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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 3 days
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: Gixxer_boy]
    #1670504 - 06/29/03 01:22 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

i only kill bugs that pose a threat:

-wasps
-spiders
-unknown creepy looking insects

etc

i let the silverfish live, theyve never fucked with me.


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OfflineGrav
 User Gallery

Registered: 02/06/02
Posts: 4,454
Last seen: 8 years, 8 months
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1670651 - 06/29/03 02:37 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I didn't give a shit about animals when I was a kid. I harassed my dog, i shot birds and rats from afar with pellet guns.

then one day there was this big rat up by my house eating some thrown out food, and I shot it right in the backside. it just began rolling around on the ground in obvious pain and disorientation.. I was horrified. i'd never actually seen an animal's reaction up close before.

I felt it's pain, and I think I clubbed it to death with my gun, but I don't entirely remember... but I do remember that moment when I became aware of the animal's life, and I've really gained a certain love and respect for all animals ever since.


Edited by Grav (06/29/03 02:43 AM)


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Offlinesomebodyelse
In_Is_Out

Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 296
Last seen: 18 years, 2 months
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: Grav]
    #1670728 - 06/29/03 03:15 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

If you kill animals you have to objectify them in order to feel no pain, so to speak. I used to shoot rabbits that got into my folk's garden where they grew half our food (the garden was fenced off, but occasionally the furry bastards would breach it in some ingenious manner; we'd plug it, but then there'd be two or three left inside happily eating lettuce.)

If you approach the rabbit as competition for your food, and as food in and of itself (I'd usually skin and cook them) then no problem. But once you start to empathize with them, it becomes a horrible experience.

Correct my background specifics if you know better on the following. The government at some point in the 70s (I think) released a rabbit plague (mixie) that was meant to wipe out the population (not sure if they did it in the US or not) , except it didn't quite work and thus the plague would come and go in waves.

One year there'd be happy healthy rabbits all over, the next year half of them would be lame and blind with this horrible disease, the following year there'd be no rabbits...and the cycle would repeat. The rabbits with the plague were really in a horrific state so we'd shoot them if we saw them to put them out of their misery. One time I didn't have my gun, but came across one of these rabbits on the road. It was blind, lame, twitching, and had grey pus seeping from every opening on its face; it was obviously in pain, and confused. It heard me approach, and tried to run down the road - but it was evidently new to its blindness, or so disorientated otherwise by the disease, that it would bump into things. I walked up behind it, grasped it firmly by its back legs and whacked it neck first into a fencepoast . It didn't die.

It started squealing in terror. I whipped it back, and slammed its head back into the post. Again, it was still alive, and whimpering. Third time I put him on the road, and crunched his skull with a rock.

Trust me, not fun.

Anyway, I just wanted to point out that if you got into an animal's pain to that extent every time you inadvertently hurt or killed one, you wouldn't be able to live with yourself. What about every bug that splats onto your windscreen, and careens off into the field to die slowly and twitching spasmodically in mortal terror?

There is a holy order in India who supposedly aim to harm nothing - no insect, anything - and will allow e.g. wild tigers to kill them, rather than fight back. Their reputation is one of total enlightenment...I'm sure somebody can supply the name of their group. But could any of us realistically live in such a manner?


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Offlinegedezia
backlash
Registered: 04/25/03
Posts: 60
Loc: heaven
Last seen: 16 years, 10 months
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: HarveyWalbanger]
    #1670797 - 06/29/03 04:02 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

i can never kill anything.. as far as "pests" are concerned. i just transport them to other parts of my house, because if i put them outside they may freeze to death or something. i dont see the point in killing spiders or insects. and i feel sad that people kill them without any thought. (or with thought but not the GOOD kind, yes, there is GOOD kind, and there is sickening kind) that people lack the capacity of understanding to see themselves in the lil fellers.. there is no such thing as "intellect", and to kill a "pest", or even label it as such shows fear, not power. there was a wasp nest on my deck last summer, they never bothered me. never bit me. and much to my surprise, they really adore steak!! some of them just sit and eat it, and others fly "woozy" style with big hunks back to their hive.. i remember the joy i felt in watching them enjoy their "meal".. anyone who elevates themselves above "lesser life forms" is... dumb


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Offlinesomebodyelse
In_Is_Out

Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 296
Last seen: 18 years, 2 months
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: gedezia]
    #1670853 - 06/29/03 04:43 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Are you vegan?


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 3 days
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1670858 - 06/29/03 04:48 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

"anyone who elevates themselves above "lesser life forms" is... dumb"

so, if army ants invade your home by the hundreds, you plan to co-exist? yeah right, non-violence is ideal, but not practical, when push comes to shove, you gotta lay and die or shove back.

fuck ghandi, dont even get me started.


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Offlinegedezia
backlash
Registered: 04/25/03
Posts: 60
Loc: heaven
Last seen: 16 years, 10 months
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1670875 - 06/29/03 05:11 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

i live in an area where there are many good trout streams, people come here specifically to fish. at was at one of them one day and 2 girls were fishing, one caught a fish, and the method they used to kill it was to drop a rock onto its head.. it took about 3 blows or so, and the blood it did gush. i told them that if they DID want to take it and keep it and eat it that they should just string it up and leave it out of the water; then its like going to sleep for the fish rather than a crude object being smashed against their head. but they didnt seem to care. they pretended like they did but as i was driving away i saw them once again dropping their rocks.. i used to "fish". until this one time many years ago when i "snagged" a very young fish, caught him right in the eye. (or her) and theres no sport in that. it was just something i had been raised to do.. we can be squashed at any time as easily as a spider or ant. and we ARE NOT at the top of the "food chain".. regardless as much as some of us PREFER to "think".


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Offlinesomebodyelse
In_Is_Out

Registered: 06/12/03
Posts: 296
Last seen: 18 years, 2 months
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: gedezia]
    #1670899 - 06/29/03 05:37 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)


Quote:


anyone who elevates themselves above "lesser life forms" is... dumb
... we ARE NOT at the top of the "food chain".. regardless as much as some of us PREFER to "think".





OK, but do you hold human life to be equal to, say, a chicken's? And what is your position on lions killing antelopes? Should we protest?


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 3 days
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1670905 - 06/29/03 05:41 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

gedezia, of course we are at the top of the food chain, superior...maybe not, but the food chain, yes.


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OfflineHarveyWalbanger
Demiurge
Male

Registered: 06/24/02
Posts: 3,071
Loc: 8b
Last seen: 1 month, 18 days
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1671074 - 06/29/03 09:51 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

We might look like the top of A food chain, but I assure you our species is at the mercy of micro-organisms. Not only can we not kill them with our bare hands, they can kill us on a level that we cant even see or fix. THEY are the true pests.

Ants just walk places and bite. So what if they took over your house, you're out alot of money? Atleast they didnt rush at your family killing people like you do to them! he threatened you with a bite on the arm, not to be crushed into a giant pile of goo for the fuck of it. It WAS a living thing, that felt pain, happiness, and terror.


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 3 days
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: HarveyWalbanger]
    #1671079 - 06/29/03 09:54 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

yeah, but our science is so advanced that we can kill them if enough pressure is put on the government.

virus's aint shit. ants feel pain, happiness and terror?

is that factually based, or just your own opinion?

ants cant feel shit, they are communist slaves. Whenever I find an ant, i take him as far as I can from his point of origin, maybe then he will be free from the terror that his totalitarian monarchy imposes on him.


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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


Edited by atomikfunksoldier (06/29/03 09:55 AM)


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OfflineHarveyWalbanger
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Registered: 06/24/02
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Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1671113 - 06/29/03 10:39 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

I see them carry their injured away!!! They are fully freaking aware of what happened. I havent the science to back up that their nerve endings feel pain, but theres no reason to assume it doesnt! There ARE definatly nerve endings there. How else does its legs move? Their antenae are nothing but nerve endings, very sensitive ones. This isnt a single celled amoeba. Its a small thing, like a crab, or a turtle, or a mouse.


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 3 days
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: HarveyWalbanger]
    #1671148 - 06/29/03 11:11 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

that is meaningless, its all for more reproduction and expansion, another individual ant is just an extension of the queen.

the only ants with self-awareness are those that abandon the hive.


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OfflineHarveyWalbanger
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Registered: 06/24/02
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Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1671154 - 06/29/03 11:15 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

So we've established that you dont think it's life was worth anything, cause it never would've done anything signifigant with its life. I hope you do something cool with your life before your crushed flat by some asshole that could care less : P


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 3 days
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: HarveyWalbanger]
    #1671181 - 06/29/03 11:44 AM (18 years, 2 months ago)

mmmm yeah, right, my posts are not abstract art, so they do not warrant an abstract interpretation.

I was arguing that self-consciousness is important in order for an animal to have feelings, you on the other hand are freely disseminating your propaganda of opinion.


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OfflineGixxer_boy
Rice Burner

Registered: 06/24/03
Posts: 149
Loc: Mass
Last seen: 18 years, 2 months
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1671262 - 06/29/03 12:53 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

By saying something hurtful to someone, thats causing more internal pain than an ant can even began to comprehend. Ants and other hive type bugs gladly through there lives away to protect the greater good of the hive. Like AFS said, they are just an extension of the queen. Bee's will sting a person that they perceive as a threat, even if it will surely kill them. They are no where near on the same level of feeling and conciousness as we are. I still would rather not kill them, because I don't like to kill.

"Ants just walk places and bite. So what if they took over your house, you're out alot of money? Atleast they didnt rush at your family killing people like you do to them! he threatened you with a bite on the arm, not to be crushed into a giant pile of goo for the fuck of it. It WAS a living thing, that felt pain, happiness, and terror. "

In areas where army ants are common, they often times swarm peoples houses and kill everything in sight. I've read and heard of several stories where an infant was left alone in its crib, and ants came into the crib and stript every piece of flesh off the baby. Ants would kill you with little to know reason if they could, its the nature of most living things. They kill anything that is tasty or threatening. Don't act like we are the evilest species on the face of the earth, we are just like any other living thing, just smart enough to argue about it.


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"Why do women have breasts?"
......
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"So you can have something to look at when you're talking to them!" -Peter Griffin


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OfflineHarveyWalbanger
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Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1671430 - 06/29/03 02:29 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Extentions of the queen? These are newborn toddler boys finding food for mom. They have exactly the mentality of a grabby human child, except with alot more fear. And when they die, I highly doubt nature has taken it upon herself to make sure they feel no pain. That doesnt make for good evolution in moving creatures. They bleed, suffer, and pray to die when you squash them. They arent an incredible loss to the gene pool, nor are they worth more or less than any other animal, but it really is awful is my point. I'm positive they are fully feeling beings like all the other animals.

But yes, none the less, they cannot function in a human society. I DO understand what you guys are saying, cause I am still killing the wasps around my house, but I would still say they suffer way more than humans. Cockroaches live for almost 2 days with 70% of their body crushed. Thats like being a hit and run victim and sitting on the grill of someone's car for a weekend....


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 3 days
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: HarveyWalbanger]
    #1671444 - 06/29/03 02:33 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

"I highly doubt nature has taken it upon herself to make sure they feel no pain"

what???? if nature had any ounce of intelligence, then it would obviously give ants immunity from pain, because it serves no purpose in their existance, it would only hinder them from helping the community.



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OfflineHarveyWalbanger
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Registered: 06/24/02
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Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1671460 - 06/29/03 02:40 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

Exactly. But, I can honestly say she didnt.


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 18 years, 3 days
Re: Regret for killing household pests : ( [Re: HarveyWalbanger]
    #1671468 - 06/29/03 02:47 PM (18 years, 2 months ago)

so, id like to see the results from the extensive research you did that allowed you to understand the feelings of ants.

or are you on some zhuangzi type-shit? (the happiness of fish...)

even if you are, zhuangzi's theories are purely philosophical and have nothing to do with biology.


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