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Invisible1stimer
Religion=Rape
Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1,280
Loc: Amerika
Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1604040 - 06/03/03 11:39 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)



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ash dingy donker mo gollyhopper patty popiton rockstop bueno mayo riggedy jig bobber johnathan pattywhacker gogboob t-shirt monkey.

There is such emotion in the distortion.


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InvisibleXlea321
Stranger
Registered: 02/26/01
Posts: 9,134
Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1604101 - 06/03/03 11:54 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

who is advocating polluting the Earth? You people seem to think that those who think Global warming is a natural occurance (even though there is NO concrete proof that man is speeding it up) actually want to pollute and litter the Earth. That's just fucking stupid.

And what if controlling pollution means controls on your beloved "capitalism"?



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Don't worry, B. Caapi


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
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Registered: 02/09/01
Posts: 16,296
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: 1stimer]
    #1604248 - 06/03/03 12:47 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Along with factors such as war and changes in the environment, scientists now believe irrigation techniques played an important role in Mashkan-shapir's collapse.




good article. I love to read about these periods, with that said the quote above states that it wasn't the sole reason for the collapse. I will concede that man can do things that cause pollution (like i've always said)but the above example mentions war and changes in environment as well. What changes in environment? Was it caused by man?

either way i like that link even though the mesopotanians are still present today, natural migration as i mentioned before.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Invisiblemantis
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Registered: 01/26/03
Posts: 5,235
Loc: Bunker Alpha, GMC
Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: luvdemshrooms]
    #1604839 - 06/03/03 03:47 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Quote:

global warming is real: this is a fact



Really? Must be great to be omnipotent and know all things.

There are probably as many scientists who say it isn't as there are who say it is. There is no overwhelming consensus.
And even among those who say there is global warming... there is no overwhelming consensus as to the major cause. 



you're absolutely right... having common-sense comes in handy :tongue:

http://yosemite.epa.gov/oar/globalwarming.nsf/content/climateuncertainties.html#known

as i stated earlier, it's happening naturally... we just don't know how much we contribute to it 


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Registered: 02/09/01
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: mantis]
    #1604853 - 06/03/03 03:51 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

we just don't know how much we contribute to it




or at all...


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Invisiblemantis
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1604863 - 06/03/03 03:55 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Scientists know for certain that human activities are changing the composition of Earth's atmosphere. Increasing levels of greenhouse gases, like carbon dioxide (CO2 ), in the atmosphere since pre-industrial times have been well documented. There is no doubt this atmospheric buildup of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases is largely the result of human activities.



but what does the EPA know?

natural global warming is a result of volcanic gases and other emissions of CO2 and Sulfur Dioxide, so why would our man-made emissions be any exception?


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Edited by mantis (06/03/03 03:57 PM)


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: mantis]
    #1604877 - 06/03/03 04:00 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Increasing levels of greenhouse gases, like carbon dioxide (CO2 ), in the atmosphere since pre-industrial times have been well documented




really? what do they say about the oceans being the #1 supplier of greenhouse gases?

Quote:

There is no doubt this atmospheric buildup of carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases is largely the result of human activities.




I won't argue that humans don't don't contribute to CO2 emissions but what humans expell is NOTHING compared to what the Earth gives off naturally. The EPA ia also a governmental agency, so you see my dilema.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Invisiblemantis
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1604913 - 06/03/03 04:09 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

yeah, but i fail to see what the government has to gain by the existence of global warming. you'd think they'd have an "everything is fine, keep consuming and driving" attitude


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: mantis]
    #1604953 - 06/03/03 04:17 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

yeah, but i fail to see what the government has to gain by the existence of global warming.




I won't discount what the EPA states because they study this more than i but i will question it. The EPA seems to walk with the likes of Greenpeace and the Siera Club which are in themselves a joke.



--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Offlinehongomon
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Registered: 04/14/02
Posts: 910
Loc: comin' at ya
Last seen: 17 years, 25 days
Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1604973 - 06/03/03 04:21 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Dude, the oceans are NOT net suppliers of CO2 (correct me if you're not thinking of CO2 as the greenhouse gas here), so you're tricking yourself if you see them as "suppliers", period, of CO2. That sounds like energy industry propaganda.

Oceans absorb AND release CO2. In fact, oceans serve as CO2 "sinks", where a good deal of the carbon it takes in--especially non-gas carbons like animal and plant parts, mafia victims, etc.--sinks down and enters the seabed, where it can remain for millions of years.

Oceans are more accurately the earth's lungs--like forests they take in our CO2 and release O2. The ocean is full of algae and phytoplankton and other photosynthesizers. And that is one of the reasons anyone who enjoys O2 should be concerned about the ocean's health.


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Posts: 27,301
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1604995 - 06/03/03 04:27 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

The EPA seems to walk with the likes of Greenpeace and the Siera Club which are in themselves a joke.



Please explain. I'd love to hear this.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


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InvisibleInnvertigo
Vote Libertarian!!
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Registered: 02/09/01
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Loc: Crackerville, Michigan U...
Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: silversoul7]
    #1605032 - 06/03/03 04:37 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Please explain. I'd love to hear this.




Why should i explain it?


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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Invisibleluvdemshrooms
Two inch dick..but it spins!?
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Registered: 11/29/01
Posts: 34,245
Loc: Lost In Space
Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: mantis]
    #1605055 - 06/03/03 04:42 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

having common-sense comes in handy



Then you should give it a try. I'll stick with facts.


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You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for that my dear friend is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it. ~ Adrian Rogers


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Invisiblesilversoul7
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Posts: 27,301
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1605077 - 06/03/03 04:46 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Quote:

Please explain. I'd love to hear this.




Why should i explain it?



Because you've made a claim and I'd like you to back it up, or else that claim is null and void. Now explain why Greenpeace and the Sierra Club(of which I am a card-carrying member) are a joke.


--------------------


"It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong."--Voltaire


Edited by silversoul7 (06/03/03 04:48 PM)


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Offlinehongomon
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Registered: 04/14/02
Posts: 910
Loc: comin' at ya
Last seen: 17 years, 25 days
Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: silversoul7]
    #1605109 - 06/03/03 04:52 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Hang on, I'm still waiting for him to explain what he means by "destroy the world".


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Offlinehongomon
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Registered: 04/14/02
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: angryshroom]
    #1605192 - 06/03/03 05:09 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Good comments, but I don't agree with this part:

The global warming idea is also a great way to show to the average person that, hey we are actually doing things which are hurting our greatest mother...Its the easiest to see.

I think it's easier to see localized damage. Especially if one is able to visualize the significance of that damage as it unfolds on the timeline. For example, Kaneohe Bay in Hawaii was a thriving bay full of beatiful coral reefs--until the 1970s. Then, erosion runoff from Kaneohe's unchecked development began to choke off the sea floor. By the time I went with my seventh-grade "Sea Trek" field trip in the early 80s (a tour of the bay on a glass-bottom boat) the bay was dead. Parts of the sea floor had six feet of sediment built up. My class was the last to go on Sea Trek before it was cancelled. I don't think they should have cancelled it, because it had a big impact on us. There is NO DOUBT by anyone that Kaneohe Bay's demise was our mistake.

The trick is seeing an example like this as an isolated incident just long enough to understand it, and then being able to tie it in to larger and larger pictures, such as land management, the situation in the Pacific Ocean, ocean health, global health.

hongomon


Edited by hongomon (06/03/03 05:12 PM)


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Invisibleangryshroom
Stranger
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Registered: 12/18/01
Posts: 7,264
Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: hongomon]
    #1605625 - 06/03/03 07:17 PM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Yeah, I hear you.

There is a lot of coral reefs which are being demolished at a very fast pace. :frown:

I used to live on the big island, Kona side... the thing was that people didn't really care or know about pollution. There was no recycling centers on the island, and there was lots of trash. They had more hate for hoale's than they did anything else.
There were guys who would just go down to the beach and trap tropical fish, and sell them...raping them from the their natural habitat and really destroying the population. They had to make someway! :frown:

Other impacts are driving through the forest, coming up over a hill, and seeing a whole moutainside that has been completely clear cut. Ohh...that is a gut wrencher for me. 


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OfflinePsilocybeingzz
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: angryshroom]
    #1607091 - 06/04/03 04:54 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

The only conclusive thing you can say about global warming is this:

It's fairly likely, but we don't have a large enough sample of data to say if it's genuine.

So, you can't say it's a myth, but there is a chance it's not real.





man this is stuff kids with a book on the subject can understand whay cant you???

like for example in 1860 CO2 parts per million was 260
now it 360
and by the way do some reading thre IS proof !!!!!!
its already getting hotter!!!!!
havent you read about how 1998 broke all heat recods then 1999 broke moisture recods then 2000 broke heat recods !!! there is a pattern here !!

Hell even from mushroom picking I can see a difference year to year , and yes I now a hundred years makes more of a case than a couple but the evidence is in my favour on that to !

Ever wonder why there is a HUGE boycott america campign going on right now ?
cause the rest of the world is ready to change and make tought choices on many issues including this one while many in america are not(I am not mocking all of you either I have meet many of you that are intellegent)
your "real problem is your governments focus and the fact SO MANY people in america have lives that to them seem to "mean nothing" so they shop to fill the void.

SICK INDEED !


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: silversoul7]
    #1607187 - 06/04/03 06:47 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

Quote:

Because you've made a claim and I'd like you to back it up, or else that claim is null and void




you want me to back up my opinion? That's funny.

Quote:

Now explain why Greenpeace and the Sierra Club(of which I am a card-carrying member) are a joke.




why?

Quote:

(of which I am a card-carrying member)




That explains a lot


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


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InvisibleInnvertigo
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Re: Good article on global warming. [Re: Innvertigo]
    #1607297 - 06/04/03 09:11 AM (17 years, 11 months ago)

I've been looking for this thread a long time..it has some pretty good info.

Global Warming, Facts Challenge Hysteria


Middle Ages were warmer than today, say scientists
By Robert Matthews, Science Correspondent - The Spectator
(Filed: 06/04/2003)

Claims that man-made pollution is causing "unprecedented" global warming have been seriously undermined by new research which shows that the Earth was warmer during the Middle Ages.

From the outset of the global warming debate in the late 1980s, environmentalists have said that temperatures are rising higher and faster than ever before, leading some scientists to conclude that greenhouse gases from cars and power stations are causing these "record-breaking" global temperatures.

Last year, scientists working for the UK Climate Impacts Programme said that global temperatures were "the hottest since records began" and added: "We are pretty sure that climate change due to human activity is here and it's accelerating."

This announcement followed research published in 1998, when scientists at the Climatic Research Unit at the University of East Anglia declared that the 1990s had been hotter than any other period for 1,000 years.

Such claims have now been sharply contradicted by the most comprehensive study yet of global temperature over the past 1,000 years. A review of more than 240 scientific studies has shown that today's temperatures are neither the warmest over the past millennium, nor are they producing the most extreme weather - in stark contrast to the claims of the environmentalists.

The review, carried out by a team from Harvard University, examined the findings of studies of so-called "temperature proxies" such as tree rings, ice cores and historical accounts which allow scientists to estimate temperatures prevailing at sites around the world.

The findings prove that the world experienced a Medieval Warm Period between the ninth and 14th centuries with global temperatures significantly higher even than today.

They also confirm claims that a Little Ice Age set in around 1300, during which the world cooled dramatically. Since 1900, the world has begun to warm up again - but has still to reach the balmy temperatures of the Middle Ages.

The timing of the end of the Little Ice Age is especially significant, as it implies that the records used by climate scientists date from a time when the Earth was relatively cold, thereby exaggerating the significance of today's temperature rise.

According to the researchers, the evidence confirms suspicions that today's "unprecedented" temperatures are simply the result of examining temperature change over too short a period of time.

The study, about to be published in the journal Energy and Environment, has been welcomed by sceptics of global warming, who say it puts the claims of environmentalists in proper context. Until now, suggestions that the Middle Ages were as warm as the 21st century had been largely anecdotal and were often challenged by believers in man-made global warming.

Dr Philip Stott, the professor emeritus of bio-geography at the University of London, told The Telegraph: "What has been forgotten in all the discussion about global warming is a proper sense of history."

According to Prof Stott, the evidence also undermines doom-laden predictions about the effect of higher global temperatures. "During the Medieval Warm Period, the world was warmer even than today, and history shows that it was a wonderful period of plenty for everyone."

In contrast, said Prof Stott, severe famines and economic collapse followed the onset of the Little Ice Age around 1300. He said: "When the temperature started to drop, harvests failed and England's vine industry died. It makes one wonder why there is so much fear of warmth."

The United Nation's Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), the official voice of global warming research, has conceded the possibility that today's "record-breaking" temperatures may be at least partly caused by the Earth recovering from a relatively cold period in recent history. While the evidence for entirely natural changes in the Earth's temperature continues to grow, its causes still remain mysterious.

Dr Simon Brown, the climate extremes research manager at the Meteorological Office at Bracknell, said that the present consensus among scientists on the IPCC was that the Medieval Warm Period could not be used to judge the significance of existing warming.

Dr Brown said: "The conclusion that 20th century warming is not unusual relies on the assertion that the Medieval Warm Period was a global phenomenon. This is not the conclusion of IPCC."

He added that there were also doubts about the reliability of temperature proxies such as tree rings: "They are not able to capture the recent warming of the last 50 years," he said.


--------------------

America....FUCK YEAH!!!

Words of Wisdom: Individual Rights BEFORE Collective Rights

"The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." -- Thomas Jefferson


Edited by Innvertigo (06/04/03 12:30 PM)


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