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InvisibleSwami
Eggshell Walker

Registered: 01/19/00
Posts: 15,413
Loc: In the hen house
Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Shroomism]
    #1633383 - 06/14/03 05:37 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

The purpose of human life on the planet Earth is to constantly evolve... physically.

Umm, old age and death is sort of a physical devolution if you will, otherwise 80 year-olds would be dominating sports.



--------------------



The proof is in the pudding.


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Offline3MJ3
i&I
Registered: 03/01/03
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Grav]
    #1633402 - 06/14/03 05:55 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Pink Shark Mark - I am not "debunking" his claim, I am asking that he provide at least an iota of supporting evidence for it, or at the very least that he tell us what the "purpose" actually is.

I think this post was orignially just a pure arbitrary speculation about the possibility of a purpose of life through the author's own perceptions, rather than a realization of such a truth universally....so there is really no utility in breaking down his argument...it does not adhere to a philosophical logicality so why analyze it with one.

Let the guy speak his two cents without being barraged by your "philo-major" discourse - obviously derivative of your vast wealth of numinous wisdom. Enlighten me, oh ominous mentor :wink:

Really though, the guy is probably just cultivating his passion for these questions...the questions that get all of those interested in philosophy to embrace the highest form of science.....the questions of life. He's trying to soar like a bird into the infinitisemal skies of 'the love of wisdom'....please....do not shoot him down.

Peace,
i&I


Edited by 3MJ3 (06/14/03 05:58 PM)


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OfflineGrav
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: 3MJ3]
    #1633526 - 06/14/03 07:03 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Thanks 3MJ3,  that's what I wanted to say but didn't know how to say it :smile:


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InvisibleShroomismM
Space Travellin
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Swami]
    #1633563 - 06/14/03 07:30 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Umm, old age and death is sort of a physical devolution if you will, otherwise 80 year-olds would be dominating sports.




By old age and death you are beyond evolving physically and are more focused on emotionally, mentally, and spiritually, eh?


--------------------


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Shroomism]
    #1633573 - 06/14/03 07:36 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

mmmm, most be devolve mentally in their old age, and how would you gauge emotional/spiritual evolution


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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OfflineMalachi
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Registered: 06/19/02
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Grav]
    #1633578 - 06/14/03 07:38 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

purpose of life = big big big party at the end of time that never ends that everyone makes it to. not the ubermensch, but the uber-party.

as for instincts.... two prominent ones come to mind. smoking weed and running from the po po.



--------------------
The ultimate meaning of our being can only be fulfilled in the paradoxical leap beyond the tragic-demonic frustration. It is a leap from our side, but it is the self-surrendering presence of the Ground of Being from the other side.
- Paul Tillich


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Malachi]
    #1633581 - 06/14/03 07:40 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

purpose of life: to make witty remarks like "the purpose of life is to debate the purpose of life".


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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OfflineDogomush
Barbless Aryan

Registered: 10/05/02
Posts: 1,286
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1633589 - 06/14/03 07:45 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

life has no meaning. It is like a truck


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Offlineatomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!

Registered: 04/07/03
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Dogomush]
    #1633596 - 06/14/03 07:47 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

dog-o-mush, you just dont understand yet. you need to do more mushrooms and open up your 3rd eye. then you will understand that the meaning of life is to make up a meaning for life and cheat naive people into believing you so that they will give you money and have sex with you.


--------------------
enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.


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OfflineDogomush
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: atomikfunksoldier]
    #1633705 - 06/14/03 08:55 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

I started laughing and then I slumped my shoulders and hung my head because it's true.


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OfflinePhred
Fred's son
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: 3MJ3]
    #1633924 - 06/14/03 11:32 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

3MJ3 writes:

Let the guy speak his two cents...

He spoke his two cents, as did a number of other people commenting on his assertions. So did I. Why are my comments singled out for your disapproval? Is there some unwritten rule here that one may only slavishly agree with what is written? Questions are not allowed?

...without being barraged by your "philo-major" discourse...

I thought I was in the "Spirituality and Philosophy" forum. Am I not allowed to ask for clarification of his personal philosophy?

...obviously derivative of your vast wealth of numinous wisdom.

What wisdom I do possess was not garnered by uncritically and unquestioningly swallowing everything I read. If something purporting to impart knew knowledge or wisdom cannot stand the test of a few relevant questions, of what worth is it?

Really though, the guy is probably just cultivating his passion for these questions...

Re-read his post, then mine. I am the one asking the questions, not him. He is the one who is making assertions.

He's trying to soar like a bird into the infinitisemal skies of 'the love of wisdom'....please....do not shoot him down.

Is it a favor to encourage him to pursue what may turn out to be false "wisdom"? What's wrong with suggesting a few course corrections to his flight through the skies? Why do you persist in calling my requests for clarification "shooting him down"?

pinky


--------------------


Edited by pinksharkmark (06/14/03 11:36 PM)


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
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Loc: On the Brink of Madness
Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Phred]
    #1634288 - 06/15/03 02:47 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

*Pinky tries hard to tell his colleagues about the colorful world outside the cave, but they instead lash out at him....*

hehehe


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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OfflineTwirling
Barred Spiral
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Registered: 02/03/03
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: RebelSteve33]
    #1634311 - 06/15/03 02:58 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

That is not an instinct by definition.  It is something we learn.

Infants do not recognize anything as threatening or dangerous.  As we age, we learn to see different things in these terms, and then learn to either fight or take flight from them.

In reply to

"I think one of the things that distingushes us from other animals is we can question our instincts and change them."

What instincts???    :confused:




I think we're getting into the "nature vs. nurture" debate. However, I think if you take an infant and make a loud noise, they will tend to cry, get upset, and/or be frightened. That is an automatic response to a stressor alerting a person to potential danger. An infants cry is an instinctual way of alerting a mother it's in danger. These aren't things they're taught or learn.

I guess the best way to figure out what's instinctual and what's learned would be to study different cultures and ways of life and see what differs. Anyone up for some sociology?  :cool:


--------------------
The very nature of experience is ineffable; it transcends cognitive thought and intellectualized analysis. To be without experience is to be without an emotional knowledge of what the experience translates into. The desire for the understanding of what life is made of is the motivation that drives us all. Without it, in fear of the experiences what life can hold is among the greatest contradictions; to live in fear of death while not being alive.



Edited by Twirling (06/15/03 03:10 AM)


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OfflineGrav
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Registered: 02/06/02
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Twirling]
    #1634668 - 06/15/03 09:18 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Do people have to start adding IMO's after every statement?

I don't think many spiritual ideas here are meant to be the poster's inflexible view of the world.
Can it be generally assumed that it is somewhat opinion-oriented, reducing the need for scientific proof because someone said "we are all one consciousness".


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Offlinecastaway
Isanybodyreallyhome?
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Registered: 06/10/03
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Grav]
    #1634685 - 06/15/03 09:38 AM (18 years, 7 months ago)

I think constant allowance for personal error, as indicated by 'I think' or 'In my opinion', forestalls the emotional trap we can fall into when our arguments are proven imperfect.

An emotional response to being 'wrong' could be irrational in that it is unconstructive and leads to withdrawal, either of one's own expression or that of the offending party.


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InvisibleSclorch
Clyster

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Registered: 07/13/99
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: castaway]
    #1635124 - 06/15/03 03:14 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Grav: Can it be generally assumed that it is somewhat opinion-oriented,

If this is a question, then my answer is 'No'.
If metaphysics is rooted merely in opinion, then all such discussions should be sent to either OTD or PAL.

Since I don't see metaphysics in such a light, it should stay here and it should be subject to scrutiny.

*goes back outside to trim the hedges*


--------------------
Note: In desperate need of a cure...


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Offline3MJ3
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Registered: 03/01/03
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Sclorch]
    #1637339 - 06/16/03 02:23 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

Sclorch - God damn you, you're in the cave too y'know, we all are, unless...you have found Nirvana or some kind of enlightenment we don't know about. Just because you aspire academically in philosophy does not mean you see the flames producing the shadows for what they are.....but alas......I will never forgive you *sniff* *sniff*

.......;)

Pink Shark Mark - I was just saying that it is wrong to OVER- critisize someone for their thoughts. He was not presenting a theory to be analyzed. Positive encouragement is good, I agree with you on that if that was your intentions.

You know, when I refered to 'discourse', that was the key element of my critisizm of your posts. It creates an unbalanced power-relation between you and PsycheStudent while you are trying to convey your ideas to him. You think it helped...but most likely he was confused. 'Discourse', a specialized way of talking, whether it be philosphy, economics, science, politics etc. gives immediate power to the individual who excercises it. It alienates, rather than integrates. It is oppositional, not co-operational. That's why I said....'barrage with 'philo-major' discourse. Especially the people who post their ideas on particular theories, I mean, I find it interesting, but you can't get frustrated when someone has trouble understanding it, or is not following the modality of philosophical logic that it entails. You have to realize the fact that some of us do take philosophy academically, but some of us are just interested in the questions it asks.

Perhaps I came to the perception that you were OVER-critical by your method of examination. Singling out each sentence, each particular phrase you find illogical, or untruthful. This is truly saying more than the actual content of your post. It is rather adversarial. It is almost putting on display for all to see - for all to see the illogicality in SO AND SO's argument. It defeats the whole purpose of each sentence and each seperate yet correlating sentiments of each sentence, building together to make the message complete. Almost, reductionism in a sense. But what are you reducing? The thoughts...the will...of the person you are analyzing. Be-littlement.

Anyways, I'm just calling it how I see it.....and I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and believe that you're intentions were truly noble.

Peace,
i&I


Edited by 3MJ3 (06/16/03 02:33 PM)


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OfflinePhred
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: 3MJ3]
    #1638208 - 06/16/03 09:11 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

3MJ3 writes:

Pink Shark Mark - I was just saying that it is wrong to OVER- critisize someone for their thoughts.

Please point out to me where I criticized him at all, let alone OVER-criticized him. I did nothing more than ask for clarification and point out logical fallacies.

He was not presenting a theory to be analyzed.

He presented no theory at all. As a matter of fact, he never even got around to stating what the "true purpose of humanity" is, which is why I decided to comment on the post in the first place.

Positive encouragement is good, I agree with you on that if that was your intentions.

And if I intended not to encourage him -- positively or otherwise -- but instead was simply trying to find out what he believes is the true purpose of humanity and how he came to believe it, you disagree with me?

You know, when I refered to 'discourse', that was the key element of my critisizm of your posts.

Good grief. HE was the one indulging in discourse -- I was merely asking questions.

From the Oxford Dictionary of Current English:

discourse -- 1 conversation; speech or lecture; lengthy treatment of subject.

Was he or was he not giving a lecture? Was his treatment of the subject more lengthy than mine?

It creates an unbalanced power-relation...

Please clarify.

...between you and PsycheStudent while you are trying to convey your ideas to him.

I wasn't trying to convey my ideas to him, I was trying to find out just what it was he was trying to convey to the readers.

You think it helped...but most likely he was confused.

That's just a tad patronizing, don't you think? If he has the intelligence to write a post such as that, clearly he has the intelligence to understand the questions I was asking.

'Discourse', a specialized way of talking, whether it be philosphy, economics, science, politics etc. gives immediate power to the individual who excercises it.

Then he has more power than me, doesn't he, since he was the one posting a discourse. As for giving "power", that is incorrect. What gives a statement power is its clarity and truth, not the style in which it is couched.

It alienates, rather than integrates. It is oppositional, not co-operational.

I have no interest in "integrating" or "co-operating", or even "alienating" or "opposing"; I just want to find out what he believes our true purpose might be and how he arrived at that belief.

You have to realize the fact that some of us do take philosophy academically, but some of us are just interested in the questions it asks.

As am I. I want to know what our true purpose is. I am still waiting.

Perhaps I came to the perception that you were OVER-critical by your method of examination. Singling out each sentence, each particular phrase you find illogical, or untruthful.

How better to identify the specific parts of his discourse I wish clarified? No possibility of confusion or misinterpretation that way, is there?

This is truly saying more than the actual content of your post. It is rather adversarial.

Ah. So now I am to be a specimen for your psychologizing. It can't be possible that I am just trying to find something out -- oh, no! I must have some ulterior motive due to some character flaw. Uh huh.

It is almost putting on display for all to see - for all to see the illogicality in SO AND SO's argument.

Are you saying it's better to have people try to guess for which parts of a lengthy post I am requesting clarification and which parts I find contradictory? I have found over decades of debate that the method of attaching my response directly to the sentence or phrase generating the response leaves the least possible room for misinterpretation.

It defeats the whole purpose of each sentence and each seperate yet correlating sentiments of each sentence, building together to make the message complete.

His original post remains here for all to read, contemplate, examine, grok, and appreciate in its unedited entirety. Nothing has been "defeated" or altered in any way. I fail to see the problem.

Almost, reductionism in a sense. But what are you reducing? The thoughts...the will...of the person you are analyzing. Be-littlement.

Dude, you are WAAAAYYYYY over-thinking this. I am not "reducing" or "belittling" or even "analyzing" the person -- or his thoughts or his will -- at all. I just want to know what our damn purpose is and at least a brief explanation of the process the writer undertook to discover this purpose. You impute imaginary motives to me with not the slightest shred of evidence.

Anyways, I'm just calling it how I see it.....

Is that to be considered an apology for implying my interest in his post was merely to shred it and somehow make myself look like a genius, or is it a standard generic cop-out meant to cover pretty much anything and everything to which I might take exception?

...and I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and believe that you're intentions were truly noble.

Gee, that's awfully gracious of you. Thank you ever so much.

pinky


--------------------


Edited by pinksharkmark (06/16/03 09:17 PM)


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Invisibletekramrepus
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: Phred]
    #1638552 - 06/16/03 11:35 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

please god tell me you dont talk like that in real life pinksharkmark, lol.

Loosen up brother.


Sure intellectual chess is fun here and there, and we all like to play but this thread, as others have observed wasn't really about scientifically proving anything to anybody. It was mere speculation and ideals.

I appreciate your challenge to him, and its good to be challenged and to challenge, but I challenge the manner in which you challenged him.

On what basis did ya make the argument? What was the purpose? Did you actually think he would show you evidence that would support his beliefs and change your mind?

If anything, you were being a tad pushy and agressive in your approach. Maybe you could have thrown in a smiley or two, or a sarcastic remark.

You are human afterall....arent you? :wink:


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Offlinecastaway
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Re: The true purpose of humanity [Re: tekramrepus]
    #1638574 - 06/16/03 11:44 PM (18 years, 7 months ago)

"this thread, as others have observed wasn't really about scientifically proving anything to anybody. It was mere speculation and ideals."-

Are you reading this PsycheStudent?
Your ideas have been reduced to speculation!

Defend yourself!


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