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 Kenny Bus
The enlightend
Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 321
Loc: ontario
Last seen: 15 years, 11 months
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 suicide? 
#1659034 - 06/24/03 04:37 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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what do you people think of people who commit suicide? is it wrong? are they just to weak? do you think they're after life or whatever you believe happens to us after we die, differs from those who die naturally?
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KB
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 RebelSteve33
Amateur Mycologist
Registered: 05/28/02
Posts: 3,774
Loc: Arizona
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i think it's our own special form of natural selection.
i don't like to judge people who commit suicide as 'wrong' or 'weak.' i think they did what they had to do. and since i don't believe in any sort of afterlife, yes, i believe the same thing happens to them that happens to all people when they die.
nothing. 
peace,
rebelsteve
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Namaste.
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Boppity604
Stranger
Registered: 10/19/01
Posts: 1,056
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It's their choice to make. It's not my place to judge their decision. I would never make that choice, but that doesn't mean it's "wrong" for those people who do. Everyone here screams they want the choice to put a drug into their body for the experience, is that wrong? Suicide is the same thing, a choice made by the individual to terminate their life. In one of my counseling classes we discussed suicide extensively. No matter how much you love and care for someone else, they are the only person in the world who can help themselves. We can offer them opinions, options and encouragement...but nothing we do can really change anything in them. They have to want to change themselves. If someone doesn't want to explore other options, that's their call to make.
It's sad to learn someone you know or cared about has decided to take their own life...but most people don't realize that once that choice has been decided, no matter what we do to try and stop it, the individual will keep trying til successful.
That being said, I don't fuck around when people joke about suicide. If someone I know were to ever call me saying they wanted to off themselves, I'd simply call the police right away. Most people who advertise really don't want to end their life...they want attention or help in another aspect of their life. Those who do successfully terminate their lives are the ones you "discover" or find out about after the fact.
In conclusion...personally, if you want to off yourself, I don't see any reason why you should be denied that option. If you decide to involve me, however, by calling me and telling me you're contemplating it or going to attempt it...be prepared to get the attention you're looking for.
Love & Light,
Boppity
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Discordja
Pope
Registered: 08/07/02
Posts: 243
Loc: Atlantic Canada
Last seen: 20 years, 4 months
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Its a choice, like any other. I don't think anyone has the right to force our continued existence on us should we make a move towards self-negation. Personally, I think (and repeat to myslef in those darker moments) Tom Robbins was right when he wrote that suicide has no style.
As for the afterlife...I have no expectations. I'll find out when I get there.
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Remember, it's only true if it makes you laugh...
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Revelation
ॐ
Registered: 08/04/01
Posts: 6,135
Loc: heart cave
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It's not wrong, it just is. 
What I think just now is that a person's problems do not leave them when they reach the "other side". We all need to sort through our own problems, in this life or the next. Karma, I guess.
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David_Scape
Anti Genius
Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 878
Loc: U.S. of muthafuckin A.
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
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Suicide is just depressing. Thinking of the concept of sucide is tantamount to thinking of a child getting tangled in the wheels of a train. It's just senseless, that poor girl didnt deserve to get tangled, and a deppressed fellow feels like he's worth less than shit. It just sucks, and you just have to accept it and move on--it's not even in the realm of judging whether they're 'weak' or 'stupid'.
I've felt the want to commit sucide.
Heck, i still have a bit of a morbid obsession of the idea of something bad happening to me, like getting sick, going to sleep and never waking up. Or getting in a car crash where i die instantly. But even when i was feeling like killing myself, I believe (in hindsight) that i did'nt really want to be extinct. I just wanted to go to a place where i could just pity myself so intensly that i dissolve into numbness. It was really just my soul telling me to let go of particularly deep and horrible attachments. Many of my thought processes as depressed individual is a combination of mood and ciruclar thinking.
Edited by David_Scape (06/24/03 05:07 PM)
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World Spirit
PNW
Registered: 07/27/01
Posts: 9,817
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Deleted by admin
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tomatoes
you say tomatoe
Registered: 06/13/03
Posts: 180
Loc: and i say . . .
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shr00m
junglisT 2 thefUll3st
Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 801
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
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 Re: suicide? [Re: tomatoes]
#1659326 - 06/24/03 06:19 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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if someone were to belive in an afterlife and decided to suicide...then think about it this way.
people suicide for many reasons. some do it while under the influence and some do it because they are just pissed off at life.
so many variations. hell, the suicide note might have said that he was sick of life but we never know if that was what he really meant.
what if he/she started to just get sick of reality and he/she shot himself? that may be running away. and so might living your life. in a way we are running away from death too by living.
if someone wants to suicide and end it all....go right ahead. You may think how cruel I am and all but if someone really wanted to suicide....chances are he/she could care less what you have to say.
just because you know of a words definition doesnt mean it goes along for everyone else.
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the only constant is change~ life goes on. so theres no point in staying back because you can always catch up. try,hope, and understand!
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Swami
Eggshell Walker
Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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I would never make that choice...
Sorry Boppity, but you cannot possibly know that. You may not currently have any depressive tendencies, but so what?
Maybe when you are 45, you will get laid off, only to come home and find that your wife and children were killed by a drunk driver. Then when trying to start over find out that your accountant scammed you out of your life savings; etc.
Many seniors who upon finding out they have a terminal illness opt out.
The point is you have no idea what the future holds and how you will react to it - you only know your present mind state.
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The proof is in the pudding.
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infidelGOD
illusion
Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
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 Re: suicide? [Re: Swami]
#1659484 - 06/24/03 07:18 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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I feel depressed just reading that.
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Swami
Eggshell Walker
Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Cheer up! Roy Orbison wrote and performed some of his best music AFTER he lost his wife and kids in a car accident. And the Swam made it past the 45 barrier...
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The proof is in the pudding.
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Zahid
Stranger
Registered: 01/21/02
Posts: 4,779
Last seen: 20 years, 3 months
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Quote:
Kenny Bus said:
what do you people think of people who commit suicide? is it wrong? are they just to weak? do you think they're after life or whatever you believe happens to us after we die, differs from those who die naturally?
I do not think that people who kill themselves do so with 'complete intent'. Suicide is a quick physical escape from whatever hardship a person may see as unbearable. By intent, I mean; suicide is a human err, it is a mistake. Mistakes are forgiven. For a person with religious convictions, suicide is not a sealed fate; rather, God will not even judge them. Only when the person who killed themself judges their own self, only then will God extend some of that sweet Mercy to an unfortunate soul who made the choice to end their own lives.
Peace.
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Gixxer_boy
Rice Burner
Registered: 06/24/03
Posts: 149
Loc: Mass
Last seen: 21 years, 6 months
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Re: suicide? [Re: Zahid]
#1659558 - 06/24/03 07:56 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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I dont really agree with the idea that someone who wants to commit suicide will do it without any regard to what others say. I myself have felt suicidal at times, and its mostly because I feel so shitty with no end in sight; a friend in those kinds of situations can do alot to turn things around. Now, I don't think I would ever actually commit suicide, but shit happens. Suicide is a mistake made in desperation. I don't judge anyone who successfully (or unsuccessfully for that matter) tried to kill themself, but I think the only logical reason to kill one's self is terminal illness. If someone kills themself for any other reason, I bet its because they just were unable to get the help they needed from others or from within themselves.
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"Why do women have breasts?"
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"So you can have something to look at when you're talking to them!" -Peter Griffin
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David_Scape
Anti Genius
Registered: 08/05/02
Posts: 878
Loc: U.S. of muthafuckin A.
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
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 Re: suicide? [Re: Swami]
#1659567 - 06/24/03 07:59 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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Quote:
Cheer up! Roy Orbison wrote and performed some of his best music AFTER he lost his wife and kids in a car accident. And the Swam made it past the 45 barrier...
Edited by David_Scape (06/24/03 08:01 PM)
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Boppity604
Stranger
Registered: 10/19/01
Posts: 1,056
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>>Sorry Boppity, but you cannot possibly know that. You may not currently have any depressive tendencies, but so what?
Uh, sorry Swami, but yes I CAN know that.
>>Maybe when you are 45, you will get laid off
I'm currently unemployed for over a year now.
>>only to come home and find that your wife and children were killed by a drunk driver.
In my life so far I've been disowned by my folks for being gay, my Father died in 1995, been bashed for being queer and have lost a job for simply being that way. In my senior year of college I was raped, and *shock!* I've been dealing with depression my entire life.
Who are YOU to tell me what I cannot possibly know??? I've been through enough shit to make me want to end it all but to me there is no point in killing myself. SO what if Life isn't peachy for me...I still have LIFE. I wake up every morning and thank God for granting me the gift of waking up for one more day of whatever may happen. Life in and of itself is so precious that I would MUCH rather wake up and spend another day homeless, lying in a box than to put a gun in my mouth and put all my suffering to rest?
I am in control of my own ego; I can control how I perceive my reality and how my mind labels it. So yes...I CAN know that I value the mere fact of life well above and beyond ANY spell of depression I may go through. I've been in some very low low's my friend...and no matter how overwhelming the depression hits me, I know it's simply a chemical reaction in my brain making me feel that way...and I know that I can simply transcend it by not empowering the emotions as I feel them.
Do yourself a favor Swami, stop making assumptions about people you've never met. I've had plenty of occasions to suck a pistol...but I see that as a pointless and wasteful thing to do. No matter how hard my life may be...I am still happy to HAVE that life in the first place.
Peace,
Boppity
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shr00m
junglisT 2 thefUll3st
Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 801
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
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yet you thank God for an extra day ?
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the only constant is change~ life goes on. so theres no point in staying back because you can always catch up. try,hope, and understand!
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nubious
1up on the rest
Registered: 10/20/02
Posts: 534
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 3 months, 27 days
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Quote:
In my life so far I've been disowned by my folks for being gay, my Father died in 1995, been bashed for being queer and have lost a job for simply being that way
The folks thing, well .. it happens.. I've known lots of people that's happened to.. Sorry bout your luck - the job thing though? You just took it? You didn't fight it in any way? You DO have rights you know, regardless of what people tell you.
Lemme guess - you live in the US, don't you....
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No one knows the worth of innocence till he knows it is gone forever, and that money can't buy it back. Not the saint, but the sinner that repenteth, is he to whom the full length and breadth, and height and depth, of life's meaning is revealed. Good and evil loose all objective meaning and are seen as equally necessary and contrasting elements in the masterpiece that is the universe.
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Boppity604
Stranger
Registered: 10/19/01
Posts: 1,056
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Re: suicide? [Re: shr00m]
#1659749 - 06/24/03 09:12 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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>>yet you thank God for an extra day ?
Of course I do! To be able to see the sun rise one more time, to be able to laugh with friends one more time, to be able to experience ANYTHING one more time...that to me is enough to be thankful for. I've learned to let go of expectations and to simply be in the "now"...that doesn't mean I still don't have goals and hopes...of course I do. But I don't fret if things don't go the way I'd like them to. I enjoy each step of the way as it happens. We are in charge of our own happiness...
Love & Light,
Boppity
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Boppity604
Stranger
Registered: 10/19/01
Posts: 1,056
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>>The folks thing, well .. it happens..
Ya, and that was the easiest thing to deal with.
>>the job thing though? You just took it?
Nope, I spoke with 13 different attorneys after I lost my job but in the state that it occured in at the time, it wasn't illegal to be fired for being gay...the only state laws were EOE...they couldn't NOT hire you for being gay...but if they wanted to fire you for it...it was legal. The one attorney told me if I wanted to stay in that state, I should get used to it. So I moved.
>>Lemme guess - you live in the US, don't you....
Yes...please don't hate me for it. hehe
Love & Light,
Boppity
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shr00m
junglisT 2 thefUll3st
Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 801
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
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why believe in God ?
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the only constant is change~ life goes on. so theres no point in staying back because you can always catch up. try,hope, and understand!
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Boppity604
Stranger
Registered: 10/19/01
Posts: 1,056
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Re: suicide? [Re: shr00m]
#1659778 - 06/24/03 09:27 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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>>why believe in God?
Because I'm a priest? Wouldn't make much sense being a priest if I didn't believe in God...right? 
Love & Light,
Boppity
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shr00m
junglisT 2 thefUll3st
Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 801
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
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didnt know u were.
religion to me isnt wrong or anything. I just dont believe in it
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the only constant is change~ life goes on. so theres no point in staying back because you can always catch up. try,hope, and understand!
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Boppity604
Stranger
Registered: 10/19/01
Posts: 1,056
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Re: suicide? [Re: shr00m]
#1659831 - 06/24/03 09:43 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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>>religion to me isnt wrong or anything. I just dont believe in it
It's all good shr00m...we all have our own reality. It's more important to be true to yourself than to worry about what other people think. And for those who care, my religion is Lukumi. It's an Afro-Cuban religion that descends from the Yoruba of present-day Nigeria. And no...don't assume because I'm on shroomery that my religious beliefs or practices have anything to do with psychedelics...they don't.
Love & Light,
Boppity
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shr00m
junglisT 2 thefUll3st
Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 801
Last seen: 15 years, 7 months
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hey now
I dont associate everyone on shroomery that they do psychedelics.
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the only constant is change~ life goes on. so theres no point in staying back because you can always catch up. try,hope, and understand!
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Kenny Bus
The enlightend
Registered: 10/10/02
Posts: 321
Loc: ontario
Last seen: 15 years, 11 months
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i feel nothing but sympathy for people who commit suicide, you may have guess i've been feeling suicidal lately, i used to say i would never do it, but things change, right now i've decided not to, but i go back and forth, doesnt look like i ever will tho. sometimes i believe people who have really crappy luck, like the guy who gets laid off and comes home to a dead family and an empty bank account, are paying for whatever wrongs they did in a past life, and they have to find they're way out of this hell, so it just gets worse and worse till they off themselves. thats the suicidal part of me talking obviously. but i'm agnostic, i have no firm beliefs. other times i think lifes a gift and should be appreciated, i think about the thousands of people that are worse off than me, and i think that i would realise what i've got till its gone. oh and for it being the easy way out, it may seam like its easier than facing your problems, but everybody has some satisfaction everyday, and they know what they're throwing away, i dont think theres anything easy about it.
sometimes i think the powers that be
are toying with me
keeping me on the edge, for eternity
it gets worse and worse
like my lifes been cursed
then i'll catch i tiny speck of hope
so i try to cope
for just anouther day
and when things feel like they're finally going my way
my blue skies turn grey
as the gods continue to play
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KB
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Swami
Eggshell Walker
Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Do yourself a favor Swami, stop making assumptions about people you've never met.
Dear Bop,
Don't go getting all defensive now. Absolutely no assumptions were made. All I said, and I will stick by it is: You cannot definitively know all your future states of mind. How many people vow to love another forever because that is their current mind state and later change?
I admire your perserverance through the tough times, but all you know is your mental states up to this point in time.
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The proof is in the pudding.
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trev
comming out of retirement
Registered: 04/02/03
Posts: 871
Loc: Aussie
Last seen: 13 years, 9 months
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 Re: suicide? [Re: shr00m]
#1660151 - 06/24/03 11:45 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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Think of the people that are left behind when someone takes there own
life. Some people actually top themselves to hurt the ones that made them so sad and this leaves a lot of people behind saying I could have done more (and mabe they will next time). I think this is possibly selfish
but mabe good can come from it. Just dont do it we all pass away sooner or later.
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Anonymous #14
[quote]There are billions of people on this planet. The world does not revolve around the united states, moron. I hope terrorists crash their collective cocks into your asshole. [/quote]
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Diploid
Cuban
Registered: 01/09/03
Posts: 19,274
Loc: Rabbit Hole
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I think people who are mentally all (or at least mostly) there should be allowed to end their life if they choose to. Of course this opens up a whole can of worms about what sanity is and where the line to insanity is.
-Diploid
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Republican Values:
1) You can't get married to your spouse who is the same sex as you.
2) You can't have an abortion no matter how much you don't want a child.
3) You can't have a certain plant in your possession or you'll get locked up with a rapist and a murderer.
4) We need a smaller, less-intrusive government.
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RebelSteve33
Amateur Mycologist
Registered: 05/28/02
Posts: 3,774
Loc: Arizona
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I can honestly say I've never been so depressed that I've considered committing suicide. It just isn't an option for me because
1. I know that now matter how depressed I might be, things will always get better.
2. I could never do that to the people I love.
and
3. I'm too scared of death.
However, sometimes I think about what lies ahead of me in life, and I think I would rather die than have to face it all. I just don't want to live through certain things, especially the death of my parents. I'm so scared of having to go through this that I've thought about taking my own life before I have to watch theirs end.
I don't think I ever would, but thinking about things like these are the only times I've ever really thought about suicide. I do think, though, that if I ever get a certain terminal illness, or if I get to an age where I can no longer care for myself, I would rather just end my life.
anyway...
I LOVE LIFE. I LOVE LIVING. I AM SO THANKFUL THAT A RANDOM SPERM MET A RANDOM EGG AND CREATED ME. THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH WORDS TO DESCRIBE HOW MUCH I LOVE LIFE AND HOW THANKFUL I AM TO BE ALIVE.
Peace,
RebelSteve
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Namaste.
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Rhizoid
carbon unit
Registered: 01/22/00
Posts: 1,739
Loc: Europe
Last seen: 11 months, 11 days
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The game of life is hard to play
I'm gonna lose it anyway
The losing card I'll someday lay
so this is all I have to say:
that suicide is painless
It brings on many changes
and I can take or leave it if I please.
--Mike Altman
Well, my opinion is that the song oversimplifies it a bit 
Suicide is never painless, but I guess there are situations where it is less painful than the alternative. The "afterlife" (i.e. the world that continues to exist after the suicide) is of course the same, and yet again not, since a suicide has its own sorrows that other types of death don't have.
In most cases I think suicide is extremely wasteful, and that's a good enough reason to avoid recommending it.
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Boppity604
Stranger
Registered: 10/19/01
Posts: 1,056
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Re: suicide? [Re: Swami]
#1660889 - 06/25/03 09:02 AM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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Hi Swami,
>>You cannot definitively know all your future states of mind.
Ya...I'm sorry if that post seemed stand-off-ish. I apologize about that. I understand your point and I do agree that nothing can remain constant and I'll be the first to admit that we cannot know anything until we're in the midst of the situation itself. I guess I just took the post a little too personally than I should have...and for that I apologize to you. I didn't mean to sound defensive.
Love & Light,
Boppity
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Lallafa
p_g monocle
Registered: 04/13/01
Posts: 2,598
Loc: underbelly
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i
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my tax dollars going to more hits of acid for charles manson
Edited by Lallafa (01/15/04 06:07 PM)
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doody
Stranger
Registered: 06/20/03
Posts: 11
Last seen: 21 years, 7 months
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Re: suicide? [Re: Lallafa]
#1661435 - 06/25/03 01:02 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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While suicide is a choice, it isn't always the choice of a rational mind. I did mid-term paper on Euthanasia for an Applied Ethics class and I came to find that in a great majority of cases where people want to take their own life they are depressed. A person can not simply wake up and decide not to feel depressed, as a person can not simply wake up and decide they can run a marathon.
Both take hard work to achieve, and both cause major changes in the person who embarks on them. Giving up training for a marathon is much like giving up on life for a depressed person. In my opinion sucidide is rarely a rational choice that someone makes. More likely, suicide is an irrational action chosen by someone who honestly feels they have no choice left.
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Swami
Eggshell Walker
Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Re: suicide? [Re: doody]
#1661469 - 06/25/03 01:15 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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More likely, suicide is an irrational action chosen by someone who honestly feels they have no choice left.
This statement is contradictory. A person who has slowly and carefully reviewed all apparent options to relieve his/her pain and honestly feels that is the only choice left is not being irrational. Ignorant perhaps, of other avenues of help, but hardly irrational.
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The proof is in the pudding.
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doody
Stranger
Registered: 06/20/03
Posts: 11
Last seen: 21 years, 7 months
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Re: suicide? [Re: Swami]
#1661537 - 06/25/03 01:43 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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I didn't say anything about slowly and carefully reviewing all apparent options. I'm saying it's likely that the person feels as if they have no choice but to take their own life. By commiting suicide they are committing an irrational act. That's why it so vitally important to inform mental health counselers, parents, friends, etc. if someone seems to be at risk for suicide.
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MuShi_KiNg
---------|)
Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 491
Last seen: 14 years, 8 months
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Re: suicide? [Re: doody]
#1662610 - 06/25/03 07:39 PM (21 years, 7 months ago) |
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In all aspects suicideis a terrible way to die
But in the end some time we can control our destiny
Afterlife ? ill never know till i get there !!
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!
Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 21 years, 4 months
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if i was going to be executed I would rather kill myself.
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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
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MuShi_KiNg
---------|)
Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 491
Last seen: 14 years, 8 months
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i dont think i would have the guts to kill myslef
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!
Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 21 years, 4 months
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you dont need guts, in fact, taking a sword, plunging it in your chest, and slicing horizontaly will remove your guts.
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enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
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MuShi_KiNg
---------|)
Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 491
Last seen: 14 years, 8 months
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heh lol :>
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Gixxer_boy
Rice Burner
Registered: 06/24/03
Posts: 149
Loc: Mass
Last seen: 21 years, 6 months
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Oh, I almost forgot the saddest suicide story I heard from a first hand account. There was this girl I had a big crush on like 2 years ago, and one night we were talking online, and pretty much told each other our entire lives. When she was 9, her father jumped out of the 2nd floor balcony of there house head first and his brains were splatted all over the sidewalk. She was the first person to find him. When she told me this, I didn't know what to say so I told her suicide isn't the worst way to die, and to which she replied 'no, but it's the most selfish'.
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"Why do women have breasts?"
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"So you can have something to look at when you're talking to them!" -Peter Griffin
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