I can set it up and show you how it works if you peeps are interested.
Quote:
Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:
Any ISP would open their logs to a police investigation.
Not any ISP. Most though...
This is an Enlil question, but if an ISP would not open their logs to an investigation, I'm sure a court order would be issued.
Quote:
Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:
Find out who is paying the ISP for a specific IP address, and voila! you've been identified.
Umm...I live with 20 people sharing the connection.
The other information in the HTTP header can be used to separate you out, like the USER_AGENT string.
-------------------- "Inspiration ~ Move me brightly ~ light the song with sense and color ~ hold away despair ~ more than this I will not ask ~ faced with mysteries dark and vast ~ statements just seem vain at last" --Jerry Garcia, Terrapin Station "Officer, I'm going to remain silent, and I would like to speak with a lawyer. I'm not resisting, but I don't consent to any searches.
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ch1ck3n.s0up
Troubled Loner



Registered: 10/03/08
Posts: 2,573
Loc: Hunting Fungi
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: Anonymous #1]
#17010106 - 10/11/12 06:19 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Anonymous said: But what if its a civil suit, a custody battle, not criminal drug charges? I understand the technical methods, I guess my question should have been more whether it is actually legal in a civil suite for an ISP to turn over that info?
This is a legal question, and I am not qualified to answer legal questions. Check with Enlil, or maybe try and entice him to answer here.
If you're concerned then try hidemyass.com http://www.hidemyass.com/
This is basically a Web-based proxy server. When you access the Shroomery through this site, your header information is not available.

-------------------- "Inspiration ~ Move me brightly ~ light the song with sense and color ~ hold away despair ~ more than this I will not ask ~ faced with mysteries dark and vast ~ statements just seem vain at last" --Jerry Garcia, Terrapin Station "Officer, I'm going to remain silent, and I would like to speak with a lawyer. I'm not resisting, but I don't consent to any searches.
Edited by ch1ck3n.s0up (10/11/12 06:56 AM)
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Anonymous #3
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: ch1ck3n.s0up]
#17010630 - 10/11/12 09:01 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Yes, I'm aware its quite easy to get a users IP address, but without the backing of law enforcement, turning an IP address into useable information is not so easy. And as Anon #1 confirmed there isn't likely to be law enforcement backing in a civil case to force an ISP to turn over who was using a given IP at a certain time.
In a civil case the content of a users postings are a much more likely method to try and establish the user of any given account. There is probably enough information from my 13 years of posting here to establish reasonably well in a civil trial that this account belongs to me, especially if the person already knows me and my history well.
That is one of the reason I post anonymously wherever possible even when there is no particular reason for me to do so, as in now. Also one of the reasons I lament the closely moderated nature of Shroomerites Anonymous now.
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Sell Your Soul
Nutmeg shaman


Registered: 03/15/00
Posts: 40,819
Loc: Over there
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: Anonymous #1]
#17010652 - 10/11/12 09:06 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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We offer the following security measures:

and

Both can be found in the Preferences settings in the Account area.
We never give out personal information which you may have used in registering your account with anyone for any reason.
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist

Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 48,392
Last seen: 2 days, 23 hours
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: ch1ck3n.s0up]
#17010653 - 10/11/12 09:06 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
ch1ck3n.s0up said:
Quote:
Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:
ch1ck3n.s0up said: With absolutely no special privileges, and about one minute of work, I am able to display your IP address, ISP, provider, and computer type in my signature!
So...What is my IP address, ISP, provider, and computer type? I don't mind if you post the answer publicly.
I have a business trip this week... going to a computer programmer's conference, and don't have time right now to write the script. Maybe next week I can set it up and show you how it works if you peeps are interested.
It doesn't work, you can't get that information.
( this is a challenge : )
Quote:
Alan Rockefeller said: This is an Enlil question, but if an ISP would not open their logs to an investigation, I'm sure a court order would be issued.
In criminal and civil cases they send out subpoenas to compel the ISP's to turn over the information. The shroomery has never received a subpoena, but we could over a child custody case.
Quote:
Quote:
Alan Rockefeller said:
Quote:
Find out who is paying the ISP for a specific IP address, and voila! you've been identified.
Umm...I live with 20 people sharing the connection.
The other information in the HTTP header can be used to separate you out, like the USER_AGENT string.
USER_AGENT just says the web browser and version. Since most web browsers update automatically these days, most people using the same web browser have the same user agent.
The relevant information is IP address and date/time.
But if it's a custody battle they probably wouldn't send out subpoenas, they would more likely have your wife testify that the account is yours and she has seen you using it.
If you think it is likely to come up, you should edit out incriminating information from your old posts before they take screen shots of them. Changing your username wouldn't hurt, though they could find the new one rather easily since people would have quoted your old one.
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Ellis Dee
Archangel



Registered: 06/29/01
Posts: 13,104
Loc: Fire in the sky
Last seen: 5 years, 2 months
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The ssl connect is a supporters only feature. That's actually the main reason I wanted the supporter account.
-------------------- "If the foundations be destroyed, what can the righteous do."-King Solomon And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
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Anonymous #1
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Good advice as I have changed my user name. My whole thing is that even if she had my old user name, without an ISP confirming my IP adress with my identification, then it becomes her word against mine and I just deny, deny, deny... at least I hope it would work like that, lol!!
Edited by Anonymous (10/11/12 09:22 AM)
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ch1ck3n.s0up
Troubled Loner



Registered: 10/03/08
Posts: 2,573
Loc: Hunting Fungi
Last seen: 2 years, 9 months
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: ch1ck3n.s0up]
#17011271 - 10/11/12 11:35 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Alan Rockefeller said:It doesn't work, you can't get that information. ( this is a challenge : )
I'm pretty sure that I can... I did something like this for an advertising firm in 2009 for a targeted marketing campaign. This, of course, is with the important assumption that you don't have any proxies or security layers between your machine and the Shroomery. With even a few security features things get a LOT harder. I can't just cherry-pick anymore; I actually have to find ways around security features--and that's a full-time job. I'll give it a shot when I get back from the conference.
Quote:
ch1ck3n.s0up said: Technically, unless you take some precautions, it is pretty easy to associate your Shroomery account with your real identity.
-------------------- "Inspiration ~ Move me brightly ~ light the song with sense and color ~ hold away despair ~ more than this I will not ask ~ faced with mysteries dark and vast ~ statements just seem vain at last" --Jerry Garcia, Terrapin Station "Officer, I'm going to remain silent, and I would like to speak with a lawyer. I'm not resisting, but I don't consent to any searches.
Edited by ch1ck3n.s0up (10/11/12 11:39 AM)
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist

Registered: 03/10/07
Posts: 48,392
Last seen: 2 days, 23 hours
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: ch1ck3n.s0up]
#17011390 - 10/11/12 11:59 AM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
ch1ck3n.s0up said: I'm pretty sure that I can... I did something like this for an advertising firm in 2009 for a targeted marketing campaign. This, of course, is with the important assumption that you don't have any proxies or security layers between your machine and the Shroomery.
I don't think you can find my IP, but I strongly encourage you to try. I don't mind if you post my IP publicly, I am using a friends neighbors wifi in Mexico City.
Internet security is one of my interests and it's how I make my living.
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 67,521
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: Anonymous #1]
#17011517 - 10/11/12 12:23 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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I didn't read the whole thread, and i have to post by phone since I'm in Vegas...but here's two things to think about:
1. The easiest way to lay foundation and authenticate these posts as being yours is for the other party to testify how he/she knows what username you use on this site...this is far easier and more compelling than any ip chase.
2. Tracing an ip to an address and even a computer isn't terribly difficult with subpoenas, but that still doesn't trace it to a specific person. It's rarely worth the trouble for a civil suit...usually, the method in number 1 will be used.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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Anonymous #1
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: Enlil]
#17011773 - 10/11/12 12:59 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Ok, cool, so essentially it comes down to her word against mine.. and I havent lived with her for over 4 years. At our last hearing the judge told her that if she were to open a new case against me, she was only able to use evidence since the last hearing which was about 6 months ago. Theres no way she could undeniably prove that a certain account was mine if she isnt even living with me other than an IP track.. Surely in that time my username couldve been hijacked right??
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Enlil
OTD God-King




Registered: 08/16/03
Posts: 67,521
Loc: Uncanny Valley
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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: Anonymous #1]
#17011890 - 10/11/12 01:23 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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Possibly she could testify a foundation to establish that it is your user name. A judge is likely to believe it, and ask if it's you...I'd caution you against lying...judges have some pretty good bullshit detectors.
-------------------- Censoring opposing views since 2014. Ask an Attorney Fuck the Amish
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Alan Rockefeller
Mycologist

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Re: Linking an account to a person [Re: Enlil]
#17012067 - 10/11/12 01:51 PM (11 years, 7 months ago) |
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If the court is trying to prove that you use drugs, the best thing to do is go to rehab. That way you can say that those days are behind you and have some paperwork to back that up.
It's not a good option, but it is an option...
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