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OfflineStable Genius
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Registered: 09/26/18
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: BigChumpus]
    #26404952 - 12/28/19 03:46 PM (6 months, 13 days ago)

XUL you stand out like dog's balls :lol: :popcorn:


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OfflineSulfurshelfsean
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: koods]
    #26404954 - 12/28/19 03:46 PM (6 months, 13 days ago)

Quote:

koods said:
Quote:

BigChumpus said:
RJ I love you holy shit

You seem to always approach these issues with a level head even if you disagree

I just wanted to point this out and say more people should have that, I wish I did



You might want to try and explain at this point who you are a puppet of and why. You registered two hours ago yet you clearly are familiar with users.



Here's a hint: he derails every thread into a bigoted rant.


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Everything is better when it is done ON TOP OF A MOUNTAIN!


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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: Citizen X] * 1
    #26405036 - 12/28/19 04:42 PM (6 months, 13 days ago)

Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Citizen X said:
I’ve read your posts and was happy when you got perma’d and I’m sad that they let you back. You devolve any conversation that you don’t agree with and just make the forum suck basically

Take this as constructive criticism

I won’t be here as long as you’re here. So have at it



There's nothing constructive about it unless you can provide specific examples, but I'm not going to expect those examples from someone who is controlled by their emotions instead of rational thought. :shrug:



***crickets***



I guess qman was right.


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I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
Chilldog Extraordinaire


Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 27,883
Loc: 'Merica Flag
Last seen: 1 day, 32 minutes
Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #26405096 - 12/28/19 05:25 PM (6 months, 13 days ago)

There’s a first for everything.

And FWIW qman has got a lot better about controlling his Hulk-like tendency to turn green and throw tanks when immigration or social justice comes up, at least from what I’ve seen. Doesn’t make him right, just more tolerable.


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OfflineSirTripAlot
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Registered: 01/11/05
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #26405327 - 12/28/19 08:04 PM (6 months, 12 days ago)

It would be a shame, not to see those tennis matches youall have had for eons.


--------------------
“I must not fear.
Fear is the mind-killer.
Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration.
I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over me and through me.
And when it has gone past I will turn the inner eye to see its path.
Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.
Only I will remain.”


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OfflineLoaded Shaman
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: SirTripAlot]
    #26405589 - 12/29/19 01:51 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Great new posts, but holy SHIT zombie bump!!!


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OfflineBrian Jones
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Registered: 12/18/12
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #26405766 - 12/29/19 06:32 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
There’s a first for everything.

And FWIW qman has got a lot better about controlling his Hulk-like tendency to turn green and throw tanks when immigration or social justice comes up, at least from what I’ve seen. Doesn’t make him right, just more tolerable.




I wasn't hoping for tolerable. I was hoping for fun and provocative like the old days.


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"The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body"    John Lennon

I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Registered: 11/11/09
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: Brian Jones] * 2
    #26405793 - 12/29/19 07:01 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

I see your point. Tbh it is more fun than the 20,000 “Obama good/bad” thread format we had in previous years. One positive aspect of the tumult of our current political moment is that it’s exciting, the facade of monotony is gone. The obvious negative aspect is that it’s terrifying, but it’s like Gramsci said: “The old world is dying and a new world struggles to be born, now is the time of monsters.”


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OfflineBrian Jones
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: The Ecstatic] * 1
    #26405802 - 12/29/19 07:10 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Excellent Gramsci reference. Along with the Frankfurt school, Gramsci is the key figure in cultural Marxism. It's a shame that in Italy and France, regular people are exposed to the intellectuals, but here how many people have read Chomsky?


--------------------
"The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body"    John Lennon

I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 27,883
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: Brian Jones]
    #26405807 - 12/29/19 07:12 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

So few that he can respond to basically all the emails he gets lol


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OfflineBrian Jones
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #26405816 - 12/29/19 07:21 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

I might have to hit him up. It would make a nice keepsake. Michel Foucault used to write newspaper columns in Paris. I assume they were intelligible. I had most of his books and they were laborious.


--------------------
"The Rolling Stones will break up over Brian Jones' dead body"    John Lennon

I don't want no commies in my car. No Christians either.


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Offlineshivas.wisdom
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03]
    #26405904 - 12/29/19 08:27 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Citizen X said:
I’ve read your posts and was happy when you got perma’d and I’m sad that they let you back. You devolve any conversation that you don’t agree with and just make the forum suck basically

Take this as constructive criticism

I won’t be here as long as you’re here. So have at it



There's nothing constructive about it unless you can provide specific examples, but I'm not going to expect those examples from someone who is controlled by their emotions instead of rational thought. :shrug:



***crickets***



I guess qman was right.



Still choosing to die on this hill? Have you honestly forgotten every economic discussion that was derailed into qmans warnings of 'hordes of unskilled migrants'? Do you no longer remember every discussion on climate change that stagnated due to qmans doubts regarding the veracity of climate science? Blocked out the memories of discussions of international politics devolving into claims of antisemitic conspiracy?

Do you forget the opportunity I gave qman to provide their supposed "rational thought" regarding claims of machinations by the Jewish people and all we got was a single anecdote and some emotionally fueled drivel?

Did you forget the discussion we already had on this topic? https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26294042

Quote:

"Especially [if] it can be supported" - except it never has. Ever. How many times have we had the discussion that race is not a biological concept, that migrants do not lower the quality of life in the countries they immigrate to, or that the Jewish people are not a malevolent ethnicity engaged in an international conspiracy to bring down the West™? Do you think that the nth time we see another thread derailed will be the time that an actual argument based on evidence and reason will be put forth?

The racism on this website has never been supported - it won't be supported - because it can't be supported. Racism is wrong and there will be no benefit from tolerating the same racist beliefs ad nausea.

Who gives a shit if a person politely spreads their racist beliefs - does that make the belief any less vile? We shouldn't tolerate racists because they are polite, we should reflect on the idea that the politeness we experience is a luxury that would not be afforded to others if the racist beliefs being politely propagandized were ever acted upon.








Here's a different challenge - instead of continually asking us to reestablish the negative effect of qmans posts, why don't you submit some examples where qmans racism and antisemitism provided a beneficial effect for this community?


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Offlineqman
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Registered: 12/06/06
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: shivas.wisdom]
    #26405921 - 12/29/19 08:40 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Oh, you have proven that bringing in millions of broke, uneducated third world migrants into Western nations doesn't have an social economic impact that lowers the quality of life for the native population?  You better inform the EU population they're getting all worked up over nothing. :lol:

BTW, this is an economic issue, it has nothing to do with race. It wouldn't matter where the migrants can from, but you obviously use the racism excuse because you just can't resist.


Edited by qman (12/29/19 08:42 AM)


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Offlineqman
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: qman]
    #26405930 - 12/29/19 08:46 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

This is hilarious coming from a member that continuously advocates and justifies preemptive violence against innocent people that might hold a different ideology than himself.


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Offlineshivas.wisdom
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: Brian Jones]
    #26405932 - 12/29/19 08:46 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Quote:

Brian Jones said:
Quote:

The Ecstatic said:
There’s a first for everything.

And FWIW qman has got a lot better about controlling his Hulk-like tendency to turn green and throw tanks when immigration or social justice comes up, at least from what I’ve seen. Doesn’t make him right, just more tolerable.




I wasn't hoping for tolerable. I was hoping for fun and provocative like the old days.



Have you ever considered that your ability to view racist and antisemitic propagandizing as merely "fun and provocative" comes from a place of privilege where the worst results of said propaganda are perceived as unlikely to directly effect you?

I imagine it's a little bit harder to view something like say... an international debate on immigration policy that has to contend with rampant ethno-nationalism, as light entertainment and diversion when you find yourself on the receiving end of resulting fascist violence.


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Offlineshivas.wisdom
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: qman]
    #26405938 - 12/29/19 08:49 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Quote:

qman said:
This is hilarious coming from a member that continuously advocates and justifies preemptive violence against innocent people that might hold a different ideology than himself.



There's nothing constructive about it unless you can provide specific examples, but I'm not going to expect those examples from someone who is controlled by their emotions instead of rational thought. :shrug:


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Registered: 11/11/09
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: qman]
    #26406001 - 12/29/19 09:44 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Quote:

qman said:
This is hilarious coming from a member that continuously advocates and justifies preemptive violence against innocent people that might hold a different ideology than himself.




Again, you don’t get to play this card when your ideology revolves around walling off the global south and condemning them to genocide to protect “your” resources.

Shiva probably has the most nuanced understanding of violence in this sub tbh


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InvisibleballsalsaM
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: The Ecstatic]
    #26406009 - 12/29/19 09:49 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Nuance is for suckers.
All issues have black/white, right/wrong causes and solutions


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Don't click this link                                         



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OfflineFalcon91Wolvrn03
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Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: shivas.wisdom] * 2
    #26406222 - 12/29/19 11:48 AM (6 months, 12 days ago)

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Quote:

Falcon91Wolvrn03 said:
Quote:

qman said:
Quote:

Citizen X said:
I’ve read your posts and was happy when you got perma’d and I’m sad that they let you back. You devolve any conversation that you don’t agree with and just make the forum suck basically

Take this as constructive criticism

I won’t be here as long as you’re here. So have at it



There's nothing constructive about it unless you can provide specific examples, but I'm not going to expect those examples from someone who is controlled by their emotions instead of rational thought. :shrug:



***crickets***



I guess qman was right.



Still choosing to die on this hill?



You mean waiting for Citizen X to provide an example of why he's ok with qman being banned???  Even if Citizen X came up with an example (which he hasn't), I wouldn't call that "dying on a hill".

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Have you honestly forgotten every economic discussion that was derailed into qmans warnings of 'hordes of unskilled migrants'?



That led to both sides presenting evidence on whether or not unskilled labor hurts the country.  I think that was a good debate.

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Do you no longer remember every discussion on climate change that stagnated due to qmans doubts regarding the veracity of climate science?



No, I don't remember.  Qman has always agreed with climate science (to my recollection).  His arguments have mainly been about the financial costs to combat climate science.

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Blocked out the memories of discussions of international politics devolving into claims of antisemitic conspiracy?

Do you forget the opportunity I gave qman to provide their supposed "rational thought" regarding claims of machinations by the Jewish people and all we got was a single anecdote and some emotionally fueled drivel?

Did you forget the discussion we already had on this topic? https://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/26294042


Quote:

"Especially [if] it can be supported" - except it never has. Ever. How many times have we had the discussion that race is not a biological concept, that migrants do not lower the quality of life in the countries they immigrate to, or that the Jewish people are not a malevolent ethnicity engaged in an international conspiracy to bring down the West™? Do you think that the nth time we see another thread derailed will be the time that an actual argument based on evidence and reason will be put forth?

The racism on this website has never been supported - it won't be supported - because it can't be supported. Racism is wrong and there will be no benefit from tolerating the same racist beliefs ad nausea.

Who gives a shit if a person politely spreads their racist beliefs - does that make the belief any less vile? We shouldn't tolerate racists because they are polite, we should reflect on the idea that the politeness we experience is a luxury that would not be afforded to others if the racist beliefs being politely propagandized were ever acted upon.






Again, I think these are important debates to have because nearly half the people in this country seem to share these views, and I think it's important to show evidence that does/doesn't back their beliefs.

Calling for someone's removal is a less effective technique than showing them why they're wrong.

Quote:

shivas.wisdom said:
Here's a different challenge - instead of continually asking us to reestablish the negative effect of qmans posts, why don't you submit some examples where qmans racism and antisemitism provided a beneficial effect for this community?



Again, I think having both sides show why unskilled labor hurts/does not hurt the economy was a good discussion.  :shrug:


--------------------
I am in a minority on the shroomery, as I frequently defend the opposing side when they have a point about something or when my side make believes something about them.  People here get very confused by that and think it means I prefer the other side.


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OfflineThe Ecstatic
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Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 27,883
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Last seen: 1 day, 32 minutes
Re: i now understand why we have a no flaming rule. [Re: Falcon91Wolvrn03] * 2
    #26406236 - 12/29/19 12:01 PM (6 months, 12 days ago)

I think you need to think more about how discussions are framed, and how certain framing affects those discussions. I think the point here is that we can’t ever get to larger discussions about labor or migration because we’re always bogged down by ceding the argument to qman and posters like him, and letting him argue on the grounds that he’d like to argue on.

If we only ever discuss migration on the terms of domestic economic net result we’re missing a vast majority of the information necessary to form an opinion on the topic.


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