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Offlinesaltyd
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Does it need to be fully colonized to case?
    #16099331 - 04/16/12 08:47 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

This is the first time I'm growing in a tub, using dried pastuerized horse manure.  It's been over a week and it's still only a third colonized.  Does it need to be fully colonized for me to case it?  I'm just worried it will start drying out.  I don't know why it's moving so slowwww..

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OfflineDazed Belief
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: saltyd]
    #16099410 - 04/16/12 09:00 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

a week isnt a long time some can take up to a month to colonize
and no worry they wont die out on ya
and yes the have to be fully colonized before you case


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Invisiblecubes4cancer
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: Dazed Belief]
    #16099475 - 04/16/12 09:15 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

i just got schooled about this very thing by RR a few weeks back,first take it easy if its your first grow,leave your sub uncased it doesn't need it,it might be the downfall of your whole operation due to contams.if you must case you need to do it at 80-90% colonization, that was RR's take on it.you could apply it late as well after pinning begins.but its probably in your best interest not to use one at all.


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$$"IM ON A RAMAN NOODLE EVERY NIGHT BUDGET"$$
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ROGERRABBIT: P cubensis will grow on stuffed animals, bibles, quarter pounds of weed, bras, etc.
In other words,it's hard to fuck up a cube grow.
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Offlineelkart
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: cubes4cancer]
    #16099498 - 04/16/12 09:19 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

mono's don't need casing. What sort of tub are you using?


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OfflineDazed Belief
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: cubes4cancer]
    #16099512 - 04/16/12 09:21 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

cubes4cancer said:
i just got schooled about this very thing by RR a few weeks back,first take it easy if its your first grow,leave your sub uncased it doesn't need it,it might be the downfall of your whole operation due to contams.if you must case you need to do it at 80-90% colonization, that was RR's take on it.you could apply it late as well after pinning begins.but its probably in your best interest not to use one at all.




why 80-90% colonized
i would think that would leave more room for contams


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Offlineelkart
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: Dazed Belief]
    #16099535 - 04/16/12 09:26 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

Dazed Belief said:
why 80-90% colonized
i would think that would leave more room for contams




I would think because it isn't completely established, it will more easily conquer the new casing. If it's a solid block, the edges are already closed off, so to speak.


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InvisibleBeefy1
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: saltyd]
    #16099541 - 04/16/12 09:27 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Quote:

saltyd said:
Does it need to be fully colonized for me to case it?  I'm just worried it will start drying out.  I don't know why it's moving so slowwww..





Absolutely needs to be fully colonized to case.  No need to case a monotub though.


A week isn't a long time.


Drying out isn't as big of an issue as too much moisture.  You can always rehydrate it after it's fully colonized.

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Offlineelkart
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: Beefy1]
    #16099571 - 04/16/12 09:31 PM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Most tend to wait around 2 weeks (for a mono)


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OfflineRogerRabbitM
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: elkart]
    #16100541 - 04/17/12 02:12 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Lots of bad info above. 

It's true that bulk substrates such as manure don't need to be cased to perform well with P cubensis, but if one is going to case, the substrate does not need to be fully colonized first.  Some of the old teks called for casing at the same time as the bulk substrate is mixed, while others call for casing at 80% to 100% colonization.  It really doesn't matter much, and depending on conditions, either will work well, as will no casing layer at all.
RR


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InvisibleBeefy1
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: RogerRabbit]
    #16100576 - 04/17/12 02:31 AM (12 years, 8 months ago)

Can you elaborate a little?

It does not matter if you case at only 80%?


Does it not hurt to potentially introduce contaminants to uncolonized substrate?


Casing at the same time as spawning seems like it would fuck things up too.  Smother the substrate,  slow down colonization maybe.  I thought myc would spread through even plain verm.  is overlay a bad thing still?

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OfflineSlimeySlugNug
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: Beefy1]
    #21791062 - 06/10/15 11:55 PM (9 years, 7 months ago)

I am also a noob so I'm not the most reliable source, You can birth whenever as long as scoop the uncolonized material with something like a sterile plastic spoon. Because any material that is uncolonized is easily likely target for contam

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OfflineMachiavelliavore
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: SlimeySlugNug]
    #21795642 - 06/12/15 01:02 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Spawning to bulk substrate is done in open air.  It doesn't magically become vulnerable to contams just because you open it up while it's colonizing.  Casing is pasturized and contains even less nutrients, so it is even less likely to contaminate than the bulk substrate.

The only issue I can see is the sudden influx of fresh air during colonizing, but if he casing is applied in still-air-ish conditions quickly, perhaps the CO2 will not be heavily dispused.

I have had some issues with bulk chomping at the bit to fruit by 100%, so I think I will be trying an ealier casing, with the hope of getting a more even pinsets and less sidepins.


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I spawned some popcorn casings and had double-overlay cause I didn't put enough hydrogen peroxide in my automated aquarium mister.  I only got one mushroom so I cut off the head part where the seeds fall from and put it in a jar of LC and sprayed it all over a tin of PF cakes I made with gravel, cardboard, and bisquick in my microwave.  I think it will be good cause B+ is so potent.
Triggered yet?

Only a square would say "a cube is a cube."


No, this does not look right...

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InvisibleFriedEggS
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: Machiavelliavore]
    #21795664 - 06/12/15 01:08 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

it's been over 3 years... i'm sure OP's tub is fully colonized by now


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OfflineMachiavelliavore
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: FriedEgg]
    #21795677 - 06/12/15 01:13 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Oops.  Didn't notice this was a necro.  Sorry for the bump.


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I spawned some popcorn casings and had double-overlay cause I didn't put enough hydrogen peroxide in my automated aquarium mister.  I only got one mushroom so I cut off the head part where the seeds fall from and put it in a jar of LC and sprayed it all over a tin of PF cakes I made with gravel, cardboard, and bisquick in my microwave.  I think it will be good cause B+ is so potent.
Triggered yet?

Only a square would say "a cube is a cube."


No, this does not look right...

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Offlinefearnoevil
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Registered: 06/07/15
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: Machiavelliavore]
    #21795786 - 06/12/15 01:51 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Well the same questions DO tend to keep coming around, so I've never seen any reason why you can't dig up old posts as long as they're worth it.
So just for the record and to stay on topic, IMHO whenever you case, you should always use something that is DEVOID of nutrients, none, nada, zippity doo dah, lol.  First off the shrooms don't need em cuz their in the substrate, and if you add nutes to the casing then the myc will simply colonize that and you're back where you started with an uncased substrate.  Plus the nutes give bacteria and mold a meal and a foothold, so I simply prefer not to chance it.

So imho, straight vermiculite, moistened to field capacity plus 10% and then sterilized in the oven for 2 hours at 325 - 350f.  Add a 1/2" layer of this to case your sub which I prefer to do as soon as it's at least 90% colonized.  Sterile verm can hold a lot of water and adds great protection from contams.

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Invisible2shoes
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: fearnoevil]
    #21795799 - 06/12/15 01:56 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

No need to sterilize verm.

:feelsoldman:

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Offlinefearnoevil
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: 2shoes]
    #21795847 - 06/12/15 02:22 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Yes you do, at least my XP says so.  Vermiculite is mined, then tossed into trucks in open air, then into a dirty plant to be sorted and bagged, then transported all over, in trains and trucks, maybe boats if you live on the islands, lol. Then it sits in distribution warehouse for god knows how long until it gets to your local store where it sits some MORE. 

No knowing how long that shit has been out of the ground and exposed to all kinds of dirt and contams, many of which could contain the nearly omnipresent endospores we know and hate.  Plus when you're processing the casing more bacteria could get in on your hands, water etc. 

So imo the absolute best way to make CERTAIN that it's as clean as you can get it is to wet it to field capacity, plus about 10%, then put it in turkey oven bags and bake for at least 2 hours at 325-350f.  Makes perfect casing material every time ;?D

Edited by fearnoevil (06/13/15 12:27 AM)

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Invisible2shoes
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: fearnoevil]
    #21795869 - 06/12/15 02:31 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Out of curiosity how many mush grows do you have under your belt?

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OfflineFreeWorldOrder
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: SlimeySlugNug]
    #21796304 - 06/12/15 07:50 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

SlimeySlugNug said:
I am also a noob so I'm not the most reliable source, You can birth whenever as long as scoop the uncolonized material with something like a sterile plastic spoon. Because any material that is uncolonized is easily likely target for contam




Fist of all, it's a monotub not cakes, so he won't be birthing.

2nd... don't "scoop out" uncolonized substrate. Doing something like that probably WILL introduce contams.

If one is questioning the best time to case then I would apply a "late casing". This is when the substrate is 100% colonized and even sometimes knotted up and/or just starting to pin.

You could also just skip the casing altogether. I use a late casing on my bulk subs, but I live in a dry climate and can benefit from using a casing layer.

Seeing quite a bit questionable info on this thread....  :shrug:


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Offlinefearnoevil
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Re: Does it need to be fully colonized to case? [Re: 2shoes]
    #21800280 - 06/13/15 12:20 AM (9 years, 7 months ago)

Newbie2shoes, I've been in this game for several years buckaroo, had more grows than I can count.  Don't think that simply because someone is new to THIS forum that it means they're a noob, THAT would be a mistake, lol, but typical nonetheless ;?D

Edited by fearnoevil (06/13/15 12:24 AM)

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