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piltzintli
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: elfstone]
#16105579 - 04/18/12 07:38 AM (12 years, 1 month ago) |
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I tend to get transient nausea and a swollen-itchy throat with the sclerotia as well. On a certain level it makes sense, as sclerotia are essentially a nutrient storage adaptation employed by the fungi when fruiting conditions are not ideal. In nature, it would make sense that the fungi would want to prevent the ingestion of the sclerotia in burrowing animals by producing some sort of irritant. Contrast this to the clear fitness in having the fruit-bodies be edible, where eating, disturbing and moving fruitbodies actually spreads out the genetic material and confers an adaptive advantage. My guess is that if there is an irritant in the sclerotia, it is probably some sort of volatile oil. So, drying them out thoroughly may in fact help with the nausea and allergic-type responses that at least some of us get.
Edited by piltzintli (04/18/12 07:40 AM)
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piltzintli
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: piltzintli]
#16106307 - 04/18/12 11:41 AM (12 years, 1 month ago) |
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2nd flush, 190grams wet weight ... mexicana prefers dry to wet weight in the dry:wet weight ratio when compared to cubensis ... not bad:
Edited by piltzintli (04/18/12 01:32 PM)
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elfstone
Initiate



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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: piltzintli]
#16121267 - 04/21/12 06:37 PM (12 years, 30 days ago) |
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For those who sent me their addresses requesting a print, please resend to elfstone@shroomery.org. I inadvertently deleted the messages while cleaning up my inbox on the shroomery private message server.
-------------------- γνῶθι σεαυτόν gnōthi seauton know thyself
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husmmoor
Invitro


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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: piltzintli]
#16121418 - 04/21/12 07:12 PM (12 years, 30 days ago) |
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Quote:
piltzintli said:
Beautiful!!
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FeedTheGods
Space Cadet


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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: piltzintli]
#16121890 - 04/21/12 09:10 PM (12 years, 30 days ago) |
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Wow really nice grow!
-------------------- Wanna little more right and a little less left Little more right now, a little less what's next Act like tomorrow's ten years away And just kick back and let the feelin' flow Drink a little drink, smoke a little smoke -Eric Church
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Lennybernadino
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: elfstone]
#16125634 - 04/22/12 07:03 PM (12 years, 29 days ago) |
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Useless comment . To thread .
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Fronnis


Registered: 04/11/11
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: Lennybernadino]
#16127247 - 04/23/12 03:53 AM (12 years, 28 days ago) |
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Fantastic grow, piltzintli! Is there a 3rd flush on the way? How many flushes do you expect from them?
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piltzintli
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: Fronnis]
#16127598 - 04/23/12 08:21 AM (12 years, 28 days ago) |
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The last time I fruited them, they gave 2 really good flushes and 2 light ones ... so maybe I will get a 3rd/4th ... we will see.
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piltzintli
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: piltzintli]
#16150499 - 04/28/12 09:12 AM (12 years, 23 days ago) |
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3rd flush -

the first time I fruited this strain under the 6500K, the third flush was basically one fruit; something about the lighting in this grow has definitely made all of the difference.
One thing that also may be part of the results here is the casing-technique I developed. For many years, casing was really problematic for me with lots of trichoderma contamination. So, I basically developed a particular pasteurization technique that works really well. I have left casings unattended with zero FAE over five month periods with this technique, and had zero contamination pop up. So, I know it works for defeating trichoderma in the casing.
Basically I mix 4:1 sifted peat moss:calci-sand ( http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2752729 ) colorless, bring it up to the correct moisture-content, pack it into a series of quart jars. Cap the jars, and in the center jar I use a cap with a nail-punched hole in it. I place a thermometer into the center of the casing material through the hole. Place all the jars in a stock pot lined on the bottom with old jar lids or something to elevate the jars off the heated metal bottom-surface. Fill with cool water and then turn the heat on high. I then allow the water to start boiling, and around the time the temperature hits 115F on the thermometer, I cut and then monitor the heat. Once it reaches 150F, I start the timer and maintain the temperature between 150F-170F (160F or so is perfect) for 1.5 hours.
It is kind of a pain in the ass, but I know it works very well ... and could have possibly contributed to the great results here. Sterilization of the casing layer apparently also works; as to which one works better, we don´t really know yet.
Edited by piltzintli (04/28/12 09:13 AM)
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RogerRabbit
Bans for Pleasure



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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: piltzintli]
#16150520 - 04/28/12 09:23 AM (12 years, 23 days ago) |
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That's the way I show it in my DVD. You can also use synthetic filter disks on each jar except the one you use with the thermometer. Then, just use the one you measured with right away and the rest can be saved for later.
Quote:
have left casings unattended with zero FAE over five month periods with this technique, and had zero contamination pop up.
With the casing on the substrate or in storage in the jars? I did some experiments this past winter with Agrocybe aegerita, where I opened up the substrate bags (when nearly colonized) in front of the flowhood and added the casing layer and then sealed the bags back up. This allowed the casing layer to begin colonizing in sterile conditions. It worked well, but was a lot of trouble for a relatively low-value mushroom. Is this what you're referring to? RR
-------------------- Download Let's Grow Mushrooms semper in excretia sumus solim profundum variat "I've never had a failed experiment. I've only discovered 10,000 methods which do not work." Thomas Edison
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piltzintli
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: RogerRabbit]
#16150839 - 04/28/12 11:20 AM (12 years, 23 days ago) |
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Quote:
RogerRabbit said: That's the way I show it in my DVD. You can also use synthetic filter disks on each jar except the one you use with the thermometer. Then, just use the one you measured with right away and the rest can be saved for later.
I must have missed that section in the video or something, I have tended to use the video as reference-material while working on a procedure. For a long time, we were doing a ´pseudo-pasteurization´ where we would pack jars into a stock pot, fill with water and then bring the water up to boiling ... shut the flame off, and let it sit in the hot-water bath for an hour. Success was sporadic, which just won´t do ... so I put a thermometer in and basically started pasteurizing like you would with wheatstraw ... I think it is the way to go. I will have to check the video-section out again on pasteurizing casing. I did a lengthy write-up on the technique for a friend of mine who is an MD, and so a real stickler for procedural details. It would be preferable to just refer people to your video, really.
Quote:
Piltzintli said: have left casings unattended with zero FAE over five month periods with this technique, and had zero contamination pop up.
Quote:
With the casing on the substrate or in storage in the jars? I did some experiments this past winter with Agrocybe aegerita, where I opened up the substrate bags (when nearly colonized) in front of the flowhood and added the casing layer and then sealed the bags back up. This allowed the casing layer to begin colonizing in sterile conditions. It worked well, but was a lot of trouble for a relatively low-value mushroom. Is this what you're referring to? RR
With the casing on the substrate. After I first got the CN-mexi to fruit, I basically just ignored all of my cultivation projects for like 6 months ... there was a casing I had left in my fruiting closet with the lid on the fruiting container. So, this was not under sterile conditions like you describe above. After several months (I think about five), I went in to check on the casing expecting everything to be overgrown with trichoderma and it was still clean. A couple rogue-fruits had popped up and the casing was covered in a spore layer, but no contamination. I would not be surprised if maybe spores themselves didn´t have some sort of anti-biotic property to them though, who knows ...
Edited by piltzintli (04/28/12 11:32 AM)
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Fronnis


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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: piltzintli]
#16151000 - 04/28/12 12:11 PM (12 years, 23 days ago) |
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I'm loving the results . I can't wait to get my hands on this species.
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bukujutsu

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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: Fronnis]
#16152207 - 04/28/12 05:42 PM (12 years, 23 days ago) |
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Is calci-sand better than hydrated lime for this?
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piltzintli
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: bukujutsu]
#16154587 - 04/29/12 08:31 AM (12 years, 22 days ago) |
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Quote:
bukujutsu said: Is calci-sand better than hydrated lime for this?
Calci-sand--which primarily contains calcium carbonate--is definitely a little easier to use than hydrated lime, which is primarily comprised of calcium hydroxide. The reason for this is that calcium carbonate largely functions as a pH-buffer, and so maintains the pH within a certain reasonable range. You really cannot add too much calcium carbonate to a casing. Calcium hydroxide from hydrated lime is a strong base--it readily disassociates into it´s ionic form in solution, so the pH will continue to climb as you add more up to the point that saturation is reached. I think saturation-pH with calcium hydroxide is somewhere above 12, which will burn the shit out of your casings and your hands.
I basically have tried using hydrated lime and burnt the shit out of my casings, so don´t use it. If--however--you have a pH monitor or can do some sort of pH-calculation for your casing, it does work and can be used.
Edited by piltzintli (04/29/12 08:43 AM)
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bukujutsu

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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: piltzintli]
#16159463 - 04/30/12 09:34 AM (12 years, 21 days ago) |
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Have you experienced any nausea with other sclerotia producing strains? I'm interested in growing this and sending prints to the free spore ring.
RogerRabbit, what's your view on using calci-sand? I know you recommend hydrated lime over other commonly used things because of the lag in raising the PH and casings usually only lasting a few weeks at most, but what about in this case?
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piltzintli
Stranger

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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: bukujutsu]
#16160774 - 04/30/12 02:50 PM (12 years, 21 days ago) |
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Quote:
bukujutsu said: Have you experienced any nausea with other sclerotia producing strains? I'm interested in growing this and sending prints to the free spore ring.
RogerRabbit, what's your view on using calci-sand? I know you recommend hydrated lime over other commonly used things because of the lag in raising the PH and casings usually only lasting a few weeks at most, but what about in this case?
per the nausea and allergic-type response, I get it with sclerotia in every strain I have tried. I have NOT tried the sclerotia of Ps. tampanensis, but have heard that there is little to no nausea-allergic response in predisposed individuals with that one. I think it may be a matter of strain and predisposition towards that particular effect.
hydrated lime definitely does work, I just personally don´t like it so much cuz it is so caustic ... but I use a 1:4 ratio with the calci-sand, which is quite a bit. I would guess it is much more expensive to use calci-sand vs. hydrated lime. If you know what you are doing and can get the pH right, hydrated lime will definitely work and is probably significantly cheaper. When I mix the calci-sand into the moistened peat moss, I really stir the shit out of it thoroughly distribute it throughout the casing layer. I don´t have a pH-meter, so don´t precisely know how it effects the pH ... I have definitely used it with plenty of success though.
Edited by piltzintli (04/30/12 05:11 PM)
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bukujutsu

Registered: 12/24/06
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: piltzintli]
#16161454 - 04/30/12 05:12 PM (12 years, 21 days ago) |
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I remember a thread where a guy used a layer of sand above the substrate and had astounding flushes. Maybe it's the calci-sand that led to such fine fruiting, not necessarily the strain.
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Javadog
Continuing along



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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: bukujutsu]
#16161505 - 04/30/12 05:19 PM (12 years, 21 days ago) |
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Many Mexican species like a sandy casing soil. I do not (or did anyway) think that this was a matter of pH though.
From the classic paper by Dr. Pollock: "The casing material consisted of an unspecified mixture of various sands and calcareous (chalky) earths."
Interesting....
JD
-------------------- Boyd Rice told my brother that life is a corny pack of freesakes Myco-tek.org
Edited by Javadog (04/30/12 07:44 PM)
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andymc
cocoa beetles from zanzibar



Registered: 11/25/09
Posts: 2,395
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: Javadog]
#16162415 - 04/30/12 07:56 PM (12 years, 21 days ago) |
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Fantastic thread, great work!
-------------------- How I make spore prints Trade List My flow hood If he asks me "Did you have a good time?" I'll say, "Get the lights, Mr. Grim Reaper" -odds
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piltzintli
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Re: New strain of Ps. Mexicana from Eastern slope of Chicon Nindo in Huatla de Jimenez [Re: andymc]
#16171479 - 05/02/12 02:12 PM (12 years, 19 days ago) |
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So, I think this thread is slowly coming to a close here. We are gradually getting spores out to interested parties. For those who are in Europe and outside of the US, I made an effort to lay down a bunch of prints on vellum-paper yesterday. The paper appears to absorb moisture very rapidly, so even using a sterile syringe with water to cover the caps with droplets was not keeping the caps moist enough. Within about four hours of laying the caps down to make prints, they were fairly dried out. So, we are working into an alternative means for printing that will allow us to send out spores in plain envelopes and letter-cards. My preferred printing medium is glass-slides, but these would require a customs declaration in order to send out of country, which I am not willing to do.
As I have mentioned to a couple of people, I have never been particularly interested in any sort of visibility regarding this mushroom. I had no intentions whatsoever of posting on any of the online forums until elfstone became ´filled with the Spirit´ and made his initial post on this new strain of mexicana. But, this has been alot of fun and I feel we have provided an honest and sincere introductory sense of a certain possibility that abides within the mushroom. If just one person becomes honestly inspired to look more deeply into this mystery, then I believe something momentus has been achieved here.
So, the third flush came in ~20 dried grams. I expect a fourth flush with about the same yield. As it stands, I have yielded ~100 dry grams of carpophores from 3 cased-quart jars; I would guess that I will end up with 120+ dried grams total. That is actually a pretty remarkable yield, I think; I have been a bit surprised how prolific this one has been. We are working on a couple of new strains here, including Ps. zapotecorum and what I believe is Ps. caerulescens var mazatecorum ... should we have any success with that, I will certainly post.
God bless everyone! Again, contact me if you would like spores on this one; it will take time, but I will certainly do my best.
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