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OfflineLearyfanS
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5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11
    #1669022 - 06/28/03 10:24 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Click here.

Quote:

Not only did the leader of the free world sit as his country was attacked, the Secret Service also
did nothing. Bush was appearing in public at a previously announced photo-op. He was a sitting
duck. The attacks were ongoing at that point (planes had yet to hit the Pentagon or the field in
Pennsylvania), and nobody knew how much more destruction was going to happen. Were there
two, three, four, eight more planes hijacked and on their way to crash into prominent buildings?
Was one headed for the school, where anyone who checked the President's public itinerary would
know he was located? Were other terrorists planning to detonate dirty nukes? Were they going to
release anthrax or smallpox or sarin? Was an assassination squad going to burst into the school and
get Bush? Was a suicide bomber going to ram a truck full of explosives into that classroom?

During the midst of the attacks, any of these things could've happened. Yet there sits Bush,
seemingly unconcerned. His Chief of Staff likewise doesn't think that America in flames warrants
the President's immediate attention. And the Secret Service utterly fails to do its job by grabbing the
President of the United States and getting him to safety. It's truly inexplicable.







Isn't it obvious to you that Bush did nothing because he knew exactly what was going to happen that day?

I'd like to hear the pro-Bush people defend these non-actions.





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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1669064 - 06/28/03 10:53 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Yet another desperate grasp of Bush bashing liberals. Why does this even matter? I am done with this forum. To many irrational people in here grasping at straws.


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1669080 - 06/28/03 11:08 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Instead of offering any kind of expanation you?ve decided to leave the forum all together.







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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1669091 - 06/28/03 11:19 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I just think the quote you posted is ridiculous, and that it seems to represent a good portion of the kind of political discussion that goes on in here. Half of the threads are about how Bush stole the election, or some other BS argument about how bad he is. I am an independent thinker myself, and this kind of unoriginal thought irritates me. Sorry. What if the monkeys from the Wizard of Oz flew in the class room, and pooped acidic monkey shit on everyone?


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1669107 - 06/28/03 11:31 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Still no explaination?

Why don?t you just humor me.
Quote:



Not only did the leader of the free world sit as his country was attacked, the
Secret Service also
did nothing. Bush was appearing in public at a previously announced photo-op.
He was a sitting
duck. The attacks were ongoing at that point (planes had yet to hit the
Pentagon or the field in
Pennsylvania), and nobody knew how much more destruction was going to
happen. Were there
two, three, four, eight more planes hijacked and on their way to crash into
prominent buildings?
Was one headed for the school, where anyone who checked the President?s
public itinerary would
know he was located? Were other terrorists planning to detonate dirty nukes?
Were they going to
release anthrax or smallpox or sarin? Was an assassination squad going to
burst into the school and
get Bush? Was a suicide bomber going to ram a truck full of explosives into
that classroom?

During the midst of the attacks, any of these things could?ve happened. Yet
there sits Bush,
seemingly unconcerned
. His Chief of Staff likewise doesn?t think that America
in flames warrants
the President?s immediate attention. And the Secret Service utterly fails to do
its job by grabbing the
President of the United States and getting him to safety. It?s truly
inexplicable.










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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1669225 - 06/28/03 12:52 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Alright. I think they were perfectly safe there. The Secret Service does a pretty good job of protecting the President. Maybe they knew something some guy writing a story on the internet didn't. Maybe not. The point is hindsight is 20/20. Was it a mistake? I have no idea. Obviuosly nothing happened. It makes it sound like he was some evil lazy fucker that just sat there as we got attacked. What was he expected to do? Run down the street screaming. They were probably waiting to get a little more info, and enact a plan to get him out of there. Which they did shortly thereafter.

I have to admit something here. When Bush was elected I was pissed. I was buying all the 'he stole the election' bullshit, and after a week or so I didn't care anymore. Then 9/11 happened. I felt like my world had been shattered. The effect that event had on me changed my life. I sat by the TV for a couple weeks, watching what was happening in the world. The President gave that speach to the nation in Congress a day or two after it happened. It helped me. It gave me hope, and it showed me that we had a very strong, dedicated President that was determined to try to stop this from happening again. So far he has been successful.

All the little bullshit things that you see about the administration, the nit-picky crap. Anything that can be said bad about him usually is, no matter how trivial, or ridiculous it is. No one is perfect. All people make mistakes. Bill Clinton sure as hell made plenty. I tend to give Bush a bit of lattitude to do his job. To me he has done a great job so far, and I hope he gets reelected. I don't agree with him on all of the issues every time either. There are many things that I totally disagree with, but I feel that he has the interest of me and my fellow countrymen in mind at all times. That is his job, and he has done it well.

As I type this some real change is starting to happen in the middle east. The Palestenian terrorists groups are actually promising to have a cease fire for 3 months. Hopefully they and the Israelis can finally work something out. It may not happen this time, but I hold out hope that it will happen soon. Iran is heading towards Democracy instead of the fanatical religion based government they have now. The people are taking to the streets and protesting. They want democracy.

This leads to a point that confuses the hell out of me. All of these things are a direct result of the war in Iraq. Period. Most of you left-wingers hate religion, or at least do not care to have anything to do with it. One of your biggest pet peaves is religion in government. This happens to be one of my highly held ideals as well. Well, this is what is starting to happen in the region. Democracy generally turns out acceptable results in a country, as compared to the other options out there. Freedom is a wonderful thing. The ability to protest what your government is doing when you disagree with it, is only available in free societies. Try that in Saddam's Iraq and see where it gets you.

I think Tony Blair and George Bush will go down in history as great, historic leaders. They may turn out to be responsible for finally solving some of the problems in the Middle East. Maybe the Arab people will finally be able to live in a better world, and join most of the rest of us in the somewhat civilized world. A world they can discuss politics, and get involved openly, to change what they don't like.


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OfflineCornholio
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1669255 - 06/28/03 01:06 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Edit:  I wrote the following before I read your previous reply.
Quote:

Half of the threads are about how Bush stole the election, or some other BS argument about how bad he is.  I am an independent thinker myself, and this kind of unoriginal thought irritates me.


You imply that any arguments about how bad Bush is are BS.  That kind of statement isn't what I would expect from someone who claims to be an independent thinker.  Every argument should be judged on it's merits.  There are a lot of very compelling arguments (and some that aren't so compelling) presented in these forums, which are turned down simply because they are either for or against Bush.

I'll agree with you in this case, however,  that based on the video alone, without any other information to go with it, that it's not enough to prove any wrong doing, especially since we couldn't hear what was said to Bush in those 2.5 seconds, and we don't know what the agents knew.  I think there's a story showing that Bush did know more, and Leary has probably already read that story (which is why he may have stronger feelings about this).  If you're the independent thinker you say you are, I would hope that you would be interested in reading that story with an open mind as well.

And when you think something is BS, chime in and tell people why, don't just call BS as you did with this thread.

Cheers!  :smile:


--------------------


Edited by Cornholio (06/28/03 01:09 PM)


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Cornholio]
    #1669311 - 06/28/03 01:26 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

[edited for early morning grammar]

Shakta, have you read this?

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/timeline/index.html


Let me pose a question to you also: why is it inconeivable to so many people that the president of the united states could be...for want of a better word, "evil"? It happens all the time, all over the world - you could write volumes about the twisted dictators, gangsters and despots who wormed their way into power in the last century alone.

Do you think the Argentinians had dismissed the mothers of the dissappeared as conspiracy theorists?

Actually, one of the best models to compare this current situation to is that of Hitler - not because Bush compares directly to Hitler, but because political dissent in Germany was quashed by a terrorist act on the back of which a wave of hyper patriotism arose. Any number of political science lecturers have made this point in depth.


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OfflineCornholio
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1669324 - 06/28/03 01:32 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

As I type this some real change is starting to happen in the middle east. The Palestenian terrorists groups are actually promising to have a cease fire for 3 months.


I agree. For the first time in his Presidency, Bush is finally not allowing Israel to dictate everything. It'll be interesting to see if he stays tough, or if he goes back to bending to their every last wish (as previous US presidents have done as well).
Quote:

Iran is heading towards Democracy instead of the fanatical religion based government they have now. The people are taking to the streets and protesting. They want democracy. Freedom is a wonderful thing. The ability to protest what your government is doing when you disagree with it, is only available in free societies. Try that in Saddam's Iraq and see where it gets you.


Be careful here. Those who have taken to the street to protest the US occupation are being arrested. They aren't as free as you think. Most Muslims believe that religion MUST be a part of Government. Should we not respect that because we don't believe it? I'm not saying they shouldn't have freedom or democracy, I'm saying if we don't let them choose their own Government, then they CAN'T have freedom or democracy.


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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Cornholio]
    #1669361 - 06/28/03 01:46 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Cornholio said:
Be careful here.  Those who have taken to the street to protest the US occupation are being arrested.  They aren't as free as you think.  Most Muslims believe that religion MUST be a part of Government.  Should we not respect that because we don't believe it?  I'm not saying they shouldn't have freedom or democracy, I'm saying if we don't let them choose their own Government, then they DON'T have freedom or democracy.




I was talking about Iran, not Iraq. The students first started protesting against the government, and now everyday people are in most of the cities. If all the people in a country get pissed enough, things will change. Iran has a history of rebellion anyway.

Next thing. The thought that the president could be evil I agree with. Anyone can be evil. I just disagree when any little nothing story is used to try to portray him as some evil guy with strange motives or something. I am not saying Bush is a saint, I am just saying he is not as bad as people try to make him seem. I think he does a good job. Of course, no matter who the president is a lot of people will think he is a jackass. :smile:

Back to Iraq. I don't think there are massive arrests to protestors going on. If you throw rocks, or incite the people to do something dangerous you get arrested, or you get a bullet. We are still trying to secure the country, and our boys are dying every day while doing the job. Freedom as we know it does not exist in Iraq yet. It can't until a new Iraqi government takes over and everything settles down. As we round up or kill the remaining bad guys things will get better. The bad guys are the ones shooting at our guys in case you didn't know. :grin: 


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OfflineCornholio
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1669374 - 06/28/03 01:50 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

I was talking about Iran, not Iraq


My mistake.

I'm off on vacation, see you guys in 1 1/2 weeks!


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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Cornholio]
    #1669381 - 06/28/03 01:52 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Ah, dang. Have a good time. I was just starting to get interested again too. I think I am going to go smoke some herb and watch a movie. Everyone have a great weekend. I know I will.


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OfflineCornholio
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1669405 - 06/28/03 01:59 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Thanks buddy.  You too!  :stoned: 


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1669467 - 06/28/03 02:25 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Whoa whoa whoa, we're getting off track here. This is about Bush's unusual response or lack there of during the attacks.




Quote:

Alright. I think they were perfectly safe there. The Secret Service does a pretty good job of protecting the
President. Maybe they knew something some guy writing a story on the internet didn't. Maybe not. The point
is hindsight is 20/20. Was it a mistake? I have no idea. Obviuosly nothing happened. It makes it sound like he
was some evil lazy fucker that just sat there as we got attacked. What was he expected to do? Run down
the street screaming. They were probably waiting to get a little more info, and enact a plan to get him out of
there. Which they did shortly thereafter.




What do I expect the President of the United States to do once he found out the country is under attack? Well it would be nice if he could

1) Leave the classroom

2) Ask what the fuck was going on

3) Ask who was attacking us

4) Leave the school in which any terrorist who wanted to could have known he was there and crashed a plane or truck bombed the place

5) Immediately find out if he needed to authorize a civilian plane to be shot down or not

There's a number of things he should have done. He did nothing. Why?

BUSH KNEW




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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1669508 - 06/28/03 02:54 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

shakta said:
Yet another desperate grasp of Bush bashing liberals. Why does this even matter? I am done with this forum. To many irrational people in here grasping at straws.



You'll find that many here will blame Bush for everything from cavities in their teeth, the death of the dinosaurs, the civil war, and anything else they can think of. You'll soon realize that they wouldn't do the same if it was a Democrat doing the exact same things.

If you learn to laugh at them, it's not so bad.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1669704 - 06/28/03 05:09 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Disillusionment, when it hits, is going to hit you hard.


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1669795 - 06/28/03 06:08 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

You'll soon realize that they wouldn't do the same if it was a Democrat doing the exact same things.




Fuck all career polititcians.

If the idea that Bush knew about 9-11 is so ridiculous why didn't you even try to explain his inaction?

He did absolutely nothing and asked no questions when America was under attack. He didn't need to.




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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1669834 - 06/28/03 06:41 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

luvdemshrooms said:
Quote:

shakta said:
Yet another desperate grasp of Bush bashing liberals. Why does this even matter? I am done with this forum. To many irrational people in here grasping at straws. 



You'll find that many here will blame Bush for everything from cavities in their teeth, the death of the dinosaurs, the civil war, and anything else they can think of. You'll soon realize that they wouldn't do the same if it was a Democrat doing the exact same things.
 




That is actually untrue.  I trust no one in the white house.  Democrat or Republican.    :tongue:
 


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Anonymous

Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1669949 - 06/28/03 07:45 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I am definately not pro-Bush. I do see your claim as ridiculous though

Consider that Bush was a new president ( 1 year doesnt mean shit, he even took a month vacation for the hell of it ), and that he had no clue what to do. The secret service is commanded to protect him- and so they did. It was not his choice to be hidden the way he was, and its laughable to expect him to be in command of everything. He is most certainly not your king, in control of every aspect of his kingdom.

Interestingly enough, it WAS his choice to come OUT of the bunker. And he immediately went about trying to piece together his nation. Have you ever read any Greek literature? Try Creon by Sophocles for a start. Maybe it'll explain the concept of a nation and a leader more clearly



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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1670006 - 06/28/03 08:31 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

somebodyelse said:
Disillusionment, when it hits, is going to hit you hard.



I'm 46. I been disillusioned. Then I grew up.

Try it someday. You'll soon learn not everything is a plot. Not everyone is out to get you.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1670011 - 06/28/03 08:34 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah, he should have jumped up, shouted "Holy Shit the sky is falling", and launched a nuke at someone.

If he knew it was gonna happen, he or his advisors would have had him do something to make it appear he didn't.

You and I weren't there. We don't know what he was told. We don't know why he did what he did.

If you want to assume the worst.... go right ahead.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: MOTH]
    #1670014 - 06/28/03 08:36 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

That is actually untrue.



How is saying MANY here will blame Bush for everything untrue?

Perhaps you'll notice.... I didn't say ALL.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: ]
    #1670017 - 06/28/03 08:37 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Morrowind said:
I am definately not pro-Bush. I do see your claim as ridiculous though

Consider that Bush was a new president ( 1 year doesnt mean shit, he even took a month vacation for the hell of it ), and that he had no clue what to do. The secret service is commanded to protect him- and so they did. It was not his choice to be hidden the way he was, and its laughable to expect him to be in command of everything. He is most certainly not your king, in control of every aspect of his kingdom.

Interestingly enough, it WAS his choice to come OUT of the bunker. And he immediately went about trying to piece together his nation. Have you ever read any Greek literature? Try Creon by Sophocles for a start. Maybe it'll explain the concept of a nation and a leader more clearly





Save your breath. To so many sad individuals here, Bush is to blame for everything.

Always has been, always will be.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1670051 - 06/28/03 08:55 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:


I'm 46. I been disillusioned. Then I grew up.




Huh, so your ignorance is cultivated? How? Do you go to sleep with Limbaugh talking in your headphones?

Quote:


Try it someday. You'll soon learn not everything is a plot. Not everyone is out to get you.




Quite true. But equally true is the fact that *some* plot theories are true. Plots exist. Did you look at the cooperativeresearch page I cited, for example? Honestly, take 5 minutes and look at the timeline as quoted from mainstream sources, and then tell me that the Bush's ass still smells as good as you seem to think it does. Am I saying *he* knew? No, not necessarily. But the official story falls short of the mark, and this is an important enough issue that it shouldn't be let slide.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1670060 - 06/28/03 08:59 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I read it long before you posted it here.

It was assinine then, it is now.

And no, I don't listen to Rush. I did for awhile when he was first making it big, he soon grew annoying. While he's right far more often then he's wrong, his style doesn't work for me.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Anonymous

Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1670111 - 06/28/03 09:24 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

heh
neat how in this forum, everyone spits venom but tries to support it with something else.. Everyone

I wonder if this is off topic? What are the politics of attacking people instead of philosophy? Hm.. in early America, politicans often dueled and attacked their disagreeing peers. It seems that these "founding fathers" had quite a few things right. Today, politicians are basically sheep, but with different qualities of wool and occasionally varying colors.

But at the same time, violence follows more violence. Hmm.. it seems that violent politics move the system, but then.. it's impossible to achieve peace through politics..


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1670114 - 06/28/03 09:26 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Why is it asinine?

Look, when a CEO is promoted, we expect him to be able to run the company from day 1. If he starts making fuckups, or melts under stressful conditions, he is booted.

Bush is the self-styled CEO of USA-incorporated. He had a year in office, which he felt comfortable enough in that he took a month off, as you so rightly point out. Then, something hits that he is required to deal with, and what does he do? Melt. As the site so clearly points out.

Your argument that he was new to office is ridiculous. The preseident of the United States is supposed to be able to deal with whatever comes his way.


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1670115 - 06/28/03 09:27 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

But I do give you credit for denouncing Rush. What about Savage? Actually, you probably like him, given your phraseology.


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Anonymous

Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1670122 - 06/28/03 09:33 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Actually, I said that.

Have you ever even taken basic history? Studied any on your own? The president has never, ever been very active in his first year. In fact, CEOs and ANY experts in any field are given a good amount of time to get used to the job. Is there any place to train for being president? For CEO? A good CEO is given a shitload of time to get his stuff together.

Why, exactly, do you think that there are many, many rich CEOs who are pathetically inept? It's a society of friends, not something based on actual skill


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: ]
    #1670267 - 06/28/03 10:53 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

No need to be patronizing.

Bush is a former governor, a former CEO, he has a cabinet of experienced advisors, his father was president, he received some of the best preparatory education possible....so, yeah, I still think his crisis management skills should have been better than those which he exhibited. He had a shitload of time, he had all the advice he needed...the president's job is not supposed to include a 25% training period, he's supposed to *lead*.




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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1670278 - 06/28/03 10:59 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

but of course, if they already knew that all of this was going to happen, then he would have no need to jump up and run off in a panic


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Strumpling]
    #1670285 - 06/28/03 11:03 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

He didn't. He sat there for 15 minutes talking about a goat after he'd been informed. He should have been getting his aircraft off the ground to intercept the planes that were known to be hijacked but were still in the air. Read the timeline link that I posted....you'll see what I mean.


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Anonymous

Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1670298 - 06/28/03 11:13 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

No need to be patronizing.



Well, I'm sorry. Im fairly insane.
Again, I apologize
it's really not nice of me to act that way..


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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: ]
    #1671421 - 06/29/03 02:26 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I just figured out this whole concept some of you are pushing. You actually think he knew about 9/11 before it happened. You are worse off then I thought. That is the most ridiculous crap I have ever heard.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1671424 - 06/29/03 02:27 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I don't necessarily think he knew, but it's certainly within the realm of possibility.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: silversoul7]
    #1671519 - 06/29/03 03:16 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Monkeys might fly out off my ass too, and giant see monsters might attack New York. I think these two things are more likely.


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1671524 - 06/29/03 03:17 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Yeah, he should have jumped up, shouted "Holy Shit the sky is falling", and launched a nuke at someone.




No, he should have asked questions. When America was under attack he sat in a classroom reading a book to kids.


Quote:

If he knew it was gonna happen, he or his advisors would have had him do something to make it appear he
didn't.




Yeah exactly. They booked an appearance at a Elementary school.


Just answer my questions. Why did he not:

FIND OUT WHAT WAS HAPPENING(whatever Card whispered in his ear couldn't have covered it all)?

Find out if he(the only person who as the authorization to) needed to shoot down a civilian airliner headed for The Pentagon or Pennsylvania?

Why didn't the secret service whisk him away?

Just answer the questions




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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1671530 - 06/29/03 03:21 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I already have, and you ignored the answers.


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1671540 - 06/29/03 03:27 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

What? No you didn't. You wrote this and then changed the subject to the 2000 election:

Quote:

Alright. I think they were perfectly safe there. The Secret Service does a pretty good job
of protecting the President. Maybe they knew something some guy writing a story on the
internet didn't. Maybe not. The point is hindsight is 20/20. Was it a mistake? I have no
idea. Obviuosly nothing happened. It makes it sound like he was some evil lazy fucker that
just sat there as we got attacked. What was he expected to do? Run down the street
screaming. They were probably waiting to get a little more info, and enact a plan to get
him out of there. Which they did shortly thereafter.








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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1671557 - 06/29/03 03:41 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

That was my answer. I trust the secret service knew what they were doing. You apparently expected him to go into a panic. No one knew what was going on for sure at the time. It was chaos. They formed their plan for removing the president and did it. Judging from the cartoons in your sig, nothing anyone says will matter anyway. You, my friend, are on the edge of reality. You are an extremist, no better than the far right Christians that I am sure you so despise. Try a little balance in your political thought. It will open your mind to all kinds of ideas you would have never considered before.

As far as shooting down planes go, we did not know how many planes were off course at the time, so shooting them down was not an option. I guess they could have just shot everything in the sky down. Would that have been safe enough for you?


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1671619 - 06/29/03 04:15 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Card: Mr. President, the second tower has been hit. America is under attack.
Bush: Oh, ok.
Bush: So kids, where were we? Oh yeah, Billy the Goat was looking for a cool place to sleep.......

You find that acceptable?

I don't think he should have shot down every plane like you said, but fighter jets should have been up the ass of both planes that had veered off course and shut off their communication.




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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1671626 - 06/29/03 04:17 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Dude, the fighter jets sat on the ground for over half an hour doing nothing, after Bush knew. Before that they were on the ground for about half an hour after NORAD knew. Why were they not scrambled? Why were the people who supposedly are in charge of our country so complacent - or alternatively so scared - that they didn't think about going into "battle mode"? Why wasn't Bush whisked to an "operations room"? Where was Cheney? Presumably he knew what was going on too? Read the timelines, if you haven 't, and then come back to me on the NORAD question.


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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1671643 - 06/29/03 04:32 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I am sick of this argument. You win. Our President is in with Ossama, and they are going to divide up the land and oil after this is all over.


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1671655 - 06/29/03 04:40 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Nobody is saying that. Just look at the evidence and then tell us that everything took place appropriately, given the emergency situation.





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OfflineDava
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1671663 - 06/29/03 04:49 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:


I am sick of this argument. You win. Our President is in with Ossama, and they are going to divide up the land and oil after this is all over.




Carlyle Group?



--------------------
"These psychedelic substances cause hysterical psychoses in people who have not taken them..."
- Timothy Leary


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Invisible1stimer
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1671680 - 06/29/03 04:58 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

I'm 46. I been disillusioned. Then I grew up.


wow, you're so old and wise.


--------------------
ash dingy donker mo gollyhopper patty popiton rockstop bueno mayo riggedy jig bobber johnathan pattywhacker gogboob t-shirt monkey.

There is such emotion in the distortion.


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1671704 - 06/29/03 05:11 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

The hope has turned to pity.....you are getting desperate.


--------------------

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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: 1stimer]
    #1671755 - 06/29/03 05:38 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

1stimer said:
Quote:

I'm 46. I been disillusioned. Then I grew up.


wow, you're so old and wise.



Thank you.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1672048 - 06/29/03 08:50 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:



The hope has turned to pity.....you are getting desperate.






And you're avoiding the issue. The gulf of tonkin was as the media presented it at the time, right? Roosevelt didn't know an attack was coming on Pearl Harbor, right?

These people are playing geopolitics - they may still have good aims. But why is it inconveivable to you that you might be being lied to?

Address the issue here - there's a set of inconsistencies which have led many reasonable people to question the official story. If you believe the official story, then please address these inconsistencies so that we can all have more peaceful minds. But don't say that questioning the inconsistencies is desperate, or wrong. The people are supposed to watch the government - questioning *is* patriotism. Patriotism is *not* marching in lockstep with the official story - that's called *nationalism*.



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OfflinePHARMAKOS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1672243 - 06/29/03 10:21 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

all that i know about this whole situation i learned from this thread... that said heres my take on it. i dont have any oppinion about weather or not bush is evil, knew about 911 ahead of time or is goin to split up the land with osama bin laden (or if i do, thats not the point of my reply)
what i do know is
1. it is really, really fucked up that our president would show no response to news that is essentially the biggest event to happen in america in living memory. it is really fucked up that that guy only took 3 seconds to whisper in his ear. what can you say in 3 seconds? 'george, towers fell' maybe, or 'hundreds dead' perhaps. if he did say something to this effect our nations leader should have done something. how does he go from ignoring the thing while it happens to making it his biggest priority after the fact? when you think about this it just doesnt make sense. I know i said that i had no oppinion on this but ive changed my own mind. What the real explanation is i dont know, but it really makes more sense to me that bush did know about this ahead of time, because he did nothing to take out the other airplanes (which could have avoided much of the death) and then afterwards he uses the fear and anger caused by this event to launch military campaigns first in afghanistan then in iraq, always using buzzwords about terrorism, ossama and weapons of mass destruction, axis of evil, etc, to justify his actions in foreign countries... whatever, theres smarter people on this thread than me who can say it better... but it just doesnt add up, or if it does its in extremely scary ways.

My OTHER point is that shakta, much as i respect your political beliefs, trust in george etc, you really ahve been more or less ignoring most of the questions posed to you/ arguments given to you.. your responses are often short and angry and dont adress the issues raised. You havent really commented on the topic of this thread at all except when you say 'this is bullshit' or 'your worse of than i thought'.. it just doesnt support your position when you make short sighted comments that attack others and there oppinions without backing it up at all. ive been reading your dialogue back and forth with the other sides and they say over and over again 'address this issue, what about this?' and you say 'im sick of this, this thread is dumb, this is bullshit' and then once 'i like bush, hes doing great, i hope he gets reelected" fuck man


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: PHARMAKOS]
    #1673331 - 06/30/03 07:53 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

You aint seen nothin' yet.

Check out THIS SITE



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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1673343 - 06/30/03 08:04 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

And you're avoiding the issue. The gulf of tonkin was as the media presented it at the time, right? Roosevelt didn't know an attack was coming on Pearl Harbor, right?




I'll make you a deal, stay on topic and i'll respond in kind.

Quote:

These people are playing geopolitics - they may still have good aims. But why is it inconveivable to you that you might be being lied to?




why is it inconceivable to you that you might be being told the truth?

Quote:

Address the issue here




I have, and i'm beginning to pity your ilk.

Quote:

there's a set of inconsistencies which have led many reasonable people to question the official story.




keep telling youself that, it'll make you feel better.

Quote:

But don't say that questioning the inconsistencies is desperate, or wrong.




I'll say what i want. For further clearification i'm accusing your ilk of being pityful. Your inconsistancies are nothing more than desperate people grasping at straws. Just aboot everything i have seen would barely amount to circumstantial evidence if even that. It's pathetic really and quite sad.

Quote:

The people are supposed to watch the government - questioning *is* patriotism. Patriotism is *not* marching in lockstep with the official story - that's called *nationalism*.




Why are you babbling this to me? I know this, what i'm saying is that you people are just grasping at straws. I have no problem with people questioning the government, in fact i'm a proponant of it, but please, this is just desperation. You probably think that Bush stole the election with help from the Aliens.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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OfflineJameZTheNewbie
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: PHARMAKOS]
    #1673349 - 06/30/03 08:07 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

i dont think that it proves anything but it should be explained by bush.but we cant ask him.


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Mice have feelings


Edited by JameZTheNewbie (06/30/03 08:08 AM)


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1673354 - 06/30/03 08:12 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

You probably think that Bush stole the election with help from the Aliens. 



Well.... he did kill off the dinosaurs, assasinate Lincoln and start the slave trade.

:smirk:


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1673365 - 06/30/03 08:20 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

i heard he had 5 slaves locked in the Lincoln bedroom. :grin:


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1673367 - 06/30/03 08:21 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Innvertigo said:
i heard he had 5 slaves locked in the Lincoln bedroom. :grin: 



That Bastard!

I bet he killed Kenny also!


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1673377 - 06/30/03 08:27 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Don't listen to them. Innvertigo and LTS lost all credibility when they said that the drug war should be ended.

What would Bush think if he heard them say some radical shit like that?





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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1673381 - 06/30/03 08:29 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

What would Bush think if he heard them say some radical shit like that?



Probably nothing.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1673391 - 06/30/03 08:35 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

You've got me there. Bush probably doesn't think anything. I meant would would he "say".






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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1673396 - 06/30/03 08:39 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Same answer.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1673401 - 06/30/03 08:41 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Leary, do you need a hug?  You're a little more stressed out than usual. :rolleyes:


--------------------

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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1673426 - 06/30/03 09:06 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Bush Knew

That's why i'm stressed.





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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1673432 - 06/30/03 09:09 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

there there lil feller, the black helicoptors are gone...go aboot being happy with life. :rolleyes:


--------------------

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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1673467 - 06/30/03 09:34 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Wait... you dropped your foil hat!


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1673476 - 06/30/03 09:43 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

It is painfully obvious that this was not an unexpected tragedy perpetrated by a crazed "freedom-hater". It is painfully obvious that the events of 9/11 became the excuse for not one, but two unjustifyable wars.

We're told just the oppposite, and it is not true. That's all you need to know.

Painfully obvious.


--------------------


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Ped]
    #1673484 - 06/30/03 09:55 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Actually the secret he's keeping that interests me the most is.....




















































How does he get his whites so white?

Is it clorox II or does he have another secret detergent?


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1673492 - 06/30/03 10:02 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

dont u think its a lil suspicous though. since 9-11 the country is starting to elimante basic freedoms and use terroism as a excuse.we are scared into submission with this bullshit. even if he wasnt responceable he sure is taken advantage and using it to limit freedoms. that includes drugs.u dont need a foil hat to see that 9-11 equals different world and fucked up bullshit.


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1673500 - 06/30/03 10:09 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

How does he get his whites so white?




ancient chinese secret....you have to beat the people who clean your clothes.


--------------------

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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: JameZTheNewbie]
    #1673506 - 06/30/03 10:11 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

JameZTheNewbie said:
dont u think its a lil suspicous though.



No. Since we (and the writers) have no idea what was said to whom, and when it was said, and what was happening behind the scenes, I find the whole "Bush knew in advance" laughable and sad, and it fills me with both contempt and pity for those who swallow it.


Quote:

since 9-11 the country is starting to elimante basic freedoms and use terroism as a excuse.



It is a sad after-effect.


Quote:

we are scared into submission with this bullshit.



Enough of us aren't to make a difference. And I don't think most of the "Patriot" act will survive.


Quote:

even if he wasnt responceable he sure is taken advantage and using it to limit freedoms.



Here's a novel thought. Perhaps (wrongly) he feels he's doing what is best. HAving never spoken to him I don't know this to be the case, but neither am I willing to assume it's for nefarious purposes.


Quote:

that includes drugs.



Did I miss changes in the drug laws?


Quote:

u dont need a foil hat to see that 9-11 equals different world and fucked up bullshit.



How could it not mean changes?


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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OfflineJameZTheNewbie
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1673517 - 06/30/03 10:22 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

the rave act is one drug law change also the thing with them saying drugs support terrorist while they were dealing with the northern alliance who are opium growers. also the attack on head shops. thats all i can think of off the top of my head


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: JameZTheNewbie]
    #1673525 - 06/30/03 10:28 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I "guess" you could consider the rave act an attack on drugs. Personally I think it's just a bunch of uptight assholes that hate to see people have a good time. Although I personally don't see raves as a good time.

The head shop thing was just existing law being enforced. (wrongly)


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1673543 - 06/30/03 10:39 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

I "guess" you could consider the rave act an attack on drugs. Personally I think it's just a bunch of uptight assholes that hate to see people have a good time.




we call them "Fun Governors" in these parts


--------------------

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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1673552 - 06/30/03 10:44 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

The WOD sucks, but it is something that most of the country supports. Remember one thing though guys, the Dems and Reps passed the Patriot act. I think of it as a necessary evil. Hopefully someday soon, it won't be necessary anymore.


Edited by shakta (06/30/03 11:07 AM)


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1673578 - 06/30/03 11:00 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

the Dems and Reps passed the Patriot act.



Heresy!

It was all the fault of Bush and the evil Reublicans! They FORCED the Democrats to vote for it!

:lol:


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1673646 - 06/30/03 11:38 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Remember one thing though guys, the Dems and Reps passed the Patriot act. I think of it as a necessary evil. Hopefully someday soon, it won't be necessary anymore.


How many of them actually got to read what the PATRIOT Act contained before it was passed?...NONE. It was forced through because of the hype and panic created from 9-11. I suspect there is alot of politicians on both sides of the political spectrum that are regretting ever supporting it.

P.S.... BUSH KNEW.


--------------------
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Rono]
    #1673760 - 06/30/03 12:43 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

BUSH KNEW.




with help from the aliens.


--------------------

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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1673770 - 06/30/03 12:55 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

I just figured out this whole concept some of you are pushing. You actually think he knew about 9/11 before it happened. You are worse off then I thought. That is the most ridiculous crap I have ever heard.


One thing that is not in dispute is that he was warned of terror attacks to include someone flying a plane into the World Trade Center. Unfortunately, we don't know the details of what he did about it because Bush has made the investigation secret for "national security purposes"

There are many credible sources that confirm this; here's a good starting point,

http://www.buzzflash.com/perspectives/911bush.html

or just do a search for "Bush knew", and choose the links of sources that you trust (NBC, and CBS even have printed stories confirming this)

Here's another good link from MSNBC::

http://stacks.msnbc.com/news/907379.asp#BODY


--------------------
:smile:  Just stating my thoughts, not trying to offend  :smile:


Edited by GoBlue! (06/30/03 01:09 PM)


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1674039 - 06/30/03 03:20 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:


Quote:
***And you're avoiding the issue. The gulf of tonkin was as the media presented it at the time, right? Roosevelt didn't know an attack was coming on Pearl Harbor, right?

I'll make you a deal, stay on topic and i'll respond in kind.





That's called "baiting and switching". You *know* this is on topic. Come up with evidence for your position or admit by default that you're just as hypnotized as LDS.


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1674068 - 06/30/03 03:30 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

That's called "baiting and switching". You *know* this is on topic.




sigh, no it's not it's called trying to incorporate something that has nothing to do with the discussion. Or in its shorter version: Bullshit.

Quote:

Come up with evidence for your position or admit by default that you're just as hypnotized as LDS.




Evidence? That's like the pot calling the kettle black. Don't be a numbnut, nothing that you've posted would even be considered as evidence. Face it, you hate Bush. Admit it. This is the only reason why you "FEEL" that there is even an iota of evidence.

You sure like to tell people how they must feel, unfortunatly i don't respect you enough to take it into consideration.


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1674097 - 06/30/03 03:45 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I'll tell you why it is on topic then, shall I? Two clear historical examples of presidents misleading their public to lead them into war. Therefore, entirely conceivable that Bush did the same. Thus your protestations of "how could you think such a thing" or "that's such a radical thought.....mommmmmy" betray nothing but historical ignorance on your part.

There is exceptionally good evidence that there was either a breakdown in the chain of command, or a good measure of corruption. Take just the NORAD issue (look it up on cooperative research.)


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1674121 - 06/30/03 04:00 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

I'll tell you why it is on topic then, shall I? Two clear historical examples of presidents misleading their public to lead them into war. Therefore, entirely conceivable that Bush did the same.




Noone's debating if it's conceivable. One has NOTHING to do with the other. You're not familiar with evidence are you? With your logic i can link you with any crime imaginable because you hold the same traits as that person doing the crime. You wouldn't last 2 seconds in a court room.

Quote:

Thus your protestations of "how could you think such a thing" or "that's such a radical thought.....mommmmmy"




noone said those things, now you're just being a knob. see above

Quote:

betray nothing but historical ignorance on your part.




Historical ignorance is that you assume that everything you hear is fact. It's pretty comical that even if your accusation of a past president is correct (which can be debated until the cows come home) you assume it is correct for all those after him. Come back to reality lil feller.

Quote:

There is exceptionally good evidence that there was either a breakdown in the chain of command, or a good measure of corruption.




If it was exceptionally good evidence you'd know if it was a breakdown in the chain of command (which would mean that Bush is innocent) or a good measure of corruption. You are soooo lucky you're not a lawyer, you'd get torn apart.

You have no idea what bush was told and you know it. This basically means you don't know shit, pure and simple


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1674258 - 06/30/03 04:49 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Did I say it was conceivable *therefore* it happened? No, so stop projecting . My point is/was with the historical examples that you guys attempted a diversion of topic by the use of tin foil hat etc jokes; thus my rejoinder was intended to show that we're talking about things well within the realms of possibility as evidenced by past reality -- and thus get with the discussion instead of criticizing the discussion itself.

I'm not arguing the case for Bush knowing in the last few posts - I'm arguing the case for you to stop using meta-diversionary tactics and stick to the point at hand. As I've said previously, offer me evidence instead of reactionary rhetoric, and I'll be more than pleased to listen.

Let's break this down into simple statements that you can either attack with evidence or concede:

1) What was supposed to take place in an emergency situation did not happen for an inexplicably long period of time. This inexplicably long period of time allowed the second plane to hit, the pentagon to be hit, and the pennsylvania plane to continue to wherever it was going before it , um, crashed. NORADs response was delayed beyond reason. Why?

Again, for the 15th time, please read the cooperativeresearch timeline before responding, as posted several times on this thread.


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1674401 - 06/30/03 05:56 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Did I say it was conceivable *therefore* it happened? No, so stop projecting




you're making some awfully strong claims for someone who has no idea what proof is. You're back-tracking which is of no surprise.

Quote:

My point is/was with the historical examples that you guys attempted a diversion of topic by the use of tin foil hat etc jokes; thus my rejoinder was intended to show that we're talking about things well within the realms of possibility as evidenced by past reality -- and thus get with the discussion instead of criticizing the discussion itself.




I'm sorry if you think i was criticizing the discussion because in fact I was criticising your ilk and NOT the discussion. The discussion is actually pretty interesing (though lacking in absolutly anything that could be construde as proof.). Sorry for the confusion.

Quote:

I'm not arguing the case for Bush knowing in the last few posts -




How about the ones before that?

Quote:

I'm arguing the case for you to stop using meta-diversionary tactics and stick to the point at hand




There you go again. The only person trying to divert is yourself. There isn't a comment that i made that incorporates any sort of diversionary tactic. I've said it from the beginning that you have absolutly no proof as to what was told to Bush at the time of the attck. You seem to think that you have first-hand knowledge of what when on. Ofcourse you don't. It is up to you (the accuser) to find evidence to the contrary, and to this date you have not. I would even accept it if you said "Hey I hate Bush, therefore he did it". Atleast you'd be honest.

Quote:

As I've said previously, offer me evidence instead of reactionary rhetoric, and I'll be more than pleased to listen.





Evidence of what? That Bush is innocent?

Quote:

Let's break this down into simple statements that you can either attack with evidence or concede:




son, you have neither the brain power nor the knowledge to make me concede.

Quote:

1) What was supposed to take place in an emergency situation did not happen for an inexplicably long period of time.




How do you know this? What was Bush told? Did you just want him to freak out like some spaz in front of a classroom full of children? My God have you ever been in charge of anything?


BTW I read the Timeline and think you're still full of shit. The burden of proof is on you. Thsi was the first time we were ever attacked in this fashion abd using hind sight logic to explain wrong doing is quite laughable.


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1674425 - 06/30/03 06:09 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Your argument is essentially "aw, the poor president was confused and didn't know what to do?" In other words, you place your marker on the "incompetence" answer.

Well, the incompetence in this case caused the deaths of 1500+ people. Don't you think that is more powerful grounds for impeachment than a blow job?

I agree with you that we can't know what Bush was told. However on his own account Card told him of the attacks. Also, he initially claimed that he saw the attacks on a TV outside of the classroom. And, in any case, whatever. What is the NSC for, and the position of the vice president for, if not to take action when the president is busy with matters of state? (Although reading about goats at a press conference doesn't seem particularly pressing matters of state.)


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1674468 - 06/30/03 06:27 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Your argument is essentially "aw, the poor president was confused and didn't know what to do?"




I guess i'm not making this abundantly clear to you so i'll be blunt:

My argument is/was that you have no idea what the fuck was told to Bush and your whole premise is based on sub-circumstantial evidence.

Quote:

In other words, you place your marker on the "incompetence" answer.




I asked for proof, you had none. It's really quite simple if you THINK about it.

Quote:

Well, the incompetence in this case caused the deaths of 1500+ people. Don't you think that is more powerful grounds for impeachment than a blow job?




This is the exact diversionary "rhetoric" i was discussing before, you are the epitomy of it. Either way you have no clue.

As for Klinton i couldn't care less if you blew him in office or Monica for that matter. Evidence is just that evidence and you have none. We did however have evidence that Klinton lied under oath (since you asked about Klinton)

Quote:

I agree with you that we can't know what Bush was told.




Great, then your whole argument is BS. Yopu based all your accusation on his reaction and now you're backing down. Why?

Quote:

However on his own account Card told him of the attacks. Also, he initially claimed that he saw the attacks on a TV outside of the classroom.




So what? I watched it on the TV at my work. Just about every TV in the land had it on. I'm sure the school had it on too.

Quote:

What is the NSC for, and the position of the vice president for, if not to take action when the president is busy with matters of state? (Although reading about goats at a press conference doesn't seem particularly pressing matters of state.)




It will never be argued that something should of been done but hind-sight is always 20/20. If the screeners at the airport would of done their job we wouldn't be having this discussion now would we? Where is your outrage for them. Can it NOT be argued that if anyone is at fault it is the security at the airport? I'm not blaming anyone in particular because i don't know all the ins and outs of what went on (just as you don't) but to say that this was done with the prior knowledge, to me atleast, is utter BS with no proof whatsoever.


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InvisibleshroomQT
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1674530 - 06/30/03 06:47 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

why isn't anyone being fired or
reprimanded as a result of the
single largest failure in national
(air) security since the begining
of time?

the investigations into the 'whys'
of september 11th were blocked by
the president.

any way you cut it, the whole deal
stinks to me.


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Offlinesomebodyelse
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1674585 - 06/30/03 07:05 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Is a lobotomy necessary to understand your reasoning?

Quote:


My argument is/was that you have no idea what the fuck was told to Bush and your whole premise is based on sub-circumstantial evidence.





a) Bush told us what Card said, i.e. that Card notified him of the initial attacks.
b) Bush told us that he knew before he went into the classroom. (Which seems like a lie based on circumstantial evidence - see the timeline.)
c) Bush read about a goat for 15 minutes following Card's whisper.
d) NORAD, which hadn't responded, still didn't respond for an painfully long period of time which allowed the remaining three planes to complete their trajectories.

Yes, this is not hard damning evidence that Bush allowed this to happen. But, this *is* hard damning evidence of something stinking - either the administration and chain of command are incompetent, or they were complacent beyond reasonable belief. Either demands further investigation, and explanation.

Quote:


Great, then your whole argument is BS. Yopu based all your accusation on his reaction and now you're backing down. Why?





I base none of my accusations solely on his response. I base them on the inaction of him *and* his administration. What Card whispered to Bush (perhaps it was about how nice the weather was outside? What do you think?) is pretty much irrelevant, because it is clear that Bush and his aides had time to prevent the remaining three planes from impacting, but didn't.

Let me ask you this as a supplementary question, which might make our relative positions clearer in this argument: do you support the stated goals and objections of PNAC?


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1674611 - 06/30/03 07:10 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

You're wasting your time trying to convince Inny...Anyone that questions the almighty Bush is just a "conspiracy nut" or "Bush hater".


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


Edited by Rono (06/30/03 07:11 PM)


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Anonymous

Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Rono]
    #1674660 - 06/30/03 07:27 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

hm..
a mighty bush doesn't sound THAT bad, does it?


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OfflineRonoS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: ]
    #1674666 - 06/30/03 07:29 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

No Bush sounds even better...


--------------------
"Life has never been weird enough for my liking"


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Anonymous

Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Rono]
    #1674688 - 06/30/03 07:38 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

actually, ive never had a shaved one
hmm
ill look into that


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Offlineerjone
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1674910 - 06/30/03 09:13 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Learyfan said:
Click here.

Quote:

Not only did the leader of the free world sit as his country was attacked, the Secret Service also
did nothing. Bush was appearing in public at a previously announced photo-op. He was a sitting
duck. The attacks were ongoing at that point (planes had yet to hit the Pentagon or the field in
Pennsylvania), and nobody knew how much more destruction was going to happen. Were there
two, three, four, eight more planes hijacked and on their way to crash into prominent buildings?
Was one headed for the school, where anyone who checked the President's public itinerary would
know he was located? Were other terrorists planning to detonate dirty nukes? Were they going to
release anthrax or smallpox or sarin? Was an assassination squad going to burst into the school and
get Bush? Was a suicide bomber going to ram a truck full of explosives into that classroom?

During the midst of the attacks, any of these things could've happened. Yet there sits Bush,
seemingly unconcerned. His Chief of Staff likewise doesn't think that America in flames warrants
the President's immediate attention. And the Secret Service utterly fails to do its job by grabbing the
President of the United States and getting him to safety. It's truly inexplicable.







Isn't it obvious to you that Bush did nothing because he knew exactly what was going to happen that day?

I'd like to hear the pro-Bush people defend these non-actions.





before that day, it was inconcievable of a attack like that happening on our soil. I am not a bush supporter as i think he is a horrible president, but im sure when news of the crashes got to him, he and all around him thought that the attacks on the towers were all that could happen.


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: erjone]
    #1675081 - 06/30/03 10:20 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Here's some evidence of prior knowledge.

Washington Post
Quote:

"Federal authorities have been aware for years that suspected terrorists with ties to Osama bin Laden were receiving flight training at schools in the United States and abroad, according to interviews and court testimony."







and CLICK HERE for the Prior Knowledge Archive




--------------------
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Invisiblechodamunky
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1675624 - 07/01/03 01:24 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Learyfan, just so you know, you are definately not alone in claiming Bush knew. Your job here is well done, even if people outright reject this idea, you have planted the seed and just maybe some day it will spurt with some clear headed, propaganda free thinking.


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Anonymous

Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1676012 - 07/01/03 04:40 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I didn't bother to read past this:

Quote:

I have to admit something here. When Bush was elected I was pissed. I was buying all the 'he stole the election' bullshit, and after a week or so I didn't care anymore. Then 9/11 happened. I felt like my world had been shattered. The effect that event had on me changed my life. I sat by the TV for a couple weeks, watching what was happening in the world. The President gave that speach to the nation in Congress a day or two after it happened. It helped me. It gave me hope, and it showed me that we had a very strong, dedicated President that was determined to try to stop this from happening again. So far he has been successful.




That is one of the saddest things I have ever read....

The brainwashing machine is in full effect....


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Offlinepattern
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1676094 - 07/01/03 05:39 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Assuming Bush is not in on it, here is my attempt at a rational explanation of why Bush didnt do anything for 5 minutes:

-He didnt know what to do. For five minutes.



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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1676197 - 07/01/03 06:59 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Yes, this is not hard damning evidence that Bush allowed this to happen. But, this *is* hard damning evidence of something stinking




it's like a broken record, you have no idea what he said to bush. You apparantly don't know what "evidence" is. Something's only stinking if you see it that way. I don't believe for one sec that he new that the attacks were going to happen, it just doesn't make sense logically. You're basing everything you find on hind sight logic ie: "since americans are up in arms at the radical muslims (due to 9-11) it is apparant that bush planned it that way".

Quote:

I base none of my accusations solely on his response. I base them on the inaction of him *and* his administration.




another accusation from the instant fratification generation. The United States gets threatened just about everyday from terrorists and to say that this was any different is laughable. We can all agree that if all the security (including the screeners (which none of you have breought up) did their job this would of never happened or greatly reduced.

Quote:

What Card whispered to Bush (perhaps it was about how nice the weather was outside? What do you think?)




I would have to say that i don't know, just as you don't.

Quote:

is pretty much irrelevant, because it is clear that Bush and his aides had time to prevent the remaining three planes from impacting, but didn't.




i don't even think they could of stopped them if they had double the time. This isn't a video game.

Quote:

Let me ask you this as a supplementary question, which might make our relative positions clearer in this argument: do you support the stated goals and objections of PNAC?




This is exactly what i'm talking about. This is the Third time during our portion of this debate that you tried to misdirect the conversation. It's pathetic.


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1676205 - 07/01/03 07:05 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

"Federal authorities have been aware for years that suspected terrorists with ties to Osama bin Laden were receiving flight training at schools in the United States and abroad, according to interviews and court testimony."




you people should learn what evidence is. The US gets these sort of threats everyday....


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: ]
    #1676634 - 07/01/03 12:38 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Fiend said:
I didn't bother to read past this:

Quote:

I have to admit something here. When Bush was elected I was pissed. I was buying all the 'he stole the election' bullshit, and after a week or so I didn't care anymore. Then 9/11 happened. I felt like my world had been shattered. The effect that event had on me changed my life. I sat by the TV for a couple weeks, watching what was happening in the world. The President gave that speach to the nation in Congress a day or two after it happened. It helped me. It gave me hope, and it showed me that we had a very strong, dedicated President that was determined to try to stop this from happening again. So far he has been successful.




That is one of the saddest things I have ever read....

The brainwashing machine is in full effect....




Just because I am not an anarchist conspiracy theorist does not mean I am brain washed. I am so sorry that I like the job our president has done, and am not as cool as you. Besides, what from that indicates brainwashing? There has not been another attack has there? I was relaying my feelings at the time. Why don't you try contributing something to the discussion instead of just spewing crap that does not make any sense, so you can look cool.


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Anonymous

Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: shakta]
    #1676864 - 07/01/03 02:09 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

I have to admit something here. When Bush was elected I was pissed. I was buying all the 'he stole the election' bullshit, and after a week or so I didn't care anymore. Then 9/11 happened. I felt like my world had been shattered. The effect that event had on me changed my life. I sat by the TV for a couple weeks, watching what was happening in the world. The President gave that speach to the nation in Congress a day or two after it happened. It helped me. It gave me hope, and it showed me that we had a very strong, dedicated President that was determined to try to stop this from happening again. So far he has been successful.




You are correct that not being an anarchist conspiracy theorist does not = being brainwashed. Of course, that wasn't why I was calling you brainwashed. You made that post, not me, and it's pretty clear which one of is asleep here.


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1677090 - 07/01/03 03:42 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Yeah, I know, Bush is our brave saviour and can do no wrong. Watch the little birdies, children.

Where do you get your news? Do you know about the energy wars going on? Do you know about PNAC's agenda? (Both of which items are in the undisputed public domain).

If so, why do you persist in pulling the wool over your own eyes? Your pops must have done a hatchet job on you if your trust in authority is anything to go by.


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Offlineerjone
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1677585 - 07/01/03 07:51 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

again let me clarify i am anything but a bush fan.........now with that out of the way.........


let me ask all you who think "something stinks". On that morning, After the two towers were hit, did you honestly EXPECT two more planes to go down? It was such a shock that no one believed it could happen. As a matter of fact, the entire city of new york must be in on it.  they were all standing just staring with no emotion.....most of them anyway. DAMN CONSPIRATORS!!!!!!!!! :rolleyes:

To make a perfectly good guess, you would think that yes there may be more, but it was the signifigance of the first two targets that makes the impact on the mind when thinking about the state of the countries safety.
As i said in my last post, b4 that date, flying jets into buildings was inconceivable........now they did it in to two targets that they have been eyeing for YEARS...........Honestly tell me that after that, you knew that there would be more attacks, and if so, what did you do? Did you run and hide due to your  knowing  there would be more?


Edited by erjone (07/01/03 07:54 PM)


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Offlinehongomon
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: erjone]
    #1677770 - 07/01/03 09:08 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Funny you should ask, because just after the first one hit I got a call from some guy who asked, "Do you think there will be more?"

I said, "What, more than ONE plane, in the same DAY? Do you realize the odds??"

Now, if he had called someone in the FAA, someone who had been watching errant blips on his radar--one, then two, three, and finally four (can you imagine?)--he may have gotten a different--and more qualified--response.

The guy was an idiot for calling me.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: hongomon]
    #1677826 - 07/01/03 09:39 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I'm not sure if any 1 radar screen would have had all 4 blips due to the range.

Any radar experts here?


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1677924 - 07/01/03 10:12 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Your point being?


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: hongomon]
    #1677929 - 07/01/03 10:14 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

It was a question in response to this....

"someone who had been watching errant blips on his radar--one, then two, three, and finally four "

I was simply wondering if indeed one person could have seen all four blips.

I don't know, so I asked.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1677969 - 07/01/03 10:29 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Alright, I'll tell you. The FAA has a super-radar of United States airspace. It's actual size, 1:1 ratio.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: hongomon]
    #1677980 - 07/01/03 10:34 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

That would be a rather large screen don't you think?

Unless I'm not following the 1:1 ratio statement?

So one guy would see every blip for every plane in US airspace?


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1678042 - 07/01/03 10:52 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

don't worry, it was a dumb joke. It was a rip-off of Kevin Wright's joke about having an actual size map of the U.S.

We need a crashing plane smiley.


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: hongomon]
    #1678062 - 07/01/03 10:57 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

See the first line in my previous post.

It's good to see a little jocularity.

(I'd rather have a puking smiley)


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1678078 - 07/01/03 11:03 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Actually, I made one
but apparently it really sucks



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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: ]
    #1678100 - 07/01/03 11:09 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

There were other things on my mind.

All hail shaved bush.


--------------------
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: hongomon]
    #1678175 - 07/01/03 11:41 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

hongomon writes:

It was a rip-off of Kevin Wright's joke about having an actual size map of the U.S.

Stephen Wright. My favorite standup comedian of all time.

pinky


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1678786 - 07/02/03 03:12 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

I'm not sure if any 1 radar screen would have had all 4 blips due to the range.

Not air traffic control radar which is good for a few hundred miles though the controllers are generally focused in a much tighter diameter. However, the minute ANY plane flies outside of its flight path, it is contacted by an air traffic controller and notified of it's digression. If the plane does NOT correct it's course nor respond, IMMEDIATE action (fighter jets being scrambled) is supposed to take place.

The WTC planes were off course for quite a long time and STILL no action was taken.



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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1679204 - 07/02/03 06:04 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

What was he supposed to do? He's just the president.

He's not a strategist. Anybody who had the ability to do anything about it probably had the authority to do it. Either there already was a plan to handle the situation, or there wasn't. It was no time to be coming up with one.

During that 5 minutes I imagine the Secret service was doing their job, forming an exit strategy for the president to get him somewhere safe, and hopefully protecting the school which may have also been a target.

You've had almost two years to think of something he could have done, what have you come up with?


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1679345 - 07/02/03 07:49 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Bush knew





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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Learyfan]
    #1679360 - 07/02/03 08:04 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Tornado machines.


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Offlineerjone
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1679603 - 07/02/03 10:03 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

so did all of new york.......they ALL knew and helped too!


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Offlineshakta
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: ]
    #1679804 - 07/02/03 10:57 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

Fiend said:
Quote:

I have to admit something here. When Bush was elected I was pissed. I was buying all the 'he stole the election' bullshit, and after a week or so I didn't care anymore. Then 9/11 happened. I felt like my world had been shattered. The effect that event had on me changed my life. I sat by the TV for a couple weeks, watching what was happening in the world. The President gave that speach to the nation in Congress a day or two after it happened. It helped me. It gave me hope, and it showed me that we had a very strong, dedicated President that was determined to try to stop this from happening again. So far he has been successful.




You are correct that not being an anarchist conspiracy theorist does not = being brainwashed. Of course, that wasn't why I was calling you brainwashed. You made that post, not me, and it's pretty clear which one of is asleep here.




BS. I watched the coverage of the WTC, and the progress of the rescue attempt and stuff. I must now bow down to the all knowing Fiend. Why don't you enlighten us with an opinion.


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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: erjone]
    #1679837 - 07/02/03 11:09 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

What did Clinton do? Wasn't he in New York at the time?


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Offlinehongomon
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Phred]
    #1680569 - 07/02/03 04:30 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Quote:

pinksharkmark said:
hongomon writes:

It was a rip-off of Kevin Wright's joke about having an actual size map of the U.S.

Stephen Wright. My favorite standup comedian of all time.

pinky




Thanks, I knew something was wrong with 'Kevin'.


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Offlineerjone
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Baby_Hitler]
    #1691421 - 07/06/03 11:54 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

lol.....clinton. Yeah. What could he do. He is nothing more than a civilian which the police were getting OUT of the area.




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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: erjone]
    #1692644 - 07/07/03 11:36 AM (17 years, 1 month ago)

And Bush could have...

Formed a committee?
Hired an analyst?
Vetoed a bill to "Not do anything"?


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OfflineStrumpling
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: somebodyelse]
    #1718555 - 07/15/03 04:53 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

somebodyelse,

you had replied to me saying "but of course, if they already knew that all of this was going to happen, then he would have no need to jump up and run off in a panic" with this:

"He didn't. He sat there for 15 minutes talking about a goat after he'd been informed. He should have been getting his aircraft off the ground to intercept the planes that were known to be hijacked but were still in the air. Read the timeline link that I posted....you'll see what I mean."

Oh I read it - that was my whole point.. I was implying that he knew BEFOREHAND that something was going to happen - otherwise, I think his punkass would have freaked out


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Insert an "I think" mentally in front of eveything I say that seems sketchy, because I certainly don't KNOW much. Also; feel free to yell at me.
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InvisibleDoctorJ
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: Strumpling]
    #1718980 - 07/15/03 07:06 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Did Bush know?
maybe.
Did the people behind Bush know?
probably
Did the people pulling Bush's strings plan the whole thing?
It seems possible.

Even if the republicans and the zionists didn't plan it, they sure have done a good job of capitalizing on it. the Patriot Act, Border control, and Drug War tightening are all good examples.

And don't forget all those weapons companies that Bush's father owns so much stock in. And don't forget the fact that Bush Sr. also has an interest in keeping the price of oil high.

And I still don't understand how exactly four planes went off course and off IFF for over 30 minutes and NORAD didn't cath it.

But hey, the man on TV said that it is all Arabs and potsmokers and those are the people I should hate.

"Go back to bed America. We have figured it out. Your government is in control. Shut up. Watch this. Here's American Gladiators. Heres 56 channels of it. Watch these two pitutitary retards beat the shit out of eachother and forget about it. You are free to do what we tell you to..."
-Bill Hicks (rip)


--------------------
Deep in the heart of Central Texas
lurks a Doktor
SM tool
Native Dallas brick-chopper...


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OfflineLearyfanS
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Re: 5-Minute Video of George W. Bush on the Morning of 9-11 [Re: DoctorJ]
    #1719373 - 07/15/03 10:43 PM (17 years, 1 month ago)

Well said.




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