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1stimer
Religion=Rape
Registered: 11/18/01
Posts: 1,280
Loc: Amerika
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Re: right wing VS left wing [Re: Evolving]
#1580143 - 05/26/03 11:55 PM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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women exploit women?
-------------------- ash dingy donker mo gollyhopper patty popiton rockstop bueno mayo riggedy jig bobber johnathan pattywhacker gogboob t-shirt monkey. There is such emotion in the distortion.
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Evolving
Resident Cynic
Registered: 10/01/02
Posts: 5,385
Loc: Apt #6, The Village
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Re: right wing VS left wing [Re: 1stimer]
#1580199 - 05/27/03 12:14 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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Okay, let me translate it for you, with the right wing, MAN exploits man, with the left wing man exploits MAN.
Clear as mud?
-------------------- To call humans 'rational beings' does injustice to the term, 'rational.' Humans are capable of rational thought, but it is not their essence. Humans are animals, beasts with complex brains. Humans, more often than not, utilize their cerebrum to rationalize what their primal instincts, their preconceived notions, and their emotional desires have presented as goals - humans are rationalizing beings.
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!
Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 20 years, 6 months
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Re: right wing VS left wing [Re: Evolving]
#1580252 - 05/27/03 12:29 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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robots exploit apes?
oh........oh shit, i think i just figured something out.....oh fuck!
-------------------- enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
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Skikid16
fungus fan
Registered: 06/27/02
Posts: 5,666
Loc: In the middle of the nort...
Last seen: 18 years, 11 months
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Re: right wing VS left wing [Re: Evolving]
#1580417 - 05/27/03 01:24 AM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
With the right wing, man exploits man, with the left wing it's the exact opposite.
Nice
-------------------- Re-Defeat Bush in '04
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Azmodeus
Seeker
Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 3,392
Loc: Lotus Land!! B.C.
Last seen: 19 years, 2 months
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Re: right wing VS left wing [Re: Evolving]
#1581627 - 05/27/03 01:43 PM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Okay, let me translate it for you, with the right wing, MAN exploits man, with the left wing man exploits MAN.
Clear as mud?
It was, but mud is not clear, so am i supposed to be confused or clear now? ...all these word games...
-------------------- "Know your Body - Know your Mind - Know your Substance - Know your Source. Lest we forget. "
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sunyata
nonexistentexistentialist
Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 133
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Ken Wilber says that the major difference he's noticed between political "conservatives" and political "liberals" is that conservatives tend to believe in interior causes for things and liberals tend to believe in exterior causes. So whereas a conservative tends to think that a poor person is poor because she's lazy or unmotivated, a liberal will argue that the social system has created the consitions of that person's life, and that she is poor because of factors that are beyond her control. I found this to be a very obvious, but obviously important, point. I'm not sure how this applies to your war analogy at the start of this thread, though.
Also on both the liberal and conservative sides of the equation, one can be either a believer in freedom, or order. So a conservative who likes order is a hard line conservative, strict rules about abortion and gay marriage based on an old judao-christian belief system, and one who likes freedom might be a capitalist libertarian who believes in a minimum amount of government intervention into people's lives, including their right to make as much profit as humanly possible in a free market system. Then, there's liberals who like order, ie the majority of the liberals today who are happy to live in the suburbs and drive SUVs but want a government to provide some social assistance to the poor, and then there are the socialist libertarians like Proudhon and Bakunin or the Spaniards who overthrew their government in the thirties and established anarchist collectives all over the country. So you are free Right or order Right, free Left or order Left. Individual, or collective.
I am also curious as to why we're so binary in our political thinking, but it seems to be pretty accurate, almost everyone you know exists along that general axis somewhere in their political thinking.
Applying these criteria to myself, it seems that I am both a liberal and a conservative. I believe that exterior forces and conditions do play a tremendous role in shaping our personalities and determining the outcome of our lives. However, I believe that these social conditions are also generated by the interior states of individuals in a society. Micro affects macro and macro affects micro in a sort of feedback loop. Change occurs in individuals before it becomes institutionalized, and then it becomes an influence on society as a whole encouraging others to change also, usually in subtle ways that are undectable because they begin at birth. Those institutions can only facilitate growth up to a certain point though before reaching their own limitations, which are recognized once consciousness has evolved to the point where the flaws can be seen. Once enough people see these flaws, new institutions can be implemented. However, the problem is that institutions are static and resist change, so IMO the ideal solution is to balance structure and flexibility to allow for change as it becomes necessary. So I think anyone at one of the four poles is missing the boat a bit. The ideal is right in the middle.
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atomikfunksoldier
T'was born oftrue in the yearof the cock!
Registered: 04/07/03
Posts: 1,500
Loc: a human-infested anthill
Last seen: 20 years, 6 months
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Re: right wing VS left wing [Re: sunyata]
#1581928 - 05/27/03 03:37 PM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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great post. And ultimately....we revert to ancient chinese philosophy....its all about balance.
-------------------- enjoy the entertaining indentity i have constructed for you while you can.
Edited by atomikfunksoldier (05/27/03 03:37 PM)
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Edame
gone
Registered: 01/14/03
Posts: 1,270
Loc: outta here
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I just read a nice quote by RAW that seemed relevent:
Groups are grammatical fictions; only individuals exist, and each individual is different.
-------------------- The above is an extract from my fictional novel, "The random postings of Edame". In the beginning was the word. And man could not handle the word, and the hearing of the word, and he asked God to take away his ears so that he might live in peace without having to hear words which might upset his equinamity or corrupt the unblemished purity of his conscience. And God, hearing this desperate plea from His creation, wrinkled His mighty brow for a moment and then leaned down toward man, beckoning that he should come close so as to hear all that was about to be revealed to him. "Fuck you," He whispered, and frowned upon the pathetic supplicant before retreating to His heavens.
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sunyata
nonexistentexistentialist
Registered: 12/26/02
Posts: 133
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Re: right wing VS left wing [Re: Edame]
#1581977 - 05/27/03 03:56 PM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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See again to me that is an extreme. That only the individual exists. Everything in the universe exists in a context, is both a whole unto itself and a part of something else. Humans are no different. A tree cannot exist without the environment around it, and our individual "selves" can't exist outside of a collective social environment. Our language, our thoughts could not exist if this were not the case. Look at "feral children" who grow up outside of any human environment -- they can't think in any of the ways that a socialized child of the same age can. To be human means to be part of a culture. The important thing IMO is to not give one a lot of precedence over the other, or you get a pathological situation like fascism or extreme individualism which would prevent the formation of new minds.
Edited by sunyata (05/27/03 03:57 PM)
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Edame
gone
Registered: 01/14/03
Posts: 1,270
Loc: outta here
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Re: right wing VS left wing [Re: sunyata]
#1582038 - 05/27/03 04:14 PM (20 years, 9 months ago) |
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I don't disagree with you, but I think the two ideas can co-exist. I don't mean it literally, the quote is meant as a kind of retort to people who say "group X is like this", "group Y always does this". To say something like that, to me seems to assume that everyone in said group thinks and acts the same way. You could say that group Y all agree on the same core values, but each of them is still an individual with their own thoughts and feelings.
-------------------- The above is an extract from my fictional novel, "The random postings of Edame". In the beginning was the word. And man could not handle the word, and the hearing of the word, and he asked God to take away his ears so that he might live in peace without having to hear words which might upset his equinamity or corrupt the unblemished purity of his conscience. And God, hearing this desperate plea from His creation, wrinkled His mighty brow for a moment and then leaned down toward man, beckoning that he should come close so as to hear all that was about to be revealed to him. "Fuck you," He whispered, and frowned upon the pathetic supplicant before retreating to His heavens.
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