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InvisibleZippoZM
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Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 13,227
Loc: Pongyang, North Korea
WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL *DELETED*
    #1670908 - 06/29/03 03:43 AM (20 years, 7 months ago)

Post deleted by boO


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PEACE

:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:



"in times of widespread chaos and confusion, it has been the duty of more advanced human beings - artists, scientists, clowns, and philosophers - to create order. In such times as ours however, when there is too much order, too much m management, too much programming and control, it becomes the duty of superior men and women and women to fling their favorite monkey wrenches into the machinery. To relieve the repression of the human spirit, they must sow doubt and disruption"

"People do it every day, they talk to themselves ... they see themselves as they'd like to be, they don't have the courage you have, to just run with it."


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Invisiblepuscle
genius of love
Registered: 01/06/01
Posts: 4,539
Loc: NY
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1670972 - 06/29/03 05:23 AM (20 years, 7 months ago)

Bummer, but tell us more.


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OfflineDreamer987
The VerbalHerman Munster
Female

Registered: 04/15/03
Posts: 5,326
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Last seen: 16 years, 1 month
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1671522 - 06/29/03 01:17 PM (20 years, 7 months ago)

Yea, i got sentenced to the easiest bootcamp in the state of texas, but i heard about those wilderness programs. Sounds ruff. they shut a few down from kids getting killed and sodamized by there caretakers. :shocked:


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InvisibleKthxBye
bandito furioso

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 1,197
Loc: bottom of the noob barrel
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: Dreamer987]
    #1672090 - 06/29/03 07:14 PM (20 years, 7 months ago)

I'll be your huckelberry? That's messed up...I want to hear the rest of the story...


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I know what he wants: a drag of smooth tobbacco blended with the finest Turkish Turkweed. Here, have a toke on me you dumb beast.


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Invisiblezeta
Stranger

Registered: 05/24/02
Posts: 3,972
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1675803 - 07/01/03 01:02 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Holy shit...
Hurry up and post the rest!


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InvisibleZippoZM
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Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 13,227
Loc: Pongyang, North Korea
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL *DELETED* [Re: zeta]
    #1675897 - 07/01/03 01:50 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Post deleted by Ripple


--------------------
PEACE

:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:



"in times of widespread chaos and confusion, it has been the duty of more advanced human beings - artists, scientists, clowns, and philosophers - to create order. In such times as ours however, when there is too much order, too much m management, too much programming and control, it becomes the duty of superior men and women and women to fling their favorite monkey wrenches into the machinery. To relieve the repression of the human spirit, they must sow doubt and disruption"

"People do it every day, they talk to themselves ... they see themselves as they'd like to be, they don't have the courage you have, to just run with it."


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InvisibleClean
the lense
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Registered: 05/11/03
Posts: 2,374
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1676251 - 07/01/03 05:49 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

christ man.
i'm sorry you had to experience all that.
those people consider themselves "adults" ? i can't think of a more childish way to "teach" than the methods you described.
they get PAID to make life hell for hundreds of kids every year, and then expect their work to be doing some sort of good?

what really concerns me is that there are so many of these organisations........................................................................  :lipsrsealed: :lipsrsealed:  :wtf:

ever heard of Willhelm Reich?  he was a scientist/genius who was endlessly persecuted by the U.S. government and ended up dying in jail.  He wrote a book called "The Mass Psychology of Fascism"... you might be interested to read that. 

thanks for sharing your story  :rasta:


Edited by Clean (07/01/03 06:07 AM)


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Invisiblebilly cuts
turntablingmycologist

Registered: 02/22/03
Posts: 656
Loc: Saturn
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: Clean]
    #1676720 - 07/01/03 11:10 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

This happened to one of my friends. 2 Big dudes busted in his house and kidnapped his ass, put him in bootcamp for like 5 months. I don't see how this business is even legal..


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1676859 - 07/01/03 12:08 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

dude. the reason they're sending you to mexico is because the sort of 'treatment' you're gonna get down there isn't even legal in the US. escape! how are you on a computer?


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InvisibleKthxBye
bandito furioso

Registered: 04/03/02
Posts: 1,197
Loc: bottom of the noob barrel
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ]
    #1677218 - 07/01/03 02:48 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

mushmaster - I think this happened some time ago since the beginning of the story was January 2001. Whatever happened in Mexico is long over...


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I know what he wants: a drag of smooth tobbacco blended with the finest Turkish Turkweed. Here, have a toke on me you dumb beast.


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: KthxBye]
    #1677316 - 07/01/03 03:43 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

oh. silly me. whatever happened to him?

those camps are fucked up. how are you supposed to know when those people come to 'intervene' that they aren't kidnappers? i've got to think that if when they come after you, you grab the closest sharp instrument and put it in their neck in self-defense, you'd be acquitted when it got to court...

man.. if my parents had sent me to one of those, i'd escape. i'd find a way to escape. goddam those camps are fucked up. the potential for abuses is staggering. any parent who sends their kid to one of those things isn't fit to be a parent in the first place. shit.


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InvisibleZippoZM
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Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 13,227
Loc: Pongyang, North Korea
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ]
    #1677376 - 07/01/03 04:17 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Deleted at users Request


--------------------
PEACE

:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:



"in times of widespread chaos and confusion, it has been the duty of more advanced human beings - artists, scientists, clowns, and philosophers - to create order. In such times as ours however, when there is too much order, too much m management, too much programming and control, it becomes the duty of superior men and women and women to fling their favorite monkey wrenches into the machinery. To relieve the repression of the human spirit, they must sow doubt and disruption"

"People do it every day, they talk to themselves ... they see themselves as they'd like to be, they don't have the courage you have, to just run with it."


Edited by Ripple (08/20/03 06:11 AM)


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1677475 - 07/01/03 05:02 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

what keeps you from escaping late at night when they've got you out in the woods?


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InvisibleZippoZM
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Posts: 13,227
Loc: Pongyang, North Korea
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL *DELETED* [Re: ]
    #1677927 - 07/01/03 08:13 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Post deleted by Ripple


--------------------
PEACE

:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:



"in times of widespread chaos and confusion, it has been the duty of more advanced human beings - artists, scientists, clowns, and philosophers - to create order. In such times as ours however, when there is too much order, too much m management, too much programming and control, it becomes the duty of superior men and women and women to fling their favorite monkey wrenches into the machinery. To relieve the repression of the human spirit, they must sow doubt and disruption"

"People do it every day, they talk to themselves ... they see themselves as they'd like to be, they don't have the courage you have, to just run with it."


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OfflineMojo_Risin
Man

Registered: 03/31/01
Posts: 2,838
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Last seen: 8 years, 13 days
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1679539 - 07/02/03 07:44 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Whats the story on your stay in Mexico?


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Fear    attracts  energy  that can expose one to be coerced. Learn to overcome fear and develop enlightenment.


Freedom Equality Justice (3 of 12 Jewels of Life)

Nov.11th Veterans Ron Paul Moneybomb...www.Ronpaul2012.com

Check out campaignforliberty.com


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OfflineLOBO
Vagabond

Registered: 03/19/01
Posts: 655
Loc: NY
Last seen: 17 years, 3 months
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1679557 - 07/02/03 07:51 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Man that is the horrible what they did to you.
What did you do that your parents sent you to that camp?
Please continue with your story, you know you should write a book about it and make some money out of it and get those camps closed.


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OfflineLOBO
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Registered: 03/19/01
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: LOBO]
    #1679674 - 07/02/03 08:20 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)



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InvisibleZippoZM
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Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 13,227
Loc: Pongyang, North Korea
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL *DELETED* [Re: LOBO]
    #1691979 - 07/07/03 01:40 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Post deleted by Ripple


--------------------
PEACE

:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:



"in times of widespread chaos and confusion, it has been the duty of more advanced human beings - artists, scientists, clowns, and philosophers - to create order. In such times as ours however, when there is too much order, too much m management, too much programming and control, it becomes the duty of superior men and women and women to fling their favorite monkey wrenches into the machinery. To relieve the repression of the human spirit, they must sow doubt and disruption"

"People do it every day, they talk to themselves ... they see themselves as they'd like to be, they don't have the courage you have, to just run with it."


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OfflineGernBlanston
unintended sideeffect
Male

Registered: 05/28/03
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Last seen: 2 years, 3 months
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1694054 - 07/07/03 06:33 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Let me start by saying that yes, there are some incredibly fucked up programs out there for this sort of thing. Anyone who abuses their position to maintain a position of power or fear over another human being should be shot on the spot. But that's just me.

That said, I worked for some period of time at a similar (but thankfully, not the same) facility. I won't use the name, but it was in southern Utah. I, and the people I worked with, counted ourselves as professionals and attempted to treat every single human who came through our program with the dignity that we would have liked to have been treated with, were the shoe on the other foot.

Lemme qualify a couple of things;

1. Zippoz, I have a good idea of how difficult this was for you. I think the program you were at was one of the worst in the country (and I know insider things about them that I won't share), and I am genuinely sorry for your experience. My posting a counter-view is in no way intended to belittle you or lessen your experience at all.

2. I have never been okay with the way that people are brought into many of these programs. It is kidnapping and psychological abuse - no buts about it. There are programs (such as mine) where the participants (will anyone get offended if I just use the word 'kids' from here on out?) are told before hand what they are getting into, and in many cases, even given a choice.

3. Of course, sometimes the choice was a) go to the program for 60 days, ot b) go to jail for 60 days.

Anyway, I'm not going to get into a long-winded thing about how great we were for doing this wonderful service to humanity. There were kids in our program who desperately needed to learn what we had to teach them. There were kids there who were guilty of nothing other than smoking the occasional bowl and not having a great deal of motivation. Was a program like this overkill for one of those kids? Hell yah, it was. But that was their parents' thing or a court decision. We just did the best we could.

Christ - half of the instructors I worked with shroomed regularly! Not while we had groups, of course... but you try living in the desert of southern Utah for a while and NOT shrooming! So needless to say, most of us knew where these kids were coming from and wanted to do good by them.

Again, I am really, truly sorry for the experience you had. Shit like that is a crime, and I'm glad programs like that are disappearing from the radar. And I'm not asking you to understand, seeing as what you went through, but... well, there are people out there who really do benefit (greatly) from the good, caring programs out there.

Gern


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There is no flag large enough to cover the shame of killing innocent people.
  --  Howard Zinn


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InvisibleAhab McBathsalts
OTD Windmill Administrator
Other User Gallery Ultimate Champion: Blackjack

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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: GernBlanston]
    #1700472 - 07/09/03 05:51 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

I had a roommate who had to go through similar shit. Oh he was my room mate at fucking boarding school.


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"Nobody exists on purpose. Nobody belongs anywhere. Everybody's going to die."


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Invisible2Experimental
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1700784 - 07/09/03 08:16 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

damn thats horribal man, you would think they woudl outlaw shit like that. When you talked to your parents, what did you say?


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InvisibleZippoZM
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Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 13,227
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: 2Experimental]
    #1701833 - 07/10/03 05:22 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

thats the other thing, i wasnt allowed to talk to them the whole time i was in texas, untill they came down on my last day to say goodbye, cuz i was going to mexico.


--------------------
PEACE

:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:



"in times of widespread chaos and confusion, it has been the duty of more advanced human beings - artists, scientists, clowns, and philosophers - to create order. In such times as ours however, when there is too much order, too much m management, too much programming and control, it becomes the duty of superior men and women and women to fling their favorite monkey wrenches into the machinery. To relieve the repression of the human spirit, they must sow doubt and disruption"

"People do it every day, they talk to themselves ... they see themselves as they'd like to be, they don't have the courage you have, to just run with it."


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OfflineLOBO
Vagabond

Registered: 03/19/01
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Loc: NY
Last seen: 17 years, 3 months
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1701907 - 07/10/03 07:35 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Well buddy It is very cruel what they have done to you especially you only did what teenagers do.
How old are you?.
No one knows why we have to go in life thru experiences like that, but make the best out of it; there is always a lesson to be learned even if it is not clear now.
As per you parents forgive them if you can, forgive them because they are ignorant.
If you are still dependent on them, hang on finish school and play the ?good boy game? and when you are at age, get the hell out of there.
I wish you good luck and peace of mind.


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Edited by LOBO (07/10/03 07:36 AM)


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Invisible2Experimental
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1702297 - 07/10/03 11:35 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

"thats the other thing, i wasnt allowed to talk to them the whole time i was in texas, untill they came down on my last day to say goodbye, cuz i was going to mexico. "

So what did you say to them then?


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InvisibleZippoZM
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: 2Experimental]
    #1703431 - 07/10/03 04:54 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

well, i begged them not to send me to mexico. what would you have done? and they said no youre going, you have problems..... i admit i had some, but they would have fixed themselves. especially if i knew this would be the consequence. odly enough, in hindsight, i see how the wilderness places i went to can be and was benificial, even if i hated it. and i an now considering taking a job in one of these places. weird hunh. although i wouldnt want one where the kids went forcefully, like i did.


--------------------
PEACE

:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:



"in times of widespread chaos and confusion, it has been the duty of more advanced human beings - artists, scientists, clowns, and philosophers - to create order. In such times as ours however, when there is too much order, too much m management, too much programming and control, it becomes the duty of superior men and women and women to fling their favorite monkey wrenches into the machinery. To relieve the repression of the human spirit, they must sow doubt and disruption"

"People do it every day, they talk to themselves ... they see themselves as they'd like to be, they don't have the courage you have, to just run with it."


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InvisibleSpiffy
Defender of theGnomes

Registered: 07/04/02
Posts: 1,693
Loc: Next to your mom
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1703896 - 07/10/03 08:10 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

hrm....this is very, very disturbing. Do you feel like they "brainwashed" you at all? That article somoen posted the link to sent shivers up my spine. "Inspirational" tapes palying during meals, being tied up and left on your face for days, and the whole part where the reporter was talking about interviewing the kids and how they were all so monotone and the same. When you finally got home, did you tell your parents about what really went on? I'm sure the place didn't tell them how horrible it was. How did they react? Did they believe you? How long were you there? Please tell more of this story....I am very very interested in your ordeal. I can't believe loving parents would do this to their children. Perhaps it does "work" but at what cost? I was a really fucked up kid and I did a lot of bad shit...MUCH worse than the behavior you described....thankfully my parents never sent me to a place like that. But I DID grow out of it and I'm now a college student with a 3.0 GPA and two jobs and a lot of morality. I didn't need to be abused and broken down to get to a better place...I just had to grow up...and most of us do. I can see how a program like that might be beneficial for kids who commit felonies (rape, murder etc.) but for smoking pot and skipping class? Thats just insane. MESSAGE TO ALL PARENTS: If your kids are acting up, it doesn't mean they are deviant people....it means they need MORE love. Allow them to be who they are and love them for it....you do not OWN your children. You are their guide, not their boss!


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Namaste: "I honour that place in you where the whole Universe resides. And when I am in that place in me and you are in that place in you,
there is only one of us."


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: Spiffy]
    #1704055 - 07/10/03 08:55 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

If my parents did that to me I would have chopped off all their fingers.


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Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ
(•_•)
<) )~  ANTIFA
/ \
\(•_•)
( (>    SUPER
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InvisibleZippoZM
Knomadic
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Registered: 06/17/03
Posts: 13,227
Loc: Pongyang, North Korea
Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1708042 - 07/12/03 07:49 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

there was a lot of bullshit. one day we all got called out side on the sandy cold beach. the staff asked us if we had anything to confess. no one owned up for anything big so they told us to flip this 300 lb. fiberglass boat. and flip it again, and again. then one of the staff got in it and had us push it up and down the beach. all this time one of the staff was in the boat, yelling and bitching about how someone needed to own up- or we all would face the consequences. an hour later, after pushing this fucking boat up and down the shore. they told us that someone stole a wallet with 400 pesos in it. that was more than enough to get to the border, and if anyone didnt own up we, would keep pushing the boat. so noone owned up, and we pushed this fucking boat some more. 1/2 hour later the staffer told us to stop. he said "do you know what day this is? April fools" i was going to kill this mother fucker for playing with our minds like that, however he was a peer staff, and was 4x my weight. so i didnt really do anything. i hope that fucker relapsed. thats just a bit of the torture we went through.

peace
zippoz


--------------------
PEACE

:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:



"in times of widespread chaos and confusion, it has been the duty of more advanced human beings - artists, scientists, clowns, and philosophers - to create order. In such times as ours however, when there is too much order, too much m management, too much programming and control, it becomes the duty of superior men and women and women to fling their favorite monkey wrenches into the machinery. To relieve the repression of the human spirit, they must sow doubt and disruption"

"People do it every day, they talk to themselves ... they see themselves as they'd like to be, they don't have the courage you have, to just run with it."


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Offlinecurenado
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1708123 - 07/12/03 09:03 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

I think those programs are really rotten, and do a lot of damage. But in trying to fight them? You are talking about a fiercely abusive culture that has a kind of weird thing about using kids for thinly veiled freudian lusts billed as "conditioning and reform" or "character building" because they know, like I do, that it breaks and degrades and enrages a person so that they will become as blind and vicious as they are - because that kind of person does what the TV and raymond moses say- they break you, and then they ride your husked out corpse while you sing the company song.
Sorry! That one gets me every time. That entire mentality is why kids ARE setiing thier folks on fire in bed. Poor kids!
You can hatch it all up in your head how great you and your capatlistic militaristic society are, but if you baby sick - it proof proof you ugly bad.
If you hurt the baby it will tell. Even if it has to create fight club to give you what you deserve (ya bastards...) or light your bed on fire as a big light so everyone can finally see.
But - this is the wisdom of the boot and bullet, and I believe the passage goes "as you sow, so shall ye reap"
Reap it Raymond Moses!


--------------------
Yours in the Natural State!
"The woods are lovely, dark and deep; but I have patches to keep, and jars to sterilize before I sleep...."


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1711579 - 07/13/03 01:54 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

Holyshit, I went through the same shit!!!!  I got busted with some mdma and pot and got sent to a group home first, then I hated all the gangsters and bad people there so I ran away back to my house.  After that I was kicked out of the group home and sentenced to 20 days in detention for "sanctions" I had to talk to my friggin parents through glass on a telephone, one of the worst feelings i've ever felt, I was only 16 and they were acting like a was a violent criminal or something, i never caused harm I had just personal amounts of both drugs and they still thought it necessary to ruin my life by putting me in with crack dealers, and car thieves.  After detention was done I got sent to Residential Treatment since I got kicked out of the group home which was wayyy worse.  The first month I had to sit at a fucking assesment center, and then went to a place called Northwest Passage in Northern Wisconsin where they treated us like fucking shit.  Just for a picture of this place, it was like a prison but a house, t.v. didn't even come in there as we were so secluded, nearest town was at least 15 miles so you couldn't really run anywhere.  This was a bootcamp wilderness type program.  We had to chop wood for 2 hours a day, ask to go up and down the stairs, ask to use the bathroom.  Many kids in my eyes were physically assaulted!!!  The counselours call it being restrained when they think a kid is out of control which was rarely the case when they would restrain people.  Kids were thrown to the floor and had rug burns all over there faces, and older teenagers were brought to friggin tears it hurt them so bad!  Then if you accidently swore or even forgot to ask to go up the steps you would first get 50 pushups, then have to sit in the corner and face the wall for 2 hours without talking then go to the wood pile for another 2 hours to chop wood.  Also we weren't allowed to see our parents at all and only got 2 10 minute phone calls a week.  We also had the shittiest chores and if you missed one little thing you would have to go chop wood.  The schedule was pretty much like this, wake up at 6 a.m. run a mile, eat breakfast then do 3 hours of physical training, weightlifting, running etc.  Then we'd have lunch, and chores after every meal of course! Then we had school for the other 3 hours or the day before dinner, and then had dumb groups and shit at night.  WE also went on a lot of Canoe trips, very hard ones though!!  we had to canoe 200 miles down the st.croix river in 7 days, the counselors would drink soda and have snacks in front of us, and all we ever got was ramen noodles.  The counselors would make us carry there stuff, and just completely break you down to make you feel like shit.  There was a few people there that basically kept me from killing myself cause they were actually there cause they seemed to care about helping kids, but others were just abusing there authority!  After being taken out of my house for a total of about 8 months, and being sent to so many different places I finally got to come home, and I was RUINED!!!  Since I was so secluded there, I have the worst social phobia and now sit in my room 23 hours a day and do drugs to try and make my life not so shitty and boring.  I hate knowing there's kids my age out having fun and i'm just stuck at home now, as I lost all my friends abrubtly when I was sent away and when I got back many of them had already graduated highschool so I didn't even know where to find them as many moved.  I have no social life now except for online, I have a few friends left from highschool but not GOOD friends, they don't have similar interests as me and whatnot but they understand where i'm coming from.  We used to be best friends but now they only drop by like once a month, cause i'm never willing to leave my room.  I went from a middleclass good student who just liked to experiment to a COMPLETE MENTAL RECK!  I don't know why the government ruins people's lives like this, I used to be happy and go out everynight and hang out with friends, now I haven't done it in years!  The last 2 years since i've been back have been me constantly sitting in my room, trying to stay secluded.  These places suck and i'm sorry that you had to go through it as well, and I know how it feels :frown:  I don't know what else to say, I believe i've been permanently ruined, they didn't stop me from doing drugs or anything or make me a better person they made me worse, they showed how ugly our country is!!!!  I missed out on a crucial part of my childhood, highschool! I didn't get to live the life of a normal teenager but rather that as being portrayed as a criminal because I wanted to put some substances in MY BODY THAT I OWN, isn't this a free country? GUESS NOT, but i won't give in and I still use drugs as I said I always would because I love them.  But that place did ruin my life, so at least they accomplished something :confused:


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ]
    #1711610 - 07/13/03 02:12 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

There was 9 other kids there with me, and I felt soooo bad for them as many of them were even younger than me as young as 14 and this place was so physically demanding and if you didn't do what they said you'd be damn sorry!! There was no way to win at this place but to act like you were reformed and say that they were always right, even though they did some of the most childish and horrible things ever. They would sit there and tell me that I'm going nowhere in life and that they knew that i'd just be in prison after there, so motivation to reform huh? I remember when I had to first go up north to the Assesment Center my mom had to take me to the East side of my town by the interstate, a guy in a minivan picked me up and we started driving WAYYY north, I ended up at this place, the assesment center where they pissed tested me and watched me piss, sicko's!!!!!! The Actual Residential Treatment Center, called Northwest Passage II was the worst place I was sent, where I stayed for 3 months. Because I was not too bad there, I was able to come home, many kids were sent to other worse places cause they had to be restrained and what not, I never got restrained, cause the first night I got there I saw it happen to a kid and could not believe my eyes, I was scared shitless they HURT HIM, he was screaming "you're breaking my arm" please let up and crying, this was the first day I can only imagine how bad that was for the kid both mentally and physically, sorry that you were restrained cause that is BULLSHIT, they should have no right to touch kids at all!


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ]
    #1711616 - 07/13/03 02:13 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

here's a link to the shithole I was sent to

http://www.nwpass.com/passage2.htm


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ]
    #1711622 - 07/13/03 02:16 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

OH yes and they made us listen to friggin jesus preaching stations and i'd always put up a fight about it! I would say quit trying to turn us into cult members, then i'd have to face the wall for 2 hours and cut wood for 2 hours.


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Offlinecurenado
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ]
    #1711948 - 07/13/03 04:32 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

<<Since I was so secluded there, I have the worst social phobia and now sit in my room 23 hours a day and do drugs to try and make my life not so shitty and boring.>>

Ok - this is just my opinion but - I don't hink it has anything to do with being secluded in the woods; life is what it is made anywhere and I can put you in the woods and you might not want to leave -
But the thing is this: Whoever's fault it was then, and whatever happened you are still hurt right now and that hurt is not thta you were isolated on the outside - they hurt you and you isolated yourself on the inside because that's what people do sometimes.
You need to know straight up that some of the features of your personality that you have been conditioned to feel guilt and fear over are some of the parts that are really important and valid and identify you as a person of some intelligence and independent thought.
It is my personal and professional opinion that you are suffering from residual symptoms of abusive conditioning and I want you to know that I read every single word you wrote and I have spent a lot of time standing against the very things you describe.
I'm going to check out for a minute and go get another guy -
I'm not so sure this forum is about the camps themselves anymore and I want this guy around for what I think this forum is really going to end up being about. Be back.

OK - well - there is a guy that runs around here and says he's a therapist but he feels he's "in a tough predicament" and if you want to pm him privately you can. (?)
I just wanted him to come in here and act like a dude but it's all good -
BTW- I am not feeling in a predicament and since I do pro bona work anyway sure, you can take my comments as just another person or as a doctor however you like because I'm going to be pretty much the same either way (wholeness/honesty)

I do think this is heinous, bears no semblance of any good thing, and I'm seriously thinking about specialising this way because I'm very familiar with abuse and self esteem issues and the idea of "Anti-Raymond Moses" camp is just too soothing to a disgusted soul that has been aginst this from the first day as I have.
Just like they physically programmed all that crap into you, it can be let loose to run right back out because it's toxic and your body doesn't want it anyway. It was a bad thing that happened and just kick it to the curb and focus on moving away from and upward from any of it.


--------------------
Yours in the Natural State!
"The woods are lovely, dark and deep; but I have patches to keep, and jars to sterilize before I sleep...."


Edited by curenado (07/13/03 05:27 PM)


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OfflineBaby_Hitler
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ]
    #1711959 - 07/13/03 04:36 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

People should start filing lawsuits against these organizations and put them out of fucking business.

Sue them, and sue your parents.


--------------------
Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ Ƹ̵̡Ӝ̵̨̄Ʒ
(•_•)
<) )~  ANTIFA
/ \
\(•_•)
( (>    SUPER
/ \
(•_•)
<) )>    SOLDIERS
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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: curenado]
    #1712119 - 07/13/03 05:42 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

thanks for the advice I really do appreciate it, but it's much easier said than done to just kick it to the curb.  I don't even ever think about that place anymore, but I know that I was a good socialable person before I got sent away and now I can't even talk to my friends without fidgiting and shit.  The place gave me a good perspective, not to get caught again!!!!  But it didn't reform me at all and just showed that even though I thought what I was doing was right that this worthless country could still ruin my life because I wanted to use a friggin substance!  My mom talks about suing the place all the time cause i'm so fucked up now, i'm 19 and not nearly prepared to live on my own like I should be, my mom still has to take me to the doctor even!  I was in college last year and had to drop out because I was so scared about being there with people I didn't know :frown:  My friends and family agree that I have been ruined since I've gotten back and I wish I could just dust my hands off and say it's over but I just can't seem to get back to my old self!  I hate these places, however I would consider working at one just to be an actual GOOD influence on someone and not ruin there lives, I wouldn't want anyone to go through what I did, it's the worst thing i've ever had happen to me, I still cry some nights over it!  If I wouldn't have gotten sent away my life would be so different right now, I used to use drugs for recreation and would have a good time with my friends, now I just sit in my room by myself and do them to try and escape my horrible reality of life.


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Offlinecurenado
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ]
    #1712188 - 07/13/03 06:06 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

<<but it's much easier said than done to just kick it to the curb>>

I know, but the attitude is a start and you've obviously got that

<<I hate these places, however I would consider working at one just to be an actual GOOD influence on someone and not ruin there lives, I wouldn't want anyone to go through what I did, it's the worst thing i've ever had happen to me, I still cry some nights over it!>>

Good I hope you will and maybe we will work together one day. Lots of people that actually belong in health sciences get there the same way....

If you ever want to get out in the country again (the good part) and recondition your self away from that damn damage in any way - we do just that kind of thing. Or rather, we'll give you space, place and peace. In all cases best wishes and I really hope you won't let what someone did intentionally and methodically waste more of what should be some of the best years of your life -
Isn't it shitty how a whole world can receive us but 2 or 3 rotten fuckers can run us away from all life? Like they speak for life and everybody?


--------------------
Yours in the Natural State!
"The woods are lovely, dark and deep; but I have patches to keep, and jars to sterilize before I sleep...."


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OfflineYouEnjoyMyself
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: curenado]
    #1712205 - 07/13/03 06:15 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

my parents used to threaten that they would send me to programs like that. never did though.


--------------------
-Wash uffitze drive me to firenze


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: curenado]
    #1712249 - 07/13/03 06:32 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

I do want to get in the country again just cause i'm so paranoid in the city now, if you have some kind of program give me a pm. You're lucky your parents didn't send you to one, they have potential for good but with the wrong people working in them they just ruin you like they did me. I'm trying to get better now but it's an uphill battle, have bad mental health issues now. I wish I could almost go back there just to be secluded, although I'd hate being bossed around like before.


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: curenado]
    #1712253 - 07/13/03 06:34 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

yep basically my life was ruined by a few counselors there and just being away from society so long it was a culture shock to come back and i'm just piss scared.


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InvisibleZippoZM
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ]
    #1713846 - 07/14/03 10:17 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

we should have some sort of a shroomery gathering for all of the people that got sent off. the other day i met this chick, well call her "R", she was in a program called cascade with a brother of someone i was in mexico with. i met her afer a rave. its good to see that not everyone was brainwashed :smile:

pm me if anyone that has gone through somthing like this wants to get togeather!!! :smile:

peace
:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:


--------------------
PEACE

:mushroom2:zippoz:mushroom2:



"in times of widespread chaos and confusion, it has been the duty of more advanced human beings - artists, scientists, clowns, and philosophers - to create order. In such times as ours however, when there is too much order, too much m management, too much programming and control, it becomes the duty of superior men and women and women to fling their favorite monkey wrenches into the machinery. To relieve the repression of the human spirit, they must sow doubt and disruption"

"People do it every day, they talk to themselves ... they see themselves as they'd like to be, they don't have the courage you have, to just run with it."


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Anonymous

Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1713929 - 07/14/03 11:02 AM (20 years, 6 months ago)

thanks for the pm zippoz nice to talk to someone that's gone through something similar to what I did, feel free anytime to talk.

dlagwagon


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OfflineDreamer987
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: ZippoZ]
    #1724928 - 07/17/03 02:03 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

It could have been worse

JACKSON, Mississippi (AP) -- Young people at two Mississippi reform schools were hogtied, shackled and forced to eat their own vomit, according to a U.S. Justice Department report.

Three administrators were reassigned following the report, a state official said Tuesday. The administrators at Columbia Training School and Oakley Training School, near Raymond, were expected to remain off their regular jobs indefinitely.

Officials with the Mississippi Department of Human Services also conferred Tuesday with state Attorney General Mike Moore and Justice officials about the report, which said the "staff at Oakley and Columbia use excessive force with impunity."

Young people aged 10-17 are sent to the training schools, overseen by DHS, after facing repeated charges for property crimes or mostly low-level offenses.

The report released Monday said suicidal girls at Columbia were sometimes stripped naked and put in isolation in a poorly ventilated "dark room" with only a hole in the floor for a toilet.

Pepper spray was used for punishment when young people did not exercise or perform military drills, according to the report. It said one girl was sprayed after she complained of the heat and had trouble keeping up during exercise.

The report said boys were forced to run around tables for hours with mattresses on their backs.

"Girls are punished in the military field by being forced to run with automobile tires around their bodies or carrying logs," the report said. "Girls reported being forced to eat their own vomit if they throw up from exercising in the hot sun."

The federal report said there was no rehabilitative value to the "cruel and demeaning" exercises.

Justice Department workers also found unsanitary kitchen conditions at Oakley, including mouse droppings and cockroaches.

DHS officials said Tuesday that the agency has made "considerable changes" at the schools since Justice Department staffers' initial visit more than a year ago.

"This is a work in progress. And it's taken over 20 years for the system to be in the state that it's in, and it would not be something we can fix overnight. But I can assure you that we are aggressively looking for answers," DHS Executive Director Thelma Brittain said during a news conference.

Moore said he repeatedly asked Justice officials during Tuesday's meeting for names of young people making abuse claims so he could prosecute employees. He said Justice would not provide the names, saying the report called for systemic changes rather than individual prosecutions.

Moore said DHS had already taken "corrective action" for some problems.

"Some of the rotten eggs, so to speak, are not there anymore," he said.

In Washington, Justice spokesman Jorge Martinez said he could not elaborate on the report because "it is an open matter."

Damon Hewitt, assistant to counsel for the NAACP Legal Defense and Educational Fund in New York, said Mississippi had abdicated its responsibility to educate children in the training schools.

"This is only part of the story of what happens to kids who end up lost in the pipeline from the school house to the jail house," Hewitt said.


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Offlinecurenado
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: Dreamer987]
    #1725035 - 07/17/03 02:59 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

"and to such as harms one of these little ones of mine, for him, it were better that he were never born"
Jesus Christ, referring to the day he settles debts.......

What a horrible sacrifice those folks had to make to show what was going on there.


--------------------
Yours in the Natural State!
"The woods are lovely, dark and deep; but I have patches to keep, and jars to sterilize before I sleep...."


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OfflinePurple Haze
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Re: WILDERNESS PROGRMAS AND RESIDENTAL TREATMENT HELL [Re: curenado]
    #1725057 - 07/17/03 03:03 PM (20 years, 6 months ago)

I know this might be off topic but still...

I saw a movie The Correction or something about some kids ~12 to 15 years old sent to a ''Care Center'' they were raped and beated up by the guardians..  :crazy: 


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