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RebelSteve33
Amateur Mycologist
Registered: 05/28/02
Posts: 3,774
Loc: Arizona
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Great Balls of Fire!
#1646749 - 06/20/03 12:02 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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That is my basic understanding of stars.
And I'm okay with that. As long as I have that basic understanding of what they really are, everything is cool.
But I wonder what the hell people used to think about stars before we found out they're really great balls of fire?! I mean, they had to have wondered!
It would be kinda freaky if we didn't know what those tiny specks of light in the night sky were. In fact, what if science is really just a form of modern mythology made up to pacify our curious human minds?!?!
I mean, do you really know how we know that "stars" are really great balls of fire?? Cuz I sure as hell don't!
Peace & Intelligence,
RebelSteve
-------------------- Namaste.
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barfightlard
tales of theinexpressible
Registered: 01/29/03
Posts: 8,670
Loc: Canoodia
Last seen: 14 years, 3 months
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Thats a pretty intersting thought! I don't think I would have came up with that. You are right that we dont really know if they are suns or not.
-------------------- "What business is it of yours what I do, read, buy, see, say, think, who I fuck, what I take into my body - as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet?" - Bill Hicks
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infidelGOD
illusion
Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
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yeah stars are really other suns out there, we know that for a fact. don't worry about the mythology thing. it's the unanswered questions that are always steeped in mythology and there are plenty of unanswered questions out there.
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RebelSteve33
Amateur Mycologist
Registered: 05/28/02
Posts: 3,774
Loc: Arizona
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: infidelGOD]
#1646813 - 06/20/03 12:20 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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yeah stars are really other suns out there, we know that for a fact.
How do we know we know, though???
-------------------- Namaste.
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SkorpivoMusterion
Livin in theTwilight Zone...
Registered: 01/30/03
Posts: 9,954
Loc: You can't spell fungus wi...
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well okay I see where you're coming from on this....so I'd say...that we're 99.99% sure that the stars out there are suns...
-------------------- Coffee should be black as hell, strong as death, and sweet as love.
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infidelGOD
illusion
Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
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a) How do we know?
or
b) How do we know we know?
it's a bit late for epistemology...
but in answer to a), we can spilt the spectrum from the light of distant stars and find out what they're made of. we know this works because it can be demonstrated in a lab.
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RebelSteve33
Amateur Mycologist
Registered: 05/28/02
Posts: 3,774
Loc: Arizona
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: infidelGOD]
#1646860 - 06/20/03 12:37 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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have you ever split the light of distant stars into a spectrum and analyzed what they were made of? huh? huh?
-------------------- Namaste.
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Sev
Astropath
Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 1,426
Loc: NY
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: infidelGOD]
#1646861 - 06/20/03 12:38 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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Just because they show different spectra doesn't mean that they're, well, giant balls of incandescent gas floating in space.
-------------------- "Do we want the stars? We can have them. Can we borrow cups of fire from the sun? We can and must and light the world." --"On the Shoulders of Giants", Ray Bradbury All of my posts are full of fiction and blatant lies.
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Sclorch
Clyster
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: Sev]
#1646876 - 06/20/03 12:42 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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Just because they show different spectra doesn't mean that they're, well, giant balls of incandescent gas floating in space. Yeah, for all we know, they could be made of helium... um...,
-------------------- Note: In desperate need of a cure...
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Sev
Astropath
Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 1,426
Loc: NY
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: Sclorch]
#1646889 - 06/20/03 12:45 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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Err...they are, IIRC. At least partially.
What I'm saying is that, just going by spectra and parallax, we can't tell much about truly distant stars. Yes, common sense says that they're like our Sun, but who knows? They could be dyson spheres or giant space louse eggs or something.
-------------------- "Do we want the stars? We can have them. Can we borrow cups of fire from the sun? We can and must and light the world." --"On the Shoulders of Giants", Ray Bradbury All of my posts are full of fiction and blatant lies.
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infidelGOD
illusion
Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: Sev]
#1646900 - 06/20/03 12:49 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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uuhhh, we can also split the light spectrum of the Sun and compare it to other stars and draw conclusions. I guess I should have said that earlier. and like I already mentioned, the process can be demonstrated in a lab.
and that's just ONE way that we know that other stars are suns. we can also measure their sizes DIRECTLY when they occult the moon. we can also observe binary stars orbitting each other and estimate their masses. we can detect planets orbitting other stars. analyze supernovae explosions. run computer simulations. etc. etc.
there's tons of research out there.
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RebelSteve33
Amateur Mycologist
Registered: 05/28/02
Posts: 3,774
Loc: Arizona
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: infidelGOD]
#1646905 - 06/20/03 12:51 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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yeah, that's what they want us to think!
-------------------- Namaste.
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infidelGOD
illusion
Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
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they?
you could see for yourself...
if you had the right equipment
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Sev
Astropath
Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 1,426
Loc: NY
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: infidelGOD]
#1646932 - 06/20/03 12:58 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yeah, but I can show you a light bulb with a spectrum very like that of the Sun's -- that doesn't prove anything.
All of the rest of the things that you say just tell us two things: that stars are large masses and that they sometimes explode. (Now, the fact that one binary star can sometimes suck away another's mass is one that's a little harder to explain, but ...;))
Now, even given that the local stars -are- stars, there's absolutely no way to tell that the ones in, say, Andromeda aren't actually giant glowing mushroom spores floating through the aether or something?
...Now this is mental masturbation.
-------------------- "Do we want the stars? We can have them. Can we borrow cups of fire from the sun? We can and must and light the world." --"On the Shoulders of Giants", Ray Bradbury All of my posts are full of fiction and blatant lies.
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infidelGOD
illusion
Registered: 04/18/02
Posts: 3,040
Loc: there
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: Sev]
#1646943 - 06/20/03 01:04 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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well, if you want to believe that we're intentionally being fooled by illusions, then there's really no point in studying the universe around us is there? unless those who are responsible for the illusion are studying our reaction to illusory universe... now THAT is mental masturbation this could go on forever, but my head hurts
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Sclorch
Clyster
Registered: 07/12/99
Posts: 4,805
Loc: On the Brink of Madness
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: infidelGOD]
#1646951 - 06/20/03 01:07 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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working beliefs
working beliefs
working beliefs
-------------------- Note: In desperate need of a cure...
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Sev
Astropath
Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 1,426
Loc: NY
Last seen: 9 years, 5 months
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: Sclorch]
#1646963 - 06/20/03 01:10 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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Lol, I think we broke Sclotch.
Naw, I'm not saying that we're necessarily being deliberately fooled -- jut that when something's outside of our ability to perceive in detail -- as all of stars in other galaxies are -- there's no way to actually tell what something is.
Besides, what if the Creator was really lazy? If I were him I'd just make the Milky way the right way and then just hang up clusters of christmas lights everywhere else.
-------------------- "Do we want the stars? We can have them. Can we borrow cups of fire from the sun? We can and must and light the world." --"On the Shoulders of Giants", Ray Bradbury All of my posts are full of fiction and blatant lies.
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Swami
Eggshell Walker
Registered: 01/18/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: Sclorch]
#1646971 - 06/20/03 01:12 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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Yeah, for all we know, they could be made of helium...
Now say that an octave lower so that I can understand you.
-------------------- The proof is in the pudding.
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lucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness
Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: Swami]
#1647040 - 06/20/03 01:37 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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>but who knows? They could be ...giant space louse eggs damn, get out those frying pans, we're all part of the "cosmic ommlette" and supernovae are just eggs hatchin... "Astronomical Breakfast Theory"... yhumm...
-------------------- "no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."
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lucid
Jack's AlteredConsciousness
Registered: 03/29/03
Posts: 6,319
Loc: up on the bidet
Last seen: 10 years, 5 months
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Re: Great Balls of Fire! [Re: lucid]
#1647055 - 06/20/03 01:45 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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>jut that when something's outside of our ability to perceive in >detail -- as all of stars in other galaxies are -- there's no way to >actually tell what something is. hmmm, but our ability to perceive is based on gathering data and making inferences, which is what we do with distant stars, quantum particles and holding our coffee mug. The question to ask is "at what point are we satisfied that we can actually tell what something is" kinda like the AI argument, define "at what point would we be satisfied to call a program intelligent" as opposed to "what exactly is intelligence and how could we replicate it in a program". But I digress...
-------------------- "no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."
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