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ellomello
XP



Registered: 08/11/08
Posts: 2,423
Loc: babilonUSA
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's; Mutations, Crested, Variegated and Lots Of Other Stuff [Re: modern.shaman]
#27755309 - 04/28/22 04:02 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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-------------------- PAY NO ATTENTION TO THE MAN BEHIND THE CURTAIN get back to the garden
some came singing, some come to play, some come for keeping the dark away
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's; Mutations, Crested, Variegated and Lots Of Other Stuff [Re: ellomello]
#27755482 - 04/28/22 06:24 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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cool never saw this method before
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant



Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 16,685
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: modern.shaman]
#27760552 - 05/02/22 08:06 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Offered for curiosity's sake:
Quote:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parabiosis#/media/File:The_Biological_bulletin_(19755290053).jpg
A headless Cecropia Moth joined with a pupa of the Polyphemus silkworm. Right: The abdomen of a Cecropia moth joined with a Cecropia pupa
A specie is a label, classification, or typology, such as is used by stamp and coin collectors -- mere verbiage, non-essential to wet biology.
People used to believe that different species could cross to form viable offspring, except, they could not be backbred to their original parentage.
One controversial method was called 'mentor grafting'.
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant



Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 16,685
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: durian_2008]
#27767434 - 05/07/22 02:15 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Cactus spines have been handy fasteners, to use in grafting.
I have been interested, this year, in developing a slightly more cold tolerant dragon fruit, in more colors, like blue and purple.
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turtle_hermit
Psychedelic Ranger



Registered: 06/03/10
Posts: 1,626
Last seen: 1 day, 2 hours
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: durian_2008]
#27767760 - 05/07/22 07:27 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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I am growing out some dragonfruit cuttings. What are you growing?
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant



Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 16,685
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: turtle_hermit]
#27767830 - 05/07/22 08:22 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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I have yellow skinned with white flesh and pink skinned with white flesh dragon fruit. A self fertile Vietnamese variety.
My red-flesh version has never grown more than a spindly pencil, in my greenhouse. I don't think I got a good clone.
I have pups of Pachycereus pringlei, aka Mexican Saguaro (lookalike) which I am told tastes like blackberries, and many seeds of myrtillo cactus, which some people substitute for blueberries.
On the fb dragon fruit grafting group, the woody core can apparently fuse to create a stable graft.
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the man
still masked



Registered: 08/12/99
Posts: 6,681
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Last seen: 30 minutes, 51 seconds
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: durian_2008]
#27769366 - 05/09/22 02:44 AM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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cool about cacti on pepper plant. i bet a few crisper inserts and could happen! i think it wont be able to handle the turgor/hormones/sugar levels and of course plants do have defenses.. but neve know, pretty cool. better would be a semi hardwood that can maintain growth for years who knows maybe if u physically hold on the graft it can just use the open wound as a media
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant



Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 16,685
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: the man]
#27769567 - 05/09/22 08:55 AM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Callous-to-callous would conceivably result in a somatic hybrid or chimerism at the grafting site.
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: durian_2008]
#27769716 - 05/09/22 11:57 AM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Looking at the graft now it seems to be failing. I will reattempt this in spring/summer with longer day times so hopefully rather then pushing flowers the new growth might make the scion grow... I did another graft with an astrophytum asterias and it also took just no new growth yet. Maybe too distant to work.
This was a completely random graft with zero expectations...
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant



Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 16,685
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: modern.shaman]
#27769721 - 05/09/22 12:00 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Too dry or too wet?
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: durian_2008] 1
#27769874 - 05/09/22 02:26 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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It seems to have partly dried out on the 'backside' small black blemish... maybe not joined or just incompatible as expected ... I'll try to take a photo tomorrow...
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Speeker

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 877
Loc:
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: modern.shaman]
#27770540 - 05/09/22 11:27 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Interesting is that comment about Nicotiana benthamiana. I have done some solanaceae grafts but this plant opens a lot of new possibilities. Probably one still has to be a master grafter anyway. Another reason for failure is the lack of plant material..
edit:
Quote:
Pat The Plant 9 days ago (edited) No, but... the Solanaceae are weird so you never know. An Australian tobacco, Nicotiana benthamiana , was found to enable grafts between totally unrelated families of plants as a middle graft between the rootstock and top. Tomato grafted to Chrysanthemum roots produced fruit 3-4 months after grafting. "We observed that Nicotiana species showed compatibility in interfamily grafting with 73 species from 38 families, including two species of magnoliids, five species of monocots, and 65 species of eudicots, " Search for "Cell-cell adhesion in plant grafting is facilitated by β-1,4-glucanases". The full paper is available.
This https://www.researchgate.net/publication/343540830_Cell-cell_adhesion_in_plant_grafting_is_facilitated_by_b-14-glucanases Patent https://worldwide.espacenet.com/patent/search?q=pn%3DUS2021285005A1
Petunia shares same properties as Nicotiana (I have grafted them to tomato and tobaccos) https://academic.oup.com/hr/article/doi/10.1093/hr/uhab056/6511820
Edited by Speeker (05/10/22 11:05 PM)
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant



Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 16,685
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: Speeker]
#27770559 - 05/09/22 11:55 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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tbh, we've had a drizzly wind storm, and I have gone out walking to find fallen branches, from which I clone fresh growing tips. And, I have grown out some unusual looking fruit seedlings. Creating chimeras is interesting, because you can take ordinary starting materials and end up with a creation, one-of-it's-kind.
One of my oddjobs has given me a flawed roll of pallet shrinkwrap (like thick cellophane), and I have bought superglue in bulk...
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: durian_2008]
#27771089 - 05/10/22 12:07 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Hard to see in the video camera doesn't focus well due to the background.
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant



Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 16,685
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: modern.shaman]
#27771114 - 05/10/22 12:19 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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There are many harmless fungicides. I dabbed a little ointment on the inside of a terrarium and never had any problems like that, again.
I also consider whether the food plant may someday be grown on the tapering, succulent root of a cactus, that may act as a reservoir, under water restrictions.
Tropical cucumbers became cold tolerant on hardier rootstocks, and the cactus will survive our mild frosts.
I read about the 'stone eating' bacteria and inoculated some of my air layers with powderized eggshell and the goo of faster-growing cacti.
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: durian_2008] 1
#27771377 - 05/10/22 03:53 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Dude has good suggestions
Pat The Plant 2 hours ago 12 subscribers I would like to see you graft one onto a tobacco seedling and another on a Portulaca grandiflora. "DNA studies show that Portulacaceae possibly cannot be separated from Cactaceae because it lacks autoapomorphies; Cactaceae however presents areoles which are not present as such in Portulacaceae." Neotropikey As you replied to another comment, flowering plants are probably not best for grafting onto, as they are putting everything into the flowers.
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durian_2008
Cornucopian Eating an Elephant



Registered: 04/02/08
Posts: 16,685
Loc: Raccoon City
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: modern.shaman]
#27771843 - 05/10/22 08:20 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Once, I applied for a job at the library, thinking of what an English Lit teacher might wear. The head librarian was heard to say that she got a bad vibe, like I would build Frankenstein.

Quote:
Is the Dodder the Most Intelligent Plant https://jonlieffmd.com/blog/is-the-dodder-the-most-intelligent-plant
Dodder not only uses taste, smell, movement and touch to manipulate other plants, but is, also, able to hijack all of their genes.
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Speeker

Registered: 02/11/04
Posts: 877
Loc:
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: modern.shaman]
#27775913 - 05/13/22 05:29 PM (1 year, 8 months ago) |
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Hmm... didn't someone asked not so long ago about grafting a Cactus to a Euphorbiaceae? Anyways, can Euphorbiaceae grafted like Cactaceae?
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: Speeker]
#27801706 - 06/01/22 04:35 PM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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They are different plant families but nothing it's not impossible just most likely 99.9% failure but you'll never know without trying... also just cause you failed once doesn't mean impossible.
I'm gonna be experimenting and sharing my successes and failures. I've posted ALOT of information and others have shared even more in this thread but most have been about others or just theories
For those with excess seedlings that don't mind experimenting...
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modern.shaman
San Mescalito




Registered: 05/09/12
Posts: 3,224
Loc: Zone 13
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Re: Creating a Cactus Chimera's- A Reason For Experimenting With Different Stocks [Re: modern.shaman] 3
#27810036 - 06/07/22 06:41 PM (1 year, 7 months ago) |
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Sweet I still have unlimited upload status even after all these years The astrophytum asterias pepper graft is showing interesting growth at the base... cant tell yet if it is just 'callous' similar to tissue culture or a pup... its been over a month since grafted and the astro has not shrunken nor died yet... it have only grown a minuscule amount but its bulging at the base.
Will have temps near 0C this weekend for 4 days so hopefully it doesn't die.
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