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OfflineCleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...

Registered: 08/26/02
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What is knowledge?
    #1626155 - 06/11/03 12:57 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

what is knowledge?
knowledge is the existence of a system in a model, which allows that system to make predictions, that is, to anticipate processes in its environment. so, the system gets control over its environment. such a model is a personal construction, not an objective reflection of outside reality. is it possible to truely know without experiencing? how different are knowledge and experience? i suppose it depends what one takes away from that experience


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if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?

this is the purpose


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: What is knowledge? [Re: CleverName]
    #1626246 - 06/11/03 01:44 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

To me you are describing the application of knowledge. I think of knowledge as the fundamental concepts underlying a system. The system itself is knowledge, I guess.

is it possible to truely know without experiencing?
Yes. Definately. I have concepts that cannot be directly experienced in this reality, yet I understand them to be valid.

how different are knowledge and experience?
Knowledge can be gained through experience. I do not believe that experience comes from knowledge.


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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OfflineViBrAnT
WaRpInG &sPiRaLiNg
Registered: 07/30/02
Posts: 286
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Re: What is knowledge? [Re: trendal]
    #1626368 - 06/11/03 02:48 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

what is knowledge? Thats a tuffeee!!!!!!! Knowledge is like an ancient tree, it has been growing for hundreds, perhaps thousands of years. It doesnt always make sense either, but then again, does a tree make sense. Without mind, who would you be? an animal, are animals happy? maybe you would be pure emotion. knowledge to me only becomes useful when it joins, interestingly enough...........


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" liken this life illusory, for your sand castle will one day be adrift amongst the wind "




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InvisibleClean
the lense
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Registered: 05/11/03
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Re: What is knowledge? [Re: CleverName]
    #1626395 - 06/11/03 03:05 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

in light of all the coincidence talk here lately i just want to say that today, while at work, i thought of posting these exact same questions in this forum:

Quote:

is it possible to truely know without experiencing? how different are knowledge and experience?




:grin:

Quote:

i suppose it depends what one takes away from that experience




for the record, i agree.



   


Edited by Clean (06/11/03 03:05 PM)


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Offlinedebianlinux
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Re: What is knowledge? [Re: trendal]
    #1626620 - 06/11/03 04:54 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

To me you are describing the application of knowledge. I think of knowledge as the fundamental concepts underlying a system. The system itself is knowledge, I guess.

is it possible to truely know without experiencing?
Yes. Definately. I have concepts that cannot be directly experienced in this reality, yet I understand them to be valid.




i'd have to say that i disagree to some extent. IMO knowledge does require experience. outside of personal experience it is merely belief however strong. the best example i can come up with is a hot stove eye. as a child mommy tells you that it will burn you. you believe mommy. hell, you really believe mommy because you have witnessed mommy get burned before. one day you, personally, get burned by the hot stove eye. now you KNOW the stove eye will burn you. knowledge through experience.


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InvisibletrendalM
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Re: What is knowledge? [Re: debianlinux]
    #1626700 - 06/11/03 05:30 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

But it is possible to KNOW and UNDERSTAND that you will be burned even before you are actually burned.

A perfect example is the concept of infinity.


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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Offlinedebianlinux
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Re: What is knowledge? [Re: trendal]
    #1626735 - 06/11/03 05:40 PM (13 years, 8 months ago)

we must agree to disagree then. i still say that you STRONGLY BELIEVE. let's say, for instance, that I am a 25 year old male and I have a lot of experience with getting burned by various objects/methods. suppose I encounter a rock that has fallen from the sky that is glowing a pulsing red and smoking. i can ascertain from previous experience that I should not pick this rock up until it has stopped glowing and smoking or else it will burn me. i do not know for sure that it will, i simply believe it will. there reamins the possibility that this an extraterrestrial communication device (or whatnot) and it is not hot at all or it is some unearthly compound that "burns" at a temperature that is perfectly safe for my skin. you see where i'm going here? the whole burning analogy is pretty rough because the human body is pretty quick to determine if it is going to be burned by utilising many senses (eyes see heat waves, nose smells acrid smoke, skin feels heat radiating) but it still required a certain level of "conditioning" (read punishment) derived from experience to know what these "symptoms" entail and even then the assumption could prove false.


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OfflineCleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
Re: What is knowledge? [Re: trendal]
    #1627633 - 06/12/03 12:15 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

is understanding a concept really knowledge of that concept? experience is inevitably connected with direct knowledge. i know about infinity, but i dont know infinity.


--------------------
if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?

this is the purpose


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Offlineshr00m
junglisT 2 thefUll3st

Registered: 05/01/03
Posts: 801
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Re: What is knowledge? [Re: CleverName]
    #1627673 - 06/12/03 12:36 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I think knowledge and experience are two different things.
but then again it depends on what you think knowledge and experience is.

with knowledge, you can learn about it without experiencing it. and with an experience....well you need to experience it. because its called an experience....


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the only constant is change~ life goes on. so theres no point in staying back because you can always catch up. try,hope, and understand!


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InvisibleShroomismM
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Re: What is knowledge? [Re: CleverName]
    #1627854 - 06/12/03 02:30 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

We experience to gain knowledge which becomes wisdom.
Knowledge is based on life experience
Experience = Knowledge = Wisdom


--------------------


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Anonymous

Re: What is knowledge? [Re: Shroomism]
    #1627858 - 06/12/03 02:31 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

what shroomism said, you need no other answers. that is perfect

lol, i typed "shroomish" :blush: i didnt mean to, stupid ass fingers 


Edited by Anonymous (06/12/03 02:35 AM)


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InvisibletrendalM
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Loc: Ontario, Canada
Re: What is knowledge? [Re: debianlinux]
    #1627885 - 06/12/03 02:47 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

If you are to go that far...it is just one more step to saying that everything is a belief, and not knowledge.

I have experienced things, with my senses, that I am aware are "not real". If I can experience something that isn't real, what separates what is real from unreal?

Knowledge. It follows a predictible path, although we are not always intelligent enough to predict.


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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InvisibletrendalM
point of inflection
Male User Gallery

Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 19,462
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Re: What is knowledge? [Re: CleverName]
    #1627887 - 06/12/03 02:49 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I do not just "know about" infinity. I understand it.

Understanding = knowing.


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


Post Extras: Print Post  Remind Me! Notify Moderator
InvisibletrendalM
point of inflection
Male User Gallery

Registered: 04/17/01
Posts: 19,462
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Re: What is knowledge? [Re: trendal]
    #1627889 - 06/12/03 02:51 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

I have proof, to myself at least, that "reality" is not necessarily "proof" that a thing is "real". Then what, I should ask, is "experience"?


--------------------
You're here because you know something.
What you know you can't explain,
But you feel it;
You've felt it your entire life.
That there's something wrong with the world.
You don't know what it is, but it's there....
Like a splinter in your mind...
Driving you mad.


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OfflineCleverName
the cloudsshould know meby now...

Registered: 08/26/02
Posts: 1,121
Loc: red earth painted with mi...
Last seen: 11 years, 3 months
Re: What is knowledge? [Re: trendal]
    #1628242 - 06/12/03 08:43 AM (13 years, 8 months ago)

experience...um, how about direct contact with percieved phenomena with a certian level of awarness, please feel free to add


--------------------
if you can't find the truth right where you are, where else do you expect to find it?

this is the purpose


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