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OfflineMisterKite
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Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes
    #1643093 - 06/19/03 12:45 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

OK, so I've heard recently about dreams being a reality. This is not some lunatic who says that God told him this and that he has it all written down in his exegesis. Nay, it was last month's issue of Popular Science. Using quantum physics, scientists proved that there is an infinite nubmer of parallel dimensions, and that anything you think of acutally exists in another dimension. This means that your dreams are actually happening on another plane of reality. If you think about punching a hole through your computer, or having sex with your teacher, then in another alternate universe you really are doing that.

This has lots of significance in multiple ways. I'll speak of one, because this could turn into a really long essay if I talk abouit all the things that come to mind. I'll shorten it up as mcuh as I can.

When you sleep, your pineal gland releases DMT. A hypothesis of mine and my companions is that DMT has a very large impact on your dreams. Your dreams are not dreams but realities. And thus, through this chemical you are brought to another dimension. Possibly, is there a dimension you could be brought to where you are the Messiah? Could you be the Messiah just by thinking that you're the Messiah? Maybe if you think of yourself being God or the Messiah long enough, you'll increase the probability of DMT transfering you to a dimension where this is true. Perhaps this is what meditation aims for.

THe more I write, the more that comes to my head. Let me just throw out random questions. Reply to whatever ones you wish.

If all thought is reality, then hallucinations are actually what you are seeing in a different world.
Since so many people think of God, God actually exists in other universes. Phillip K. Dick said that our God is crazy.
This proven fact of quantum physics could possibly be the answer to the ongoing question of substances bringing you to enlightenment. Substances could simply be a quicker way into your brain, and thus into the megaverse of the infinite reality.
But there's also an enormous number of universes where God doesn't exist. Or Pegan gods exist. Or any type of God exists.

I had more questions, but they have slipped from my mind. If anyone knows more on this subject, feel free to make any criticisms or add to anything I said. Ask questions of your own. I don't know much on quantum phsyics or how it proves this theory, all I know is that it somehow relates to how an electron is at every single point around the neutron at once.

And everyone, please, do not get really angry by me saying that substances could lead you to God, it's just an opinion(though it could be a proven fact).


--------------------
"But for the sake of some little mouthful of flesh we deprive a soul of the sun and light, and of that proportion of life and time it had been born into the world to enjoy."


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Offlinemanna_man
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Registered: 06/10/03
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1643151 - 06/19/03 01:07 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I read a similar article in Scientific American. Basically, it talked about parallel universes and the like. What really grabbed my attention was when they started discussing our replicas...yes, our FUCKING CLONES. Apparently all humans have at least 4 clones, doing EXACTLY what you are doing right now,  having led the exact same life as you. This is a valid theory because since the universe is infinite, or at least theorised to be, then there is potentially a "dimension" where everything is exactly the same as ours. There must almost exist a dimension, like you said, where god does not exist, etc. Ultimately, ANYTHING is possible.
         
And readinng over your post I realised that I just repeated a whole lot of what you said. Should've read the entire post before making a reply...oh well :crazy:



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This post is protected under copyrite law.All above content is strictly the property of ?manna_man.Any infringement of copyright property is strictly prohibited.Any violators will be stretched, shot, and then vaporized into a state of anti-matter, where they will cease to exist.


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1643263 - 06/19/03 01:52 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

The "megaverse" theory is slightly flawed, IMHO, because of the way it interprets certain quantum-level events.

The idea of multiple realities comes from the wave property of the electron. Say you fire an electron accross a room at a target. You observe that the electron hits dead in the middle of the target. But which path did it take?

Classical physics would state that it took a single path, one which you could trace (by observing the electron's motion in-flight).

Quantum physics tells something different. The electron takes all possible paths to the target at the same time. This seems strange, I'm sure, but it's the way the quantum world apparently works. This is ONLY the case, however, as long as you do NOT observe which path the electron actually takes. The instant you try to find out which path it takes...the electron's probability wave "solidifies" into one path out of all the possible ones. You can only ever "watch" the elctron take one path.

How does this relate to reality and the multiverse theory?

Well someone decided that if, in the quantum world, all possibilities exist simultaneously...then why can't that be true in the macroscopic world?

Well I have a few reasons:

One, quantum processes only really occur in VERY small systems - we're talking single particles here. The probability of quantum events occuring in macroscopic systems is EXTREMELY tiny.

Two, the theory forgets the point about how the numerous possibilities clear away into one possibility upon observation. Maybe ALL realities do "exist" simultaneously, just like the electron-paths, but only until reality is "observed". It then becomes singular.


Question:
Is God the one doing the observing? Meaning, does his observation of "reality" cause the "selection" of one possibility from the many?


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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InvisibleSwami
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Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1643272 - 06/19/03 01:54 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

...or having sex with your teacher, then in another alternate universe you really are doing that.

Excuse me for a moment, the police are at my door...


--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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OfflineMalachi
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Registered: 06/19/02
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: trendal]
    #1643293 - 06/19/03 01:59 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I think that I'm the observer. There's this comiv book called johnny the homicidal maniac in which johnny is the observer and when he dies the world shrinks down to nothingness.


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The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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OfflineSlapnutRob
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: Swami]
    #1643310 - 06/19/03 02:08 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

First of all, I find the idea that what I'm thinking is really happening in some other dimension is ridiculous. I'd have to read that article, but that's really fuckin out there to me.

Manna Man, I'm not a physics expert, but I'm reading a Brief History of Time by Stephen Hawking right now and he in no way believes the universe is infinite. He actually believes it's expanding and will one day begin to contract.

Trendal, maybe I'm wrong here, but I thought that the idea of quantum mechanics was that at such a small level we have no idea what's going to happen. It's the uncertainty principle. There are many possible paths for a particle to take and it will only take one, but we can't predict which... that's how quantum mechanics defeated scientific determinism--the idea that if we can somehow completely understand our surroundings we can predict everything that will happen in the future. I'm far from an expert though, maybe I'm wrong.


--------------------
Anything stated above is fictional roleplay dialog by the character that is Slapnut Rob, in no way representing the actions or beliefs of the man behind the keys.


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: SlapnutRob]
    #1643329 - 06/19/03 02:14 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Well you're close, but not quite right  :smirk:

In essence, the uncertainty principle says that you can never know BOTH the position and the direction of motion of a particle. Not that you can't know either to a HIGH degree, you just can't know BOTH to a high degree.

Say you've got an electron flying along and you want to observe it. How do you observe it? By bouncing another particle off it and watching how the particle reflects off. That's the problem. When your particle hits the electron, it will cause the electron to change course. Also, the more accurately you try to measure the elctron, the more you knock it off course.

The uncertainty principle DID the idea of determinism, but not by saying that we can't predict at all. It just means that instead of saying "this electron is RIGHT HERE" we have to say "the electron is most likely to be here".


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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OfflineSev
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Registered: 06/06/03
Posts: 1,426
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: trendal]
    #1643587 - 06/19/03 04:21 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I've stopped regarding quantum physics as anything other than magic since they managed to do the classic double-slit interference pattern thing with single sodium atoms.


--------------------
"Do we want the stars? We can have them. Can we borrow cups of fire from the sun? We can and must and light the world." --"On the Shoulders of Giants", Ray Bradbury

All of my posts are full of fiction and blatant lies.


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OfflineAsanteA
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1643739 - 06/19/03 06:31 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

AAAAAAAHHHRRRGGG!!
*wipes goo off of PC monitor*

I love this topic. Dreams aren't seperate from, but an integral part of our Universe, nay? This means that all that happens within them is part of our universe and part of the sum of things.

Some scientists now believe there exist no boundaries between Dreams, Delirium and Psychosis, but that the latter two are simply the Dreamstate getting activated whilst awake. One of the key neurotransmitters here is Acetylcholine, this being connected to our beloved Dopamine/Serotonine system.

If you were to take a HIGHLY SPECIFIC AND PERSONALIZED amount of an anticholinergic (like Thorn Apple, Belladonna, Angels Trumpets but do not mess with this because YOU have not the knowledge to safely wield them)you would inhibit Acetylcholine at muscarinic receptors. This would automatically feed back onto your Dopamine system wich will elevate specific Dopamine systems, D2 being among them. You would enter a deliriant state with technicolor imagery and enhanced emotions but with lessened recall of what happened during the experience. (amnesia effect)

So-called Smart Drugs (No?tropics like Piracetam) enhance Acetylcholines whilst anticholinergics inhibit them. The beforementioned herbs can therefore quite literally be dubbed Dumb Drugs, no pun intended.

Now comes the really good shit!
Delirium: technicolor imagery, trance-logic, decreased memory.
Dreaming:  "  "  "  "  " "
Psychosis: "  "  "  "  " "

Anticholinergics enhance D2, don't they? Well: all Antipsychotics inhibit D2 in order to BE Neuroleptic! This would predict an overdose of Thorn Apple would CAUSE Psychosis.  IT DOES!!

If Dreams and Delirium and Psychosis partly operate on the same mechanism & activate waking dreaming, eating (toxic) amounts of Thornapple or being sufficiently psychotic would cause technicolor imagery of a highly symbolic nature, hypersuggestibility, trance-logic and memory disturbances to superimpose themselves over the Concensus Reality and would be most often highly nightmarish, since about 70% of dreams (most unrecalled later) are nightmares. It would also mean that auditory hallucinations are highly common too.
ALL OF THIS HAS PROVEN ITSELF TO OCCUR.

I can vouch for the fact that ultra-low doses of nightshades (we're talking a couple of 10s of milligrams of dried leaf here in my 250lbs case)in total darkness evoke imagery quite unlike LSD and that are definitely the stuff that DREAMS are made of Psycho-sensorily speaking. Do not do this: YOU READING THIS LACK THE KNOWLEDGE REQUIRED FOR REASONABLE SAFETY BUDDY!!!

So it's highly likely Dream = Delirium = Psychosis.


Time to go out on a limb: I believe in what I call the OMNICYCLIC UNIVERSE. Since this post's sheer length has decimated it's readers I'll spare you 10 years worth of theorizing and simply state:

ANYTHING THAT CAN HAPPEN WILL HAPPEN INTO ALL ETERNITY

combined with:

EVERYTHING IS PRESENT EVERYWHERE WITH TIME AS THE ONLY SEPERATING BARRIER. (the entirety of the Universe is present within your mouth :shocked:)

Please think on this for a sec  (...)  yup you're right on: I believe you will live all possible lives into all eternity over & over again, and also that the Universe and your role in things is completely carved in stone. We humans may poison and nuke but try as we might, we cannot fuck up the fabric of the Omnicyclic Universe  :grin:


Thanks for reading this!

 


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OfflineRhizoid
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: Sev]
    #1643911 - 06/19/03 08:31 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

I've stopped regarding quantum physics as anything other than magic since they managed to do the classic double-slit interference pattern thing with single sodium atoms.




The have actually done it with buckyballs (molecules with 60 carbon atoms).
Here is an article by the people who did it:

http://www.quantum.univie.ac.at/research/c60/

Interference, quantum uncertainty, and the "travelling all paths at once" is not at all strange if you think about matter as microscopic wave patterns. But then the strange part is why interactions between these wave patterns only take place in discrete units (the quantum of action) instead of any arbitrary amount. All attempts to resolve this need to introduce more information than the theories can provide, which seems to imply that quantum mechanics is incomplete.


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Offlinecleaner
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1643946 - 06/19/03 09:10 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

MisterKite said:
This means that your dreams are actually happening on another plane of reality. If you think about punching a hole through your computer, or having sex with your teacher, then in another alternate universe you really are doing that.






*puts on his robe and a wizard hat*

No no and once again NO.

There is only one physical universe it's time they told you that in school.

However, all your thoughts exist in another dimensional universe called astral dimension. And it's got nothing to do with the real time physical world.


--------------------


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OfflineMurex
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1644216 - 06/19/03 11:30 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)


Anything imagined has, does, or will exist somewhere.


Infinity + Eternity :laugh:


--------------------
What if everything around you
Isn't quite as it seems?
What if all the world you think you know,
Is an elaborate dream?
And if you look at your reflection,
Is it all you want it to be?



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Offlinelucid
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: Murex]
    #1644249 - 06/19/03 11:42 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

yeah yeah, I get all of this, but getting back to the part about
having sex with your teacher... :grin: 


--------------------
"no-mind un-thinks no-thought..."


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Offlinejohnnyfive
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Registered: 07/02/02
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1644613 - 06/19/03 01:43 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I agree with your dmt theory. I notice that if i use the dream herb, ill get vivid dreams, but no more vivid than if i didn't use it.

I notice that if i do about two psiballs, a day, cut down on sugar consumption. I WILL HAVE THE MOST VIVID DREAMS, even more so than with any use of the "dream herb".hmmm.. i might start a post on this one, id like to find out more and see if anyone else expierences like this.


--------------------
And the gameshow host rings the buzzer (brrnnntt) oh and now you get a face full of face!


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OfflineSev
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: Rhizoid]
    #1644632 - 06/19/03 01:47 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Ooh, thanks for the link.  THat's even more far-out.

Quote:


But then the strange part is why interactions between these wave patterns only take place in discrete units (the quantum of action) instead of any arbitrary amount. All attempts to resolve this need to introduce more information than the theories can provide, which seems to imply that quantum mechanics is incomplete. 




Like I said.  Magic.  :wink:


--------------------
"Do we want the stars? We can have them. Can we borrow cups of fire from the sun? We can and must and light the world." --"On the Shoulders of Giants", Ray Bradbury

All of my posts are full of fiction and blatant lies.


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OfflineMisterKite
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: Sev]
    #1746876 - 07/25/03 03:36 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Could any skeptics please read the link before they come to their conclusion. If you oppose to what I propose then please present a reasonable rebuttal, instead of using your flawed and limited human logic.


--------------------
"But for the sake of some little mouthful of flesh we deprive a soul of the sun and light, and of that proportion of life and time it had been born into the world to enjoy."


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OfflineRhizoid
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1746949 - 07/25/03 04:26 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

What link?


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OfflineDrubuShrume
EAT ME - I'm afungi

Registered: 05/14/02
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1746954 - 07/25/03 04:29 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

And what link is that?


--------------------
AH HA....


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InvisibleDarkcloud
‮tiwkcuFtsilihiN
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Registered: 04/06/03
Posts: 1,331
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Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: MisterKite]
    #1747024 - 07/25/03 05:10 AM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

MisterKite said:
Using quantum physics, scientists proved that there is an infinite nubmer of parallel dimensions




They actually proved this? Are you sure? It was just a theory not too long ago...



--------------------
:poison: :poison: :poison:


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Anonymous

Re: Dreams-The Key to Alternate Universes [Re: Darkcloud]
    #1747714 - 07/25/03 12:40 PM (13 years, 4 months ago)

Well, logically there would have to exist a dimension for each and every possible action that has and will occur, right? So at any point in time with each decision you make, "time" branches off into the dimension in which you made that choice. So you are passing seamlessly through parallel dimensions constantly, with each and every second. Thus since there are an infinite number of things possible to happen, there would have to be infinite parallel dimensions in which each of of those things does happen.

Or so I think.


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