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Invisiblemodern.shaman
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How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti
    #16958776 - 10/03/12 12:59 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I found this post on the shaman-australis forum which is very interesting and I will give it a try next time my astro flowers without any others.

Quote:


Alright guys, just want to share tech that can be used to fertilize the flower of a cactus that usually needs pollen from another one to develope seed:

1. Get yourself some Cement from the DIY Store. Very fine pulver. The finer the better. But the typical Commercial grade works fine as well.

2. Get yourself a small brush and apply some of the cement dust on the Stigma of the flower on the plant that you want to produce seeds with. Also try to blow a little bit of the dust inside the flower.

3. Cement works as some kind of irritator what makes the flower create some Anti-Bodies that enable her to accept her own pollen.

4. Then wait for half an hour and brush some of the own pollen on the flower and repeat this numerous times.


Now heres some additional info: Usually, there is only very few seed to be harvested but it works and the seeds are usually viable. The reason why this works is that cement consists of highly basic calciumsillicates that tremendeously raise the ph of the flower. Because there also are aminoclusters on a pollencorn that are also responsible for raising the ph, the cement has the very same effect. Because of his highly basic potential, cement is even way more effective. Basic niveau reduces the ability of the flower to abort the pollen so it accepts it.

IT ALSO ENABLES YOU TO CROSS CACTI THAT ARE INCOMPATIBLE WITH EACH OTHER! Like LOPHOPHORA x GYMNOCALYCIUM, MAMMILLARIA, TURBINICARPUS ETC. Its not guaranteed that it works all the time and you have to experiment a lot but i know that it worked in some cases.
Another Advantage is that genetecially, defects will be passed down to the offspring so this would be very interesting for pollen from Cristates and other mutants.

But in some cases, plants can be weak or not healthy and may need additional generations of breeding in other cacti. The produced Offspring thats created with this tech is not to be seen as clones as there is a recombination of DNA going on, what enables them to cross them in with the motherplant as well.

Alright guys, this is no bullshit, its working so use this info to your Advantage and create some fucking freaks. :wink:





Source


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Invisiblenotanumber
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: modern.shaman]
    #16958788 - 10/03/12 01:01 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Wow, really interesting.


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OfflineRen
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: notanumber]
    #16959931 - 10/03/12 04:18 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Very interesting, I wonder if this would work with all types of plants?

One way to find out :laugh:


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Invisibleferrel_human
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: modern.shaman]
    #16961018 - 10/03/12 06:46 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

modern.shaman said:


But in some cases, plants can be weak or not healthy and may need additional generations of breeding in other cacti. 




Source




this is exactly why you get a pair of cacti for breeding pruposes. i just germinated like 50 fresh seed from my aztekium ritterii.

now i say, if rarity and freaks is what its all about then, well i just may try it.

i'm a 50/50 on this.


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Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely.
-Karode


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Offlinejjjcmzzt
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: ferrel_human]
    #16966874 - 10/04/12 05:22 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

So is their restrictions as to what types of cacti could successfully breed? Like could pollen from bridgesii be used on a lophophora willamsii? I imagine the resulting cacti would be mutated as hell, but could perhaps be a faster growing peyote alternative. Or cross breeding pereskiopsis with bridgesii/willamsii? If this is truly universal, i imagine some crazy things could be done.

Also, if this does work with all plants, what about a salvia-cannabis cross? That would be something i could only dream of owning, but it would be hard as hell to get sice salvia doesnt flower often if im not mistaken.


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Psychedelics i want to take: Mushrooms, Salvia (weak), Salvia (strong), Cannabis, LSA, Cactus, LSD, DMT, Bufotenine, 5-meo-DMT, 4-aco-DMT, Bufocin (theoretical as of now),  and a long long time from now, Datura (deliriant).

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Offlinehookahhead
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: jjjcmzzt]
    #16967216 - 10/04/12 06:16 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

jjjcmzzt said:
So is their restrictions as to what types of cacti could successfully breed? Like could pollen from bridgesii be used on a lophophora willamsii? I imagine the resulting cacti would be mutated as hell, but could perhaps be a faster growing peyote alternative. Or cross breeding pereskiopsis with bridgesii/willamsii? If this is truly universal, i imagine some crazy things could be done.

Also, if this does work with all plants, what about a salvia-cannabis cross? That would be something i could only dream of owning, but it would be hard as hell to get sice salvia doesnt flower often if im not mistaken.




So your a fan of interspecies erotica?


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Offlinejjjcmzzt
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: hookahhead]
    #16967357 - 10/04/12 06:35 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

Quote:

jjjcmzzt said:
So is their restrictions as to what types of cacti could successfully breed? Like could pollen from bridgesii be used on a lophophora willamsii? I imagine the resulting cacti would be mutated as hell, but could perhaps be a faster growing peyote alternative. Or cross breeding pereskiopsis with bridgesii/willamsii? If this is truly universal, i imagine some crazy things could be done.

Also, if this does work with all plants, what about a salvia-cannabis cross? That would be something i could only dream of owning, but it would be hard as hell to get sice salvia doesnt flower often if im not mistaken.



So your a fan of interspecies erotica?





Haha i just cant imagine all the possibilities. Im sure genetic mutations would be a huge problem, along with getting hybrid seeds to germinate but it would be really cool stuff. I cant even imagine what a peyote-bridgesii cross would look like.


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Psychedelics i want to take: Mushrooms, Salvia (weak), Salvia (strong), Cannabis, LSA, Cactus, LSD, DMT, Bufotenine, 5-meo-DMT, 4-aco-DMT, Bufocin (theoretical as of now),  and a long long time from now, Datura (deliriant).

"LSD is a psychedelic substance which occasionally causes psychotic behavior in people that have never taken it."

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Invisibledurian_2008
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: jjjcmzzt]
    #16980848 - 10/06/12 09:54 PM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I heard something similar about chimerism.

Allegedly, seeds can be made to grow together, if wrapped in a duct tape envelope, giving the roots and stem somewhere to emerge. The person doing this believed the irritating qualities of the glue worked to her advantage.

I related this to a more skeptical forum and was shot down.

So, at the risk of sounding rude, I would like for resident experts to evaluate photos for morphology.

I find it interesting and would like to test it.


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Invisiblesavage.renegade
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: durian_2008]
    #16983584 - 10/07/12 11:56 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

science is crazy


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Invisiblemodern.shaman
San Mescalito
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: savage.renegade]
    #16989524 - 10/08/12 09:11 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

I'm sure there are limitations to this process. Columnar cacti and a globular cactus would create an extremely unstable cactus that would most likely not even germinate or die shortly after. This however would be practical in doing cross breading somewhat similar species much more readily. After a few generations it should be stable enough to not have any problems or at least you would know the problems and possibly perform further crosses.

Here is a cross that my be achieved from this process (I don't believe that the creator used this method but simply tried enough times to get seeds.)

Source

Strombocactus disciformis X Turbinicarpus lophophorioides





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Invisiblemodern.shaman
San Mescalito
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: modern.shaman]
    #17017193 - 10/12/12 08:09 AM (11 years, 3 months ago)

After more searching on crosses I have stumbled upon a few very interesting crosses involving the lophophora sp.

Astrophora (astrophytum asteria x lophophora fricii)

Source



Source

Turbinacarpus lophophoroides x Lophophora williamsii

Source

I didn't know what to make of this?

Source


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OfflineJuke Adro
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: modern.shaman]
    #18001508 - 03/23/13 11:03 PM (10 years, 10 months ago)

Interesting and I need to keep this thread open.


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Offline420milehigh
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: Juke Adro]
    #18001560 - 03/23/13 11:17 PM (10 years, 10 months ago)

I will try this eventually with a Loph willi crossed with trich bridge :wellholyshit:


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All posts are entirely, 100%, conclusively false or complete works of fiction... but I can levitate lol

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Invisiblemodern.shaman
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: Juke Adro]
    #18001568 - 03/23/13 11:18 PM (10 years, 10 months ago)

So apparently you can use any 'powder' that changed the pH, mainly higher base. I'll be attempting sodium carbonate and will report if its effective or not. I don't want to buy a bag of cement so just using some baking soda.


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Invisiblemodern.shaman
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: jjjcmzzt]
    #18001579 - 03/23/13 11:22 PM (10 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

jjjcmzzt said:
Also, if this does work with all plants, what about a salvia-cannabis cross? That would be something i could only dream of owning, but it would be hard as hell to get sice salvia doesnt flower often if im not mistaken.




Sorry I skipped this but yes according to the source they should work with any plant however with salvia there is already a low viability rate so may not be likely.


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Invisibleferrel_human
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: modern.shaman]
    #18004165 - 03/24/13 02:48 PM (10 years, 10 months ago)

This stuff scares me. Dont ask me why but it does. Something unnatural about the whole thing.:tinfoil:


--------------------
Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely.
-Karode


Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade


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Invisiblemodern.shaman
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: ferrel_human]
    #18004283 - 03/24/13 03:12 PM (10 years, 10 months ago)

Well it is possible to happen in nature however we are just intervening and selectively crossing rather than letting nature do the work.


A strong base dust may be blown into flowers than they are cross pollinated by natural selection.
It's possible.


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Offline420milehigh
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: modern.shaman]
    #18004350 - 03/24/13 03:27 PM (10 years, 10 months ago)

this would make sense in nature, when faced with extreme circumstances they might cross breed with other species they normally wouldn't in the pursuit of survival... basically creating a totally different plant :wellholyshit:


--------------------
All posts are entirely, 100%, conclusively false or complete works of fiction... but I can levitate lol

"Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do." Benjamin Franklin

if I owe you seeds from a previous trade send me a PM, I will rectify my shortcomings and compensate you for your patience


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Invisiblemodern.shaman
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: 420milehigh]
    #18063481 - 04/05/13 05:19 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Another method for achieving hybridization would be the application of GA and cytokinin to the blooms at the time of hand pollination.
http://www.crfg.org/tidbits/gibberellic.html

Some already have both plant hormones in their possession so experimentation would be quite easy. From what I've gather be quickly researching this is that the lower the concentration the better the results. Perhaps combining the two methods would increase success rate? I'm looking at you Juke.

Would anyone be willing to try spraying a 'mature' large TBM with a weak GA solution a few times to possibly promote flowering? Would need to be entering spring or summer for your best chances. This isn't really something this is likely to happen but I've been thinking about it for a while... Maybe we should make a "Garden Experimentation" Thread so we could start testing/debunking 'plausible' theories.


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Invisibleferrel_human
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Re: How To Producing Seeds with Self-Sterile/Incompatible Cacti [Re: modern.shaman]
    #18063705 - 04/05/13 06:21 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I dipped a qtip in calcium carbonate and proceeded to brush the flowers of my turbinicarpus crest and my obregenia denegrii strombocactus flowers. Lets see if anything happens.


--------------------
Nature is my church and walking through it is gospel. It tells no lies and reveals all to those who look, and listen, closely.
-Karode


Looking for Mimosa tenuiflora seeds. Buttons for trade


Edited by ferrel_human (04/06/13 12:49 PM)


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